The 2006-2008 Tier list

[mood4food77]

ganon's bair goes through those too, for the most part, trade hits though cause of the range on ftilt, utilt doesn't work well in the match (luck of actually using it)

marth's also screwed once ganon gets like a uair on him since marth's dair doesn't have much priority at all

people keep saying htat marth has more priority that ganon, than why does ganon's dtilt cancel out peach's dsmash while marth's fsmash just stops and peach;s dsmash still goes on

ganon's supposed to spam aerials, it's marth's nair that i really hate

lord knight doesn't use either character, he's a roy/IC user.....no offense to him, yea he's a great player...but he doesn't main that character, so his opinion is like....second hand

it depends on the marth, i hate nair spamming marths, i can deal with the rest

i'll give him even match-up or 51-49 in ganon's favor

[Emblem Lord]

Marth can death combo Ganon. Why wouldn't Marth be able to? When I say death combo I don't neccessarily mean 0 to death. I just mean from low to moderate percents to death. Marth can do that to Ganon.

Ganon can't do it to Marth.

Edit: Ok, maybe I'll give priority to Ganon, but like I said priority in this game makes no sense alot of the time. But my other points still stand.

[Aesir]

ganon's bair goes through those too, for the most part, trade hits though cause of the range on ftilt, utilt doesn't work well in the match (luck of actually using it)

marth's also screwed once ganon gets like a uair on him since marth's dair doesn't have much priority at all

people keep saying htat marth has more priority that ganon, than why does ganon's dtilt cancel out peach's dsmash while marth's fsmash just stops and peach;s dsmash still goes on

Tipper fsmash beats out the down smash. <_<

[mood4food77]

everytime i've seen it...it's always cancelled out...and peach keeps rotating

that's probably cause it hits the upperbody in which peach has no priority, while down by her spinning foot is where all the priority is

[DarkKnight077]

Counterpicks FTW. Gannon and Marth is even, Gannon can easily edgeguard Marth easily...Marth can maybe easily combo but Gannon can easily chaingrab Marth and Marth can chaingrab Ganny.

It really depends on the stage..really. It's too close to call who has the advantage.

[Emblem Lord]

But still I'm fairly certain that a tipper f-smash would crush any of Ganon's aerials. Hence why I said priority makes no sense in this game alot of the time.

[Protoguy]

Counterpicks FTW. Gannon and Marth is even, Gannon can easily edgeguard Marth easily...Marth can maybe easily combo but Gannon can easily chaingrab Marth and Marth can chaingrab Ganny.

It really depends on the stage..really. It's too close to call who has the advantage.

^ What he said.

[DarkKnight077]

But still I'm fairly certain that a tipper f-smash would crush any of Ganon's aerials. Hence why I said priority makes no sense in this game alot of the time.

Gannon's aerials not only the thing he has. =/ Chaingrab FTW...

[Aesir]

you ahve to grab marth first though thats the thing. >_>

[DarkKnight077]

Grabbing...Marth is not that hard not is it?

[phish-it]

Why are you guys even mentioning the chaingrab vs Marth? Ganon can only do it if the Marth is at like 15% or less unless the Marth doesn't DI at all.

It really is an even match up at best maybe a slight advantage to Marth.

Ganon can screw Marth's recovery with the U-air, but Marth can edgeguard him much better than Ganon can Marth.

Even still Marth really can Kill the Giant Man without a tipped F-smash or multiple edge

[mood4food77]

NO PHISH-IT, siding with the marth side

it's probably stage dependent, like YS, FoD, and Battlefield are in ganon's favor while FD, PS, and DL64 are in marths

the other stages are probably same set-up, maybe with exception to mute city being in marth's favor

[Sandy]

In the words of Scav, "Tires don Exits".

[Aesir]

Grabbing...Marth is not that hard not is it?>_> play a good marth marths tend to not let you inside and they can force to remain outside.

[BigRick]

NO PHISH-IT, siding with the marth side

it's probably stage dependent, like YS, FoD, and Battlefield are in ganon's favor while FD, PS, and DL64 are in marths

the other stages are probably same set-up, maybe with exception to mute city being in marth's favor

I'd also say that it's a slight advantage for marth...

but mood is right, Ganon seems to fare better with them low platforms.

[mood4food77]

i was thinking smaller stages with platforms, cause once ganon is underneath marth...pretty much, marth is done

[REDRAGON]

So we have decided that the matchup is very stage dependent but overall its VERY close with Marth having a SLIGHT edge............

Yay!



Redragon

[BigRick]

i was thinking smaller stages with platforms, cause once ganon is underneath marth...pretty much, marth is done

well, isn't that where most characters are trying to be when fighting Marth?

[mood4food77]

no, only characters that rape on small stages, so basically ganon and bowser

[Protoguy]

no, only characters that rape on small stages, so basically ganon and bowser


Now you'll say Bowser is a Marth counter, right?...>_>

[BigRick]

Well idk, I'd rather be under him than over him...

that sword is kinda scary... you know

Btw why has the Marth VS Ganon argument started in the first place?

