Falco vs C-Falcon

[lonejedi]

I need some pointers on Falco vs Captian Falcon. I'm about to play tourney in a week, and a real good C-Falcon is going. What is the best way to Play CF, I don't have much experience with CF, so any advice would be a great help.

[Vall3y]

falco is a hard match up for falcon
SHB mess his approaches well, really easy to combo (waveshines and shffled dairs) and easy to edge guard (basicly even dair spike is enuogh because its so hard for him to sweetspot the ledge, but dsmash and ledgehopped bair are great too) for you
just watch out from the grabs and the tech chase games.. mix di's and techs to confuse him

[JBM falcon08]

Same here, most likely Darkrain is coming up and i've got a tourney this saturday, I main as marth and i'm going to choose falco to counter his falcon, because as marth I have no experience against CF, especially Darkrains. i've got all the advanced technique down, but is there any particular stage i should counterpick against him, his best level is FD, so i'm 2nd guessing if that is the right stage or not to counter pick against him. Any help would be good for both myself and lonejedi (he isn't going to the same tourney as I am i don't believe).

[bornfidelity.com]

>_>

FD can go both ways. If you have a habit of getting grabbed alot, don't go there against Falcons. So i you want free laserspam and waveshine combos, go FD, but be wary of the fearful grabs, Falco gets fcked up badly by Falcons grabs and chasegames. Land behind their shields, for instance, instead of infront -.-
a simple nair cancels a falcon's approach as well, sometimes.
when edgeguarding, and trying to, for instance bair a recovering falcon, be aware of falcon's upB's hitbox and make sure your bair is out first... err, just good luck. however, on a tourney, the chances of winning against a pro player if you dont even have experience against his character are quite dim, id say.

[lonejedi]

Yes I'm going to a different tourney, but the C-Falcon I'm playing is best in Wisconsin, Tapion. I was thinking would't falco's dair be a good edgeguarding technique on FD?

[audreyh]

dont get falcon punched =p

make sure ur quick and manuverable with the sh laser. dont let him grab you, if you get grabbed, dont let him do the tech chasing. on ur first techroll, spot dodge right away. keep spot dodgeing a couple times, he'll prolly figure it out, then just stop teching a couple times... mindgames =p

be aggressive with those lasers.
lasers.
lasers.
lasers.

[lonejedi]

What are good stages to play C-Falcon on, and what are stages that I should ban, and not play on?

[W.Jr]

What you should do is use the lasers most of the time. Also use counter stages,combo alot, and space.

[bornfidelity.com]

What you should do is use the lasers most of the time. Also use counter stages,combo alot, and space.

That's just what any player should do vs. any character.

[lonejedi]

It would be really nice if someone posted some counter stages for C-falcon, and some stages to ban.

[Tin]

i like the captain falcon. but im not good enough with Falco to give anyone advice.

:(

[whiteboyninja]

well as falcon main and falco secondary, i feel like i have a fairly good grip of what they can do to eachother. if the falcon cant ledge tech, falco's down smash will kill him on recovery. every time.
my best weapons against falco as falcon are, as was earlier started, grabs. i have become very good at reflexing reacting to where/if the falco techs to, and not just grab again but stomp, knee, and forward B as well which makes spot dodging difficult to time. id suggest trying to roll sometimes out of that, too.
my second best weapon against falco is a shffl stomp, especially when they keep trying to shine. it pops them up JUST for the right level to shffl a knee at a lot of %'s, and as a falco player i know falco DOES NOT LIKE TO EAT A KNEE!!!

however, id say falco has a lot more advantages on falcon than the other way around. although falco's throws suck, his ariels if done quick and in his face eat through most of falcon's. since falcon loves to stay low close to the ground, SHL forces him to play a game he doesnt want to. once falcon gets back on the edge, he's probably THE easiest character to spike that comes to mind, so abuse this fact. you cant meteor cancel that dair, so if he takes one at above 40% or so, he's gone to oblivion. make him feel it!!!

edit: sorry forgot to mention counter picks. FD is your best solid choice for easiest pillaring and SHLing, but its bad for tech chase. depending on how you do, you may want to play a funkier stage like...brinstar, where the lava prevents you from tech chasing forever, but still gives you a surface to SHL on

[lonejedi]

Thanks for the help.

