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Make Your Move 8: -TOP 50 POSTED-

half_silver28

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
862
Location
MYM, Ohio
So I was gonna start reading more sets & commenting them with my ketchup. Then I realized THIS existed.

Ok, so this moveset doesn't have "playstyle" like the Conceptual Work. The point here is to on a certain scale FUN AND EDUCATIONAL. I wanted to go back to what I wanted from a set, and what I wanted to offer. The point here is for people to, perhaps enjoy the part of the set's reading. I've decided to abandon concepts and playstyle, though I'll still try to give the characters a playstyle that fits their character, but I won't focus on it too much. The point of such movesets is not neccesarily to try and reach Top 50s, but to be there so that in the future somebody might read it and have a good time with it.
So putting as little effort into a set as possible makes them in-character? Brilliant. Why didn't I think of th-WAIT WHAT. Playstyle is the primary thing that makes sets in-character, not writing or random moves. Though you obviously don't care much about sets being in-character judging by Dio Brando. Not to mention that Jecht has random as hell moves like his grab.

Please don't comment on things like Playstyle and Concepts. That's not the point. I'll be doing this from now on. It's a change from Conceptual Movesets - I'd like to point out that there's more than one kind of moveset. These kinds of movesets are also designed so that they can be made more quickly, and that I can actually make characters I WANT to make movesets for, just like the original meaning of MYM1. I believe that if people realise that this kind of movesetting way can be still accepted by the general populus, it could allow for people to want to make more movesets, and therefore help MYM (get some more sets in to help). If anyone else wants to do this kind of thing, by all means join me. You don't have to abandon conceptual movesets - Im not saying they are bad in any way.
...where do I even start...? Yes, there are many ways to make a moveset. But Jecht is just a horrible moveset with no redeeming qualities at all. Poorly written, hardly existent playstyle, horrible organization, random moves that don't even fit Jecht. We're in MYM to make sets for characters we like, yes, but we're also here to post them so people can enjoy them. Do you really think others can enjoy a moveset like Jecht (I certainly could not)? Since you've made it very clear that you're only making them for personal enjoyment, why bother even posting them? Just keep them to yourself or post them elsewhere. And just so you know, I really did enjoy reading and commenting Sarisa, a very cool set. Why would you post 5 movesets that very few will like over 1 moveset that everyone can enjoy reading?

Also I don't care if anyone disagrees of doesn't think these are "true" movesets, Im doing them.

Actually, I don't really want anyone commenting on this set. I'll have it on this last page here so somebody can post their set next page.
They are true movesets of course. But the second to last sentence says it all: no one will comment on your movesets if you continue with these types of sets. As DM said, they will just be taking up space.
 

Rychu

Thane of Smashville
Joined
Jul 5, 2010
Messages
810
3DS FC
1908-0105-4965
Edit: critisism removed after reading K.Rools post
 

KingK.Rool

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 26, 2005
Messages
1,810
An innocent difference of opinion really brings out the ugliest side of MYM, doesn't it? Come on, folks. You're all channelling your inner Warlords and it's really not a very pleasant sight.

The one day Pokeset movement proves that any user can make a decent moveset in a single day, there were even some real gems in there too, and several made Top 50.
The misconception here is that Katapultar cares about making the top 50. And I don't blame him.

For those who weren't in the chat, let me explain my logic.

1) There are about 10 eligible voters in all of MYM, five of whom are leaders.
The issue with this, of course, is that there's an incredibly tiny pocket of people who have any influence on what happens with the top 10 and half of them will get the chance to do even more changing to get it to match with their opinions. Basically, at the end of the day, this top 50 is going to be Warlord's opinion + a few sets he's alright with.

2) Judging sets is no longer a science in any way.
I can't believe it took me this long to realize it. You look at comments for sets today, and they're very confused. They nitpick about things that they admit don't matter, then compare the set to the MYMer's last successful set. If I ask what people look for in a set, almost all will say a unique playstyle. If asked how one playstyle is more interesting than another, they'll continue with "It's more interesting."

More interesting doesn't even pretend to be anything other than a matter of personal preference.

Choosing between, say, Magmortar and Hariyama or Hannibal and Dark Bowser is hardly anything more than a subjective thing - influenced with a sprinkling of presentation and character bias, whether you pretend it's not or... not. The top 50 will reflect the whims of a very small group of people who can no longer properly categorize one set as better than another.

This is why I believe the top 50 is no longer relevant and the competition aspect of MYM should be downplayed - because, at the moment, it's incredibly, ridiculously, dominant. Why else would everyone attack someone for admitting that he doesn't care about the competition and is making sets for their own sake?

Also, I think your conclusion that Katapultar made up the whole thing as an excuse for the set's weakness is completely ridiculous, off-base, and little more than a cover to make yourself feel less like you're beating up on a baby.

While yea, your making move sets for fun, if other people can't take your sets seriously, it will end ugly, and you will start loosing peoples opinion that you are a move setter with potential.
The fact that it'll end ugly is entirely the fault of other people. Katapultar stated his opinion in a completely harmless way, and attack him for it is like kicking a puppy - yes, very ugly indeed.

And potential for what? Placing on the top 50? Winning Warlord's respect?

Just keep them to yourself or post them elsewhere.
Do you honestly think nobody would enjoy reading Jecht? We might not with our lofty standards, but the average newcomer would stumble into this contest and it's reading something like Jecht that would first get them interested in this whole thing - before they "graduate" to advanced concepts of playstyle and flow, if you will (hell, that's how all of us got interested in the first place, isn't it?). With all newcomers nowadays, we try to take them straight from an MYM2-like state to playstyle-flow-focus with our criticisms. This could serve as a crucial bridge and do nothing but help us in the long run. I mean, this is a good thing for MYM, and you're all turning it into a very bad one by coming off as a bunch of uptight, elitist and very patronizing people. Which bewilders me completely - I mean, coming from Silver, Slash, and meanie? This isn't even Warlord, or Khold, or Daddy we're talking about.

And before you do, no Katapultar isn't going to "infect" newcomers with his beliefs. If they're the kinds of newcomers we'll want, they'll take interest in going from movesets-for-fun to movesets-for-MYM soon after discovering the chat

One last thing: Since Katapultar has been misunderstood, let me translate what he's saying:

"I'm no longer making sets as gameplay experiments to be put in a game. From now on, they will be pieces of writing meant to be fun to read and to share my knowledge of the character."

Is it a perfect idea? Certainly not. Is it morally wrong? Of course not.
 

Thrice

Smash Cadet
Joined
Apr 1, 2010
Messages
45
Location
Washington
Well, I don't really like disputes, but it seems that if I don't put my say it now I won't really get another chance to. Though with what I have to say, that's likely anyways.

I've no problem with what Kat is doing. If he wants to make sets for fun, let him. When did MYM lose that anyways? Like Rool said, it's pretty much all about the competition now. There are few left that make sets solely because they want to and want them to be enjoyed by MYM or others.

I'm not saying Kat's in the right or wrong, I'm just trying to say that we really shouldn't have a problem with it. It doesn't affect the Top 50, so it doesn't affect the current MYM that much, seeing as that's what it's all about nowadays. If the guy wants to do things his way, why not let him? Of course, you can always fall back on the claim that he'll "taint" the newcomers, because there is no way to disprove (or prove) that without evidence. Really, saying that is saying that MYMers don't trust themselves to lead the newcomers in the "right" direction.

And it doesn't matter if we think it's a bad idea or not; telling someone to leave because they have a different opinion than the rest of us or aren't as good as everyone else...that's just wrong on so many levels. And going on an all-out offensive when someone says that they want to do things differently...I'll just say this. Kat's a MYMer. He might not be the best MYMer, but he is one nonetheless, and he should be treated like one, not like something to throw away. Sorry if I'm kinda treating you like you're not here, Kat.

And yes, I know it's hypocritical and odd that I put my say in on this, since I am also a newcomer, and I know I'll probably be condescended and shunned for this for a bit and probably ban/guest/kicked from the chat by someone. But I don't really care, this is what I think, I'm not really afraid to say it.

Oh right. Forgot to say something. Kat, if you plan to focus on making your movesets fun to read, work on your writing style, creativity, and organization and look over the set after you make it, to make sure everything is nice and neat. Also, you may want to rethink your extras, and ask yourself if they're actually fun or just dumb.
 

Darkslash

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 1, 2008
Messages
4,076
Location
Strangereal Equestria
Rant about how MYM needs to be changed
I actually....have to agree with you. I woke up this morning and found myself thinking, "is this how Spadefox feels?"

But my actual beef with Jecht is that it seemed he didn't take Jecht seriously. It just looked like he watched a few videos of Dissidia on youtube, and called Jecht manly becuase of his Hotblooded attitude.

Yea, I have no problem about Kat doing sets for fun (if I did say that before, I now retract that statement), but I didn't find Jecht was taken seriously at all. But if that's Kat's idea of fun, then let him have his fun.
 

UserShadow7989

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 13, 2007
Messages
305
Jecht is a pretty bold move, moving away from the conceptual sets of the norm. The problem is the execution falls flat on it's face. I know you requested no comments on it, but it's a fun little idea I want to discuss.

Firstly, the constant repetition of 'Manly' throughout the set was funny the first three times I read it, but after that felt forced and started to grate on me. If it had been limited to section headers or a single line filled with variations of Manly, I'd have been able to enjoy/put up with it.

The Neutral Special introduces a "FUN and EDUCATIONAL" idea, using the scoring of goals as an alternate to straight up KOes. So at first I'm starting to like Jecht, and anticipating how it builds upon the fun little mechanic.

Then you never do. You've got the Side Special (which I don't see how is of any benefit to Jecht. So he runs, something every other character can do? No speed boost listed, no attack, and the only special quality is he can jump or attack out of it... just like a normal run. Yay?) and the Up Special (which is the type of thing I'm looking for). That's it.

The later attacks claim that they're great for Jecht to use to move the Blitzball around. How? Do they hit the ball twice as far? Do they increase the damage on the ball, make it fly in a special, hard to block trajectory? Nope. They're just 'great' at it. Nothing to give Jecht an edge, which is a big surprise since he's a star Blitzball player.

Next is the Down Special. I won't deny the coolness factor, but the fact Jecht can instantly KO his opponent with it if they interrupt his buffing kinda cheapens the fun of everything else. And instant KOes are hardly fun to read about or interesting.

After that, things just become dull. The attacks are boring, have no special twists or even fun animations, and could almost be transplanted onto any other character with no change. The attempts at humor are even worse here, and there's nothing FUN or EDUCATIONAL about any of it. Nothing truly 'Jecht' shines through.

There's a few gems, though. The Forward Smash, Back Air, and Grab all give us bits of his personality and are genuinely enjoyable to read, but even they feel like a bad joke with all the 'manly's dropped in and random effects that serve no purpose. And what happened to the Blitzball?

The Final Smash is the part of the set that serves to be the most (wait for it) FUN and EDUCATIONAL. The transformation (broken, but you're not going for balance here) got a smile out of me, and a few of the attacks were nifty while we're at it... but then there's several that are, again, boring. In the end, the Final Smash was the part of the set that entertained me to any real extent, and even that was only minor.

