EddE's tips on TL (some useful, others weird) + some general TL knowledge

[Lobos]

hmmm that combo didnt seem to me like a zair to dash grab... seemed more like a fair... anyways, after i test it w and check its usefulness, i could add it to the list if you want

combo is sick, but sinced you kept resetting his damage meter, it could turn out to only work at low %s

w/o bombs it can be used up to around %50-70 depending on the character, after that the second grab has to be timed or you can just chain the hookshot in mid air, I'll try to get another vid up soon to show what I'm talking about also I might have a chain grab for TL now but still testing it out

[edde]

w/o bombs it can be used up to around %50-70 depending on the character, after that the second grab has to be timed or you can just chain the hookshot in mid air, I'll try to get another vid up soon to show what I'm talking about also I might have a chain grab for TL now but still testing it out

what are you exactly doing on the video? its just strange... what i see is that you throw a bomb, miss a delayed nair (possibly fair) to hookshot as you lamd (i might be wrong)... i assume you miss the nair/fair because that combo just does 20%... a bomb hits around 7%, grab hit hits around 3% and all throws do 7%... but, nair/fair both do 10%+... the whole move/combo you pull does just 20%... its just amazing and complex

ive just been trying and cant pull it, if you do a new video please notify me... also, does it work on like all chars, is it weight depending or depends on something else

50%-70% is without the bomob right? cause in your vid you were doing it with at 0%

[Lobos]

All im doing is hookshot in the air and then another on the ground since there is no lag. I use the bomb as a decoy/cover/extra damage however you want to view it as. It can be used on all characters as far as I know and works best at low percentages. Just need work on timing so that your opponent doesn't just air doge it.

I do it in this match at 1:15 and 2:20 w/o using any bombs. http://youtube.com/watch?v=hej6ukloW9A

[edde]

so what you did was zair grab/bomb zair grab?

hmmm im gonna test that tomorrow... im nowhere near a wii right now XDD

anyways, after a day of brawling, i figured a new little killer move (not bad for a first time, got me 3 kills)

[Clevr]

^Care to elaborate?

Does anyone here SHBA instead of SHDA? I've really started pulling out bombs, doing a SH, throwing it in the air, the quick drawing an arrow as I come down. Nice for a bit more damage than the standard SHDA.

I still like SHDA, and always start my games doing it, but I've found that I like SHBA throughout the game a bit more.

[edde]

^Care to elaborate?

Does anyone here SHBA instead of SHDA? I've really started pulling out bombs, doing a SH, throwing it in the air, the quick drawing an arrow as I come down. Nice for a bit more damage than the standard SHDA.

I still like SHDA, and always start my games doing it, but I've found that I like SHBA throughout the game a bit more.

sure... Lobo's discovery is zair to grab... its maybe even a real combo... ziar gets them on floor (tether's cant grab characters that are airbone) and grab gets them... its a fast and very effective technique, im implementing it on my own game asap... now here's Lobo's even flashier version (almost impossible to pull out, timing is ridiculous) which is bomb>zair>grab... flashyest TL simple combo ive seen so far.... in general, both of the combos are easy to pull on big chars (marth, dk, ganon) hard to pull on smaller (ollie, MK, squirtle)

on the SHDA SHBA part, i think its just aout preferences and utilities... to have the option of these 2 moves makes TL have a versatile camp/chase game... you can camp with SHDA, but if the pressure you can do a SHBA, to approach its better to SHBA, but a SHDA is useful too.... its just pretty much about the TL user's opinion and the uses he can give to the tech to adapt it more to his game... its good to see that you analized that SHBA is better for your gameplay than SHDA, analyzing your game is an important key of knowing how to fight

NOTE: some info in the guide is outdated, with some time ill do some updates on the guide

credited & added Lobo's tip

[Coselm]

does this really deserve a sticky?


I guess there really isn't tht much TL info on the boards.

[blazefox]

I don't think the quantity of the info is short, it's the quality aka. what's useful and what's not.

I don't know about wall-jump to a f-air off of FD. I haven't been able to implament it into my gameplay just because it looks cool, but I find a Neutral Air is just as effective, as it tends to send the opponent out farther, where as F-air sends them up slightly as well.

