The 2006-2008 Tier list

[mood4food77]

kirby to the bottom, ganon to the top of mid, sheik and marth to top, staying in order, ICs, falcon, and samus (in that order) right under peach, and a couple of other moves

[sin_the_warrior]

not in favortism, but i think jiggs should be up 1to 2 more spots.she has a nice cult following and the people that play her are (usually)fairly good at the least(no run out and repeated down b spam) just my oppinion.....

[mood4food77]

what good reason does she have to move up, she'll probably go down, she's even with peach and has an advantage on mario, every other high tiered match-up she has is in her opponents favor

[MaskedMarth]

^ lies? I thought they weren't even going to bother with brawls pending release. >_>

Also, they just don't care as much. Look at the dates of these tier lists (http://www.smashwiki.com/wiki/Previous_tier_lists). They aren't even annual any more.

[SuperDoodleMan]

Is there going to be a new tier list soon? I'd REALLY like to know!

[MaskedMarth]

You want The Last Tier War to stay current to the tier list, eh? If you ask me, it's unlikely there will be another tier list until at least the summer. The last tier list came out July 2006; the one before it March 2005, and the one before that in April 2004.

[petre]

but that would kind of suck if you made 90% of the vid, only to have roy shot up to high tier because of some random technique someone discovers. not like it will really happen, but that would be funny.

[Jumpfreak]

When will they FINALLY acknowledge that Luigi is NOT low tier???

[Eggz]

When he isn't like the worst character in the game Dan.

[Jumpfreak]

u r dumb. Kthxbye.

[06Falcon]

When he isn't like the worst character in the game Dan.

the day kirby goes up to low tier, which is never.

[06Falcon]

When will they FINALLY acknowledge that Luigi is NOT low tier???

when kirby goes up to low tier, which is never

[pdk]

When he isn't like the worst character in the game Dan.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/4/49/Dan_SF.jpg

I resent that statement!

[Linguini]

Id appreciate it if someone that has access to the back room updated me on the state of the new tier list discussion.Please.

[StripesOrBars]

There is no new tier list disscusion.

The only major changes that need to be made are: Shiek and Marth going up to Top with Fox and Falco, Gannon going under ICs, and Kirby dropping to the very bottom(or just being removed from the list completely)

[Kirbyfighter]

thats true arrowhead pichu is weak u just dont know how to play as him so dont say anything.... Kirby owns u should see some kingkirby 90 movies on youtube then id like do see wat u think about kirby suckin

[arrowhead]

if kirby ever owns, it's cause the player's much better than his opponent. kirby sucks. kirby sucks. kirby sucks.

[Samochan]

I wonder if DK will rise on the list now that Bum has been raping people with his DK. Maybe time will show if some more DK pwnage will ensue. I personally want to see low tier dominating on tournaments and then rise on the tier list. :3

[Eggm]

Yeah bum is a monster... 2nd at gauntlet!? omgosh, i've also played some nasty DK in my time.. this guy Mexican at NCT2 he was real nice w/ DK, and one of my crew members can use him really well, hes a scary character played by the right player, cape destroyed my falco w/ DK too, i'd like to see him moved up, I also think Taj's m2 should make him move up, and yeah i'm down for kirby at bottom he is truly terrible...

[ToP CaT]

yea kirby sux, but move zelda up fo sho

[Eci4]

thats true arrowhead pichu is weak u just dont know how to play as him so dont say anything.... Kirby owns u should see some kingkirby 90 movies on youtube then id like do see wat u think about kirby suckin


What I hate about this argument is that it could be used for anyone... it has no validity

X Character is good, you just don't know how to use him...

does that mean everyone is top tier? No... because of inherent abilities that make characters better...

What makes a character good?

Priority of attacks
Chainthrows
Speed
Range (sword/projectile/ect...)
Knockback (Shine, tippers)
Lagtime
Recovery...

There is other stuff too... actually making a good list would be nice... but then after that, you look at match ups...

Basically what Im getting at is kirby sucks, but yes a good kirby will be an awful fox

[ToP CaT]

Yes as long as people dont argue ridiculous things like m2 being higher than marth, the tier list shouldnt be this big of a debate

[Samochan]

Quit the kirby bash already, I've seen enough of that for a lifetime. Let's discuss about more recent happenings like Bum's amazing DK. >_>

[Link-NY]

DK wont move up the tier list. One person alone cant move a character up the tier list. Bum's DK is amazing yeah,,, but he doesn't go to many tournies =(

[moogle]

One person alone cant move a character up the tier list.Ken, Isai, Neo, Chu, etc.

[Emblem Lord]

Those guys all found out things with thier character when the metagame for that character was underdeveloped. At this stage in the game, we have discovered alot of things and I would say we have hit the limit of the metagames for the cast.

