Hows my Toon Link?

[Ryos4]

Hes really only my secondary, but sometimes i feel like he plays better then pit. I only have a few videos up with toon link. Usually his matches take longer then 3 mins. Anyway...

Vs Captain Falcon (Nk)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZlFJ_Tza0Q
Vs Bowser (Kidd)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z47rO0cmRI8

Whatcha guys think? And aside from people telling me to not use so many Dairs (key part of my strat lol), any advice? And yes i like bombs. lol.

[3transfat]

Learn to bow cancel. If you hit the B button just before you hit the ground you'll shoot an arrow with no lag. Your nair and bear work great for easy timing of this.

Stop dair spamming. It's really predictable, and I'm upset with the Captain Falcon player for not punishing it. It's not a key part of your game. You'll eventually play someone who makes punishing you a key part of their game.

Stop fsmash spamming. You wasted a good kill move. If you notice he shields the first hit, stop. Everyone and their grandmother knows Toon Link has that optional hit.

Ledgeguard. I noticed around twice that you could have killed him with a ledgeguard. Toon Link can edgehog really easily as well. Just hit back on the control stick, then press Z twice (presuming thats your grab button).

Use more bombs. Throw them as you're coming back onto the stage. Neither of your opponents edgeguarded either, but you can deter them further with some bombs and arrows.

[Ryos4]

i know how to bow cancel. lol. And i use dair alot soo people will try to predict it. Its a nice lure for them to try to dash attack, grab or smash. All i have to do is dodge asap and then counter. Not to mention i like the dair float as well. Mind games lol, get them to think they have you, then u take that opportunity to punish them.

And i dont think i spam the Fsmash. If anything i spam up tilts. And up tilts still kill more often then the Fsmash. Besides the Fsmash is easier to block. Not to mention that it also has a chance of completely missing the second strike on certain characters. Like kirby, u can miss the second swing if u use it too fast, and if use the second swing alil too late they will shield, dodge, or jump. And no, not ever one shields the second strike.

About the bombs as a defense against edge guarding, if they arnt doing it, then why bother? Its not like i dont know that basic tactic. And as for ledge guarding, u must mean edge hogging. Against the Cf it most likely woudnt have worked. Just because he was going over the stage ledge most of the time so it wouldnt have made a difference, the only sort of edge guarding i probably could have done would be to chase him off stage, but with Cf thats rather dangerous considering his side special spike.

I probably have more to say on this subject but im about to have a match. Maybe later. lol.

[3transfat]

Why didn't you bow cancel then?
So you're willing to get punished at least twice so you can punish them once?
If they don't block the second hit the first time they will the second time.
Captain Falcon's side special incapacitates him. It's only safe to use it high above the stage. Throw more bombs, shoot arrows, anything to stop him. Edgehogging is so easy and all you did was stand on the stage.

All I'm saying is that you're more predictable than gravity.

[ADMJP]

well, if you continue to play people that would have trouble with lvl 3 cpus, then dont bother fixing your tink.

But, if not then the dairs have to go, close range projectiles need to stop, less grabs, etc.

Im guessing you play this guy alot, and hes worse than my kid brother who plays a meta knight slower than ddd. You should be easily 3 stocking him if you are even going to take tink seriously. Especially when he's playing CF and Bowser.

[AvantGarde]

Use arrows way more. SHDA is love. There were so many opportunities in those vids for free damage with arrows. As previously said, don't use dair. Bombs are for mind games, dair is for masochists. I would also suggest switching Fsmash as an offensive move for Downsmash. Dmsash leaves them in the air behind you, a really good position, and Fsmash is slower and clunkier.

[Ryos4]

lol wow everyones just telling me to spam arrows. I already feel that i am dangerously close to spamming. There is no way im gonna use more projectiles. lol. U think u can beat NK, go ahead and challenge him. If any of you frequent on gamefaq, he can beat holy, ally, kyou, ec. The top gamers on gamefaq. I forget what his name is on there. And dude, the bowser and CF are 2 different people. the boswer is admittedly was not a good player. If you think NK is so junk go play him. his aim is slashofdarkness.

Anyway im such a horrible player then you should have no problem beating me. I hate toon link mirror matches but meh if thats the only character you can play then so be it. Hit me up on aim or msn, if u guys think ur so great. Oh and spamming that is soo sad, if a toon link has to restort to spamming then u arnt a very good player.

And for your guys information, these are friendly matches, not competitive ones. if it was they would have been their mains, these are the only ones i could get replays of. Say what u want about how junk u think i am, toon link isnt even my main. But keep ur comments about the other players too urself. Its so low to insult people who arnt even around to defend themselves. You should be ashamed.

[plural]

ryos, i have to disagree..

all of toon link's b moves are projectiles (other than ^B) for a reason.

projectiles are a part of toon link's game, so i guess spamming is too. It isn't that you aren't a good player, thats like getting angry when a marth uses a bunch of fairs or snake brings out the ftilts.