Taunts and Victory Screen results got a few chuckles, and did what the set failed to do in part- show off Jecht's personality and 'charm'. Codec was so forced that I felt more like crying then laughing. Or finding something to punch. Character Interpretation... this shouldn't be needed. The set itself should showcase the character. If there are some things you can't fit in, like Jecht's nice guy side (buried REALLY far below the surface), then it's nice to mention them, but ultimately it doesn't need a section.

I'm sorry to say I don't find Jecht a fun read. It's like the set equivalent of a B-movie, really. Like a joke set that's not funny. Not really fun, and doesn't say much about Jecht beyond "MANLY! MANLY! MANLY!". It would be better if we got to see more of the arrogance from Jecht himself, instead of the set.



Also: What the hell, everyone? Seriously, what the hell? So he wants to make movesets as fun to read writing pieces about characters he loves as opposed to actual concepts. Big deal. Get over it and drop the subject. If you don't like it, then forget about it. Don't spend an hour writing a rant about how 'yousukleavehearkthxbai'. I don't care even if it was intended as an excuse (which I doubt), drop it.
 

half_silver28

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
862
Location
MYM, Ohio
An innocent difference of opinion really brings out the ugliest side of MYM, doesn't it? Come on, folks. You're all channelling your inner Warlords and it's really not a very pleasant sight.
I was really just stating my opinion, even though it was a bit harsh.

The misconception here is that Katapultar cares about making the top 50. And I don't blame him.

For those who weren't in the chat, let me explain my logic.

-Whole thing having to do with top 50-
I agree with all this, moving on.


Do you honestly think nobody would enjoy reading Jecht? We might not with our lofty standards, but the average newcomer would stumble into this contest and it's reading something like Jecht that would first get them interested in this whole thing - before they "graduate" to advanced concepts of playstyle and flow, if you will (hell, that's how all of us got interested in the first place, isn't it?). With all newcomers nowadays, we try to take them straight from an MYM2-like state to playstyle-flow-focus with our criticisms. This could serve as a crucial bridge and do nothing but help us in the long run. I mean, this is a good thing for MYM, and you're all turning it into a very bad one by coming off as a bunch of uptight, elitist and very patronizing people. Which bewilders me completely - I mean, coming from Silver, Slash, and meanie? This isn't even Warlord, or Khold, or Daddy we're talking about.

And before you do, no Katapultar isn't going to "infect" newcomers with his beliefs. If they're the kinds of newcomers we'll want, they'll take interest in going from movesets-for-fun to movesets-for-MYM soon after discovering the chat
I never said that NO ONE would enjoy a set like Jecht, but most of us will not. And if Kat has no intention of trying to make a better set, people will stop commenting on them whether its fair or not. Thus his sets will not create thread activity. As for the newcomer thing, they'll likely read several sets before posting their own (either that or they read none), so Kat's sets would not be the only examples for newcomers no matter what. And we aren't as harsh on them as you claim: we take into account their newcomer status when judging their first few sets and don't demand that they jump up to Warlord levels or anything. In the long run, I don't think this really will have a large impact on newcomers or MYM as a whole. As you say, the kinds of newcomers we want will still strive to make good movesets.

& I don't THINK I was being particularly mean in my post... was I? Regardless, Kat has said that he doesn't care about others opinions on this, so I was just getting my viewpoint out there really. If there's one thing I can respect Kat for, it would be his ability to try something completely different like an artist or musician who is ahead of their time. Not that I'm saying Kat is Picasso or anything, it was just the first metaphor I could think of (CHEW).

One last thing: Since Katapultar has been misunderstood, let me translate what he's saying:

"I'm no longer making sets as gameplay experiments to be put in a game. From now on, they will be pieces of writing meant to be fun to read and to share my knowledge of the character."

Is it a perfect idea? Certainly not. Is it morally wrong? Of course not.
While I agree with your last statement, your "translation" makes it sound like Kat has abandoned making sets altogether in favor of just telling us about a character he likes. I know that's not true, but I just felt as though I should point that out.
 

Junahu

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 15, 2005
Messages
899
Location
Shropshire Slasher
And Junahu, if I'm not mistaken you're one of the ones least likely to find a subversion to traditional KOs acceptable, so I'm tempted to believe that you like it in Jecht purely out of a desire to be contrary. Correct me if I'm wrong, of course. And even then, the goal system would be more interesting, were it not for the fact that very little of the rest of the moveset plays into it.
That is very true. I am adamant that every MYMer is allowed to persue their own goals, rather than some collective objective, so I do have some obvious bias here. And, on reflection, I did find Jecht's alternate KOing to be at odds with the general idea of Smash, the aim of which is to remove these kinds of superfluous objectives from characters. However, that doesn't stop me from respecting Jecht, as an idea.
I suppose you could call it a kind of, begrudging respect; it does something that I feel is wrong, but achieves something bigger in the process. If Blitzball was a selectable mode, it would fit right in with Brawl, and I would fully support it.


A lot of people are saying that Jecht doesn't "play into" his blitzball, simply because no attack explicitly declares itself as doing anything unique to the ball. The key element in Jecht is that it is the relationship between his two simple objectives that is his playstyle;
  • Kick the ball into the goal
  • KO the foe
Jecht's simple attacks can do both, and they can even do both symultaneously. The fact that there's no superfluous nonsense to most of the moves means he can throw out an up-air, and expect it to knock the ball upwards, without some circumstantial sub-mechanic kicking in. More to the point, he needs these basic attacks in order to move the ball as efficiently as he does, and he can flawlessly switch from wailing on the ball, to wailing on the opponent.


"KingK.Rool" said:
Choosing between, say, Magmortar and Hariyama or Hannibal and Dark Bowser is hardly anything more than a subjective thing - influenced with a sprinkling of presentation and character bias, whether you pretend it's not or... not. The top 50 will reflect the whims of a very small group of people who can no longer properly categorize one set as better than another
Would you like to know a secret? Pk-OW said something to that effect quite some time ago. Emergency was sharp enough to see this too. And now that you've realised it... you must also... dissapear :bee:
 

Agi

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 27, 2008
Messages
1,120
Location
SE Washington
Why isnt the top 50 decided by a larger vote? I mean,(i'm just guessing here) there are only, what, 5 leaders and a select few others that have a say in it? It seems like a fairly small group to judge a contest with over 60 entries. And i'm guessing that the older more experienced voters have a ton of influence over the others, either by how much their vote counts or just being able to influence others oppinions. I'm not saying that EVERYONE should have a vote, that would be chaos, but would it kill to have maybe 15-20 voters, not all of whom would be greatly influenced by friends or someone who has a more (hypothetical) powerful oppinion?
It just seems the "contest" is irrelevent if its judged by a very small and possibly biased select group of people

Edit: How is the vote decided anyway(i know this seems dumb of me to ask)? Is it a point-type system, or does everyone just like, vote for one moveset, or is there a debate-type thing, or whatever?
Oh, don't worry about that number of ten voters... that was just something Warlord threw out in the chat going by who he thinks has been keeping up with reading the sets. And the voting system itself seems to change every contest, but basically it works like this: You get 6 Super Votes, I think 10 regular votes, and something like 14 weak votes. You can vote for movesets as you see fit, Super Votes counting as three votes, regular votes as two, and weak votes as only one. Then again, we may have a completely different system by the end of this contest, so keep alert!

EDIT: Aaaaand you edited your post. Well, I'll keep this here anyhow.
 

Rychu

Thane of Smashville
Joined
Jul 5, 2010
Messages
810
3DS FC
1908-0105-4965
Oh, don't worry about that number of ten voters... that was just something Warlord threw out in the chat going by who he thinks has been keeping up with reading the sets. And the voting system itself seems to change every contest, but basically it works like this: You get 6 Super Votes, I think 10 regular votes, and something like 14 weak votes. You can vote for movesets as you see fit, Super Votes counting as three votes, regular votes as two, and weak votes as only one. Then again, we may have a completely different system by the end of this contest, so keep alert!

EDIT: Aaaaand you edited your post. Well, I'll keep this here anyhow.
Thanks for clarifying for me. After posting that i was thinking that maybe i was misinformed and that maybe i rushed into that.

It stll doesnt seem like a perfect system to me, but its better than what i was thinking it was
 

Hyper_Ridley

Smash Champion
Joined
Dec 21, 2007
Messages
2,289
Location
Hippo Island
Christ, can I EVER go away for a day without the community sinking deeper than Hell?

If Kat wants to make really simple sets, then by all means, he should be allowed to make really simple sets. Heck, if Axel Gear didn't make it obvious enough, I myself found that I vastly prefer to make generally simple sets built around a few creative ideas with the occasional really wacky move. Both simple AND complex sets should have a place here in MYM.

Now, as for Jeht himself, the problem I have with it is that it feels like a rough draft, mainly in that it doesn't actually say HOW the attacks affect the ball. You know, like what direction and with how much force does this move "kick" the ball. There's actually a wonderful comparison to this set in a real fighting game, Venom in Guilty Gear. He sets up FLOATING POOL BALLS around the stage, and all his attacks (he fights with a cue stick btw) smack the balls around in all sorts of pre-defined ways and they bounce, so he can set up all sorts of various projectile walls. Fun stuff.

I think Jeht could have become a truly awesome set without having to make ihim any more complex gameplay-wise, if more detail was added to his attacks so I know how they interact with his cool mechanic.


Upon re-reading the set, I saw that it DOES state that the ball takes damage/knockback in the same way as a character, so that clears things up. ololololol
 

Rychu

Thane of Smashville
Joined
Jul 5, 2010
Messages
810
3DS FC
1908-0105-4965
Okay: Stupid question not relevent to the topic at hand.

I read in the thread something about Story-modes people have written. Is there a contest for Story writing yet?
 

Hyper_Ridley

Smash Champion
Joined
Dec 21, 2007
Messages
2,289
Location
Hippo Island
There WERE "best story mode" awards in MYM3 and 4, because back then there were 3-5 going on for people to vote on, and they actually were finished. Now we just get 1-2 a contest that hardly ever get past the first level or 2, lol.
 

Agi

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 27, 2008
Messages
1,120
Location
SE Washington
Two year anniversary set

Well then, it's been two years, eh? Two years since I stumbled across that thread, Make Your Move 3.0. I never thought that this would become such a huge part of my life, but I certainly don't regret the fact that it has. Anyway, this set in particular is me trying to get back to what I originally was seeking with the thread... putting a character into Brawl, not making my own strategy/platformer game. As such, you'll find absolutely NO move interactions in this set, only moves that are meant to go together. This set borrows a few concept from Darth Meanie's Magmortar and Wizzerd's Stranglelove, as well as a few moves that largely resemble Brawl attacks. However, if all went well, this set will have just as much flow as anything else I've made. Anyway, that's up for you all to decide, so enjoy my obligatory Robot Master...