We may discover a few more tricks, but nothing as ground breaking, as the way Ken played Marth when he first arrived on the scene or the way Chu showed us what the IC's can really do.

[phish-it]

I think Kirby Fighter was referring to
this (http://youtube.com/watch?v=wK9Q4pRmbQ0).

Just because you wreck someone bad doesn't necessarily mean you're good; or should I say kirby's good.

[ToP CaT]

DK wont move up the tier list. One person alone cant move a character up the tier list. Bum's DK is amazing yeah,,, but he doesn't go to many tournies =(

are you serious? some idiot says this all the time, Chu by himself moved the ice climbers! Why do things always circle back around on smashboards? Yes if one person is amazing they can completely change a communites perception of that character.

[Link-NY]

are you serious? some idiot says this all the time, Chu by himself moved the ice climbers! Why do things always circle back around on smashboards? Yes if one person is amazing they can completely change a communites perception of that character.

Ummm.lol. that was back then when the metagame wasen't completly developed. Now it takes more then 1 person to move a character up the list.

[Emblem Lord]

Top Cat did you even read my last post? Link-NY just restated what I said basically. lol

[Eci4]

Quit the kirby bash already, I've seen enough of that for a lifetime. Let's discuss about more recent happenings like Bum's amazing DK. >_>


Does Bum have any videos up? I was looking for them on youtube... I really want to see what he does with DK...

I think in this case, it may move DK up for the sole reason that lower in the tier list, it can be possible for one person to move a character up (but then again, Mewtwo isnt really moving up on account of Taj)

[Samochan]

I could still see some of the lower tiers moving up simply because their metagame is not yet as developed as the higher tiers have. Taj for example has showed us his amazing Mewtwo, Chu has been showcasing his Pichu and Bum even came second on Gauntlet using DK only. It's been quite unheard of that low tier wins any money on big tournaments and there were many big names there, like PC, KDJ, Zang, Wes... plus lots of other known smashers. So imo, Bum's DK is what stands out the most of these three developments. There hasn't been any competition of who has the best DK (Captain Jack) until now that Bum has showed up and if these two players would succesfully play DK on big tournaments and do great (or perhaps just Bum doing great on every tourney he enters, dunno how much CJ uses DK on tourneys), perhaps it would inspire more people on playing DK on a higher level and a rise on a tier list would then be more than justified, even though I don't see that happening with the big gap on the updates. You don't look at the whole metagame itself as a reason to not have him rise on the list when certain character's metagame is still undeveloped. Just how many have played DK on big tourneys and won money? >_>

And Eci4, Bum has some 2 months old vids on tube, search for ssbm+Bum and you'll find them. The first one me thinks has 74% damage combo on fox, that was amazing to watch. I could also easily see him improving a lot during those 2 months. ^^

[StripesOrBars]

The tier list is close to flawless.

If any lower tiered characters move up, it has to be because certain characters(Kirby) need to be moved down.

[06Falcon]

The tier list is close to flawless.

If any lower tiered characters move up, it has to be because certain characters(Kirby) need to be moved down.

just out of curiosity, how do you feel about kirby in 64?

but yeah, kirby should go down if anything.

[NJzFinest]

Kirby is probably the best in N64. Either him or Pikachu.

HAL decided to make him the worst in Melee then after.

[StripesOrBars]

I don't think HAL intended for Kirby to be as bad as he is.

They just royaly screwed him up.

Really bad.

[06Falcon]

hope it doesnt turn into a trend for brawl.. with fox being screwed next.

[Emblem Lord]

Ummm. In games it's good to nerf those that were top tier. Just don't nerf them too badly.

Actually, when making a game you want everyone to be balanced. So in that regard low tiered characters would be considered a success in terms of development and the top tiers would be seen as the failures. But we are gamers, not developers.

BTW I do think all top tiers from melee will most likely be nerfed if they return in Brawl. We already know Fox is there. Fox lovers better hope he wasn't raped with the nerf stick.

[K.C. Cloud]

I don't believe in a tier list.

If you're good with that character, you're good with that character.

The japanese players pick their favorite characters and get good with them, why can't other people do the same.

I've seen plenty of "low tier" characters utterly rape "High Tier" ones.

honestly, I think the tier list itself is an excuse.

but, just my opinion.

[mood4food77]

i can't see them completely nerfing fox, marth, or sheik, it's really hard to, even giving them lag, they can still l'cancel and be pretty good

falco, just remove shl and peach get rid of her dsmash and float cancelling

kirby lost his dash attack and gained knockback in his juggling moves and lost it in his killing moves

pika, lost priority and his ability to infinite his b

ness, no more godly spike (they gave that to falco) and his juggling options are horrid

for all three, they really decreased their grabbign reach

i want them good again

but yea, kirby needs to go down while ganon moves up, i think those are probably the only changes we're gonna see