[Ryos4]

actually no because while he has them, u dont have to use them for spamming long distance. its just easier because they made this game way to camp friendly. Slow gravity, easy to dodge now, instant dodge to smash, not to mention if ur camping out and ur opponent is running around he will trip way more then you. Overall this game is set to make camping easy. I dont really care what is the best idea, or what is the best options to do.

Besides just because u can do something, doesnt mean you have to. Pit can be a spammy sob, but i dont play that way and i still beat people, probably more so then i would with spamming. all you toon links are just afraid to get into the fray. lol His attacks are really fast with light knock back, perfect for juggling people. Spammers just take the easy way out, anyone can spam, how does that take skill. lol.

If you wanna play that way just go play wolf and spam ur blaser and fsmash across the field. Idk about you guys, but i play fair. I dont do whatever it takes to win, its just a game. In fact i either steer clear of characters i think are cheap for certain reasons, either that or i dont use the cheap style of play, and im still able to win. example being pika's Dsmash, really fast, lots of hits so its hard to side step it, nice knock back that can lead into thunder.

Anyway marths Fairs arnt cheap, they are easy to get around with a simple air dodge or dodge roll behind them. Not to mention shield grabbing and what not. The "cheapest" move marth has is his Fsmash, and that isnt even that bad. Spamming projectiles are completely different, theres no way to really counter aside from reflectors. And if they run and shoot the whole match and ur say bowser, what chances do u have for winning are much lower.

Also even if something is punishable doesnt mean its a bad move, like falcon punch or links Dair. It may have a huge weakness in it, but the reward if it does land out weights the risk. So meh.

[ADMJP]

i love it when people ask for criticism, but when they get something they dont agree with, they argue with the hopes of getting what they desire...

but anyway, when it comes to most games, the people on each game's boards on gamefaqs are noobs.

Also, if this NK is really as good as you say he is, then he should know TL's moves. He was playing as if it were his first time seeing a TL allowing all those obvious dairs and not punishing the multiple ones you missed.

And no, giving your opponent a free smash/aerial from a missed dair spike isnt worth the low chance of connecting with it.

And if you have a problem with spamming, then i advise you drop TL right now, or dont plan on going far with him. Especially once you run into a decent MK/Marth/G&W etc.

[The_Fool]

If something works, do it.

Spamming works.

Just don't get predictable.

[BattleChrist]

I'll give a simple answer to your thread "Hows my Toon Link" It's not vary good, there are lots of things you could do to get better and people have told you what they are so maybe instead of getting all defensive how about you try some of the advice you've been given.

[Ryos4]

i stated in my first post not to tell me too use less Dairs, and as the person above u stated, if it works use it. And the dair works for me.

How can i not be defensive about it "You are more predictable then gravity." Nothing positive what so ever, not even about the small combo i did at 1:30 against CF. Nothing about the fact that im using diagonal Dairs. I dont see anyone else doing that. Even if the path of the Dair is predictable, no one really expects it to move in a diagonal path, tell me thats predictable. Its also a nearly unstoppable defensive attack for people who really like to chase. When most people knock someone up they will immediately chase them, a small jump followed by an instant Dair will not only prevent them from following up but also has a good chance of hitting them. If it does miss them they will be in the air unable to attack you.

This can also be changed up with a floating Dair. While it is a possibility someone will be able too follow you up, such as sonic. If ur moving horizontally while u float it will be harder to aim at you, and if they come straight below you they will run into ur sword.

It seems apparent that most of you dont know what potential the dair has. Most of you just think its useless just because theres a slight lag at the end and you think it has a predictable path. But as you could see from the CF video, it has 3 or 4 types of movements coming from one attack. The air pocket you create is usually enough to keep them away from you long enough for you to put up ur shield or sidestep.

I think the Bair is more predictable, most toon links abuse it. As most people know only the second hit is unavoidable, however any hit before or after that can easily be air dodged. And if your fighting style differs from the majority of players, its obvious that u wont be as predictable as them.

[Ryos4]

For any of those who think i am predictable and my toon link is junk, then i challenge you to a set.

For certain im not the best toon link out there. But im not nearly as bad as all of you are trying to make me out to be. If you want to prove otherwise, im right here. If ur not willing to take that challenge then keep ur distructive crit to yourself.

Edit: oops double post, i thought the other post didnt go through. Oh well.

[ADMJP]

Its clear that your bubble has been burst. Next time just go to Gamefaqs and ask them and maybe theyll praise you. But for your so-called groundbreaking dairs, even if the person you were playing was stupid enough to get close beneath a TL, unless the person was just not too bright, he wouldnt do it over and over again.