[Bull37]

first you got to watch out for his mindgames. his grab is good against a falco to so be ready. make sure you use your SHFFled bairs while edgegaurding. also while edgegaurding remember that after he does his up B to get back he can grab you off the ledge from under, just tech so he cant hurt you or grab the ledge. shffled dairs are great against a falcon. also while he is in the air try to get him with your shine.
hope this advice helps.




Edit the counter stage you should ban(now this is my opinion) is battlefield.his knees can hurt you good if youre on a platform. i advise pokemon stadium or FD.

[Fox McClowd]

here's a combo that you can practice on falcon: first try to start it up when hes 0-10%(for better results)
when you approach him: shine full jump f-fall d-air l-cancel repeatedly will do the trick.
you can do this 'till he's 70-90% damage before he can break free.(works best in FD)

[KyUuKyUu]

here's a combo that you can practice on falcon: first try to start it up when hes 0-10%(for better results)
when you approach him: shine full jump f-fall d-air l-cancel repeatedly will do the trick.
you can do this 'till he's 70-90% damage before he can break free.(works best in FD)

That'll work... if the Falcon sucks. Shine -> full jump spike -> Shine will never work for more than maybe two times before they can get out of it. If they DI the shine the full jump can't even reach them, so you're a lot better off with WDing from Shine to do stuff.

Falcon's grab will rape you, as will his shffl'd stomps. Just spam lasers and wait for him to try to do something to hit you and hopefully messes up (ie missed Raptor Boost or something like that), then go in for the Shine combos. On a side note, I think Raptor Boost goes under SHL? Someone confirm/refute?

edit: mid-high SHLs

[frotaz37]

I know one thing you can do is practice your teching. One thing Falcon will do vs. Falco is chase techs with grabs, knees, forward Bs, and stomps. Work on reducing the number of times you get caught out of a tech and you should do better.

[Fox McClowd]

hav u ever heard of shine cancelling.Which is w-dash after u shine so u can follow their DI.

[jamz]

On a side note, I think Raptor Boost goes under SHL? Someone confirm/refute?



im not sure what happens to falcon, but i know he cant be hit any projectiles when hes over Bing.

as to falco vs. falcon, i think this is one of falcos more fun match-ups than lets say falco vs. peach or marth. as before said and further reiterating, tech chasing sucks and u can own falcon on the ledge with ease, much more than the other way around.

as for stages. i find dreamland and pokemon decent. platforms for comboing and room for lasers.

[BrTarolg]

i just played a 50 stock match against a friend who mains CF using falco <yeah thats right, FIFTY stock :P>

sure enough, i beat him, but a few things shone out

a> he has REALLY nasty grab combos. the most common one that wrecked me was downthrow, forward +B, u air. he got me with this EVERY time, and you CANNOT di out of it. so DO NOT get grabbed - shine at every jump when you are near him or before every wavedash to avoid getting grabbed.

b> FASTFALL YOUR LASERS when being defensive - i cannot stress this enough - when i started FFing my lasers, i wrecked any down+b or forward+b approaches from him

c> when pillaring, DO NOT pillar more than once - when you spike him to the ground, do a downsmash! ESPECIALLY if he is near you. you hit him with a downsmash whilst he is in the air, and its the equivelant of being kneed - its REALLY hard to recover from

d> ALWAYS approach with lasers however, DONT always fastfall it!- if you are being offensive you want to mix it up a little- although this makes sense anyways - the main point of this is to stop him landing BEHIND you when he does aerials. if he lands behind you, you have a problem. shl will stop most counter shorthops against, and it will be high enough to hit him if you dont fastfall!.