Napalm Man

Playlist
Napalm Man is a weapons enthusiast loyal to Wily. He is equipped with explosives called Napalm Bomb in his arms, can shoot missiles straight forward from his head, and can shoot six small homing missiles from his shoulders. He has treads on his feet and can speed up with a rocket on his back. Because he is a walking weapon, even his allies feel uncomfortable near him, so he doesn't have many friends. His weakness is the Crystal Eye, which in Smash causes him to take 1.5x the knockback from round projectiles.​

Stats

Napalm Man has a fairly unusual set of stats. On one hand, he appears to be a typical heaviweight... he's as heavy as Snake, has a below-average first jump and a simply pitiful second jump. He also falls fairly quickly and it a bit of a slowcoach, only able to run as fast as Zelda. On the opposite end of the spectrum is his aerial mobility. When midair, he can move around faster than any of Brawl's playable characters, as fast as Pikachu's dash... however, he takes a bit of time to recover when he lands, similarly to Ganondorf. Couple this with his unrivaled range and power, and he's a serious threat to virtually any character.​

Specials

Side Special
Napalm Bomb




This move is incredibly similar to Pikachu's Thunder Jolt, in that it causes Napalm Man to toss a small, peanut-shaped bomb out in front of himself. It bounces off of walls and shields, and into bottomless pits, following the contours of the map to the best of its ability at the pace of Ganondorf's walk. Up to three of these can bounce around the stage at any given time, and it takes very little time to fire one; about the same amount of time that it takes Link to pull out one of his own bombs. When they touch an opponent, they'll explode in a large burst of flame and deal 12% with knockback that kills at 200%.

Shielded Napalm Bombs are dangerous to Napalm Man as well as his opponent. Watch out!



Smashing this input, however, delivers a completely different attack. It can be seen at the end of the above video, or in the sentences to follow. Napalm Man thrusts both of his arms upward at a diagonal angle, hurling two Napalm bombs in an arcing path. They'll crash down to earth about a battlefield's platform ahead of Napalm Man on level terrain, and reach their apex about two Ganondorf heights above the ground. Each of these Napalm Bombs is somewhat weaker than their non-smashed cousins, dealing 9% and KOing at 250%, whether the foe is hit midair or by the grounded explosion. However, if the foe is hit at the apex (where the two bombs are crossing over eachother) they'll take 18% and knockback that KOs at 125%, effectively doubling the power. Watch for this attack's blind spot.

Napalm Man can move again as soon as the bombs reach their apex.

Neutral Special
Beacon


Napalm Man turns to face the foreground and crouches down a bit, almost sitting on his treads. The missiles ordinarily poking out of his arm cannons retract and are replaced with crude pincers for the duration of this move. Napalm Man fiddles around with the patch of ground in the foreground, setting up something mechanical. After a second of frenzied motioning, a kee-high, metal pillar with a flashing red light on top is revealed. This serves absolutely no purpose whatsoever on its own, although Napalm Bombs will bounce off of them like walls. Up to three beacons can be on the stage at a time, and you can remove all beacons at once by repeatedly pressing B, and you can remove individual beacons by walking up to them and pressing the B button twice. You can also press it once to simply deactivate the beacon and cause its light to stop flashing.

Beacons will just collapse into the ground when they're removed, nothing fancy. The lights on top of the beacons will flash once every second, letting you keep track of time.

Up Special
Suicide Bomber


A sharp "click" is heard when you activate this move, giving the opponent a split second to react. After a fifth of a second of super armor, Napalm Man creates a massive explosion which encases the lower half of his body in flame. This has slightly more range than Jigglypuff's Rest, and is certainly more powerful. It can deal 25% and knockback which KOs at only 60%. It also rockets Napalm Man skyward, blasting him as high as Diddy's 75% charged recovery. Unfortunately, he takes 10% from the explosion. Napalm Man is helpless until he reaches the apex, but can move around normally afterwards, making this his best way to get airborne. He can’t use this again until he touches the ground.​

Down Special
Cease Fire


Napalm Man raises his arm and touches the side of his head, followed by some indistinct mumbling. It appears that he's just accessed a radio of some sort. At any point during this move's .5 seconds, you can input any button to cancel the call, adding another quarter second of ending lag as he frantically shakes his other arm. What this does is simple: deactivate any moves in-progress. Some of Napalm Man's moves are on a timer of some sort, and this move halts the timer. If you've already stopped the timer, another input will start it up again. Smashing this input will cause the timer to instantly end. This move is necessary to master if you hope to consistently land some of Napalm Man's attacks.​

Smashes

Up Smash
Air Strike




With the same animation as his Down Special, Napalm Man accesses his radio once again. When smashed, this has the exact execution time as his Down Special, although increased charge will eliminate any such mindgames. Ten seconds after this move's use, a large shadow will pass over the screen from left to right, accompanied by the roar of a jet engine. As it passes overhead, it will drop three missiles about the size of Ganondorf at three different points on the screen: the left edge, the right edge, and the center by default. Through judicious use of your beacons, you can control exactly where they'll land. A single beacon will cause the center missile to change its course, two beacons will alter the trajectory of the edge missiles, and three will cause every missile to target a beacon. Note that a beacon must be active to count towards the total beacon count and to be targeted.

These missiles are the biggest threat when it comes to fighting against Napalm Man. Given that he has complete control over when and where each and every one will land, the potential mindgames with deactivated beacons and this move's similarity to the Down Special, not to mention the sheer power of the missiles themselves, (24-33%, vertical knockback KOing at 80%,) this is truly a triple threat to fear. Napalm Man can't call for another air strike until the first one has finished, although he will go through the same animation as if he had called one if he tries to.

Napalm Man can be harmed by his own Air Strike, although they only do 75% the damage and knockback. Except for the Down Smash and obvious Up Special, this is the only one of his moves that can harm him.

Forward Smash
Artillery Cannon




This is Napalm Man's other signature attack, and it can be seen at the start of the video for the Side Special. After firmly planting his treads in the ground, he'll fire a barrage of 2-5 missiles forward at the speed of Samus's smashed missiles, with about 1/3 battlefield's length in between each of them. Each of these does 5-7% with knockback equal to Dedede's Down Throw, even to shielding foes. Once an opponent gets hit by one of these, they'll probably be hit by the rest. Ducking or going in the air is a good idea here. This is best used to force approaches, although you must take care with this move's high overall lag. When fully charged, it'll take a massive four seconds to complete this move.

If any missiles are reflected, they'll crash back into the next missile in line and explode. This prevents reflector abuse, and adds another layer of strategy to Napalm Man... if he fires out an even number of missiles, he's perfectly safe from having any knocked back at him!

Down Smash
Proximity Mine


Napalm Man aims a single arm cannon at the ground at point-blank range, and visibly tenses up while you charge. Upon release, a loud whump is heard as Napalm Man embeds a special breed of Napalm bomb into the ground. Yep, you guessed it... this is a near carbon-copy of Snake's Down Smash. It's notable that the bomb will only go off if someone walks over it, as it ignores projectiles and stray Napalm Bombs. This is slightly less laggy than Snake's attack, and the bomb is notably weaker... only dealing 10-14% and knockback that KOs around 140%.

Note that the bomb will be buried deeper in the ground the longer you charge... when C-sticked, a whole half of the peanut will still be visible, but it's hidden entirely underground from half charge and on.​

Standards

Neutral A
Treads


Napalm Man locks his feet together almost instantly, creating a single mass that looks quite similar to one of those conveyor belts from stage builder. From here, you can move the control stick in either direction to cause Napalm Man to automatically move in that direction at his walk speed. He can attack, dodge, shield, grab, anything besides roll and jump. If he rolls off the stage, he'll finish any attack he's in the middle of, and then be free to control. If no attack is in progress, he'll grab the edge.

Rolling over a Proximity Mine while in this form is essentially a free Up Special. The bomb explodes, Napalm Man rockets up to the same height, his treads come apart, and he takes no damage. This is good for mixing up approaches, as well as a way to make opponents consider throwing themselves on the trap so you don't get the chance to abuse your air game.

You can change direction at any point while on-ground, (even mid-attack!) but it'll take you about half a second to do so. However, Napalm Man is locked into looking the same direction until the move's end. Tap A to deactivate Napalm Man's treads, and cause him to snap them apart. Alternatively, get knocked into the air somehow.​

Side Tilt
Flamethrower


Read as: Bowser's Neutral Special. Napalm Man's version of this attack is aimed perfectly horizontally and has about the range of a battlefield platform, but has a distinctive starting animation which makes it quite predictable. It's best used in conjunction with your Neutral A for approaching purposes.​

Up Tilt
Blast Burn


As you hold up on the controller, Napalm Man takes on a new idle stance, as he looks slightly upwards in an uncaring gaze. This also happens to aim his head cannon in a very convenient direction… a direction this attack takes full advantage of.

With very little starting lag, Napalm Man releases a sudden burst of fire at an upwards angle. The size of this blast is about the size of Ganondorf, if you were to turn him on his side and rotate him 30 degrees. There’s a bit of cooldown lag, about as much as the average FTilt. This onslaught of flame deals 12% and horizontal knockback that can KO only at 300%. It’s best used against opponents trying to jump over you… approach on treads with a flamethrower and switch to this attack when they try to avoid.​

Down Tilt
Overheat


Well, well. It appears that Napalm Man has been overexerting himself a bit much... when this move is used, a sharp burst of steam will shoot out from his body, with no hitbox or anything like that. Afterward, though, his body will take on the slightest hint of red, with a small flaming aura around him. This becomes more and more obvious over the next eight seconds, until Napalm Man is pure red and leaves trails of flame behind himself. After eight seconds, he suffers immense cooldown lag as he cools down, a second worth of it.

So, what's the purpose of this attack? Well, if the opponent touches Napalm Man while he's red-hot, (from four seconds onward,) they'll take 5% and weak knockback, as if from a jab. This can save your life if you're fighting a fast, combo-based opponent.​

Dash Attack
Afterburner


After a fair bit of starting lag as Napalm Man looks behind himself, his rear thrusters kick in and propel him forwards in a large explosion. Essentially, this is a horizontal version of his Up Special that kicks his dash speed up to Sonic’s level as long as he goes in the same direction. He deals 10% if he crashes into an opponent, with knockback that kills at 220%. The explosion behind him deals 24% with diagonal knockback that kills at 90%. This move is particularly vulnerable to being shield grabbed, and Napalm Man’s traction is worse than Luigi’s when he attempts to turn around. Like his Neutral A, he can use any of his grounded attacks while moving, although he has a short window of opportunity.​

Aerials

Down Aerial
Firestorm




This is easily one of Napalm Man’s most useful moves, and the centerpiece of his airgame. Aiming both of his arm cannons straight down, he releases an enormous stream of napalm beneath himself that has the range of the stream from a fully-charged Wario Waft. Opponents caught in this stream take a massive 13% per second, and are pushed down at a bit more than Falco’s fallspeed. Napalm Man can hold this as long as he pleases, but he has to watch out for massive landing lag and a distinctive starting animation.​

Neutral Aerial
Steamshovel Harry


Napalm Man activates the until-now unused jetpack on his back for this move, which takes very little time. Once it's activated, a small hitbox of fire is created underneath Napalm Man, which is a weak spike that does 4%. More notably, though, it slows Napalm Man down to 1/3 of his usual fall speed, potentially letting him get above an opponent for use of your DAir. Also notable is that Napalm Man can use his specials and move around while the jetpack is active. This has a recharge time similar to ROB's recovery special.​

Forward Aerial
Quincy


This is a unique move. It’s similar to the standard Napalm Bomb in animation, as Napalm Man fires out a single bomb in front of himself. However, it only travels a short distance, about Bowser’s width, before exploding. It has odd knockback, diagonally downward towards Napalm Man, and deals 10%. This puts foes exactly where you want them for your DAir, and you may even be able to footstall jump them if you’re fastfalling for a double threat.