Your mentality in playing is already flawed. This game is about winning, you do everything within the rules to win. Limiting yourself by your own rules only defeats yourself. You should definitely check out higher levels of play in tourney vids to see that you will need to do all you can as TL to rack up damage against the better competition out there.

Also, if it will quit your whining.......your toon link is perfect. /lies

[BattleChrist]

I'll play you in a set.

[3transfat]

I don't know BC this guy is legit.

/sarcasm

[BattleChrist]

You might be right :psycho:

[riboflavinbob]

i was playing this godly toon link yesterday named "DRAGN" and wow, you really have to use your projectiles to keep your enemy away and rack up some damage. for example - arrow arrow -> jump and throw boomerang down to prevent enemy from jumping to avoid damage -> keep a bomb handy. you really have to use down smash more too it hits twice i think. use your dair as a spiker not a damage dealer, its too easily avoided. and try to put some more bair into your combos, it hits hard and does a good amount of damage.

[ph00tbag]

I just have one word for you: spacing. Space your aerials better.

Other than that, the others have given good advice.

[Ryos4]

K well i fought battlechrist today. And i 2 stock him in almost every match that i was toon link. And then he played toon link and i 2 stocked him with pit. No mirror matches just because we both hated them. I have 2 of the matches that were short enough to catch a replay maybe ill put them up after. lol.

You can keep telling me how junk my style is if u want, but after you beat me. lol.

Soo anyone else want a few matches? Some time later tonight or tomarrow.

[BattleChrist]

Haha wow you're a *****, im glad you think you're good why dont you go to a real tournament and see why onine doesn't mean sh!t lol.

[Ryos4]

lol i dont think im good. Atleast not as good as you think you are. lol. Its really not my fault u cant handle gameplay online. I sorta think its funny when people make excuses about button lag. I mean i had the same button lag as you. Besides i saw your basic strat for toon link. It wasnt anything to be impressed about. You just seemed to say out of both our ranges and aerial, i assume hoping i would walk into or something idk. You had no real basic attack strat, only just a defensive style. Staying back and hoping i would walk into ur attacks. You were oh so predictable. I even mind gamed u into the dairs. I didnt use as much since because of snakes up smash.

Its weird how people are saying how predictable i am, and yet what he says is that he just reacts. If you just react, then obviously, it wouldnt matter how predictable i am if all you do is react to what i do.. lol. I on the other hand predict more then i react, which in my opinion takes more skill then just reacting.

Oh and look whos getting defensive now. lol. And let me tell you, i play against someone who plays offline really well, never really loses a match and even one the only tournament they went to, for like 600 bucks i think idk. And that player does really well online, and usually beats most people online as well. Sure he cant reach his full potential online, but the same goes for everyone else.

[BattleChrist]

First off i wasn't the one who said you're predictable, and i never once said i was good. You can keep thinking you mind gamed me if you like but really you just button mash more than me and thats what it takes to be good online.

[ADMJP]

Now, im not going to act as if i was there or not, but the distance from idaho to hawaii is big enough to throw off someone that isnt used to it.

I also prescribe to the online doesnt mean much unless the proximity is there and even still it can be bad. Then again, i have enough decent competition around me that i dont have to try online that much.

[Ryos4]

Well online plays really different from offline. Its relatively hard to shield ontime. So mostly i just spot dodge which is weirdly faster. If shield ever does go through its usually a power shield, just because the button lag has about the same lag time as u would have to time a powershield. Most button lag for me is at most a few split secs. Nothing too huge, just effects my defense.

[ADMJP]

Its kind of like a home-field advantage then.

I dunno, it's not beneficial to post these rate threads unless you have data that can be well judged due to all the discrepancies involved.

[Ryos4]

i did forget to say they were both online matches. I do see what your saying about the variables that can effect game play, that may cause problems on basic judging and what not. Though the people that do respond to such posts should also take into account this as well.

Ribo:
You must not fight alot of toon links. For those who do try to spike, end up suiciding. I did notice in my bowser match where i missed an opportunity to spike, but instead i threw a Bair, but what can u do. lol. And about the projectile defense, i do run into alot of people who try to do that, its easy enough to shield, spot dodge or roll to get closer. After one stock you should be able to understand their projectile pattern if they do use it alot. If all else fails you can always shield it, or you could just put constant pressure on them so they dont have time.

[Edds]

its a known fact

spamming online is alot better than doing it offline. people who spam online tend to win alot more. because of button delay and if there smart about spamming then you wont get many hits in. unless you spam back. which drags the match on for a frickin 6mins

[QUIVO]

Online does kinda suck...

[Pep1to]

Ryos don't get mad if people say that your TL is not that good you should know that if anyone mades a "Rate my TL" they will expect critic.

BC if you are going to john after a loss online then i would recommend to not play online :P

Europe vs USA online sucks tought >.<

Nice Toon Link btw just don't spam Dair. and i would recommend to save your Fsmash until your oponnent has high %.