How essential is wavedashing? [Archive]

The Hanz

07-02-2006, 08:58 PM

well when ur doing shine pillar combos when u come down from ur second shine piallr u gotaa l-cancel then wavedash into a shine to continue it. and if u do moves and wavedash after ull be able to combo more consitant and have better combos ;)

bornfidelity.com

07-03-2006, 08:17 AM

There will be people saying wavedash isnt all that important.
well screw them.
have you ever seen a good Fox vs Falco fight without wavedashes? NO. because it's hella important. especially for a technical character like Falco.
so you need teh waveshine combos, of course you do. you need to be able to WD out of shield. you need WD to edgehog fast. you need it to space yourself. you can use it for mindgaming. etc.
do it a lot
dont do it for a day
and then come back and do it right.

ChozenOne

07-03-2006, 09:06 PM

Not Washdashing is like saying L-Cancel'ing with Shiek isn't important... Everything in this game that is technical is important... WaveShining with Falco is an excellent Mindgame, aswell as important for Shine Combos (like BF said). I can guarantee that if you master your washdashing+waveshining with Falco your non-flight bird will improve drastically. It took me two months to master wavedash with everycharacter and one month to master waveshining with Fox+Falco... prove you're better and do it in two weeks ^_^ Practice makes perfect. Set down goals for yourself in all your matches when you're not practicing... It doesn't matter if you win as long as you incorporate wavedash/waveshine into your game... Be like: "I have to waveshine/wavedash atleast 5 times this game... next time 6... next time 7... next time ect". Whether you win or lose it will improve your game/speed you up. Don't forget about wavedashing to the ledge... that seems kindof useful...

Pretty much wavedashing/waveshining=as important with Falco as SHFFLC'ing...

ChozenOne Out.

Dark Bowser

07-03-2006, 09:16 PM

I think wavedashing is absolutely unessential with Falco, or any other character for that matter. If you're quick enough you won't need to wavedash at all.

ibeplu

07-03-2006, 11:24 PM

^ WOW? have you ever seen a good falco?

Miharu

07-04-2006, 12:05 AM

I think wavedashing is absolutely unessential with Falco, or any other character for that matter. If you're quick enough you won't need to wavedash at all.
This individual should be ignored.

bornfidelity.com

07-04-2006, 06:09 AM

I think wavedashing is absolutely unessential with Falco, or any other character for that matter. If you're quick enough you won't need to wavedash at all.

You are the biggest idiot ever.
Or you're just ignorant.
Meh.

Office_Shredder

07-04-2006, 11:44 AM

Hey, he's right guys. Now, it's a little known fact, but each time you wavedash, you take .2% damage. So while waveshining may look cool at first, it's really costing you the game

Zephira

07-04-2006, 11:46 AM

Could someone show me a video of wavedashing and tell me how to do it? I'm really in the dark here.

Kai_

07-04-2006, 11:53 AM

I think wavedashing is absolutely unessential with Falco, or any other character for that matter. If you're quick enough you won't need to wavedash at all.

in what universe?

BrTarolg

07-04-2006, 02:47 PM

have you ever seen a good Fox vs Falco fight without wavedashes? NO. because it's hella important. especially for a technical character like Falco.

yes i have actually...

i remember theres that guy.. his name is mashsahi or something - hes a fox player who doesnt shorthop or wavedash - and hes well known for beating many good players from doing so

this is because his mindgames are good and he plays to win, not to look flashy.

wavedashing in MOST instances, is just as proficient as dashing and then crouching.

the only exceptions are jumpcancelling and ledgegrabbing.
when ledgegrabbing, often a well timed shorthop will suffice <unless you REALLY need the speed, in which case reverse laser will do>
when jumpcancelling shine - wavedashing probably IS the best option. however when pillaring, you need to mix it up depending on the height - sometimes a shorthop or full jump is needed instead.

but i have seen plenty of good matches where wavedashing is rarely used - instead dashcrouching is used instead<you can attack straight out of a dash, and you have a similar kind of movement>

NJzFinest

07-04-2006, 04:08 PM

yes i have actually...

i remember theres that guy.. his name is mashsahi or something - hes a fox player who doesnt shorthop or wavedash - and hes well known for beating many good players from doing so
ur an idiot masashi always wavedashes (he doesnt short hop, but he definately wavedashes). dont act like you know anything about masashi if you cant even spell his name. havent u seen his other characters too?

