Toon Link vs Yoshi?

[hdrevolution123]

Hi there. I have this friend on brawl but he's also a Smash Debater here in a different forum section and he is a true Yoshi master. He makes Yoshi seem top tier. I, as a developing Toon Link player, would like to improve and thus prove to him that I can step up to him against his all powerful Yoshi. I checked but I couldn't find a matchup with Toon Link and Yoshi in this forum section however I saw one matchup with Yoshi against Toon Link in the Yoshi discussion where they were yapping on about Toon Link spamming. Screw them. Anyway I'd like to ask if anyone here has either a comprehensive or concise yet informative matchup for Toon Link against Yoshi so I will have some idea about what action I can take against him to survive in a match against my friend and perhaps stand a chance in beating him.

Factors I might be looking for are how to play offensively in this matchup (without spamming too much), how to play well defensively in this matchup and how to edgeguard against this character (I know though his recovery methods are pristine they will make him falter and use up-B repeatedly with fail). If anyone can do this for me I would truly appreciate it. It's a fairly common task which is what a lot of Smash debaters or researchers do here so thanks in advance.

HD

[Fenii]

Hey there HD. I'm not one of them fancy debaters or researchers that are common here, but I know both characters through and through. And having Yoshi as my main, I know potential ways how to beat me.

First of all, and probably the most important thing: Yoshi is fairly weak in the air. Give him a good hit while he's airborne (after his second jump) and he'll be in a pickle. The way I counter this is using my Yoshi Bomb (Down+B). He then hurls himself to the ground, shooting stars sideways on landing. Follow his route and hit him in his only blind spot (his head) by using your Down+A attack in the air, which should stab him right in face basicly. Of course, these actions should be performed at a really high pace, we're talking about a period of less then a second.

Anyway, when Yoshi's airborne, I suggest a Up+A attack in the air, sending him flying.

Second notice covers ground attacks. Yoshi's smash-attacks are no laughing matter, he's just strong! This means you need to try to keep distance whenever you can. Your boomerang is a good solution, as well as equiping a bomb regularly and hurling this at him too. SHOULD he get close, I recommend the Downward Smash-attack; although it has limited range, it packs a hefty punch. An alternative is just a Sideways Smash-attack. Keep in mind that Toon Link can strike TWICE in this attack, with his second slash being the strongest.

Eventhough this isn't the most information I can offer, these are the points you should train on. It's not like you can just adapt any fighting style someone suggests. Keep your own swing throughout the match, or else actions might become repetitive and obvious to your opponent.

So, synopsis: Yoshi is heavy, strike him HARD! Try to do so by smashing him UP while he is in the air, and don't let the green bugger get too close.

If you need more details, you can always ask! Hopefully I've been some help!! :D

[hdrevolution123]

Hey there HD. I'm not one of them fancy debaters or researchers that are common here, but I know both characters through and through. And having Yoshi as my main, I know potential ways how to beat me.

First of all, and probably the most important thing: Yoshi is fairly weak in the air. Give him a good hit while he's airborne (after his second jump) and he'll be in a pickle. The way I counter this is using my Yoshi Bomb (Down+B). He then hurls himself to the ground, shooting stars sideways on landing. Follow his route and hit him in his only blind spot (his head) by using your Down+A attack in the air, which should stab him right in face basicly. Of course, these actions should be performed at a really high pace, we're talking about a period of less then a second.

Anyway, when Yoshi's airborne, I suggest a Up+A attack in the air, sending him flying.

Second notice covers ground attacks. Yoshi's smash-attacks are no laughing matter, he's just strong! This means you need to try to keep distance whenever you can. Your boomerang is a good solution, as well as equiping a bomb regularly and hurling this at him too. SHOULD he get close, I recommend the Downward Smash-attack; although it has limited range, it packs a hefty punch. An alternative is just a Sideways Smash-attack. Keep in mind that Toon Link can strike TWICE in this attack, with his second slash being the strongest.

Eventhough this isn't the most information I can offer, these are the points you should train on. It's not like you can just adapt any fighting style someone suggests. Keep your own swing throughout the match, or else actions might become repetitive and obvious to your opponent.

