"common knowledge" that a lot of people don't know

I just now realized this.

On Brinstar, when you hit the lava you can only be damaged by it again after a certain period of time. This means that if you were to spike/meteor smash someone the very moment they hit the lava, they would proceed to go through it to the bottom of the stage because the game won't let them keep getting hit.

Wobbles the Phoenix said:

I just now realized this.

On Brinstar, when you hit the lava you can only be damaged by it again after a certain period of time. This means that if you were to spike/meteor smash someone the very moment they hit the lava, they would proceed to go through it to the bottom of the stage because the game won't let them keep getting hit.

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So....you receive some invincibility frames? or no?

i THINK(read: Have no proof of) that it's because the lava acts like a constantly refreshing active hitbox. You can only be hit by any single hitbox once(partially true, too lazy to explain the 16 hits thing) so you're not actually invincible when you get hit by the lava but instead have to wait for the next hitbox in sequence.

Pink: Yeah, pretty much. The lava itself is only allowed to hit you once every so often. Getting hit by other sources doesn't appear to refresh the hitbox either; I d-aired a Marth with Ganon into the lava immediately after he touched it, and he just went straight through it to the bottom of the stage.

Metal: you don't get any invincibility frames from hitting the lava at all. A good analogy would be the Hammer item; it can only hit players once ever X frames, which is why you can shield grab hammer-wielders and they don't break your shield by bonking it repeatedly.

Wobbles the Phoenix said:

I just now realized this.

On Brinstar, when you hit the lava you can only be damaged by it again after a certain period of time. This means that if you were to spike/meteor smash someone the very moment they hit the lava, they would proceed to go through it to the bottom of the stage because the game won't let them keep getting hit.

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This happens alot...
ask Sveet...=D
He's the honorary member of the "get spiked through the lava club"

Wobbles the Phoenix said:

Pink: Yeah, pretty much. The lava itself is only allowed to hit you once every so often. Getting hit by other sources doesn't appear to refresh the hitbox either; I d-aired a Marth with Ganon into the lava immediately after he touched it, and he just went straight through it to the bottom of the stage.

Metal: you don't get any invincibility frames from hitting the lava at all. A good analogy would be the Hammer item; it can only hit players once ever X frames, which is why you can shield grab hammer-wielders and they don't break your shield by bonking it repeatedly.

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haha yes yes, I love doing that and then once he goes through, he gets spiked by the lava somehow and gets hit multiple times due to the momentum of the downair too... its too good.

The interval of what you speak is very quick though. It's like either 1 second or a few seconds i forget exactly.

Pink Reaper said:

i THINK(read: Have no proof of) that it's because the lava acts like a constantly refreshing active hitbox. You can only be hit by any single hitbox once(partially true, too lazy to explain the 16 hits thing) so you're not actually invincible when you get hit by the lava but instead have to wait for the next hitbox in sequence.

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What is this 16 hits thing? It sounds very interesting and it would probly fit this thread very well.

I cant actually remember how many hits it is but it goes like this:

Any given hitbox can hit any given hurtbox multiple times, but in order to hit a hurtbox a second time it must first hit x(I said 16 just cus i know it's a fairly large number) amount of other hurtboxes first.

It's the main principle of the Black Hole glitch, you have a bunch of turnips all hitting each other constantly so their hitboxes constantly refresh. If you touch the black hole you get hit but since the turnips are all constantly refreshing you can be hit again(and since you'd be getting hit by x number of turnips each time you get frozen in place from hitstun)

Magus420 said:

For PSing with Roy, his and Marth's shields are glitched and pop up in the same spot regardless of the position you're in instead of being tied to the character. If you PS out of a crouch it's ridiculously disjointed, especially on your backside, though it kind of sucks regardless of front/back/crouch/stand if what you're trying to PS is really low to the ground at your shins/feet.



The full area is shield coverage in general, and the lighter green ring and white area inside of that is the part that will powershield. To go into the type of guard on animation that has the PS area in it (GuardReflect) you need to have the button clicked all the way down on the 1st or 2nd frame, and projectiles can reflect on the first 2 frames of GuardReflect (PSing attacks is a 4 frame window).

If you don't use the analog part of one of the shoulder buttons (the part before the click like you'd use for variable shield size) you can disable it by holding it all the way down when plugging in/resetting your controller to make PSing a little easier since lightshielding before you get it pressed all the way down and interfering with a PS attempt won't be possible, and you can also keep it pressed most of the way down before timing the PS without it doing anything so it acts more like a normal button. I l-cancel and lightshield with R, so I disable analog on L and use that one to PS.

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I thought this belonged here.

I just thought of something that probably most Kirby players dont even know.

If you dash attack off of a platform and grab on a specific frame(no idea which one) when you land you'll instantly cancel your dash attack and grab out of it.

To my knowledge there's never been any real info on how it works, why it works or how to do it.

