New Character Suggestions: Questions to Ask Yourself First

[=TF=Omega]

There are way too many threads out there right now with down right obscure or unreasonable characters to implement in SSBB. May I suggest that before posting any more support threads that you logically ask yourself the following questions:

What would the developers do?

Now, I'm not trying to crush anyone's dreams or desires here, cause believe me, I want characters like Ridley in there as much as the next guy, but you have to think from a logical developer's standpoint. A character like Ridley's fighting system woud be so different and radical (the bad radical) from the other characters that he just wouldn't fit.

Would the character stay true to the types of fighters in previous SSB games?

You have to remember, this is a cherished fighting game series for perhaps millions of people around the world, so it has to stay true to the fighting genre. Putting massive dragons in there all of a sudden makes this game into Panzer Dragoon, not our beloved Smash Bros.

Is the character I want from reasonable for the type of game Nintendo is aiming for?

Is it from a game company that has little or no collaboration to Nintendo? Yes the MGS series started on the NES, but it is now primarily on other consoles. You have to remember that just because Snake got in, that doesn't mean it's possible for everybody. Hideo Kojima (MGS series creator) had to beg Nintendo to add Snake in there, and I'm betting it was a tough decision too because of two factors:

1. It's a third party character while SSB games have been purely first party characters in the past.
2. The MGS series is primarily for mature audiences while Nintendo is focused on family entertainment. (I'm not saying kids can't play MGS games!!)

Will the character be accepted by most of the SSB audience? (Is the character popular?)

Shadow the Hedgehog's buddy Sonic has a good chance of getting into SSB, so why can't he? Most people place the blame on Shadow for ruining the Sonic franchise with the mainly abysmal reviews of his new game. This might turn some players away from the game, should he be added.

Try to ask yourselves these questions before decidng on a character you think might have a shot a SSB and you'll be well on your way to making informed and logical decisions. ;)

[Vulpine51]

Good to set some guidelines, but im just too tired to read the whole thing. This is my last post for tonight. Im out like a fat chick in dodgeball.

[FoolyCooly]

http://i64.photobucket.com/albums/h178/GanonFLCL/icon_up.gif You get a gold star for being a genius. Kudos to you.

[_the_sandman_]

Popularity plays a factor as well. Its a game of fame. Smash bros is known for bringing all of the most famous characters of their time together. The Game and Watch games and Kid Icarus might not be that popular now, but for their time they were amazing, and that part makes them famous.

When people throw in Pokemon ideas like Archanine and Zapados out there for Brawl, its just silly. The majority will not see them as popular pokemon characters, but Pikachu, Jigglypuff and Mewtwo on other hand have a whole lot of popularity ever since the game came out.

And also, because they are popular like Cloud and Sephiroth, doesn't mean it makes any sense to add them in. Characters from FF, Rayman, Spyro, ect. don't make sense. They are not part of Nintendo, most of the time they aren't even on a Nintendo system! Try to be reasonable and pick someone that actually has been on a Nintendo system.

Popularity can be tricky sometimes.

I applaud this post, I hope more people read it and think about their posts. There are so many great character ideas out ther that are not noticed because theres just too many bad posts.

[Taramoor]

Well, the obvious answer to the Ridley question is one of continually altering scale.

Ridley changes size (relative to Samus) from game to game. By the time you reach Metroid Prime she's not that much larger than Samus, and would probably fall somewhere into Bowser/DK range if put into the game. Ridley is a perfectly acceptable entry into the character pool, though the fact that she can fly might put a damper on things. Then again, both Pit and Metaknight have wings, so who knows.

The idea of third party characters is somewhat more troublesome and unsavory. Naturally I think the only characters Nintendo will even be considering will be those with a long history of gaming behind them and who are easily identifiable icons like Sonic and Megaman. Characters from Squaresoft titles, as much as we might like them, tend to appear in a single game and are never heard from again, so they won't have near the probability of showing up that the big blue Hedgehog does.

[FoolyCooly]

Rid...Ridley's a guy. All I'm saying.