e> stay near the edge of the stage! - although your recovery is awful, staying near the edges is good, because his are even worse ! - i took ALOT of stocks off him by standing near the edge, reverse lasering as he comes towards me, grab, throw, and then ALWAYS use dsmash to knockback his up+B as it stops his sweetspot. if he is higher, spike is easy.

f>if you get a throw on him, use forward throw. forward throw usually leads into a shortop laser stun + free hit <dsmash, or fsmash usually, or another throw> - this is how you can end up chaingrabbing him.

g> shffl dair to smash attack at certain percentages. if not, shine. if your shffled dair knocks him into the air a little, he is stunned, and a dsmash just WRECKS him, it sends him a VERY low angle. if not, shining will counter any grabs he has, and you can shorthop attack out of it. if you hit with the shine, then be sure to combo it into a pillar + smash when he hits the ground.

[Dopey]

dont use Dsmash after pillaring, use more pillars and shines, keep the combos going. use lasers. going by the edge of the stage can be good, unless you catch a knee in the face at 50%, falcos recovery sucks. grab him and up throw, then follow it with a Dair or a sex kick. and when he downthrow over+b's you ummmm how about you tech it? its not hard to get out of at less than like 50 or so %.

levels to counter falcon on: mute city / yoshi story / poke stadium / FoD

mute city is the best i think, cause you geta free hit every time he tries to get back to the level. yoshi story is good cause its small, you can combo him alot on the platforms. poke stadium is just a good falco stage. and FoD will screw up his L cancling on the platforms.

[bornfidelity.com]

dont use Dsmash after pillaring, use more pillars and shines, keep the combos going. use lasers. going by the edge of the stage can be good, unless you catch a knee in the face at 50%, falcos recovery sucks. grab him and up throw, then follow it with a Dair or a sex kick. and when he downthrow over+b's you ummmm how about you tech it? its not hard to get out of at less than like 50 or so %.

levels to counter falcon on: mute city / yoshi story / poke stadium / FoD

mute city is the best i think, cause you geta free hit every time he tries to get back to the level. yoshi story is good cause its small, you can combo him alot on the platforms. poke stadium is just a good falco stage. and FoD will screw up his L cancling on the platforms.

Wonderful thought about Mute City, didnt think of that yet :/
no sweetspotting is at least a free dsmash every single time...

[The Hanz]

spam SHL and shine pillar combo him sick cause cpt. falcon is easy to combo. :chuckle:

just try to like get him off theedge then ethier bair him or metoer spike him either way

he should be dead :)

[BrTarolg]

dont use Dsmash after pillaring, use more pillars and shines, keep the combos going. use lasers. going by the edge of the stage can be good, unless you catch a knee in the face at 50%, falcos recovery sucks. grab him and up throw, then follow it with a Dair or a sex kick. and when he downthrow over+b's you ummmm how about you tech it? its not hard to get out of at less than like 50 or so %.

levels to counter falcon on: mute city / yoshi story / poke stadium / FoD

mute city is the best i think, cause you geta free hit every time he tries to get back to the level. yoshi story is good cause its small, you can combo him alot on the platforms. poke stadium is just a good falco stage. and FoD will screw up his L cancling on the platforms.

nah you should be able to dsmash EVEN with an edge - the biggest problem you have is ledgeteching - which you wont face in mute.

however! even if falcon ledgetechs - the beaty is correct play will still kill him. if he wallhops, then he has no choice but to do an up+b - which you can just smash as landing. if he doesnt, then you can simply de-sweetspot him again using your dsmash as he goes for it.

when he did downthrow over+b i couldnt tech, because i never hit the ground <except for during the throw, when i cant tech> - or perhaps it was upthrow. either way i had 50 stocks to try it out :-/

when i upthrowed - i couldnt seem to combo him at all. occasionally i would be able to get a nair or something, but he would often jump

and i wasnt too worred about getting kneed in the face - i was constantly SHL spamming, on the edge. this nullifies any shorthop knees to me - the only knees he got were FF from full jumps <which were lucky, but confusing> - and combod ones.