Any tips against Falco?

[Nowaytoeatatater]

I'm doing better against the Falco that keeps kicking my *** with TL than I am with Falcon (Falcon vs. Falco is simply hopeless). However, he still manages to kick my ***.

My biggest problem is his recovery. No matter how hard I try, I just can't gimp it (he knows better then to end up in a position that forces him to use Fire Bird, because that lets me dair him, so he uses Phantasm). Is there any way to do that?

[Recognize]

Falco is hard, because he can outcamp you (preety easily IMO) great projectile and a reflector. TL doesent have anything that will get someone below the stage, bairs and arials always make them fly upwards. Best would be getting him too far off the stage so that he cant phantasm back on but...
thats all I can think of for now x.x

I play against a rape pikachu so I always have to approach, mainly with bomb and boom combo and rush him.

[Nowaytoeatatater]

Come to think of it, he is somewhat reflector happy, so I might be able to bait him and then punish him.

But he adapts quickly, so after I do it one or two times, he'll start punishing the hell out of me for it.

[JesiahTEG]

http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=169292

This is the matchup thread, the Falco section is completed. Check it out to find out more about the matchup. Also, next time you have a question about a specific matchup, it'd probably be easier to just post in that thread. xD

[edde]

heres a tip that you can use to finish early a falco

when hes at low % lure him to near the edge, when you have a possibility, downsmash him facing to the center of the stage so that the dsmash low % weird effect works... he will get knocked horizontally and a bit down... now... hog him, bare in mind that you must regain your edge hog invincibility frames so his recovery wont get oyu off the edge (to do this, press stick away from the edge while hanging and press z fast, this will quickly give you inv frames, also, you can only do this 3 times until you hit the ground so, keep it in mind).... this works since his recov is pretty crappy

if he spams... stand still, crouching will make his bullets hit your head (not 100% sure of this though)

bombs are your best projectile, space him well on the floor, on the air be ready to airdodge since his jumps have both great reach and speed... just watchout for him... oh and his chaingrab... another reason to space well

im in a rush, cant tell much more, g2g

[3transfat]

B-Throw off of the stage, bear bear jump bear bear recover.

As long as you can get him in the position, you can easily quadruple (possibly quintuple) bear him outside of phantasm range.

As for the rest of it, I'm not sure. If he doesn't know how to SHDL you can approach with some short hops while throwing bombs or using your hookshot.

Or, his lasers will just hit your shield and disappear if you stand still for them.

[Shanky]

I always struggle with Falcos at first, but by the second or third stock he's pretty easy to read. One of my favorite tricks is to B-throw off the edge, anticipate his phantasm (sideB) and unleash a fully-charged UpB. Works for a while until they realize it.

But yeah, that annoying reflector makes it hard to use projectiles effectively. Try and keep him in the air as much as possible, don't be predictable and watch out for that Fsmash. You always think you're out of range, and then he hits you! Pretty annoying.

And yeah, Bair chains are your friend. And if you ever do get him to firebird make sure you dair spike him! It's probably the easiest spike after Ness/Lucas's recovery.

[gkrackerr]

B-Throw off of the stage, bear bear jump bear bear recover.



lmao @ bear. Ima use that from now on.

but yeah, b-throw off the edge and then force him to use his up-b to recover then intercept.

Way's to force him to use up-b. Bomb him so he either air-dodges and drops lower himself, or he gets hit and pushed further away. SHDA to block anything a little bit above the edge. Boomerang him when he jumps up after being b-throwed.

And once you got him under the stage and using his up-b instead of phantasm, you can fair him, nair him, or edgehog him (like drop-> tether, drop -> tether etc. to keep your invincibility frames going)

[Ezkl]

Yeah i play against a lot of falco, for me i learned to space with z-air. Usually try not to jump straight into him cuz he can just shield and grab but use it while keeping your distance and if you hit approach him with a n-air.

[Aziel]

And, just in case someone is rather lazy.