This move named in honor of Thrice's firstborn son.

Up Aerial
Fire Field


Well well, the opponent got above you. Not surprising with all your launching attacks, but still not the place you want them to be. So, let's encourage them to stay on the ground, shall we? With this move, Napalm Man fires out two Napalm Bombs above himself, each slightly angled to either side. These will explode about halfway up the screen on most stages, creating a large area of burning flame that actually lingers around for a bit! It's about as big as those cloud enemies from the Subspace Emissary, and deals 13% per second to foes who go into it. Hey, it's just like the Down Aerial! Of course, if an opponent was in the area of effect when the bombs exploded, they'll take 10% with vertical knockback that, if the opponent was grounded, would kill at 250%.

This aftereffect will disappear after about five seconds. Use this as an opponent is on the way up from one of your launchers and force them to come back down through the fire for extra damage. Oh yes, and if Napalm Man goes through the fire himself, he won't take any damage... but he WILL heat up as if he had used his Down Tilt.​

Backward Aerial
Homing Missile


Napalm Man turns around slightly so that he can look over his shoulder, then points an arm cannon behind himself and fires a missile that looks exactly like the ones from his Forward Smash, if a bit more rounded. This missile seeks out anyone in a Smart bomb’s range much like a Metroid at the speed of Mario’s dash, and deals 8% with weak knockback on contact. This is less of a threat than a distraction; a way to interrupt foes with a stronger airgame than you. If it doesn't hit a target within two and a half seconds, it'll explode on its own. And no, you can't stop this timer with your Down Special. That'd be silly.​

Grabgame

Grab
Lurch


Napalm Man reaches out with both arms, with fairly high range. This is among the laggier grabs, as Napalm Man bends over as far as he can, almost turning horizontal. The large surface area of his treads helps him maintain his balance. Naturally, using this with your treads active will drastically increase the range. It also gives you the added ability to carry your opponent while moving.

Pummeling the opponent is somewhat awkward for Napalm Man, as releasing the opponent with either arm would let them escape. Deprived of any other options, he’ll headbutt them slowly for 2% a pop. An alternative to your pummel is your Down Special… that’s right, you can use it while holding your opponent. Instead of activating his radio via the usual method, he’ll send a flare out of his head cannon to signal the air strike.​

Forward Throw
Hotfoot


Napalm Man hurls the opponent diagonally forward with an underhand motion to deal 6%, with set knockback; about a Battlefield platform and a half. He then shoots a single Napalm Bomb towards them which explodes on impact, bursting into flame as it hits his foe’s feet. In addition to doing 8% with weak vertical knockback, this sets their feet alight, forcing them to behave as if they had eaten Superspicy Curry... without the added bonus of shooting out fire, of course. Force them to dash around into Proximity Mines and Napalm Bombs, or jump into the air where you can force them back to the ground. Due to how long it takes to use this move, it’s not recommended for use in close quarters.​

Up Throw
Cover


Napalm Man quickly swaps to the pincer hands he used in his Neutral Special to get a better grip on the opponent, then raises them above his head and... holds them there? He's basically just changed his grip on the opponent, as he can still pummel them as usual. He also gains the ability to move around from left to right to reposition himself. What purpose does this serve? Do you really have to ask? Stand where you expect an Air Strike to land and let it crash down on top of the opponent while they struggle to escape with 2x the difficulty!​

Down Throw
Steamroller


Napalm Man forces the opponent onto the ground with a smack to the back of the head for 3%, and then adds insult to injury by rolling over them with his treads to deal an extra 12%. This leaves the foe in a prone position, vulnerable to be followed up with an Air Strike or what have you.​

Backward Throw
Human Cannon


Napalm Man lifts the foe up and then shoves them into his headcannon, face-first. No, this isn't some weird form of vore, or an obligatory Warlordian eating move. Napalm Man quickly turns around and fires the opponent out of his cannon just as he would a missile from his FSmash. They'll bounce along the ground a few times before skidding to a stop about half Final Destination's length away, and have the opportunity to tech at any of these bounces. Only 9% is done directly by this move. Use this to force opponents that have managed to get close to you to approach all over again!​

Final Smash
Shrimp on the Barbie D-Day

Napalm Man calls in for a helicopter to lift him out of the way of the incoming assault, as there's little chance he'd survive it... once he's safely out of the way, the attack begins. Shadows pass over the screen accompanied by the endless scream of roaring engines, once, twice, three times... culminating in six passes. I suppose you can guess what's going to happen now... over the next ten seconds, the stage will be engulfed in falling missiles, (20 of them,) each 1.5x as powerful as the ones from his regular Air Strike. They're a bit easier to predict, though, because there's a shadow that appears just before each missile crashes down. After the carnage ends, Napalm Man jumps down from the top of the screen, ready to continue his attack.​

Playstyle
Endless Approach

Napalm Man is, at his core, a spacer. He has countless options for long range and midrange attacking, but is incredibly weak up close. There’s a blind spot about a battlefield platform’s radius in all directions around Napalm Man, with his only moves that attack those locations taking far too long to use in close quarters. In short, he’s combo fodder. You’re going to have to use every tool in his disposal to defend him, be it Napalm Bombs to interrupt chaingrabs or a Homing Missile to get out of a difficult situation in midair. Napalm Man does have a bit of setup to him, with the Beacons and Air Strikes, but you can hold off of such matters until the foe is at high enough of a percentage to be KOed.

So, how does Napalm Man play? At early percentages, you’ll want to fight as far away as possible, and force your opponent to approach you. Drop a couple of Napalm Bombs and fire your Artillery Cannon to force your opponent to practice their jumping skills, and repeat as necessary. Try to fire out an even number of shots to prevent abuse from Reflectors. As they get closer, try to predict their motions and land a smashed Napalm Bomb on them. If it hits, great! Plant a Beacon, activate your treads and move the opposite direction while still facing them, firing your Artillery Cannon or your Flamethrower all the while, then repeat the process. While this strategy is effective against slower, heavier characters, (especially with the Artillery Cannons pushing them backwards through shields,) it doesn’t leave a lot of room for experimentation, creating a boring game for all involved. Plus, if they do manage to penetrate your defenses (entirely possible if they’re good at spotdodging) you’re pretty much screwed with your poor grab and lack of short-range attacks.

No, Napalm Man is much more fun to play as if you’re willing to take some risks and actually approach the opponent. Your Neutral A will see a large amount of use with this method. Activate it right off the bat and head towards the opponent. Use your FSmash at long range and FTilt as you get closer. You may want to mix the FTilt up with Napalm Bombs which will bounce out slightly in front of you, and some Smashed Napalm Bombs at mid-range. Keep in mind that Smashed Napalm Bombs will crash down right on top of you, interrupting a foe that may have ideas of grabbing you. Another good idea would be to use your DSmash as you approach, not for your opponent to run into, but for a convenient bounce into the air later. Once a few Napalm Bombs are bouncing around the stage along with a Proximity Mine, you may want to give the foe a hotfoot via your Up Throw to force them to either dash around like a madman or jump into the air.

And the air is truly where Napalm Man shines. Unfortunately, Napalm Man has the same problem in the air as on the ground in that he has so few short-range options, but if he can get himself above the opponent they’re almost guaranteed to feel the pain of a Firestorm. This simple attack, the DAir, is so powerful of a gimping technique that you almost forget that Napalm Man lacks a reliable way to get his opponent offstage… his main KO tools are vertical kills, remember? No, Napalm Man still wants to gimp the opponent, but he wants to gimp them onstage to force them back down where all his Napalm Bombs and Proximity Mines can continue to chip away at his opponents’ health. There’s the obvious FAir which places opponents exactly where you want them, and suicide bombing with your Up Special will almost always get you that extra height you need for an effective Firestorm. If you find yourself completely overwhelmed by your foe in midair, then fire off a Homing Missile and fastfall out of harm’s way. Still, it’d be a shame to deprive yourself of such a great damage-racking opportunity.

When it comes to the KO, an Air Strike is the most reliable decision. It’s a powerful, slightly more laggy version of Snake’s Down Special when combined with Cease Fire, that has the added bonus of multiple hitboxes. Combine this with the mindgame potential of your ability to activate and deactivate your Beacons at will, the ability to call an Air Strike out of your grab, and the constant threat of Napalm Man’s neverending approach, it can be easy for an opponent to get caught in an Air Strike, even if you hadn’t set up any Beacons whatsoever. Mix up your Beacon placement… use them regularly to cause the foe to think they’re safe as long as they aren’t standing next to one, then call them down underground or manually deactivate them to shake such beliefs and pound them in the default blast zones. Alternative options include grabbing your opponent with your treads active and rolling off the stage for a Napalmcide, and using Suicide Bomber at close range, although that may backfire as the opponent defends with a flurry of quick attacks.

In the end, Napalm Man is a furious brawler. With an arsenal of many varied ranged weapons, a powerful approaching game, and power and weight to spare, he can face off against most of the roster fairly well. However, with no quick move to get opponents out of his hair, it’s easy to turn his size against him. Napalm Man can cover up this weakness by always being on the move, but one well-timed grab could spell game over for him.​

Playing Against
Return Fire

As intimidating as Napalm Man is, he does have some exploitable weaknesses. There’s the blind spot that’s been mentioned so many times, of course, but with Napalm Man’s onslaught of projectiles, how do you even get close? Well, if you have the option, crawl. Napalm Man’s missiles will pass over all but the worst duckers, and Napalm Bombs can be clashed against by most Down Tilts. Keep an eye out for Air Strikes as you work your way towards him… the shadow passing over the battlefield is the only warning sign you’ll get before the missiles crash down, so time your spotdodge or airdodge accordingly. When you get within range, he’ll probably activate his treads and his flamethrower or use Suicide Bomber to bounce over you. For the first option, shieldgrab. Otherwise, just try to avoid the Firestorm and let him take the 10%. Keep pressuring him, shield a few Napalm Bombs to bounce them back towards him and keep him on his toes.

Once you get close to Napalm Man, KEEP HIM CLOSE. Avoid your Smashes until he’s at KO percentages, especially your Up Smash. Barrage him with tilts, sourspotted aerials, throws, (stick to pummels, if possible) and dash attacks if he starts to get too far away. If he manages to get his treads out and retreat while firing his Artillery Cannon towards you, just duck the attack as you’re likely to get knocked farther away than you would if you just stood still.