And it was probly mentioned, but running at the edge, pivoting, and hookshotting the ledge just destroys Lucario's, Jigg's, Pikachu's (although you may take 2% damage if the timing is bad), Ice Climbers, Mario's, and Luigi's recovery. As long as your at about the hookshots longest reach, they'll usually fly up between you and the platform and fall accordingly (:

Mario's might be a little tricky as he can come up at an angle, but I've rarely failed this against Luigi when he uses his up-B to recover.

[Coselm]

I don't think the quantity of the info is short, it's the quality aka. what's useful and what's not.

I don't know about wall-jump to a f-air off of FD. I haven't been able to implament it into my gameplay just because it looks cool, but I find a Neutral Air is just as effective, as it tends to send the opponent out farther, where as F-air sends them up slightly as well.

And it was probly mentioned, but running at the edge, pivoting, and hookshotting the ledge just destroys Lucario's, Jigg's, Pikachu's (although you may take 2% damage if the timing is bad), Ice Climbers, Mario's, and Luigi's recovery. As long as your at about the hookshots longest reach, they'll usually fly up between you and the platform and fall accordingly (:

Mario's might be a little tricky as he can come up at an angle, but I've rarely failed this against Luigi when he uses his up-B to recover.

if you are already on the edge you can jsut press back and z (or w.e. you have grab assigned to) twice quickly to regain your invincibility frames for a similar method of edge hogging. Also, in situations as you described, i find it easier to usually just time grabbing the edge so i am invincible when their up b's get to the stage rather than trying to space my hookshot so they go in the middle, although that could be situationally useful. video?

[blazefox]

I don't have the means to record matches but it's quite easy to accomplish.
I'll see if I can get even a mid-grade video up on youtube.

[edde]

i think im removing that FD tip... i barely use it anymore, if i do it im calling to get stage spiked...

mair could of worked, i liked fair better since it kills on lower %s and back then i didnt consider much the diffirence on vertica knockbacks

[edde]

anout turnaround boomerang dash

this technique is not only useful for toon link, but all chars can use it and many of them (like MK, falco, fox, wolf, DK, pika, ganon, etc) dont have a jump distance which makes this technique very useful in theyr games (i use it a lot with falco nowdays)

so... the turnaround boomerang dash name was just to make it look fancy XD, this tech has no name *yet*

link to thread: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=176707

[Lobos]

I made a video about the "Momentum Tlits" don't know if its done correctly.
Link to thread: http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=177504

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3QOz8x4ESd0

Something new?

[edde]

very hard to pull... i cant pull it at the moment, need soem more practice... doesnt seem worth it to set c-stick to other than smash to be able to pull momentum tilts effectively

will do more testing though

[smaci92]

thanks alot...my main is zss but I like playing with toon link too! these should help!

[2kuul]

nice guide! =)

[Sasuke the Sheik Main]

Nice Techniques.
Good for people who are just getting into using TL. =)

[raidos]

Dunno if its mentioned in the thread but I just wanted to share that when you throw your boomerange and when its coming back at you, to reduce all/whatever % of the delay from catching, you just have to shield for a split second and keep running/doing whatever. If its mentioned please ignore ;)

[F3ma Ch33f]

Wow amazing guide man! Im gonna have to practice some of this stuff:chuckle:

[Twiliz]

Hmm, I just noticed something. Not sure if it's useful but if you shorthop into the opposite direction that you're facing and then immediately throw a boomerang forward (just tilting forward might work too), TL moves into that direction about the same amount as the shorthop is, making an angle like this <. It needs to be done really fast, faster than SHDA. I don't think it's anything normal and you should notice when it happens if you try.

[feddieboy]

This is a good guide. I only thought of a few of these techniques.

[edde]

well guys, thanks for posting around and well, wasnt around for some days

i dont have any strange discovery yet for you, but, i am learning to give many of the moves uses, and, ill do a small update now

[Sasuke the Sheik Main]

We can add things right? ._.
>_>

[Lobos]

We can add things right? ._.
>_>

If something new is found then yes.

[edde]

We can add things right? ._.
>_>

yes, as lobos said, but, it must meet these requirements
-must be new
-must be useful and worth using in a match

if you know something, i can add it to the guide and credit you

[Sasuke the Sheik Main]

yes, as lobos said, but, it must meet these requirements
-must be new
-must be useful and worth using in a match

if you know something, i can add it to the guide and credit you
Na just making sure.
My stuffs not important enough to be considered useful.