Falco goes even with Toon Link. They can both do some pretty shady things to each other, so really it just comes down to who is the better player. Starting off, like most people already know, Falco can chaingrab Toon Link to around 40%, his lasers can be a pain in the butt, and he can run away quickly using his Side B. Falco has some priority through his attacks, mainly his Dair. He has a bit of range also, which can screw you up sometimes. Lastly, Falco's shield pressure game is really good, so it's going to be hard for Toon Link to attack out of shield, which is already hard because not many of Toon Link's attacks are quick enough to punish out of shield anyways. For Toon Link's favor, he doesn't get raped by projectiles as badly as other characters, due to Toon Link having projectiles of his own. He has more range and priority than Falco, a better recovery, and he can kill Falco easier than Falco can kill him.

As far as projectiles go, both characters should take about the same amount of damage, if not Toon Link should deal more damage. Don't sit back and let Falco laser spam you, but get in range where you can hit him with projectiles, and he'll be afraid to laser you because you're so close. Sneak your projectiles in between your attacks, via missed techs, while your opponent is recovering etc...You have more uses for your projectiles than Falco does, so make sure to be using them at all times. Falco does have his reflector, but the uses for his projector are more in theory than in actual practice. Sure he'll reflect a few of your projectiles if you get spam happy, but it's not like he's going to be reflecting them all. If you can catch Falco full hop double lasering, you can run under the second laser and hookshot grab him when he lands.

As far as actual onstage fighting goes, it's about even. Falco can really do a number to your shield, and if you let go to punish some of his attacks, you'll find yourself getting hit by any of his attacks really. Falco has some range and priority, but you still outrange and outprioritize him. Using retreating aerials on his shield works well, and shooting an arrow before you land also is good. Basically, Falco should have a tough time punishing you out of shield, like most characters should. The shield game is pretty much even here, due to Toon Link's amazing DI and Falco's quick attacks. Both characters shouldn't have too much of a hard time approaching each other because of this fact also. I find that Toon Link's hookshot grab works very well in this matchup for some reason. Anyways, combo like always using Bairs too. In terms of killing, Toon Link should have a much easier time killing Falco than Falco will killing Toon Link. This is because your killing moves are stronger, come out quicker, and becuase you outrange and prioritize Falco.

Edgeguarding goes to Toon Link, due to the fact that Falco's recovery is predictable/easily gimped, while there's nothing really Falco can do aside from shoot lasers if you are far away off the stage...Which shouldn't happen much. If Falco Side B's, he will either end up on the stage or on the ledge. If you suspect he's going for the ledge, edgehog. If he's going for the stage, you can shield his Side B and then punish with a running Usmash or grab, or if your timing is good enough simply Usmash them out of it. If Falco is forced to use his Up B, simple Dair spike him or edgehog...Almost all of the time, Falco's Up B will be too short to get back on the stage if you are grabbing it. He's easy to gimp.

Overall, the matchup is even, if anything leaning towards Toon Link, but I'll call it even for now, due to the fact that Falco is just an amazing character in general with his potential not really fully discovered. Toon Link can kill Falco better, and Edgeguard him better, while Falco can chaingrab you to 40% and then Dair spike you, and the rest of the aspects are even. 5/5 Even.

[Hype]

Nair/Fair to quick bow is your best friend in this match up. space well and make sure your playing really "safe." what i mean by this is aviod using attacks with alot of lag (ie. F smash) unless a certain situation arises. I find that vs falco the slightest mistakes get you punished really badly, espesially at low percent because of chain grabs.

Although this works WAY better with Marth I just thought I'd mention it because your talked about punishing his recovery. When I send him off the map and I'm pretty sure he's going to phantasm I roll at the edge off the map (so I'm right at the edge facing towards the center). from there I either tap diagonally down to edgehog or I foxtrot forward a few steps then pivot smash. This way he has very minimal time know if I'm gonna edgehog or not and its harder for the falco to safely recover based on my actions. I just want to say again that it much more effective with marth but still useable with TL.

[Sanzi]

when he fb onto the stage learn the timing of it and punish him with a fair or bair

what i do against falco is space myself at the right distance so if he decides to up b from under the edge i can edge guard, and if he decides to fb onto level, i can smash him

[the melon!!!!!]

To be honest, I don't see any sort of problem you could have with edgeguarding a Falco. I myself prefer the nair to ledgehog, since the nair has more lateral knockback then the Fair and they'd need to hit the edge to survive. Don't worry. Follow everyone else's advice. They SEEM to know what they're doing. Everything I tested and found to be noob-free truth.