Gimping Napalm Man is your best option when it comes to scoring a KO. Yes, his airgame is fairly strong if he’s above you, but if you have the upper ground… or really, even if you’re at his level, you should be able to overpower him with an FAir or an NAir. Otherwise, stay away from vertical kills, as that’s just inviting him to use his DAir on you as you fall down.​

Extras




Entry Pose

Napalm Man jumps out of some conveniently placed underbrush, then points out a single arm as if to emulate Fox’s “Come on!” taunt.​

Taunts

Up: Napalm Man opens up a flap on his arm, presses a few buttons, then snaps it back into place. Who does he think he is, Buzz Lightyear?
Side: Napalm Man emulates his Side Special perfectly, but instead of a Napalm Bomb, one of Link’s bombs pops out. He grabs it and looks at it curiously before it goes anywhere, then throws it into the background where it explodes. Other appearances include Snake’s grenades, Toon Link’s bombs, and sticky bombs. Even if a foe DOES happen to be in the background from, say one of Haunter’s attacks, this won’t hurt them.
Down: Napalm Man shoots a single, small bomb into the air, which explodes into… fireworks! Yay!​

Personal Thoughts

I quite enjoyed making Napalm Man. Personally, I think he's a bit of a step back for me, as you'll notice that move interactions are few and far between. However, it was fun for me to remember "Hey! There's an actual game I'm putting these guys into," and design a set FOR THAT GAME. Napalm Man, to me, feels like the spiritual sequel to Bubble Man, with a strong approaching game behind a wall of projectiles. As such, I get a feeling that I'll turn off some people who used to like my sets, but probably gain a few new readers. That's a risk I'm willing to take. Oh yes, and sorry about the less than serious movenames... there's a story behind each of them, I swear.​
 

darth meanie

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
452
Napalm Man

In my continued attempt to reiterate my relevancy this MYM, here's a comment on Napalm Man!

Anyways, Naplam Man is a pretty decent set Agi. I like how you took the idea from Magmortar of forcing opponents into the air, and reversed it, forcing opponents on the ground. Makes me wish you'd made a Magmortar match-up for him in fact. Neither of them would particularly like to play with each other, I'd think.

Anyways, as for the moveset proper, it's decent, but has a few weaknesses. Beacons feel a little awkward for a Special move, since they only really end up affecting his Up Smash, and the Down Special doesn't really help control them, as it turns beacons on and off, but also calls off the air strike...

A few moves felt rather fillerish as well, especially some of the aerials, like the Forward Aerial and Up Aerial. Generally, when a signature move is introduced as a Special, and then reappears again for another fairly random move with a different effect, it feels out of place.

That said, I do like his approach game through Treads; it's a clever way to get the bang of constantly moving attacks without the cost, and the use of his ranged attacks in conjunction with his strong approach gives him two unique ways to play on the ground, which is very cool.

It's got some flaws; moves like Overheat, which exist for their mechanical effect rather than damage, sort of frustrate me, especially when you make a point of his vulnerability at close range in his playstyle and don't even mention the move again.

All in all though, Napalm Man is a decent set. Not amazing, but certainly a worthwhile read. Good job Agi.
 

Agi

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 27, 2008
Messages
1,120
Location
SE Washington
Napalm Man

Anyways, as for the moveset proper, it's decent, but has a few weaknesses. Beacons feel a little awkward for a Special move, since they only really end up affecting his Up Smash, and the Down Special doesn't really help control them, as it turns beacons on and off, but also calls off the air strike...
Sorry, but I felt this was the main thing I needed to comment on. Down Special doesn't call OFF the air strike, it just puts it on hold. Smashing the Down Special at any time will cause it to instantly occur. I'm not sure where you got turning the Beacons off from; you need to use the Neutral Special for that.
 

darth meanie

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
452
Oh my bad. I misremembered the move that activated/deactivated Beacons as the Down Special, which confused me. Sorry about that then.
 

Hyper_Ridley

Smash Champion
Joined
Dec 21, 2007
Messages
2,289
Location
Hippo Island
Napalm Man

An Agi set without 10000 different interactions? (horror)

Oh, but he's still a stage controller. (h)

What I see in Napalm Man is a fun collection of various projectile and trap moves that synergise well together to help with his spacing and positioning game. I'm glad that you didn't take the route of "in-smash = no creativity", as stuff like Napalm Man's DAir, while simple, are still plenty creative in how they have bad*** animations and effects to create chaotic fun. THIS is the kind of stuff that Sakurai needs to put more of into his sets if he wants it to remain a "simple" party-game without sacrificing the flash factor.

Of course, Napalm Man still strives to create a functional playstyle underneath all the flash, and while he may not have your signature "hard coded" interactions, he still reeks of your style with all the ways the moves play off their base mechanics to form soft interactions. At first I questioned how a character with amazing range, good defense, and great offense could ever be balanced, but then I remembered that he is a rare set to explicitly state he has a poor off-stage game (lol @ gimping onstage).

I don't really like DTilt, to be honest. I mean, can't I just run away until the move wears off then punish him during the end lag? It feels kinda annoying for a character who's supposed to be limited at close-range suddenly have an option that scares away any character who's close to him.

Overall, while I would still say Hornet Man is your best set for the beautiful ways he interacted with his Bee system, Napalm Man was a fun experement, and an enjoyable set. (y)
 

Agi

Smash Lord
Joined
Jul 27, 2008
Messages
1,120
Location
SE Washington
I don't really like DTilt, to be honest. I mean, can't I just run away until the move wears off then punish him during the end lag? It feels kinda annoying for a character who's supposed to be limited at close-range suddenly have an option that scares away any character who's close to him.
Y'know, I kinda had a feeling you'd like this set, HR. (h)

To be equally honest, DTilt was either the second-to-last or the third-to-last move I wrote, and I'm not much a fan of it either. It was meant to be a way to keep Napalm Man from being absolutely screwed if an opponent gets within that range... moves such as Sheik's FTilt would completely shut him down, and this gives him a slight window to escape. Keep in mind, though, that if he has his treads active, he'll be able to keep moving even during this ending lag... not to mention that Napalm Bombs and such would make it just a tad more difficult to simply run away mindlessly.

Also, the playstyle section was written before I thought up those last five move inputs... which explains why UAir, NAir, BThrow, UThrow, and DTilt never crop up in there despite a few of those moves being incredibly playstyle relevant.
 

half_silver28

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
862
Location
MYM, Ohio
Half_Silver's
Episode Three: The Revenge of the Magical Street Fighting Robo-bunnies



Oh hey, just me again. With more of that commenting thing...


Alright, so I know Q already got a bunch of comments, but I'm gonna add my 2 cents anyway since I'm one of the big SF guys in MYM... even though I likely won't join in on the SF x Tekken movement (WARY). Anyhow, Q manages to be a surprisingly strong set in my eyes, considering he was a one day set & a SF character (after Cammy, I have to props for making him interesting). Even though I'm not too fond of many of his attacks essentially doing the same thing in several cases, the core of simply predicting foes and then grounding or occupying them so the explosion can hit is awesome and really fitting for Q. & the healing really contributes well to the set too: I do think more sets should utilize healing like this really. And the set was easy to read of course, the MT writing style is as good as ever. I hope you're able to get your laptop problem fixed soon! :)


Now we've got Kamek ,who is certainly far better than Dark Samus or the earlier Boo. A generally annoying character who can give foes a hell of a time with his camping, teleportation, moving platforms and unpredictability in his interactions and changing moves with the neutral special. The only interaction that really concerns me is the triple fireball thing, which seems unlikely to be able to pull off ever. That being said: Kamek's playstyle basically equals camping, then more camping once the foe's stuck in a hellstorm of moving platforms, hexes and flaming shy guys. & it certainly helps that Kamek is great at running away with his teleporting between platforms and gliding, & he's got that glide attack to cover his escape.

Though I do have a few nitpicks. First off, I wish that Kamek had some other way to leave hexes lingering around the field other than canceling the up smash: maybe just a very slow moving hex or something. The down throw stands out as very irrelevant compared to the rest of the set, and as a really specific nitpick, I think you should break up some of the larger paragraphs. the set will look larger, but it will be much easier to read I think. So yeah, terrific job with this set: hopefully you've got another good one planned for when you get back! (wow two straight comments on sets of people who are temporarily absent <.< )



Oh man, now I have to comment this horrible set for Childre ololololol. But seriously, the basic concept behind Childre is quite good: spread ice around the stage to buff your movement, then freeze the foe in order to damage rack & kill. That being said, I think the biggest problem with Childre is that you try to do too much: the whole freezing the stage concept could make up the set on its own: Childre could just take advantage of the speed it gives him to jump around and use moves like a sliding up smash to unexpectedly kill foes. Now the whole thing with making foes easier to KO via freezing is a good idea for sure, but it just seems like the set would flow better if there was less focus on that aspect of Childre's play. & the whole neutral special buff move seems pretty pointless to me: why not just let his freezing moves have the buff to begin with? Well, at least the stage-related freezing buff.

Now, nitpicks. While you are pretty good about mentioning the different playstyle uses of moves, you tend to repeat yourself at times & take a long time to describe simple/obvious things. Like you repeat that the icicles from the up special have to travel 1.25 platforms in order to become mist upon hitting the ground. And the standard A seems like it would fit a special more, imo. Then there’s the down smash: the fact that it can only be used on ice is kind of an unneeded restriction, it can still have its ice restoring properties anyhow. & yeah, you should have a playstyle section, even though Childe is easy enough to understand without one. Overall, this was a decent set by any standards, & a great one by newcomer standards. Hope to see another one from you! :D



Finally we have Ken, the first set made specifically for the SF x Tekken movement! Now I got a little concerned when I saw the fired up mechanic at the beginning, but it sort of works considering Ken's combo-ish playstyle. Now the violent ken mode I won't get into with the non-canon nature, but it seems that being stunned for 2 seconds when it wears off is a bit much. Now Ken is a lot more creative than I would've thought, with you using super moves in the set and all (& I'm fine with akuma's aerial hadouken being in there). What really gets me is the first person writing style that makes up the ENTIRE set. Ken's personality according to this set is a generic cocky fighter, & it really does get tiring to heard Ken talk about the technical details of moves. WAAAAAAY back when I made Midna, I didn't have her get into technical move properties too much, which I think led to the first person writing not getting in the way of the set (this can also stand true for Excel).

And there's another problem that's present throughout the whole set: the KO percents of his moves are just INSANE. He can deal damage really well: why do so many of his moves KO at 100% or earlier? & even his weak moves KO at 150% or something. & that's even before taking into account the 1.5 KB boost from fired up (HORROR). & I hate when a character has a grab reverse move & no grab of their own, but that's just personal perferance. Overall Ken isn't one of your better sets, but you already know that really. You did as good a job with him as you could've I think, so just keep the sets coming (Y)
 

TWILTHERO

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 19, 2007
Messages
1,880
Location
Canada
Napalm Man

Okay then, I promised you a comment since yesterday, so here it is. That and i need the next page for something.(wary)

Unfortunately, I don't have a whole lot to add that hasn't been said before. I'll say that I really like the set. I like how Napalm Man can gimp onstage. He has a cool ground game of spacing and positioning with his projectiles and traps. There are a lot of cool moves that I really like. I particularly like Treads which helps him attack while he's moving, especially when combined with those mass projectiles, and that up smash sounds really cool to use. There are a couple of fillerish moves (particularly the forward aerial)...but I won't go into too much detail about that considering you know about those already. Plus, aside from maybe the forward throw, I'm not a huge fan of the grabs. More on the positive side though, this set was very easy to read, and it's not overly complicated. This is the kinda set I would love to see in Brawl. Overall, I don't consider this set to be your best, especially considering they don't have the signature mass agi interactions we've come to love, but it's still a very enjoyable read, so good job agi.(h) Sorry if this comment seems rather short. (sry)

Oh and Silver, I thought people would assume Ken grabs the opponent generically like most characters do.(wary)
 

Lusitania

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jul 26, 2009
Messages
17
Napalm Man is pretty neat. I like all the projectiles, since camper-ish characters are fun. The treads and beacons are something I'd never think of if I was making a set for him. So kudos on the creativity. I also didn't know he had a jetpack. Napalm Man has now inspired me to work on my set, thanks.
 