[Peregrinus Falconidae]

Thank you for posting this collection of tricks and tips, it was really helpful.

[Cloud Cleaver]

Helpful stuff. I noticed that you didn't have any strats involving the dair pogo. It that just useless in tourney play?

Ledge-drops to wall-jumped fairs are nice for edgeguarding. :D

I find it useful to use the bairs and spin attack to kill with. They're both low-knockback, but their chainability means you can "carry" characters, especially fatties like Ganondorf, right to the edge. Just use normal bair combos with liberal sideways DI ( I recommend SH double bair, double jump with rising bair, falling bair) and finish with an airborne spin attack. The final strike should knock the opponent past the blastline. It's good for early kills; the bair doesn't combo well at high damage.

I can't seem to get the hyphen smash to work. Is the timing any different from Falco's, or just stricter? I can make his work just fine.

[edde]

Helpful stuff. I noticed that you didn't have any strats involving the dair pogo. It that just useless in tourney play?

Ledge-drops to wall-jumped fairs are nice for edgeguarding. :D

I find it useful to use the bairs and spin attack to kill with. They're both low-knockback, but their chainability means you can "carry" characters, especially fatties like Ganondorf, right to the edge. Just use normal bair combos with liberal sideways DI ( I recommend SH double bair, double jump with rising bair, falling bair) and finish with an airborne spin attack. The final strike should knock the opponent past the blastline. It's good for early kills; the bair doesn't combo well at high damage.

I can't seem to get the hyphen smash to work. Is the timing any different from Falco's, or just stricter? I can make his work just fine.

dair pogo... is that the dair after getting knocked to gat no movement?

i think i wrote something about the spin attack though

hyphen smash is just dash and c stick up, there is also smash boosting which is falco/snake/wario/wolf/link/some other guy's AT.. works dashing, hit the c stick, put the normal controller stick up and press z

[Cloud Cleaver]

Dair pogo is utilizing the dair's bounce after hitting an enemy to hit them again. Use is predicated on the initial hit, though. It usually bounces once, and then can be followed with another aerial depending on enemy position. Don't know how well this fares against humans, though, so its usefulness may be nil in tourneys.

EDIT: Like you said, the dair can also be used to negate knockback; if the knockback is horizontal you can smash yourself into the stage, if the knockback is vertical you just stall. The sideways knockback reduction requires nearly the strictness of timing as zair ledgegrab canceling.

[Santi]

I've been trying to find new little things with Tl.

mostly ledge tricks.

not much so far... but I'm gonna keep trying.

[Sasuke the Sheik Main]

If someone hits a bomb, their move goes through move degeneration (or whatever its called).
So as well as being able to stop spamable projectiles, they also make the move weaker. Perfect for IC's.
Just thought someone would find this useful.

And Santi discovers TL's edge game huh? =P
I'll help you out on that if you want.

[Santi]

And Santi discovers TL's edge game huh? =P
I'll help you out on that if you want.

I need all the help I can get.

[Sasuke the Sheik Main]

I need all the help I can get.

Get ready for a very very long PM my good buddy.

[Santi]

Get ready for a very very long PM my good buddy.

Yeeee

that's what I'm talking about

Santi Sasuke Brain Storming

[Sasuke the Sheik Main]

Yeeee

that's what I'm talking about

Santi Sasuke Brain Storming

Haha yeah.
SSBS ftw
I expressed my thoughts in fullest in that message man... Hope you understand it. =)

[Sasuke the Sheik Main]

Maybe something to add to this?
SHBD?
Short Hop Bomb Drop.
You can pull out a bomb, and drop it on the level in a short hop. >_>
I'm making a vid of it and its uses.

[edde]

shdb is pretty much a mindgame, lets see what ur vids got ;o

been away for a week, graduation trip, and in a few days ill be gone fore 2 more weeks

see the 0 death combo thing i wrote there? its paying off big, usually does 59%+ damage and sometimes kills, thats pretty much what ive been up to lately as TL

[noelwashere]

whats utilt?

[Beagle007]

Thanks everyone this is going to help a lot! :)