G&W mindgames

[goblin]

so i play my friend's marth and i need mad mindgames to even stand a chance w/ g&w since this is such a horrible match up. while in the air i do ok, when a marth is on the ground, ftilts and fsmashes pwn me.

I feel like in the air g&w can do pretty well with a well timed fair against just about any character, even marth. since i think range is g&w's biggest problem, im gonna use marth as my example here.

anyways, does anybody have good advice on approaches?

maybe its just me but even if i dash in, wd out and marth does any move, even a fsmash, i dont really have enough time to pull out any thing before marth can shield.

imo g&w's grab is garbage. since it's so short i dont have the time to get in and grab him even if he is shielding.

however while most other characters u can take out the box or even the key cuz its sorta deceptive how good it is.

so... suggestions?

[footnbaseball]

full hop and key. Ive been saying this from the beginning, and its always worked for me. also, this is a rare occasion where gw's dash attack works. It's so slow that generally marth will attack before you hit him, but its got such good priority that it will clank with most of his ground moves. If you KNOW that he's going to hit you and clank, that gives you an edge. when he clanks with you, downtilt immediately. Also, you have to keep the pressure on. if you hit him once, keep hitting him until he slaps you away.

[omegablackmage]

you need to learn how to jc your grabs with gaw, once i started doing that, my grab game got a lot better with him. Grabs can be an important part of this matchup, any grab could equal an instant death or at least a good combo.

Ill agree with foot on the fullhop key thing, it seems like a simple idea, but when canceled into a green house and a dtilt, it turns into a devastating pressure technique, props for that foot.

I wouldn't say range is gaw's biggest problem, but in that particular matchup, more than likely. Keep tricky with the wavedashes and alwasys be flowing around on the ground, to keep him guessing. If you understand marth's range, you can play around just outside of it and lure your opponent into fsmashing, which will leave a big opening. If you know he's gunna sheild right after a wiffed fsmash, then grab him, its a free grab. Just predict when hes gunne sheild to get free grabs.

[VilNess]

also you can do a landwavedash after fulljump key OR parachute.
might lead to d-tilts or grabs. try it! especially the keylandwavedash is hard...