Thrice

Smash Cadet
Joined
Apr 1, 2010
Messages
45
Location
Washington
Okay. So, Napalm Man. I liked the set, but I can't really compare it to your other sets because, well, I haven't read any of them. Here's what I have to say about this set itself, though:

I like Napalm Man as a whole; the lack of a million interactions helps to keep it simpler than what I've heard of Empoleon, which is a good thing for me. However, there are some moves that seem a little awkward or out of place, or just not used enough, like the Beacons. They only really have one real purpose, besides the inherent mindgames that come along with the air strike itself.

Also, I cannot believe that no one has mentioned the Down Special. If you charge it even halfway...the opponent cannot see the bomb at all. There is also no limit to how many can be placed on the stage at a time. With all of the spacing techniques Napalm Man has, he could easily litter the entire stage with Napalm Bombs, and cause a gigantic chain combo using the bombs and his gigantic air game(mostly Down Aerial),or even other moves, since the Napalm Bombs cannot be set off by anything but an opponent. It's like you're playing a game of Epic Combo, but in Brawl.

Another is the Neutral Aerial...oh god. You never say anything about how LONG this lasts, only that the recharge time is similar to R.O.B.'s. For all we know, this could go on forever. Also, being able to use your Specials while you have this going improves Napalm Man's air game even further; which is not a bad thing at all, but it makes this move a bit overpowered. Of course, this means that you have huge horizontal recovery as well as vertical; you can easily use this to slow your fall and get over to the side of the stage, then use your Up Special without having to interrupt your slow fall. I assume you can only use this once while you're in the air; otherwise, Napalm Man can glide over his opponents with this after recovering and proceed to Down-Aerial them or do some other wacky combination that leads them into a Napalm Bomb or other trap.

At heart, Napalm Man is a spacer, as you've said. However...he might be a bit too good at his job. If you stand near a Beacon, especially when three are out, opponents will fear to even think of approaching you, as you could simply call out an Air Strike before this situation ever occurs, then halt the timer when they don't approach. Yes, they could abuse this, but so could you. Hell, Napalm Man could abuse their abuse of his abuse of it through his spacing moves and general projectile game.

Of course, he isn't extraordinarily broken; if they DO manage to approach, Napalm Man will have a hard time getting away...unless he has a halted Air Strike up. If so, he can activate that, and then try to lure his opponent near where he thinks one will land. Sure, you'll take damage too, but that doesn't matter much; you've just gotten them away from you, and you have the upper hand again.


Okay, so I don't hate the set in general...it's just that I think some moves are underplayed or overpowered. And yeah, I don't know much about making movesets at all yet, so I'm sure someone can disprove every point I made in this comment, which is part of why I've been hesitant about commenting at all. And the reason this is so negative is because people have pretty much covered all of the good things I would have said; nice flow, simple, and fun to use. And I think Agi can take some criticism. I think that there needs to be a balance between positive and negative reviews....but yeah. Tear this comment to shreds if you will, it's just what I noticed most from reading the set.
 

Axx o Nn

Smash Rookie
Joined
Sep 12, 2009
Messages
5
Location
Cincinnati, Ohio

The skeleton's made up of seven interlocked bones, four of which are made up of three separate parts - which makes for fifteen, total. These are:

Head
Ribcage
Pelvis
Right arm - upper arm, forearm, hand
Left arm - upper arm, forearm, hand
Right leg - upper leg, lower leg, foot
Left leg - upper leg, lower leg, foot

Technically the hands and feet and ribcage are made up of even smaller bones, but these count as one for all purposes.

The skeleton uses all of his bones to fight, and every time he detaches one, it's not longer a part of his hurtbox, only his hitbox. Bones that are discarded or thrown will reattach as if by magic after five seconds or if you reuse the input that threw them away. The skeleton is a very offensive character based on reducing his hurtbox to nothing so that the opponent can never set up a proper counterattack.

By default you always control the skeleton's ribcage and pelvis - his trunk. If your legs have been thrown away, you'll only be able to slowly wobble along. If you've thrown away the trunk and legs but still have arms, they don't count as a hurtbox - the head, however, will unless you physically throw it away/use it for an attack.

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The skeleton is a fast runner, a quick faller, and a good jumper. His attacks come out very quickly in almost all cases. On the downside, his traction is very poor - especially if his feet are detached - and he has low firepower. It's hard to get a KO unless they're at very high damage, which, as you'll see, isn't very hard to do. Your range is excellent.

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\ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \

Neutral Special -// - - | - - //- Unligament -\\ - - | - - \\- The skeleton snaps all his joints apart and stretches, spreading his hurtbox and making him very difficult to hit.

This starts up almost instantly and then you tilt up as much as you want to make his bones stretch apart rapidly, leaving gaps that can become as large as the hit area of a Warlock Punch. You can also tilt down to have him instantly start to compress again. Cancel this "changing" state and cement your current stretch by pressing A. You remain stretched for five seconds, during which you can attack however you want.

Forward Special -// - - | - - //- Head Games -\\ - - | - - \\- The skeleton launches its head forward, terrifying the enemy when it hits.

The head flies straight forward, chomping, although you can control its trajectory and how much downward curve it has by tilting the control stick (this doesn't make you shrink or rise if you're using NSpec); if it has no curve, it'll fly back and forth over a space of two platforms for two seconds until it gives up. If the head connects, it deals 9% in a puff of smoke and bounces off, clattering on the ground.

Up Special -// - - | - - //- Bone Fetters -\\ - - | - - \\- The skeleton pulls off its limbs one by one and thrusts the chain of bones forward and up, through the air.

Press B for each limb you want to tear off; first the right arm, then left leg, then right leg, and finally the head and neck. This is a tether recovery, but one that you have to manually assemble by tapping the button. Each limb he pulls off extends the chain and makes the targe they'll hit if they want to gimp you smaller, leaving only the ribs and pelvis in the end. If somebody's camping on the ledge, the chain of bones will swing wildly up and down until you connect the head, which will chomp wildly, knocking them off for 8% and letting the arms grab on. This works best if you have all your limbs on you.

Down Special -//- - | --//- Rib Shatterstorm -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton bursts his ribs in all directions and then attaches his head and arms directly to his legs, making him very short.

This is chargeable but not storable. The ribs are strongest near the skeleton and can deal 3% each, along with flinching knockback. They move very slowly as they fan out in all directions. This is a great spacing option.

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Jab -//- - | --//- Arm Barrage -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton thrusts forward and launches hand, then other hand, then forearm, other forearm, etc, until his arms are all scattered.

Each bone is a projectile, and as you move up the arm, they get stronger, dealing 2%, 4%, and 7% progressively. The hands fly farthest forward but deal inward knockback, the forearms deal a flinch, and the upper arms deal okay knockback. You don't have to go all the way up the arm if you want to stop the attack early. You can move forward while using this jab.

Dash Attack -//- - | --//- Outrunning -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton's legs and pelvis slow down while the rest of his body rushes forward crazily, waving its arms, ribs and head all about.

The skeleton's whole body is a multi-hitting hitbox that knocks the foe to the ground; the legs, which run for a second before stopping, trample prone foes and deal 15%. After the run, the upper half of the skeleton's body hits the ground, where it can only slowly wobble back and forth, but the legs will catch up soon, don't worry.

Forward Tilt -//- - | --//- Pelvic Thrust -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton launches his pelvis on a rolling trajectory forward.

The pelvis trips foes if it rolls through them and deals 4%. It'll roll until it hits a ledge, where it'll stop precariously.

Up Tilt -//- - | --//- Pop Goes the Weasel -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton's backbone jabs straight up, knocking his head right off as it goes.

This attack comes out instantly and the backbone is a strong hitbox that deals 15% on the sweetspot. It has a long duration, though, and since the backbone is connected to the ribs, they'll all tumble off along with the head, leaving only your limbs hanging around on the ground.

Down Tilt -//- - | --//- The Splits -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton pulls the splits and his legs go flying in either direction.

Knockback here is strong and low, and since this attack sends you directly into your wobbling position, it's the best way to separate yourself from your legs.

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\ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \

Forward Smash -//- - | --//- Bone Run Bat -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton rips off an arm and swings it, batter up!

The swung arm deals 17% and comes out much quicker than Ness's bat attack - it also has a fun clattery sound effect. If this attack is uncharged, he'll actually throw the arm away behind him after the swing is done, sending it on a 45 degree angle behind him. If you use this with only one arm, he'll just swing a leg, or the other arm if those aren't available (with reduced range/strength).

Up Smash -//- - | --//- Rib Rain -\\- - | - - \\- The ribcage gets tossed straight up, where it shoots ribs downwards at random.

This lasts for 2-4 seconds, depending on charge. Ribs are shot haphahazardly and each deal 3% with flinching/downward knockback. Some will get shot offstage, so this can occasionally pull off lucky gimps. As usual when he has no ribcage, the skeleton gets shorter and funnier-looking.

Down Smash -//- - | --//- Twist and Shout -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton turns into a whirlwind of spinning bones! He can move side to side, picking up discarded bones as he goes along.

The skeleton's spinning bones are all multi-hit hitboxes, while his ribcage is a hurtbox (unless it's been scattered into a bunch of individual ribs, say, by DSpec). If he picks up things like rolling pelvises, running arms, or FSpec skulls as he spins around, they keep their effects if they hit the opponent. This is a good move to use after you've discarded every bone you have and you want to keep up your momentum and gather them all up again.

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\ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \

Neutral Aerial -//- - | --//- Rib Cage -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton opens his ribcage and tries to swallow up any opponent overlapping him.

This move is really hard to pull off unless your hurtbox has dwindled to nothing but the leg you need to jump and not much more, because they have to be right next to you. The ribcage swallows them up and then you can run around with them inside you for as long as it takes them to struggle out. You can also use Rib Rain to toss them up into the air, where they might be randomly tossed out, just like the ribs are. Maybe they'll even be one of the few to be tossed straight offstage.

Forward Aerial -//- - | --//- Elasticity -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton instantly stretches backward unnaturally, making a quick dodge, then launches his pelvis forward as he comes back.

His whole midsection is a strong hitbox when he bounces back, dealing 4-14% (you can control how far back he stretches by tilting farther or less far forward) and throwing his pelvis forward. The pelvis deals half the damage of the rest of his body, but oh well.

Back Aerial -//- - | --//- Wrack Kick -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton does a plain boring rear kick, like Mario's, but loses his legs as he does so.