wavedashing in MOST instances, is just as proficient as dashing and then crouching.

have u forgotten this is a falco thread? falco's dash dance is far from useless but not as effective as his wavedash. he goes no where. and dashing + CC is far different then wavedashing. stop comparing them.

the only exceptions are jumpcancelling and ledgegrabbing.
wow, only exceptions my as$, u must not be very good at this game.

but i have seen plenty of good matches where wavedashing is rarely used - instead dashcrouching is used instead<you can attack straight out of a dash, and you have a similar kind of movement>
stop watching ur nooby friends play. at least elaborate on some specific vids to back up ur statement.

so anyways, yea
no wavedashing = no waveshine guys

Kai_

07-05-2006, 07:15 PM

ur an idiot masashi always wavedashes (he doesnt short hop, but he definately wavedashes). dont act like you know anything about masashi if you cant even spell his name. havent u seen his other characters too?

This thread is wack so im just going to go off topic. HAve you seen masashi's roy? It's godly.

Monkus

07-06-2006, 01:39 AM

If you watch this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDoL695ioH0&search=Masashi

It seems as if neither Ken nor Masashi are wavedashing. Masashi is also not short hopping. In fact, at some points you almost forget you're watching two of the world's best smashers, because of the absence of such well-known techniques. However, both seem to do fine without wavedashing.

I think it's fair to say that wavedashing helps improve your game a lot, but it's not a necessity to succeeding at the highest levels of ssb:m. However, unless you're as talented as the two of them, you're probably better off learning it.

NJzFinest

07-06-2006, 10:19 AM

Monkus, the video was made before i joined smashboards. im dead serious. that's wen ken said wavedashing was to hard for him. now he does it effectively (just look at his fox, and waveshine= wavedash)
plus, since wen was masashi one of the world's best smashers? he's just good.
btw, marth doesnt need to wavedash, his dash dance is good enough >.>

Office_Shredder

07-06-2006, 10:21 AM

If you watch this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDoL695ioH0&search=Masashi

It seems as if neither Ken nor Masashi are wavedashing

Actually, ken is wavedashing nearly every second throughout the first life.

It may be tough to see, but it's there

doob10163

07-06-2006, 10:24 AM

I hear aniki doesn't wavedash.

NJzFinest

07-06-2006, 10:44 AM

yea, aniki doesnt wavedash at all with link (samus, he does)

xelad1

07-06-2006, 12:15 PM

I hear aniki doesn't wavedash.

why would you need to wavedash with link... hardly ever would be the appropriate response

Kankaku

07-06-2006, 08:58 PM

I feel that the topic has completely changed its course.... either close this topic or put it back on course. If you want to talk about different players, there is a thread somewhere else in this forum to do so. This thread is about the necessities of wavedashing with Falco.

I believe that Falco does need wavedashing, as people have said, it is required within combos. I have yet to perfect my combos, but I do realize that I cannot do as well without wavedashing.

JBM falcon08

07-06-2006, 09:58 PM

Masashi is NOT considered one of the worlds best, but he is good just as F&F has said. For falco though wavedashing is essential for him, even if you don't waveshine and stick with pillaring, wavedashing seems to make falco a much faster character, which is how it is usually(except for chars. such as cfalcon). basically any person should use wavedashing, for reasons being that it adds mindgames to a persons game, which always helps.

RusselC

07-08-2006, 12:14 AM

Could someone show me a video of wavedashing and tell me how to do it? I'm really in the dark here.

The two movies below are of a few advanced moves (including wavedashing) and how to practice it.

-http://youtube.com/watch?v=4n4s5yB7ZkE&search=ssbm%20how%20to
-http://youtube.com/watch?v=xiZLs2doK8E&search=ssbm%20how%20to

and here is one with a good falco player (ive heard its bombsoldier and if not dont complain) and a good fox

-http://youtube.com/watch?v=_m3gitYccuY&search=ssbm%20falco

DDRKirby(ISQ)

07-08-2006, 02:34 AM

but it looks cool! who cares how useful it actually is!?!?

-----

wd with falco = waveshine combos and spacing.

if you want to be able to do shine combos and spacing using wd, learn it.
if you dont, don't learn it.

it doesn't matter what the top players do unless your objective is to be exactly like them, in which case, you should be asking THEM what they do.

