G&W's down aerial is the key

[PXTalon2000]

Yes, that's right, I am posting a thread to state what should be obvious. G&W's down aerial is awesome. I also think fair is overrated.
I think the down aerial is the most spammable of his aerials, applies the most heavy pressure to shield (especially with that ground hit; if you strike a person's shield, chances are you will get a grab in, since that second hit combos into it), and facilitates L-canceling. You can use it from a full jump and from a short hop and from a double jump and not be nervous about it unless you're dealing with, like, Bowser or Marth. In my experience, it leads more consistently into combos, and the combos into which it leads may be of the utmost power and creativity. For instance: Dair judgement, dair fair, dair upsmash, dair fsmash, dair grab, dair parachute, dair downB, dair dtilt.

In most fights, I use this as my primary aerial. I use the fair more defensively... But I'm willing to talk with supporters of the fair's superior range and power, to see if we can elaborate upon the situations in which one is superior to the other.

[Undrdog]

heh, I was just playing around with his key attack. its pretty funny. its like a mini downward thrust. I tried some of the combos you said, and I had some issues with the papachute. i got off its initial hit but not its power hit. =/

[PXTalon2000]

Ehh.. I don't really know the exact situations during which any one of those combos is applicable. As you probably noticed, the key itself has a variety of knockbacks. All I know is... I use dair... And then do something cool afterwards... Dair to parachute is something I can recall hitting a lot, though.

[omegablackmage]

and lets not forget that if you hit the othe person within the first frame (or maybe the first three or so) you spike them. It may seem hard to do but i can get this off most of the time, pretty useful.

[footnbaseball]

i ALMOST agree completely. my only problem with dair is that shffld, it is not the best approach move due to its lack of horizontal range. you can easily be smacked away by anybody with a little range, heck even a quick smash could get you if their quick enough. so i still try to approach with dair and fair at about a 50:50 ratio, probably leaning more towards fair due to habit.

[omegablackmage]

sticking with shffld fairs is a better idea as it leaves you less open, in some cases i would rather use the parachute than the dair as it can hit in all directions.

[AWrulez]

Low range. Grab or any superior horizontal attack (aerials or ground). Forward aerial has good range, and with good spacing, it's hard to retaliate against. My most commonly used approaches are wavedash to down tilt and shffl'ed forward aerial. I will use down aerial at times if I manage to wavedash into a character though.

[dan smith]

I'd say SHFFL'd Dair is almost as effective an approach move as Fair. It is a lot harder to avoid than you'd think....

Spking is hard...

[omegablackmage]

i will have to put the key into my aerial game more often, at least to see its effectiveness. I use it mostly when coming in from above, but i will try to shffl it.

[AWrulez]

As I stated before, his down aerial lacks range. This makes it a much less reliable approacher than forward aerial. And how is it not as easy to avoid than I think? What am I missing?

The key isn't really the best spike or edgeguarder anyways. I usually stick with forward aerials, parachute, forward smash, etc. But it can surprise people I guess.

[omegablackmage]

the only advantage that i can see with it is that you can't overshoot while shffling because it covers all the way to the ground, other than that i would go with a block or parachute.

[HoChiMinhTrail]

key is much more effective against most characters because simply the pressure it puts on ur opponent's shield allows u to l cancel and hit him with a d-tilt or a grab, which will ussually throw them into one nof GW's death combos, indeed the block's range makes for an excellent ariel offense as well, but comparing the 2, the key takes the bacon.


--; bacon

[Needle of Juntah]

i think Utilt is underrated :/

[HoChiMinhTrail]

heh good story needle, but we are comparing key and black here (-.-)

indeed

[omegablackmage]

i use the u tilt very often, much more than the up smash. The up smash has too much lag to be useful. This leaves the up tilt as the best ground upward defense. It can juggle against low damage and heavy characters. Also i like to take advantage of the disjointed hitbox and high priority (?). It also covers a good range and makes for a great upward defense.

[PXTalon2000]

Upsmash is useful.. You just have to think about when you could use it

[HoChiMinhTrail]

stagger indeed like bowser's forward smash.

[Hoefler]

No trail, G&W fails. Your strat consists of shuffl'd fairs and nairs.

BooOWowowow (")(._. )

[HoChiMinhTrail]

and it will come out on top eventually, and there will be no taking my face. ('')( ._.) he is my companion only.

[Hoefler]

Your's is looking the other way though. Mine's unique.

"Alright now... what the he-- does this say?"

Heh...

I'm serious about your strat though.

[HoChiMinhTrail]

the turtle cares not......

[Scav]

311 and HoChi need to stop spamming up every thread, even if they're threads in a relatively inactive board.

From the best I can tell, you two are having a Spammy competetion. Cease.

-Scav

[TheKoopaBros.]

The Dair(key stab) is quite useful,but don't rely on it and do nothing else or you'll get Ko'd quick.

Fair should be used just as often as it has extra reach and can block moves like Ganondorf's Bup attack and some of Peach's attacks.

[omegablackmage]

the fair (coupled with good priority and reach) can get around most characters attacks.

[PXTalon2000]

Originally posted by omegablackmage
the fair (coupled with good priority and reach) can get around most characters attacks.

Want a cookie..? x.x

[omegablackmage]

well he did make it sound like the fair only worked on ganon and peach which is very untrue, no need for you to go around and belittle people.

[TheKoopaBros.]

Originally posted by omegablackmage
well he did make it sound like the fair only worked on ganon and peach which is very untrue, no need for you to go around and belittle people.

I was using those 2 characters as an example. As I find Fair essential to blocking their attacks.

It does apply to many other characters as you said.

[PXTalon2000]

Originally posted by omegablackmage
well he did make it sound like the fair only worked on ganon and peach which is very untrue, no need for you to go around and belittle people.

Really sahri then.
But you can easily see how I mistook it for something extremely obvious. If you had said "Not just Ganon and Peach's..." or something I would have understood that there was a point to your post.

[omegablackmage]

yeah i probably should have quoted his post, its all good though