The kick itself is plain and effective here, dealing 10% and good knockback. The legs detach themselves after it's over, leaving the skeleton to fall into a faceplant below. They'll land on their feet, though.

Up Aerial -//- - | --//- Pleasant Stroll -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton's turns sideways and begins running straight up, against gravity, his legs flailing in a wild downward hitbox.

This attack still works if your legs - or even just feet - are detached, and will actually make it more effective, because there'll be no hurtbox to make using it risky. He continue walking upwards for as long as you hold the input, but he'll tumble if you reach the upper blast zone.

Down Aerial -//- - | --//- Stall-then-Feet -\\- - | - - \\- Just like it sounds, the skeleton freezes in midair, then launches his feet straight down.

Feet are bouncy. They'll hit the ground, then bounce back up depending on how high you were when you used this. The whole time, they're hitboxes that deal downward knockback and 4%. You can land a bunch of hits if you time this attack right, because you can get up to six small bounces out of those feet. It's also a weak spiking option, although you might lose your feet permanently, which will make you trip more often.

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\ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \

Grab -//- - | --//- Grasping Hands -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton's grab is just a one-handed snatch, but it also works if his right hand is detached...

The skeleton's hand does a wild sweep through the air even if it's detached, so if it's just lying around somewhere, the opponent had better watch out for it - and to make matters worse, it's hard to spot if it's scattered among a bunch of ribs.

Forward Throw -//- - | --//- Alien Arm -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton's arms pop off and attach to the grabbed foe's shoulders.

The arms can and will soar through the air to get to the grabbed foe. Once they're attached, they can attack directly from a close-up position; any attacks that involve the arms attacking will happen, and since they're attached to the foe's body, they're impossible to dodge. Bone Run Bat is one great example, with one arm ripping off the other and swinging inward at the opponent. Using them in this way will cause them to fall off after the attack. Also, they'll fall off naturally about as quickly as a Lip's Stick flower.

While the arms are attached, the skeleton himself can still move around and attack normally; his arm-based attacks are the only ones changed.


Back Throw -//- - | --//- Alien Ribs -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton's ribs pop off and settle onto the foe's body like a suit of armor.

Same idea as FThrow. Any rib-involved attack can happen, including DSpec rib explosion, which will force the opponent to stop moving completely while the ribs slowly fan out - and USmash, which won't throw out the opponent but will suspend them in midair while the ribs shoot all about, a great tactic in team matches. You can also use Rib Cage, of course, which will basically end the grab by encasing the opponent and letting you run up and start attacking away.

Up Throw -//- - | --//- Second Head -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton's head - complete with backbone - pops off and attaches itself right next to their own.

Apart from being a funny sight to behold, the skull can't do much beyond FSpec, which will throw it at the opponent it's attached to for what's basically an auto-hit. You can also use UTilt, but it won't be able to land the sweetspot unless the foe is really weirdly-shaped. The technicals of the attack are the same as the two above.

Down Throw -//- - | --//- Spare Legs -\\- - | - - \\- The skeleton's legs pop off and attach themselves to the opponent's waists, stretching a bit or compressing to be anatomically correct.

When the legs are attached, it's a bit different then the other "alien" throws. You can't move the skeleton himself - he can't even wobble - but you have decent control over the opponent's movement, and can even make them jump a bit, although you have no control while they're in the air and can't make them use or not use second jump. You can also use pleasant stroll to force the opponent to walk straight up through the air, straight into an FSpec skull or a Rib Rain or what-have-you.

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\ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \

Final Smash -//- - | --//- Skeleton Dance -\\- - | - - \\- The source material for this moveset, a creepy old cartoon, comes into play as three more skeletons leap out from their graves and they all dance and rejoice until the cock crows.

The skeletons will mostly just run around using their own attacks and dancing for their idling animation, but you can also press B to have them all fuse into a single, very tall, invincible skeleton, with four ribcages overlapping each other, four heads to throw, eight legs for added speed and jumping power, eight arms for plenty of overlapping attacks, and four pelvises. The skeleton dances for its idling, but it's no laughing matter and can throw out attacks willy-nilly.

It's ironic that just when its hurtbox is very, very big, it becomes invincible. This FS lasts for fifteen seconds.


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\ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \ \ \ \ - - - - - - - - \ \ \ \ \

In most fiction, a skeleton is a crazy and uncontrollable thing for some reason, so it makes sense that playing against one is going to be a crazy, uncontrollable experience, and playing as one too. With every attack, you're getting so carried away that you're literally throwing away pieces of yourself, weakening yourself even as you make yourself harder to hit.

And that's the crux of the whole matter. What's the problem with every offense? It's so easy to stop any kind of offensive momentum by just landing a well-timed counterattack. The skeleton solves that problem by tossing everything away; often, in the middle of the brawl, there's nothing at all to hit. You'll want to set off your head and your pelvis and your ribcage to do their static actions, or maybe just discard them on the ground; either way, it's easy enough to call them back to you and set them up to do something else, or just attack away. In some ways, the skeleton is a stage-controlling character, but in his case, it's just a byproduct of a focused offense.

No matter how little there is left of you, there's always something you can do with it. Are you just a stump, a ribcage lying there? Blow it up with a DSpec! You may have no hurtbox now, but you have plenty to do. You can order your legs to run straight up no matter where they are, you can grab the opponent with your discarded hands, or you can just turn into a tornado, gather up everything you've lost, and keep your opponent off-balance along the way.

Not only is the skeleton quick, he's tireless. There's no moment when he needs to take a break, to charge a trap, to prepare a prop. He's always running for the goal and he'll keep running for it even if he has no legs at all.

One of the best tricks you have is the potential to attach your own body parts to the opponent. Everything except the pelvis can be stuck onto them, although probably not at the same time - it's too likely to fall off between grabs, although if you start with the arms, you may well get a chance or two to use a close-up grab and at least add on your head and legs. Once your body is attached the opponent, the whole nightmare is taken to the extreme - there's nowhere for them to run to get away from your offense, and there's nothing for them to hit. Your hurtbox is nothing, a thing of air and shadows.

You've got projectiles to deal with campers while you close the gap, and you've got good aerials that let you drag them back down to earth, where there are rolling pelvises and all sorts of nightmares. If they're quick and seem to dodge everything you throw at them, attaching your legs to them or trapping them in a rib cage independant of the rest of your body should give you the chance to manuever them around while you get your gear - well, body - together and turn things around.

You play in a frenzy, and live and die in a flash. The whole stage is an extension of your body in many ways, and your hitboxes litter the stage just as your hurtbox dwindles. It's a living nightmare, a macabre dance that won't end - and there's no rooster around to crow.


Notes: Sorry there are no colors, it might be a bit hard to read, but oh well.
 

darth meanie

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
452
Skeleton

Well, I have to say I wasn't expecting this at all. This is one of the best newcomer movesets I've seen in a pretty long time. It's not without it's flaws, to be sure, but the concept is simple, well thought out, and the moves are all a fair balance of creative and build up a rather unique playstyle.

The idea of a character who splits himself over the stage as a strategy to change his attacks or do grabs from a distance, and later attach himself to the foe, is something that I've never seen before. It even contributes to his offensive playstyle and the concept along the rest of altering his moves through bone scattering. Kudos to a clever playstyle.

There are some weaknesses of course. This is one of the most unapproachable looking movesets in the contest too, with small font, a lot of characters, and plain white text. It makes the moveset harder to read too, which is a shame, as it's a rather decent set.

A few of the moves are missing any damage percentages too, and the Up Aerial seems pretty odd. Why use a recovery when he can randomly run straight up into the air?

That said, aside from simply needing some more depth and more flowing moves, there's remarkably little else to complain about in this set, something I don't get to see very often in newcomer sets. This is a fantastic place to start your MYM career from, and I eagerly await what you make next.
 

half_silver28

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
862
Location
MYM, Ohio
Skeleton
I'm very seldom the person who has this duty, but welcome to MYM! Quite honestly, Skeleton is one of the best newcomer sets I've seen in a while. The dude generally annoying and unpredictable without being too terribly complicated, and the whole idea of shrinking your hitbox and creating detached hurtboxes by tossing away your limbs is a really awesome one. The grab game is also full of win with forcing your body parts onto foes to do guaranteed damage and distracting them to boot.

Of course, no set is without its flaws. You mostly tell us everything we need to know about how skeleton operates and the moves themselves, but it'd be best if you specifically mentioned how much knockback each move does. You do mention it for some moves and very low knockback can be assumed for others, but for moves like the up tilt, forward smash and forward aerial, knockback is an extremely vital thing to know as far as move properties go. I also feel that the 5 second limit on the usage of the neutral special is kind of unneeded: it changes your hurtboxes, but since you'll be tossing your body parts around anyhow, you likely won't stay like that too long anyway. And that organization, while fitting, does need a bit of color to be easier on the eyes: even silver or gray would make it better.

Still, this is a really great set even ignoring your newcomer status. Though I certainly would still recommend you check out the Stadium and the MYM chat which are on the first post of this thread. Nice job with Skeleton: hopefully we'll see more sets from you in the future! :)

And you're from Cincinnati? That's where I live as well! We could run into each other sometime o.O

Rool? ROOL? ROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL!!! D:
 

Darkslash

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 1, 2008
Messages
4,076
Location
Strangereal Equestria
Skeleton

Oh hey a newcomer. You chose a very interesting character for the set, and when I went into it, I thought it was going to be generic to be honest. But finished reading it, I was overall pleased at the work that went into writing this beauty. While it has some flaws, skeleton over all is a nice spin on....a skeleton.

Off the bat, I want to mention how fun sounding the set is. The notion of dissembling a character then annoying the living
herpderp
**** out of a character sounds like a very interesting playstyle indeed, and one I haven't seen yet (I'm sure it might of popped up some where in the past). Of course, like mentioned earlier in commentaries, the lack of mentioning knockback in the moves is a bit jarring, and I used the assumption of knock back being low for most moves due to other moves having the same characteristics. Also the lack of color is hard on the eye's, but doesn't detract from the set as a whole.

Skeleton sounds like a character one who is reckless would play, seeing how fast he gets down to his torso. Sounds like my kind of character.
 

TWILTHERO

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 19, 2007
Messages
1,880
Location
Canada
Skeleton

Okay, I would just like to say, welcome to MYM Axx! It's always great to see new faces around here!

Okay then commenting time. First of all, I'd like to say that it's really surprising (in a good way of course) to have a newcomer set with legitimate and unique playstyle. He throws around his bones to turn them into hitboxes/hurtboxes. Pretty cool stuff, and I especially love how he can attach his own bones to the opponent. It's the kinda set I'd love to see for a random skeleton. Alright, I don't have a lot to add what Silver and DM hasn't said, but I think that the organization could use a little work. I know it's supposed to give you the skeletonish feeling, but it does give me a little strain on the eyes. I'd recommend making the font normal size, so I don't have to read the small text, and maybe put in a little gray here and there. I think it'd fit Skeleton a bit more.

Overall...Yes, this is a really good newcomer set. Sorry if this comment seems kinda short, but I will say that you got potential to make it big man, and you could be the best newcomer so far! (sorry wrk) :bee:

Uhh....nevermind! Olololol
 

wrkngclsshr

Smash Rookie
Joined
Apr 15, 2010
Messages
17
Location
Bursting Out Into Song
Sophomore Slump or Comeback of the Year?