Pink Reaper said:

I cant actually remember how many hits it is but it goes like this:

Any given hitbox can hit any given hurtbox multiple times, but in order to hit a hurtbox a second time it must first hit x(I said 16 just cus i know it's a fairly large number) amount of other hurtboxes first.

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That sounds like it's related to re-equipping Yo-yo glitch Jackets.

12 things I hit after you

Pink Reaper said:

I just thought of something that probably most Kirby players dont even know.

If you dash attack off of a platform and grab on a specific frame(no idea which one) when you land you'll instantly cancel your dash attack and grab out of it.

To my knowledge there's never been any real info on how it works, why it works or how to do it.

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Check our thread. It's at any point during your falling dash attack you hold R/L/Z, when you hit the ground you'll instantly grab. It's ****.

Bunfire all dai.

I didn't know you could hold those buttons.

I always did a falling dash attack and hit z when I landed.

i always did it right as i slid off. imma try it when i get off work.

Bump. This thread is too good

Magus420; said:

As a somewhat proficient masher myself I was interested in finding out more about escaping. Here's some stuff:

When hit by an attack that does less than 6.00% you go into CaptureDamage which is 20 frames long + added frames from hitlag. You can only break if you are able to finish CaptureDamage and go into CaptureWait. Fresh headbutt and f-tilt (on someone in a grab) add 3 frames of hitlag while d-tilt adds 2. When staled the headbutt and tilt may add 1 less frame of hitlag depending on how stale it is.

If you headbutt immediately after landing the grab they have 12 frames for inputs to mash out before the headbutt hits/CaptureDamage starts. Any inputs after those 12 won't matter unless they leave CaptureDamage.

To maintain the CaptureDamage lock after an immediate headbutt, Nana's tilt needs to hit on the 36th frame or earlier within the grab hold. To do that you can input an f-tilt on 25 or earlier if within close range, otherwise frame 24 or sooner if full range is needed to reach (it hits up close before the hammer extends). D-tilt needs to be input on 23 or earlier since it's slightly slower.

Nana's standing grab lag normally prevents inputting the tilt until frame 23, so with an immediate headbutt the f-tilt can be input on 23-25 and d-tilt can only be done on 23. If the headbutt is delayed 1 frame they have 13 frames for escape inputs, f-tilt can be input 23-26, and d-tilt 23-24. If delayed 2 frames they have 14 to escape, f-tilt 23-27, d-tilt 23-25, etc. On that note, to me it seems like f-tilt wobble is superior to d-tilt in almost every way. More damage (fewer reps), more hitlag (locks longer so more room for error), comes out faster (easier to get started faster from grab), and IASA is 1 frame sooner (closer to grab attack's duration). D-tilt has slightly more horizontal range though.

With absolute frame perfect mashing, an immediate headbutt (12 frames to mash out) into wobble is escapable until they get to 61%+. To put that ridiculous mashing speed into perspective, it's not possible to get even 2 grab attacks in until they are 251%+ (they break out before the 2nd one hits).

Now against actual humans, I'd estimate that an immediate headbutt into wobble shouldn't be mashable starting around 25%+ with the very very best players at mashing and them also having enough forewarning that they are going to get grabbed so that they are already at "top speed" as the grab connects. Against normal people it would probably be more like 15%+ with full warning. If they didn't expect to get grabbed at the time or realize it a bit late and start mashing after the grab connects it would most likely work on anyone at or close to 0%+.

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This isnt common knowledge by any means but its neat

how do u call the arwing with fox on corneria? dont u mash up on c-stick?

lol reading that makes wobbling seem broken.

if you just say its an infinite you can just brush that **** off and say ill just avoid it.

fox falco have a hidden taunt that works on corneria and venom.

can only be done once per game. you hit left, right on the d pad.

if thats not what you mean then you are referring to something that can't be done.

Taunt->Mash Left/Right/Left/Right etc on the D Pad

KAOSTAR said:

lol reading that makes wobbling seem broken.

if you just say its an infinite you can just brush that **** off and say ill just avoid it.

fox falco have a hidden taunt that works on corneria and venom.

can only be done once per game. you hit left, right on the d pad.

if thats not what you mean then you are referring to something that can't be done.

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Yeah thats what I ment....

Rofl at reaping pink and metal.

common knowledge that a lot of people don't know

popo and nana live on completely separate damage meters. their percents are almost always different during a match.

unlike fox, falco's up+b has no flames during his charging animation making it super super vulnerable. this is why falco's side+b to recover like 90% of the time (apart from the fact that it's a great recovery)

a standing laser stops all horizontal momentum.

slide on the ufo and shoot a laser.

ive only actually done it with fox but I assume falco is the same.

The Corneria taunt is done by hitting down on the d-pad for 1 frame, you don't have to hit left/right at all.