[phish-it]

Now you'll say Bowser is a Marth counter, right?...>_>


http://pressthebuttons.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/bowser.jpg

YER **** ****ING RIGHT!!!!

[mood4food77]

no, just bowser like small stage

MURT MUHR!!!

and the ganon vs marth thing, cause i said that ganon could be a counterpick to marth

[REDRAGON]

no, just bowser like small stage

MURT MUHR!!!

and the ganon vs marth thing, cause i said that ganon could be a counterpick to marth

Hope we were not to mean in proving you wrong!!! :(



Redragon

[woody72691]

i sooooooooooooooo soo soo disagree of the tier!!! falcon is sooo upper tier and everyone knows it!!!

[mood4food77]

you didn't prove me wrong, but ganon can be used as a counterpick to marth

[Magus420]

lord knight doesn't use either character, he's a roy/IC user.....no offense to him, yea he's a great player...but he doesn't main that character, so his opinion is like....second handYou don't know what you're talking about. He's mained Marth for a long time. He also beats me in the matchup a very sound majority of the time, and actually knows how to fight the matchup correctly unlike almost every other Marth I've played. Usually when I do win it's because of him accidently attacking 1st too much and getting raped for it. Play him and see how second hand his opinion is. If you do, let me know how that whole advantage against Marth thing works out for you :ohwell:

it's marth's nair that i really hate.It's Marth's dashdance grab and d-tilt that I really hate. E-tilt too but less so. (aka u-tilt) i hate nair spamming marthsSounds like an attack. These Marths should be losing in that case.

Also, why is Ganon's vs Marth's air priority even being discussed? Marth shouldn't even really be leaving the ground unless he's comboing/punishing lag or something and Ganon can't use an attack that could trade or outrange it anyway. The best thing Ganon has in the matchup against his zoning is waveland f-tilt, and that can only get you so far.

[mood4food77]

he used marth...never knew taht

[Aesir]

Lol I knew that and I met him 3 days ago. >.>:

[mood4food77]

i've only seen him use roy and ICs

and i've only seen him twice in my life....that being over a year ago

[56k]

LMAO @ Ganon being a good counterpick vs Marth.

Also this priority issue. Marth's sword moves are disjointed (not part of hs body). Ganon's moves are not disjointed. Therefore, Ganon's body comes in contact with Marth's sword. If they try to trade hits, Ganon will get hit and Marth won't be hurt, get what I'm saying?

This thing about Ganon's aerials canceling Samus' charge shot, that's just raw power, not priority.

[mood4food77]

ganon's bair is disjointed, it can't be grabbed, not sure about fair though, i'm pretty sure it is

[RyokoYaksa]

None of Ganondorf's moves are significantly disjointed. They have range, but are not disjointed. "Disjointed hitbox" means that the hitbox is NOT connected to a vulnerable part of your character's body, such as a sword. Your face will die for erroneously using the term.

[56k]

^^^^ Edit: thanks for clarifyng :)

Doesn't disjointed mean it's not part of his body?

Ganon's Bair = fist = body part
Ganon's fair = fist = body part
All of Marth's moves = sword = not body part = disjointed

[Magus420]

None of Ganondorf's moves are significantly disjointed. They have range, but are not disjointed. "Disjointed hitbox" means that the hitbox is NOT connected to a vulnerable part of your character's body, such as a sword. Your face will die for erroneously using the term.Have you forgotten the bomb incident? :chuckle:

The hitbox near his hand does stretch a good deal past where his hand can be hit though. More than nearly all of his other moves or most other characters' moves at least. Then again it doesn't really come close to something like Marth's sword.

[RyokoYaksa]

No one's forgotten the bomb incident. XD

"Disjointed hitbox" could be considered a subset of "move priority," which is how far the hitbox extends past the character's body parts. Yeah, Ganondorf does have great priority (obviously enough to overcome Bob-ombs...), but we're talking about fighting Marth here. With proper spacing and camping, Marth wins 90% of priority wars against Ganon and trades hits the other 10% due to his priority advantage over Ganondorf.

[Magus420]

I was just pointing out that the distance between the edge of the hittable part of his hand and the edge of where it actually hits is indeed greater than most moves. Doesn't really matter against Marth though. While not disjointed enough to straight up beat out heavily disjointed attacks, it is very good at trading hits against them since Ganon reaches his arm out and begins the attack at the exact same time.

Hitbox (http://img520.imageshack.us/img520/7302/bair6yp.gif) (click)

[Aesir]

ganon's bair is disjointed, it can't be grabbed, not sure about fair though, i'm pretty sure it is
Everyone including respected ganon players are telling you its not disjointed/insignificantly disjointed., why're you arguing that it is?

[56k]

^^^ LMAO, so true.

Time to fire up the AR and check the disjointedness of other moves...

[Pat/Pro]

LMAO @ Ganon being a good counterpick vs Marth.

Hes one of the only characters in the game that is about even with marth. Why would you think that was funny?