The 2006-2008 Tier list

[JBM falcon08]

i think the same thing emblem lord, i believe its very stage dependant.

pk stadium with marth vs cf= marth's nightmare.

[Pat/Pro]

I like picking onett against marths with my fox if its allowed for the tournament. Thankfully it is for MLGs. Ive also beaten alot of really good marths on brinstar. Of the neutrals pokemon stadium is usually of my favorite to random.

[wordman]

Tiers only affect tourney play, as there are some tactics a casual Smasher may not use for a character. For example, casual Smashers may not use Waveshine combos or Shinespike when playing Fox. This means they are not using Fox fully, and tiers won't apply as much

An important part of tiers is MLG rules. This means 1vs1, no items, some stages banned (like Hyrule Temple), stock match. If not all of these are met, then tiers won't matter so much

Also counters could come into effect. A counter is when one character is resistant to another characters abilities. For example, Mario can chain grab Fox and use the Caping technique against him.

Tiers don't affect a match's outcome unless both players are on the the same skill level, don't counter each other, are fighting on an unbiased stage, and use the same advanced tactics.
therefore, player's skill>counters>stage>tiers

More here: http://www.freewebs.com/typhlosionisme/tiersessay.htm

SandTiger owns arguements 4 free. :p

This is how I feel on teh sitchation. 70% percent of tiers should be based on tournies. And 30% should be based on just raw intense matchup encounters. Because you can't knock either one, and you'd be fool to do so. Of course characters will have more pros than cons compared to others. It's a fact. But matchups do effect the way the game is played in a big way. Just like I know if a player is better than me. Peach will most likely rape my Falcon. Or if a very beastly Ganon goes against a player with equal skill level and plays with Falco. Falco should most definitely be top tier or broken tier but Falco should never be hit. Same goes with everyone.

But it's a special case with Falco. Dont get me wrong most of the time a Falco can zone the Ganon into victory if given the opportunities with lazer spam, godlike shfl, correct pillar techniques. But if the Ganon even manages to get a good upperhand with proper mindgames, and adapting to that falcos playing style--that falco is dead meat nuff said and thats with any Ganon/Falco match. Ganon just takes your life from u if he hits you more than 3 times. Lie and say that he doesn't. You hide from the truth. BTW I dont like having tiers but if i had my own tier lists it would be based on if Agent Smith's hands were holding a gc controller, playing against himself and he downloaded all the unique playing styles from the world into his mind. Stupid theory, yes:( If u feel u need to flame me do so. But I'm bored so bare with me.

Broken-order
Fox (perfect execution=win i'm sorry)
Falco (counter to Fox, ditto fox on execution)
Marth (good matchups vs space animals, tipper rapes everyone)

Top-order
Shiek (we already know her bs its been here for years so lets go on.)
Falcon (perfect l-canceling, insane mix-ups, tech chase king, 0 to death combos, fastest)
IC
Peach
Jiggs

Mid-Top: order
Ganon
Spamus
Doc
Mario

Mid-Low: No order
DK
Link
Pikachu
Y.Link
Luigi/Yoshi (I think that they are on equal terms.)

Low Tier-No order
G&W
Roy
Ness
Zelda

Very low Tier-No order (honestly I think this group is the most balanced group)
Bowser
Pichu
Mewtwo

Wow Tier

Kirby (yeah, I said it..Kirby used to be a contender until they threw every good move he had out the window.)


I don't know If I missed anyone. I'm done. good day gentleman

[HeadISBAgent]

It seems that everyone keeps forgetting that this list is supposed to be based off the meta-game in tournaments as opposed to theoretical matchups (which can be argued back and forth as can be seen in the last 100 pages).
Anyways, since I'm bored and have nothing else to do, I might as well give it a shot :P
Top Tier:
Fox
No surprise here, the only argument I could see arising here is if we look back at the 2006 season the top 3 players on the MLG Circuit (most 1st place wins/top placings) have been Ken, PC Chris, and Azen; none of whom main Fox. However, both Ken and PC Chris play Fox competitively in tournaments and even note that PC Chris took the championship last year by switching to Fox. Regardless, when you look at the performance of other Fox players such as KDJ and M2K and the sheer quantity of pro-Fox players in the pro-circuit right now, I don't think anyone will disagree that Fox belongs at the top of the list.
Falco/Marth
I was originally going to put Falco above Marth but I think the difference is too difficult to distinguish. Looking back to the 2006 season, you have Ken and Azen dominating the competition with Marth and PC Chris with Falco respectively. In terms of number of wins, Marth outstrips Falco for 1st place in MLG but on the other hand PC Chris did take the championship. In the 2007 season we see almost utter domination of the tournament scene with all three top tier characters Fox, Falco, and Marth. PC Chris is continuing to do well with Falco and both Forward and DaShizWiz have been winning regional tournaments with Falco. On the other hand, M2K has made the switch to Marth and he too is doing just as well. The resolution of the placement of Marth and Falco will hopefully be finished by the end of the summer, but we have some really exciting matches to look forward to (haha, get it? forward :D) in the next few weeks: FC Diamond, OC3, and EVO west with M2K and Ken representing Marth and PC Chris and Bombsoldier (!) representing Falco.