So, synopsis: Yoshi is heavy, strike him HARD! Try to do so by smashing him UP while he is in the air, and don't let the green bugger get too close.

If you need more details, you can always ask! Hopefully I've been some help!! :D

Well for being a Yoshi player yourself, you have been highly helpful to me but since you too have a good idea about Yoshi's ability perhaps you could train me to defeat my friend. He hasn't been frustrating to me yet because we only brawled once yet I want my second attempt to be memorable. So could you perhaps brawl me sometime? Shall I add you in my friends roster in brawl?

[Fenii]

That sounds excellent! I'll also add you to my friends list right here on the boards, that way, we'll be able to see each other's availability!

Just a question though, how long have you and your friend been playing Smash in general, and just how experienced is he with Yoshi??

[hdrevolution123]

That sounds excellent! I'll also add you to my friends list right here on the boards, that way, we'll be able to see each other's availability!

Just a question though, how long have you and your friend been playing Smash in general, and just how experienced is he with Yoshi??

Great! I shall I add you as a friend in brawl now. I have only brawled my friend just once but I have a fair deal of experience in brawl. I've had brawl only since it came out on London. I didn't have Melee or Smash 64. I know for a fact that people really admire him for his Yoshi skills and one of his friends (who's a Yoshi player as well) says he's the guy who's making Yoshi top tier. I agree to some extent but still I have to focus on improving myself.

So let's brawl now. We should add each other on brawl now.

[Fenii]

I'll try to give you some pointers here. First of all, I wasn't playing at my full potential, as you need to learn how to counter some of Yoshi's moves. What noticed me the most was your use of the Boomerang+Arrow combo, it's a very good way to keep me at a distance. However! Matches aren't won with moves like that. Toon Link is fast: use that to your advantage. You need a find a way to close in on me after using your projectiles and getting me out of the stage.

Also, too much distance between players is annoying (at least in my eyes) and you will lose the respect of the more casual smash-players such as myself. Most fighting should be done at striking distance, and I don't know if you've noticed, but that's when the battles are most intense and fun to play.

All in all, I was pretty impressed by the skill level you've built in such a short amount of time. Six months isn't that much to get decent at the game. Anyway, for further training, PM me and we can settle a date and time. There's just some days when I'm not available to play on! :P So, when I'm not around, you can always take on the computer to analyse Yoshi's moves and attacks.

[hdrevolution123]

I'll try to give you some pointers here. First of all, I wasn't playing at my full potential, as you need to learn how to counter some of Yoshi's moves. What noticed me the most was your use of the Boomerang+Arrow combo, it's a very good way to keep me at a distance. However! Matches aren't won with moves like that. Toon Link is fast: use that to your advantage. You need a find a way to close in on me after using your projectiles and getting me out of the stage.

Also, too much distance between players is annoying (at least in my eyes) and you will lose the respect of the more casual smash-players such as myself. Most fighting should be done at striking distance, and I don't know if you've noticed, but that's when the battles are most intense and fun to play.

All in all, I was pretty impressed by the skill level you've built in such a short amount of time. Six months isn't that much to get decent at the game. Anyway, for further training, PM me and we can settle a date and time. There's just some days when I'm not available to play on! :P So, when I'm not around, you can always take on the computer to analyse Yoshi's moves and attacks.
Thank you very much. I do hope to brawl you again sometime. Note that I have acknowledged everything you said there. I will have to initiate some theoretical research about Toon Link myself. I feel like I'm at university :-)

[TheFast]

Why you are having trouble fighting Yoshi is because he is top tier material. You are one of the few people who has played an actual Yoshi player. Yoshi is an amazing all around character with not many bad match ups, and his bad match ups are still winnable. Never underestimate a character. Anywho I can give you some tips on Yoshi.

1st edge guarding Yoshi is a myth..... its not very good to chase one off the edge. With ToonLink vs Yoshi is better to just send projectile out when fighting Yoshi. You arnt going to gimp him but you might get a couple of damage in. This Yoshi player said hit him after his 2nd jump when he is in the air. Well if you can do that go for it but all the Yoshi players I know will not let that happen. They use eggs to recover saving their 2nd jump only for desperate times. Even when they do it they can air-dodge the whole 2nd jump or sweet spot the edge to avoid getting hit after it. All in all you do want to try and keep Yoshi is the air, just not off the side. Sexy kick stage spikes, and flutter kicks to stole hops are not good.