-Fox's Jab causes tumble stun at around 130-170% (fox 130%, great for chaining into smashes, marth 150%)
-Fox's Jab can be combo'd into Usmashes or any other fast attack even without tumble at around 80% up
-Without DI fox's jab launches the opponent diagonally in the direction of the jab, but most players I've played tend to DI in to jabs, causing them to go straight up (VERY common when playing cpus). So if you're getting jabbed make sure to DI out to avoid potential risk of getting comboed. =]
-Fire fox and Illusion have different landing delays (Illusion is longer by FAR)
-Fire foxing into the floor does not affect its landing delay
-If you fire fox sideways from the ground the tumbling animation that results at the end is part of the post attack delay (Which is VERY LONG), but if you fire fox in the air toward's the ground, the resulting tumble is part of the special fall and as a result immediately gets canceled if you hit the floor. This shortened landing delay also occurs if you fire fox between platforms because you leave the floor. So be in the air if you're going to use an offensive fire fox.
-Fire fox stuns your opponents for a long time.
-You can fire fox at around 1-10 degrees (sorry for not knowing exact angles) into the ground without triggering the floor slam effect.
-Sound effects for attacks change as they get stale
-To maximize horizontal distance with fire fox aim 22.5 degrees diagonally and mash forward. It's about 1-2 character spaces farther than aiming straight forward or 45 degrees up
-fire fox seems to grab the edge before the end of the animation if you fire horizontally at a short distance away, but I'm not sure and someone else with AR should test it. Fire fox DOES, however, grab the edge early if you aim at it from above the ledge, and you can also grab the ledge backwards during the tumble animation at the start of the special fall
-the landing delay for air dodging with fox (yes, this includes landing delay from wavedashing) is longer than the normal landing delay of just jumping and doing nothing (i'm sure this applies to every other character as well)
-Marth's dolphin slash goes farther left if you mash forward at the start-up of the attack by about 1 character size, at the cost of less height.
-Some air attacks will allow you to land normally if you hit the floor during the last few delay frames of the attack, like Marth's short hop nair, meaning some attacks don't have to be L canceled.
-The stun time is shorter at higher percentages if your shield breaks, which is really weird, i would think that it would be longer
-Fox's level 9 computer AI will always use reflector at a set time after he tosses you upward, even if you land on a platform above you.
-Reflector does not reflect at the one attack frame that occurs at the start of the attack (needs confirmation)
Most of this data was gathered from training mode against fox and marth. Percent damage info is probably somewhat inaccurate since i was gathering this info to increase my chances against beating a friend who main's marth. Anyway, Enjoy. Sorry if any of these are reposts.

NubTactics said:

-Reflector does not reflect at the one attack frame that occurs at the start of the attack (needs confirmation)

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actually, it depends on whether the projectile's hitbox is inside the reflector box when the shine comes out

ihavespaceballs said:

The Corneria taunt is done by hitting down on the d-pad for 1 frame, you don't have to hit left/right at all.

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At least 3 people have gotten this wrong already ._.

You have to taunt for exactly 1 frame. This is really hard to do, so most people suggest mashing left/right on the D-pad to lightly activate the taunt for hopefully 1 frame.

Phoenix~Lament said:

At least 3 people have gotten this wrong already ._.

You have to taunt for exactly 1 frame. This is really hard to do, so most people suggest mashing left/right on the D-pad to lightly activate the taunt for hopefully 1 frame.

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No. You press down on the d-pad only, and release it really fast. That was the only input I did just now, and it activated the taunt.

Yup, it's down. Just tested it.

The reason it's usually known as "mash left + right" is because in doing so it creates a chance of hitting down for one frame, and if you keep doing it it's likely to happen eventually.

But yeah, down for exactly 1 frame.

Gustav Wind said:

The reason it's usually known as "mash left + right" is because in doing so it creates a chance of hitting down for one frame, and if you keep doing it it's likely to happen eventually.

But yeah, down for exactly 1 frame.

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its known that way because most ppl found it under some cheat section years ago.

frames aren't normally standard talk for entering codes.

game faqs had it listed as mash left right.

its always worked so alot of older smashers didn't get the update.(older meaning played the game around release)

I got something for you guys i'm not sure if this is completely new, but I've never heard of this.

Original post: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=279850

the video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cMYxIIE4vWc

Hey Magus, why is it that sometimes when I hit with a move, the enemy is instantly out of hitstun even when they should be affected by it.
An example is at higher percents, Kirby utilting fox, fox is instantly out of hitstun sometimes.

Much obliged.

most the cast can simply hit kirby once and run around KJ64 forever easier because kirby has slower run speed/falling/ air speed and lacks an upair with range and his projectile stinks. it takes 3 jumps for him and puff to reach the platform everyone else in the game only takes 2 at max.

Since Marth has the best non-grapple grab in the game, does that also mean he can pick up items farther away than everyone else? and if so, is it the same in the air too?

for boost grabbing, if you delay the timing between the dash attack and the grab you can allow more of the dash attack to come out before cancelling it. This gives you more grab range. I believe the cancel window is anytime before the hitbox comes out for the dash attack. I could be wrong though.