[HeadISBAgent]

High Tier:
Sheik
I think at this point in time, Marth should definitely move above Sheik. At the tournament scene, Sheik is played pretty consistently and has good records against other popular tournament characters such as Marth (although the matchup is beginning to even out at the highest levels) and Captain Falcon. KDJ is a prime example of the dominance of this character and yet represents why Sheik belongs in High, not Top tier. On the national (even regional) levels, Sheik has not been able to consistently finish in even the top 3. The reason is simple if you look at the meta-game: Space Animals. At the highest levels, it is much more favorable to switch characters in a Fox/Falco matchup.
Captain Falcon
An all around solid character, his performance is pretty consistent even at the highest levels. On the recent tournament scene we see Isai, G-Reg, and SilentSpectre all placing high/winning in national/regional tournaments. Not much else to say about him other than the fact that his performance like Sheik suffers in a meta-game clogged up by Space Animals.
Ice Climbers
By Ice Climbers on the *successful* tournament scene, I really just mean ChuDat. In the 2006 MLG season Chu was consistent enough to place Top 8 all the time. This year, he's going absolutely nuts (compare the consistency of his grabs last year and this year in videos and you'll see what I mean). Contrary to Sheik and Captain Falcon, this is a character that benefits...a lot...from the Space Animals meta-game. While I don't want to rant too long about matchups, if you watch some videos of ChuDat, you'll find that all it takes is 1 grab on a fastfaller and 80-90% of the time its death. This is a character that will define the pace and play-style of a particular match, you'll notice in games with ChuDat that most players be forced to a style they are usually less comfortable with simply to avoid grabs. While it is true that one person shouldn't absolutely define placement on this list, ChuDat's extraordinary record in 2007 in addition to the IC's potential in this meta-game bumps them up the list.
Peach
I haven't heard too much about any breakout Peaches right now. Still doing about the same in tournament consistency and sometimes is used by pros for certain matchups.

[HeadISBAgent]

For the rest of the list, I wouldn't change it too much. Just a couple alterations:
Donkey Kong
Definitely needs to be higher. Bum has shown the community that DK is going to be a serious contender (especially with the Space Animals meta-game). I would put DK (tentatively) at the bottem of the middle tier (below Ganon) until his spot is truly worked out, but for now he definitely shouldn't be allowed in low tier. As DK's popularity increases we're going to see if Bum's performance was a one-shot wonder or if DK really is a viable character at high levels.
Don't believe me? Watch this: :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3U4oT0UokU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kik6-tEHM0U&mode=related&search=

Other than that, G&W should go up to at least low tier. Because of SNAP haha, nuff said ;).

[Shaeman111]

Link should be higher.... he does decent in tourneys. which means middle teir is where he belongs. I mean, i guess they're not counting aniki at all?

[HeadISBAgent]

Yea, personally I'd yank Luigi and Link out of Low Tiers cause they're pretty much like Fox and Falco in Low Tier tournaments...

[mood4food77]

i'd take link, luigi, and DK out of low tier cause they actually do decent against upper tier characters

[Shaeman111]

there u go, these people r just jealous of his projectiles xD
and the dreaded up-B!

[Protoguy]

Link should be higher.... he does decent in tourneys. which means middle teir is where he belongs. I mean, i guess they're not counting aniki at all?

Aniki is a Japanese smasher, and this is the American list...

[mood4food77]

link's up b is bad, it's easy to get around, sheild grab or sweetspot the ledge

[Emblem Lord]

This is the real tier list.

The characters that usually win tournies tier

Fox
Marth

The characters that usually place well and have the potential to win

Falco
Sheik
CF/Peach (They are equal IMO)
IC

Everyone else tier

Everyone else (duh, lol)

This list is flawless.

[Emblem Lord]

WTF? Smashboards is acting stupid.

Ignore this post.

[StripesOrBars]

Marth
Fox
Sheik

Falco
Peach

C Falcon
Gannon
ICs
Jiggs
Samus
Mario
Doc

[Keitaro]

Yeah, M2K, Chu, and PC are rocking the East Coast. That's 2 Fox, 2 Marths, and an Ice Climber with a side of Pikachu. Makes no sense Falco is still so high.

[StripesOrBars]

Falco just dies waaaaay too easily.

He still owns Fox, Marth, and Shiek combo wise, but those three are just way too gay to let Falco make a single mistake(especially Marth, 1 grab=death).

Plus Falco gets owned by Peach.

[mood4food77]

i wouldn't put ganon over ICs though, ICs are a sheik counterpick, do well against fox, very good against falco, marth, peach, and samus are the only 3 characters that give them trouble, ganon has fox, falco, sheik, and falcon to worry about

[slikvik]

Plus Falco gets owned by Peach.

its a closer matchup than u think

[_Phloat_]

Falco just dies waaaaay too easily.