[Taramoor]

"According to the original instruction manuals for Metroid, Metroid II, and Super Metroid, Ridley is in fact a female of her species. Because Ridley is similar to a dragon, however, many people continued to believe that he/she was male. The debate still rages on even today."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ridley#Ridley_a_Female.3F

I prefer the original version of Ridley. Ridley didn't really become a he until Prime, and it always struck as kind of awesome having this kickass dragon and leader of the Space Pirates be female and have it in for Samus.

[McFox]

The problem with this topic is that these "questions" aren't really as ironclad as they were presented.

What would the developers do?

Most people would not have thought that Game & Watch was feasible before Melee came out. I know this because when he was originally announced, there was a ton of "NO WAY" comments being made here.

Would the character stay true to the types of fighters in previous SSB games?

Is the character I want from reasonable for the type of game Nintendo is aiming for?

Both of these are questions that, before today, most people would have attributed Snake to. Snake really isn't true to previous games, and his hyper-realistic portrayal (in his own series, anyway) is not reasonable for the type of game Nintendo is aiming for.

Will the character be accepted by most of the SSB audience? (Is the character popular?)

People are still warming up to Snake, because a lot of people have a problem with him being a third party character.

Hell, Pichu and Doctor Mario STILL aren't accepted by most of the SSB audience.

It's a nice list, but don't exclude Ridley from the runnings just because you came up with a set of rules that are designed specifically to exclude him.

[Pikawil]

Yes the MGS series started on the NES

Wrong. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metal_Gear_%28video_game%29) It started on the MSX.

[xianfeng]

Yep I read your rules Diddy and the others in my sig are fine (except Waluigi)

[dotdotdot!]

How about a chart of priority. The higher up in the chart, the more deserving a character is to be in S2B2:

1. Heroes: (Ex. Mario, Link, Pit, Baloon Fighter.) The basic protagonist of the video games they star in. Best chance of getting in before any other character.
2. Villains: (Ex. Ridley, Bowser, Gannondorf, Metaknight, King Dedede.) The basic Antagonist of their patron videogame. Very good chance to get in.
3. Secondary Heroes/Helpers: (Ex. Peach, Daisy, Toad.) Helpers and secondary playable characters. Very good chance to get in.
4. Third Party Heroes: (Ex. Snake, Sonic, Pacman.) Third Party Protagonists. Have less chance of getting in than 1-3.
5. Third Party Secondaries: (Ex. Tails) Third party helpers. Have Less chance of getting in before 5.
6. Third Party Villains: (Ex. Liquid, Eggman, Dr. Wily.) Third party antagonists. Have little chance of getting in before the heroes they fight. Why give us villains without heroes after all?
7. Helpful NPCs with names: (Ex. Impa, Tom Nook) Helpful NPCs. More likely as trophies.
8. Minions: (Ex. Koopa, Shyguy, ReDead, Goomba) Minions of higher Villains. More likely as Trophies, or as items/obstacles like in Adventure mode.
9. Faceless NPCs: (Ex. Guy who says "There are many gaurds in the castle.") Faceless, forgettable.

[ToddCam]

I know this hasn't been addressed per se on this forum, but I just wanted to comment on this idea that a character has to be bipedal to be a character. Pikachu is quadripedal, and is a character. It holds items in its mouth.

[Noypi_GjD]

How about a chart of priority. The higher up in the chart, the more deserving a character is to be in S2B2:

1. Heroes: (Ex. Mario, Link, Pit, Baloon Fighter.) The basic protagonist of the video games they star in. Best chance of getting in before any other character.
2. Villains: (Ex. Ridley, Bowser, Gannondorf, Metaknight, King Dedede.) The basic Antagonist of their patron videogame. Very good chance to get in.
3. Secondary Heroes/Helpers: (Ex. Peach, Daisy, Toad.) Helpers and secondary playable characters. Very good chance to get in.
4. Third Party Heroes: (Ex. Snake, Sonic, Pacman.) Third Party Protagonists. Have less chance of getting in than 1-3.
5. Third Party Secondaries: (Ex. Tails) Third party helpers. Have Less chance of getting in before 5.
6. Third Party Villains: (Ex. Liquid, Eggman, Dr. Wily.) Third party antagonists. Have little chance of getting in before the heroes they fight. Why give us villains without heroes after all?
7. Helpful NPCs with names: (Ex. Impa, Tom Nook) Helpful NPCs. More likely as trophies.
8. Minions: (Ex. Koopa, Shyguy, ReDead, Goomba) Minions of higher Villains. More likely as Trophies, or as items/obstacles like in Adventure mode.
9. Faceless NPCs: (Ex. Guy who says "There are many gaurds in the castle.") Faceless, forgettable.


Jigglypuff and Pichu seem to go against this list. Also, wasn't Young Link the protaganist for Zelda games with Adult Link as the secondary hero?

[WindGuru]

'Fan Worship' helps, of course, but I agree that a character doesn't have to be popular to be in...

Oh Noypi, I think that both Link and his younger self were 'Primary Heros', and Jigglypuff and Pichu were added to bulk out a cast with easy-to-make-clones.

[=TF=Omega]

It's a nice list, but don't exclude Ridley from the runnings just because you came up with a set of rules that are designed specifically to exclude him.

I think of them as "more what you call guidelines than actual rules." ;)

(Anyone recognize the quote?)

Back on subject, the primary focus of what I'm trying to say is to think about characters who would be a logical choice for the game rather than a personal preference to any random character in any video game library.

[Mud Buddha]

I think of them as "more what you call guidelines than actual rules." ;)

(Anyone recognize the quot-.

Yarr! Pirates of the Carribean!

So this post isn't useless: I don't care about the feasibility of the character in question, I just wish people woul stick to one god**** thread and not try to make a million more.

This isn't a dig at the thread creator. This thread could have, unfortunately, greater and greater use as the number of hapless newbies joining increases.

[Falling Whistness]

I don't think you can make rules to exclude any character. I think ice climbers and mr. game and watch prove that you don't have to be popular to get in. Snake proves you don't have to be first party, and you don't have to be rated E.

What's awesome about smash is that you get such a diversity of fighters, with such different styles and backgrounds. The only characters I really couldn't see making it are from other fighting games like Street Fighter and Mortal Kombat, or characters who didn't originate in video games, like Dragon Ball Z, or Batman, or something similar.

[Zodiak-Lucien]

pretty good guidelines, though I doubt anyone will follow them.

[Gamingboy]

I think I should also throw in this:

Is your character popular in both America and Japan?

With all of the SSBM characters with the exception of the Fire Emblem guys, you can see that they are all popular (or at least have very large cult followings, like Ness) in both America and Japan. Remember, they are marketing to both Japan and the USA (and Europe), so don't say something that has only been released in the US of A. or Japan. So don't go saying you want to see a player from Super Pro Action Football or Doshin the Giant.

[dotdotdot!]

Jigglypuff and Pichu seem to go against this list. Also, wasn't Young Link the protaganist for Zelda games with Adult Link as the secondary hero?

You could make the case that Pokemon, being a creature of popularity, attributes it's "Main Character" status to the most popular pokemon at the moment, and attributes "Minion" status to every other pokemon. Pikachu and Jigglypuff were the most popular pokemon at the time when PKMN was popular, and Pichu was probably popular by proxy, being that he is Pikachu's unevolved form. Mewtwo is such a demonised pokemon (See the movies) that whether or not he is evil in the games, he is basically the villan by default, what with him being the last guy you have to catch(Thus, the "Last Boss").

Under that rule, then, The most popular Pokemon at the moment (I don't know yet) would have a good chance, while the "Last Boss" pokemon (Like "Deoxys" from Emerald) would have a lesser chance, but still a chance, whether or not you like too many Pokemon in the game. (I don't)

Or you could add a separate group under "First Party Villans" just for Pokemon, I dunno.