Thechene
07-14-2008, 04:07 AM
well, in the "best toon link" thread i commented that i'd make a good thread of my own for tips on toon link if i did well at the tournament.
well, i did bad at the tournament. it felt like a series of unfortunate events. first tourny though, and i'm confident about the next.
here are my tips on how to improve your toon link. the stuff that nobody else is telling you.
eventually you will see some of my videos and you'll understand why you should take my advice. Until then you're going to have to trust me.
Toon Link can bring a whole lot of combo pain on their enemies. The smashback room weekly/monthly character analysis says that toon link combos really well but fails at creating openings for his finishers. Whoever those experts are, they don't know the full potential of toon link yet.
ZAIR:
Is an AMAZING move. You must practice this move a lot. It should replace your forward air in most cases. You can't fair a grounded enemy, but you can ZAIR a grounded enemy.
The beauty of this move lies in these factors:
toon link floats and has a decent aerial movement speed
zair cancels air dodges
zair has great priority
zair has great speed
zair has low knockback
zair has no landing lag
(also no move decay)
When using the zair you should always get in the habbit of airdodging first. You shouldn't usually fast fall until the end or in certain circumstances. Usuallly you want to hang around in the air floating back and forth adjusting your spacing.
Spacing is key. It is one of the most important concepts when performing this move.
You should always short hop it and never do it on the way up in your jump. You want to land this move into the ground almost everytime.
1) If they dodge the zair:
By the time they return from their dodge, you'll be waiting for them with all the time you need to punish them.
2) If they shield the zair:
If you've been pressuring them and spacing for a while with the zair they start expecting it and they will shield when they realize that you can attack them after the dodge. Poke the zair into their feet. That way the time between you striking their shield and you landing with no lag whatsoever is as small as possible. This way you can be tricky and grab them as soon as you land.
3) If they attack the zair:
If you airdodge before your zair you can usually dodge through projectiles and many times catch projectiles. The chain itself will stop some projectiles too. If you space well you should rarely ever worry about punishment from a melee move. Just don't land too close to them. It outprioritizes practically every move you put it against. Sometimes don't even zair out of your airdodge to mix it up and keep them surprised.
4) If they get hit by the zair:
Most characters are garaunteed one of these three things:
Dash grab
Dash forward shorthop nair in them
dash forward to an upsmash
if you're holding a bomb you can throw it directly when you land
another zair is also possible
marth you only get the upsmash, metaknight you can get the grab. so it depends on the character.
if they DI away or jump out ready your other projectiles.
Especially if you chase with the neutral air. You can do the arrow cancel right before you land.
I arrow people on the ground all the time. It has the effect of like a laser lock type animation. They take the arrow and just bounce away but still are on the ground. Tech chase it. The zair is a good tech chasing move because of its horizontal length. You can usually space it so that a get up or do a roll away will get nicked.
The zair makes people not like being in front of you.
well that's not too bad because of your bair.
so if you pressure them well they might try to roll through. This should always be punished by pulling a bair right off the ground.
Once you add your projectiles to the mix it makes poking people with the zair SO much easier. Throw the boomerang around them. Throw the bombs up and stay behind them. SHDA last.
So order of events:
pull out bomb
throw it up
Jump away under the bomb for protection and then throw the boomerang under them or over them.
Shorthop double arrow them while the bomb is floating/falling and the boomerang is making its way back.
This makes them worry and think and take up mind power by splitting their attention.
They become a lot easier to hit with the zair.
GRAB:
Not many people may want to use toon link's grab because of the lag afterwards.
Well, don't use toon link's grab out of his shield like most characters can do easily. You can usually jump cancel your up B. Unless you KNOW you have the grab. Like when an enemy is silly enough to attack your shield from the air and land infront of you.
So you won't be using it in a traditional way.
I think pivot grabbing is amazing with ranged grabs. Not many people use it to it's fullest potential yet either.
A good way to use the pivot grab is in a retreat. If the enemy is rushing you because there is an opening in your projectile spam, you can dash away from them and pivot grab their advance.
This works especially good for enemies who are trying to aerially approach you through your projectiles. Anticipate the landing area and run away from it. Pivot grab them AS SOON AS THEY HIT THE GROUND.
So you're searching for any moment when an enemy touches the ground. They can airdodge into the ground and do a spot dodge as soon as physically possible but there is still a window exactly when their character touches the ground.
So search for every moment your opponent lands. There are a lot.
The dash grab will work in that fashion.
Dash grab or just shield grab people approaching you on the ground.
If they are inside you and you're close fighting, dash away to pivot grab.
you'd be surprised how far away you can get surprise somebody with a dash grab.
If somebody is close to you and jumps, dash under them to a pivot grab.
Grab through fsmashes too. A lot of characters have high priority fsmashes or fsmashes that move them forward. You can grab those almost all the time.
But i just can't stress how improtant it is to get good at reading where people will land. Also tech reading is easy with the grab. You can dash grab and pivot grab the rolls.
Out of the grab you can bair people like crazy. Or get another grab sometimes if you're sneaky and they land next to you. I like waiting after i throw them down. then jumping inside them with my up air out. By the time the airdodge ends they get hit by my up air.
it's good for those people who think they're clever because they dodge immediately after a throw.
Use these techniques and i think it will make wolf, olimar and metaknight a lot easier to fight. I feel that when you include airdodging and zair, zelda no longer has the advantage. You can dodge the dinn's fire and then zair her. She's a tall target.