Falco&Victory

07-08-2006, 02:50 AM

JBM falcon08

07-08-2006, 03:57 AM

I know wavedashing is very essential,but I am more focused on learning to pillar and get perfect l-cancels.
I know that wavedashing is essential,but I have seen good players do without.I once used Falco's dair on my friend 8 consecutive times before he DId out into a techroll,and he can wavedash,even though it is pretty crude.Ah,let the good times roll.

Who said wavedashing gives you .2% damage?STOP THE LIES!!!I do not know if that is truebut even if so wavedashing is certainly worth it.

But can you name one falco player who doesn't wavedash? no u can't because waveshining is so important in falcos game, especially against fastfallers due to the way the DI left and right, no so much in floaties(marth, peach, samus) its more about pillaring when it comes to them, bombsoldier, zanguzen, pc chris, they all use it in their game.

Miharu

07-08-2006, 04:00 AM

I know wavedashing is very essential,but I am more focused on learning to pillar and get perfect l-cancels.
I know that wavedashing is essential,but I have seen good players do without.I once used Falco's dair on my friend 8 consecutive times before he DId out into a techroll,and he can wavedash,even though it is pretty crude.Ah,let the good times roll.

Who said wavedashing gives you .2% damage?STOP THE LIES!!!I do not know if that is truebut even if so wavedashing is certainly worth it.
The "good" players that you saw weren't as good as you envisioned them to be.

Your friend can't DI.

bornfidelity.com

07-08-2006, 06:38 AM

I know wavedashing is very essential,but I am more focused on learning to pillar and get perfect l-cancels.
I know that wavedashing is essential,but I have seen good players do without.I once used Falco's dair on my friend 8 consecutive times before he DId out into a techroll,and he can wavedash,even though it is pretty crude.Ah,let the good times roll.

Who said wavedashing gives you .2% damage?STOP THE LIES!!!I do not know if that is truebut even if so wavedashing is certainly worth it.

When you have a Mickey Mouse avatar you should be making intelligent posts to make up for that.

Falco&Victory

07-08-2006, 02:54 PM

Miharu

07-08-2006, 04:58 PM

All I am saying is that you can make up for wavedashing,unless you play in a tourny.I have seen a Sheik beat a tourny without WDing,but Sheik IS a fast runner.

Oh,my friend can't DI,but he was bound to get it after 8 tries.
That's not the point. The point is to be able to use a character to its full potential, and without WDing, that's not possible with Fox/Falco.

Sheik doesn't rely on WDing as heavily as the space animals.

RaRaRachael

07-08-2006, 10:40 PM

Wavedashing is quite nice to have but if there was no wavedashing, SSB could still go on . Wavedashing allows for distancing between attacks and helps create MindGames against the other opponent which, in turn, allows for a better battle. However, if wavedashing never existed or gets taken away in SSBB, us players will still be able to play. No wavedashing might even make for a better fight.

Sytar

07-09-2006, 08:23 PM

Ken doesn't need to wavedash because he can DA dash perfectly. That's probably what separates the good players from the bad. DA Dashing seems godly.

Sniph

07-10-2006, 08:56 PM

Dark bowser, where are you int he washington area? If close enough, Ill teach you why wavedashing with falco will kick your *** :)

Falco&Victory

07-12-2006, 01:50 PM

That's not the point. The point is to be able to use a character to its full potential, and without WDing, that's not possible with Fox/Falco.

Sheik doesn't rely on WDing as heavily as the space animals.

I have seen a few good Falco players with no WD.I think Venom is one.Also,I take SHL over WD

Miharu

07-12-2006, 05:26 PM

I have seen a few good Falco players with no WD.I think Venom is one.Also,I take SHL over WD
That's total bull****.

JBM falcon08

07-12-2006, 09:16 PM

All falco pros wd, i've never heard or seen venom so idk what ur talking about but some falco pros just dont' use it as excessively as others.

Falco&Victory

07-12-2006, 10:04 PM

If it is essential,they would use it as much as they could.I am not saying the WD is pointless,I use it to edge hog and am trying to polish up my skills,the point is take SHFFLS and SHL before you try to get the WD down.Also,l-canceling is nothing short of better than WD.

Can't find venom?Check youtube for venom(falco) vs. d101(fox?can't remember)

JBM falcon08

07-12-2006, 10:30 PM

true, shffl is more important, but thats not what we are discussing, we are discussing the fact that wd as falco is very important, not only is it faster than roling but it adds mindgames, better spacing and waveshine combos on fastfallers.

Miharu

07-13-2006, 12:56 AM