He still owns Fox, Marth, and Shiek combo wise, but those three are just way too gay to let Falco make a single mistake(especially Marth, 1 grab=death).

Plus Falco gets owned by Peach.

In high level matches, most of the time you are off the stage should result in a death, so recovery is a hindrance, but because falco can make recovering just as bad for the other character, it is not that bad!

Also, the shine is just to good, a combo started, that leads to deadly combos, and comes out in 1 frame and can be shieldgrabbed (easily)... It also has shield stabbing potential...

I think the list is correct, except for maybe the luigi, and a little tweaking near the bottom

IMO kirby is the worst character..

[StripesOrBars]

i wouldn't put ganon over ICs though, ICs are a sheik counterpick, do well against fox, very good against falco, marth, peach, and samus are the only 3 characters that give them trouble, ganon has fox, falco, sheik, and falcon to worry about

Ganon doesn't do bad vs Falco. It's pretty close to almost even. The only stage Ganon gets raped hardcore is FD.

Ganon/Falco on battlefield or YS is Falco rape for Gannon.

Ganon/Fox isn't that bad either.

Fox still wins, but Fox dies at 70% in the matchup.
its a closer matchup than u think

No, its not.

[mood4food77]

it's pretty bad...why i'm making my doc my secondary, for fox and falco, fox is much harder than falco cause of his shine reach

[StripesOrBars]

I've watched Tipman rape Shiz, Chillen, and Forward's Falco and Fox.

Shiek is the only unwinable match up for Ganon.

[Keitaro]

I wonder, does KDJ actually use Shiek through most his tourneys or does he just use Shiek to face certain Marths like M2K's and Ken's?

[HeadISBAgent]

Yeah, M2K, Chu, and PC are rocking the East Coast. That's 2 Fox, 2 Marths, and an Ice Climber with a side of Pikachu. Makes no sense Falco is still so high.

You mean that's a Marth, Ice Climber, and Falco with 2 sides of Fox (and a side of Pikachu I guess...)
Of course let's forget about DaShizWiz rockin it up in the South with Falco and Forward dominating parts (I say parts because there hasn't really been one big WC tourney yet this year...but we got back to back OC3 and Evo so it's all good :D) of the West with Falco as well.

[HeadISBAgent]

I wonder, does KDJ actually use Shiek through most his tourneys or does he just use Shiek to face certain Marths like M2K's and Ken's?

Well at lower levels he pretty much plays whatever (**** your DK dan! :laugh:). At the top level though, he probably goes by the most favorable character matchup. Ken is so dominant against Space Animals anyways, so why not go Sheik?

[StripesOrBars]

Shiz just raped Forward at LTEC2 on Saturday in the finals.

[Shaeman111]

well ima change the list starting the 28th when i start playing tourneys. :)

[wordman]

well ima change the list starting the 28th when i start playing tourneys. :)

excellen excellent my young squire. Play with Ganon/Boozer/Fox/Falcon. Those dudes will never see it coming.;):laugh:

[Eggm]

Shiz just raped Forward at LTEC2 on Saturday in the finals.

It wasn't rape lol, set one went to game 4 and set 2 game 5. how is that rape?

Edit oops on double post sorry.

[Eggm]

This is the real tier list.

The characters that usually win tournies tier

Fox
Marth

The characters that usually place well and have the potential to win

Falco
Sheik
CF/Peach (They are equal IMO)
IC

Everyone else tier

Everyone else (duh, lol)

This list is flawless.



The real flawless list is

Marth
Sheik
Fox
Falco
Ic's
falcon
peach

The rest doesn't matter, this list was from whta i've seen in the past 6-7 months or so at EC tournys and i've been to quite a few big ones.

[slikvik]

The real flawless list is

Marth
Sheik
Fox
Falco
Ic's
falcon
peach

The rest doesn't matter, this list was from whta i've seen in the past 6-7 months or so at EC tournys and i've been to quite a few big ones.

originally quoted for truth, but now i feel sheik and fox should be switched

[Emblem Lord]

If you went strictly by tourney results the only characters that could even be top tier are Marth and Fox.

[DarkBlade]

Sweet, I can now play in real low tier tournys. Link FTL!

[HeadISBAgent]

If you went strictly by tourney results the only characters that could even be top tier are Marth and Fox.

Really? Did you bother reading my post on why Fox, Marth, and Falco should be top tier? If we went strictly by tourney results...what happened to PC Chris placing top 3 nearly every tourney in MLG last year with Falco. And of course we can just ignore the rising Forward and DaShizWiz who have claimed utter dominance in their regional tournaments and placing quite high in nationals.

[Emblem Lord]

Falco is good. Can't forget about him.

[max32090]

marths the best character in the game m2k proved it


Edit: nvm game n watch is

[The Hypnotist]

Since when do the ICs do well against Fox, Fox gimps Nana so well, it's almost unfair.

[max32090]

ic's do well against everyone but fox

[mood4food77]

samus peach and marth are ICs worst match-up, then fox, but they can handle fox