EDIT 10/1/09:
I've got some vids up finally that you can look at.
my thread:
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=196787
my youtube username:
http://www.youtube.com/user/thechene
well, i did bad at the tournament. it felt like a series of unfortunate events. first tourny though, and i'm confident about the next.
here are my tips on how to improve your toon link. the stuff that nobody else is telling you.
eventually you will see some of my videos and you'll understand why you should take my advice. Until then you're going to have to trust me.
Toon Link can bring a whole lot of combo pain on their enemies. The smashback room weekly/monthly character analysis says that toon link combos really well but fails at creating openings for his finishers. Whoever those experts are, they don't know the full potential of toon link yet.
ZAIR:
Is an AMAZING move. You must practice this move a lot. It should replace your forward air in most cases. You can't fair a grounded enemy, but you can ZAIR a grounded enemy.
The beauty of this move lies in these factors:
toon link floats and has a decent aerial movement speed
zair cancels air dodges
zair has great priority
zair has great speed
zair has low knockback
zair has no landing lag
(also no move decay)
When using the zair you should always get in the habbit of airdodging first. You shouldn't usually fast fall until the end or in certain circumstances. Usuallly you want to hang around in the air floating back and forth adjusting your spacing.
Spacing is key. It is one of the most important concepts when performing this move.
You should always short hop it and never do it on the way up in your jump. You want to land this move into the ground almost everytime.
1) If they dodge the zair:
By the time they return from their dodge, you'll be waiting for them with all the time you need to punish them.
2) If they shield the zair:
If you've been pressuring them and spacing for a while with the zair they start expecting it and they will shield when they realize that you can attack them after the dodge. Poke the zair into their feet. That way the time between you striking their shield and you landing with no lag whatsoever is as small as possible. This way you can be tricky and grab them as soon as you land.
3) If they attack the zair:
If you airdodge before your zair you can usually dodge through projectiles and many times catch projectiles. The chain itself will stop some projectiles too. If you space well you should rarely ever worry about punishment from a melee move. Just don't land too close to them. It outprioritizes practically every move you put it against. Sometimes don't even zair out of your airdodge to mix it up and keep them surprised.
4) If they get hit by the zair:
Most characters are garaunteed one of these three things:
Dash grab
Dash forward shorthop nair in them
dash forward to an upsmash
if you're holding a bomb you can throw it directly when you land
another zair is also possible
marth you only get the upsmash, metaknight you can get the grab. so it depends on the character.
if they DI away or jump out ready your other projectiles.
Especially if you chase with the neutral air. You can do the arrow cancel right before you land.
I arrow people on the ground all the time. It has the effect of like a laser lock type animation. They take the arrow and just bounce away but still are on the ground. Tech chase it. The zair is a good tech chasing move because of its horizontal length. You can usually space it so that a get up or do a roll away will get nicked.
The zair makes people not like being in front of you.
well that's not too bad because of your bair.
so if you pressure them well they might try to roll through. This should always be punished by pulling a bair right off the ground.
Once you add your projectiles to the mix it makes poking people with the zair SO much easier. Throw the boomerang around them. Throw the bombs up and stay behind them. SHDA last.
So order of events:
pull out bomb
throw it up
Jump away under the bomb for protection and then throw the boomerang under them or over them.
Shorthop double arrow them while the bomb is floating/falling and the boomerang is making its way back.
This makes them worry and think and take up mind power by splitting their attention.
They become a lot easier to hit with the zair.
GRAB:
Not many people may want to use toon link's grab because of the lag afterwards.
Well, don't use toon link's grab out of his shield like most characters can do easily. You can usually jump cancel your up B. Unless you KNOW you have the grab. Like when an enemy is silly enough to attack your shield from the air and land infront of you.
So you won't be using it in a traditional way.
I think pivot grabbing is amazing with ranged grabs. Not many people use it to it's fullest potential yet either.
A good way to use the pivot grab is in a retreat. If the enemy is rushing you because there is an opening in your projectile spam, you can dash away from them and pivot grab their advance.
This works especially good for enemies who are trying to aerially approach you through your projectiles. Anticipate the landing area and run away from it. Pivot grab them AS SOON AS THEY HIT THE GROUND.
So you're searching for any moment when an enemy touches the ground. They can airdodge into the ground and do a spot dodge as soon as physically possible but there is still a window exactly when their character touches the ground.
So search for every moment your opponent lands. There are a lot.
The dash grab will work in that fashion.
Dash grab or just shield grab people approaching you on the ground.
If they are inside you and you're close fighting, dash away to pivot grab.
you'd be surprised how far away you can get surprise somebody with a dash grab.
If somebody is close to you and jumps, dash under them to a pivot grab.
Grab through fsmashes too. A lot of characters have high priority fsmashes or fsmashes that move them forward. You can grab those almost all the time.
But i just can't stress how improtant it is to get good at reading where people will land. Also tech reading is easy with the grab. You can dash grab and pivot grab the rolls.
Out of the grab you can bair people like crazy. Or get another grab sometimes if you're sneaky and they land next to you. I like waiting after i throw them down. then jumping inside them with my up air out. By the time the airdodge ends they get hit by my up air.
it's good for those people who think they're clever because they dodge immediately after a throw.
Use these techniques and i think it will make wolf, olimar and metaknight a lot easier to fight. I feel that when you include airdodging and zair, zelda no longer has the advantage. You can dodge the dinn's fire and then zair her. She's a tall target.
EDIT 10/1/09:
I've got some vids up finally that you can look at.
my thread:
http://smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=196787
my youtube username:
http://www.youtube.com/user/thechene