2nd advancing through the air is a bad move. His forward smash and pivot grab can catch you off guard. If he EVER rolls rush in thats one of Yoshi's weaknesses. You should always try to force him to advance since you should be able to out camp him. Yoshi has far less options advancing than defending making him easier to predict.

3rd his down-b (from the ground) kills at about 120% so be aware of your damage and avoid this move.

Those are a couple of things I can think of right now. I'm a little tired -_-

[sasukebowser]

Yoshi's as basic as Game and Watch with a short wave dash.
Just predict him and that it. Play Melee if it helps.

[bigman40]

Who is this guy you're talking about? I'd like to know his name.

And Yoshi is not as basic as GW.

[hdrevolution123]

Yoshi's as basic as Game and Watch with a short wave dash.
Just predict him and that it. Play Melee if it helps.

Hi sasukebowser. I understand you're a downright Toon Link master and I'm an advancing amateur with TL so could you train me privately with Toon Link please, if you can? It would very grateful of you to help a fellow Toon Link supporter as I do feel I'm more successful with him than any other characters now (apart from a few others).

So can you help me please? In turn I will be more confident and rife with tactics to act offensively and defensively against my Smash friend who's a Yoshi master.

Thanks sasukebowser

HD

[hdrevolution123]

Why you are having trouble fighting Yoshi is because he is top tier material. You are one of the few people who has played an actual Yoshi player. Yoshi is an amazing all around character with not many bad match ups, and his bad match ups are still winnable. Never underestimate a character. Anywho I can give you some tips on Yoshi.

1st edge guarding Yoshi is a myth..... its not very good to chase one off the edge. With ToonLink vs Yoshi is better to just send projectile out when fighting Yoshi. You arnt going to gimp him but you might get a couple of damage in. This Yoshi player said hit him after his 2nd jump when he is in the air. Well if you can do that go for it but all the Yoshi players I know will not let that happen. They use eggs to recover saving their 2nd jump only for desperate times. Even when they do it they can air-dodge the whole 2nd jump or sweet spot the edge to avoid getting hit after it. All in all you do want to try and keep Yoshi is the air, just not off the side. Sexy kick stage spikes, and flutter kicks to stole hops are not good.

2nd advancing through the air is a bad move. His forward smash and pivot grab can catch you off guard. If he EVER rolls rush in thats one of Yoshi's weaknesses. You should always try to force him to advance since you should be able to out camp him. Yoshi has far less options advancing than defending making him easier to predict.

3rd his down-b (from the ground) kills at about 120% so be aware of your damage and avoid this move.

Those are a couple of things I can think of right now. I'm a little tired -_-

Thank you. However the majority of these seem to be warnings about Yoshi. Do you have any attacking tactics with Toon Link vs Yoshi? Any good way to get them off the stage cleanly or effectively? I have decided that I'm not ready for truth of dair yet with Toon Link. It's far too suicidal though fun.

[sasukebowser]

Hi sasukebowser. I understand you're a downright Toon Link master and I'm an advancing amateur with TL so could you train me privately with Toon Link please, if you can? It would very grateful of you to help a fellow Toon Link supporter as I do feel I'm more successful with him than any other characters now (apart from a few others).

So can you help me please? In turn I will be more confident and rife with tactics to act offensively and defensively against my Smash friend who's a Yoshi master.

Thanks sasukebowser

HD

Uh sure.

Do you Zair a lot? Because you should against Yoshi, I don't think there is much he can do against it.

[hdrevolution123]

Uh sure.

Do you Zair a lot? Because you should against Yoshi, I don't think there is much he can do against it.

I'm ready to train now? Shall we. Shall I add your friend code to my roster?

[sasukebowser]

I'm sort of busy.
Maybe tomorrow.

But sure, add me now if you want. Its gonna be laggy though.

[hdrevolution123]

Ok then. Thanks