Amane Kuzuryu is a major character in the game Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor for the DS. Basically, she's a normal girl... aside from being the maiden of a cult that worships "god," being the only sane person in said cult, and having a "COMP," which is blatantly a hacked DS, which summons monsters to do her bidding, one of which is an angel named Remiel. Also, the COMP gives her superpowerful magic and physical skills. Oh, and she was once possessed by an evil demon named Jezebel. Yep. Totally normal.

Really now, Amane is a seemingly cold and unemotional teenage girl, but does care for others and the betterment of humanity. She often times helps the protagonist and gives him useful information throughout the story, and can even join his party as a playable character!

In Brawl, Amane brings her COMP with her (along with her great magical skills)


Size - 7/10
Zelda, maybe, yes? Average female mage height.

Weight - 4/10
She's a lightweight female protagonist. Take that, Warlord.

Power - 8/10
In Devil Survivor, she's known to have the strongest Magic stat out of all characters, which is shown in SSBB, especially in her Aerials and Grabs.

Range - 7/10
Also good, possessing many magical attacks to give her quite a few disjointed hitboxes.

Jumps - 6/10
She isn't the best at jumping, but it is just good enough for her to take advantage of aerials.

Movement - 5/10
Nothing spectacular.

Aerial Movement - 7/10
Pretty good.


Next to Amane's Damage Count, there will be a verticle meter with 20 segments to it. Let's call this her "Mana," each segment representing one. Many of her attacks take up a certain amount of Mana on usage, and a few even help her regain Mana! Sometimes moves will even gain added effects if Amane has a certain amount of Mana!

There are also downsides to this, such as not being able to use certain attacks if there is insufficient Mana. Also, if Amane successfully uses a Mana-Restoring move when she already has full Mana, 5% damage will be dealt to her, along with slightly electric flinching knockback, and her Mana will be dropped to 15.

Other than Mana-Restoring moves, Amane's Mana Count also goes up when she is healed. For every 2% she is healed, one Mana is added to her count. An exception to this are the Max Tomato and Heart Container, which heal 10 Mana and raise her Mana Counter to full capacity, respectively.

While this mechanic DOES limit the usage of Amane's powerful skills, finding a balance between her Mana-Restoring attacks and big Mana-Drainers will allow players to unleash chains of strong combos, while still retaining a steady amount of Mana.


Standard Special:
Angel's Grasp (2 Mana)


Amane will quickly rear back her hands, then she propel her hands to right in front of her, drawing a line on the COMP while doing so. After this bit of start-up, similar to Pit's F-Tilt in length, a hand (which looks like a smaller, two-stage builder block, yellow glowing version of Master Hand) will dash forward at the speed of a fully charged Charge Beam, able to be controlled by Amane like the PK Thunder. This hand is a hitbox, able to take 15 damage before fading. Amane will stay in the position until the hand goes away by being attacked and destroyed, going off-screen, or hitting a solid object like a wall or the ground.

However, if the hand reaches a foe, then the hand will grab the foe, and teleport back to right in front of Amane, taking little time. Note that this "grab" does go past shields. The foe is dropped slightly above ground in helpless fall, putting them right in Grab Reach for Amane!

Side Special:
Higher Force (2 Mana)


Amane claps her hands together and closes her eyes as a white silhouette of Remiel appears behind her (this animation goes very fast, actually). Then, Amane will glow white and obtain a strong vacuum effect around her body (taking in foes four stage builder blocks in front of her) as she “meditates” for as long as the player holds down the Special button. Letting go will cause the silhouette to disappear, fading away as smoke, and Amane taking .50 seconds to lose her glow and return to her normal stance (hey, focus is important :p).

However, the ending lag can be avoided! Amane is able to grab out of her “meditating” state (nothing else however). Here, her grab is basically Marth’s, but Amane slightly leans forward during the grab, giving slightly more range, but also a bit more ending lag (nothing too significant though). Due to the little start-up lag and a quick, decent grab, Higher Force can be used as a combo-finisher or even to try to prevent approaches if timed correctly.

Down Special:
Divine Intervention (No Mana Cost)


Remiel "possesses" Amane for 7 seconds, shown as Amane slightly putting her arms out (similar to the picture of her at the beginning of the moveset), then glowing in a similar fashion of Zelda/Sheik's transformation. Amane is also invincible during this period. After that, Amane's body will be intervened by Remiel, her face being shown as is in this video (AKA the left image in this set's title header). While in this state, Amane will gradually be healed (which means mana restoration). Amane heals 2% once every second.

Amane is forced back to her normal state if she takes more than 15% while in Divine Intervention. This move has a moderate amount of start up lag (which, in Amane terms, are a lot), and there is no ending lag, with Amane simply turning back to normal as she moves.

Initiating Divine Intervention while Amane is already possessed will revert Amane back to normal, shown as her body flashing blue once, returning to her normal looks. During this little "flash," Amane gains super-armor for that moment, giving this a dual-purpose similar to Olimar's Whistle.

Up Special:
Remiel's Grace (2 Mana)


While Amane's jumps aren't the best, Remiel's Grace does give her some more aerial mobility. When performed, Amane will stall her momentum and spread her arms slightly to the side. This is the player's chance for a directional input; default direction: right. Keep in mind, this still is very slight, barely being longer than it takes to jump. Then a strong, narrow wind push effect will blow Amane in the direction inputted.

I DID mention the wind push effect to be strong, right? Well, it is. It WILL push Amane (and anyone that might possibly be near Amane) at least four stage builder blocks far. This distance can slightly be lowered if Amane tries to move against the push, and can also be heightened by about another stage builder block if Amane tries to flow with the wind push.

Another thing to note about this move is the very little lag on both ends. Remiel's Grace's lag ends right when Amane is pushed. This allows Amane to perform an aerial, or even "slide" on the ground to perform a Smash or Tilt, or even grabbing. Using this technique allows slightly more range in attacks!


Jab:
Holy Agi (1 Mana)

No, not THAT Agi. The basic fire spell in the Megami Tensei universe >.>
Here, Amane claps her hands into “prayer hands,” with the COMP in between. After that, a blue flame will appear two stage builder blocks in front of Amane. The distance can be altered about a block to the left or right if you tap in the respective direction during the start up. This flame hurts foes just like Ness’ PK Fire, doing many 1-2% multi-hits at the same rate as Ness' PK Fire, and even has a similar hitbox, though not as long and a bit wider. Holding down the A button will keep the fire burning. The start-up is a few frames slower than the average jab, but there is little ending lag on this move, allowing for a follow-up.

Dash Attack:
Boost (4 Mana)


Actually, Amane’s Dash Attack isn’t even an attack! When inputted, Amane’s body will flash quickly (literally lagless) orange WHILE dashing, giving Amane a slight orange aura along with a number of buffs for the remainder of her Dash:

-Dashing Speed as fast as Marth
-Jumping height out of dash is slightly increased
--If the player does jump out of dash, aerial speed is also significantly increased for that time until landing.
--- Aerial attacks deal 2% more damage (per hit) until landing.
----Along with that, Amane’s midair jump is also increased until landing.
-Dash grab range is slightly increased about a Ganondorf character space.

As you can see, the buffs are overall useful in many ways! However, this can’t always be taken advantage of due to the 4 Mana price tag, so be careful of when you use Boost so you can use it to full potential.

Forward Tilt:
Double Palm (No Mana Cost)


Amane's Forward Tilt is a two-hit Tilt similar to Snake's (however not nearly as broken). First, Amane will simply punch forward with her palm, dealing 2% and flinching knockback. The next hit is Amane punching with her other hand (gripping her COMP tightly), dealing moderate knockback and 5% damage, going forward a little further than Sonic’s F-Smash. The first hit of this move doesn't have much range, but the second hit follows up extremely quickly, and ends almost instantly.

While Double Palm is nothing spectacular, it is Amane's ONLY attacking move that requires no Mana. While this move may not be spectacular, it has uses in being a decent interruption move and combo-starter.

Down Tilt:
Shock Wave (3 Mana)


Amane will swipe her stylus on the COMP, as a foot-high blue wave travels three stage builder blocks forward at the speed of Captain Falcon’s Dash. The damage and knockback dealt by this attack actually depends on when the foe got hit during the shock wave. If the foe was struck at the beginning or end of the shock wave (beginning = first stage builder block of travel, ending = last), they will take 8% damage and be hit up to two Lucario’s height. If the foe was struck in the middle of the wave, 13% damage will be dealt along with high upwards knockback, capable of KOing!

Up Tilt:
Zio (2 Mana)


If you know now that Agi is the basic fire spell in the Megami Tensei Universe, then you should also know now that Zio is the basic thunder spell! Amane performs Zio by raising her hand forward at a 25 degree angle. Then, a straight line of blue thunder will go forward about 1 ½ stage builder blocks forward, dealing 9% damage and moderate upwards knockback. At the VERY tip of the thunderbolt is a sweetspot that also does 9% damage, but instead spikes, giving Amane just enough time to Dash Grab the foe or a sweetspotted Shock Wave! There is little lag on both ends of this attack.


F-Smash:
Sparks (4 Mana)


Amane will push out her right hand, glowing red, in the "Stop!" manner, sending out a red spark the size of a fully charged Aura Sphere (at 0%) three stage builder blocks in front of Amane (this means that no one will get hit in between that space). Then, after a very short while (about .05 seconds), the spark will fade away, but -another- spark will appear a stage builder block in front of where the other spark used to be. Both sparks do high knockback and 15% damage uncharged (20% charged, with slightly even more knockback). This attack's start up is about .30 seconds, but has medium-high ending lag. Obviously, this Smash requires excellent spacing and timing, even if it comes out quickly, it is a predictable move. However, a certain throw later on can help pull this off...

D-Smash:
Radiance (3 Mana)


Forcefully holding out her COMP open, Amane will point it downwards on the ground in front of her. Then, a beam of light will come out of the COMP, then bouncing off the ground and shooting directly upwards to Snake’s height, dealing 12% damage and low knockback to anyone getting hit. Little lag on both ends, making this attack great in combos. This move, however, degrades VERY quickly. Also, if a foe was aerial when hit by this attack, they will take slight spiking knockback instead! Charging this move increases the damage output, going to 18% fully charged.

U-Smash:
Light Shower (3 Mana)


Facing the screen, Amane will look upwards while spreading her arms out like a cross. Then, a stage builder block above her will be a sun-like ball of yellow energy the size of Kirby. Coming in contact with the sun deals 2% damage and flinching knockback. From this sun, 12 small yellow fireballs will drop directly downwards (in a similar fashion to Ivysaur’s Bullet Seed), dealing 1-2% damage and flinching knockback, comboing into each other. The final fireball is an exception in that it does a set knockback of two Snake heights upwards. The sun will disappear once the final fireball is sent. When charged, the number of fireballs sent is increased (20 fireballs are sent at full-charge) along with the height were the sun appears (5 stage builder blocks upwards at full-charge).

One definite thing to note is the lag and animation time of this move. While it can potentially rack up a lot of damage, there is moderate start-up lag, making timing crucial. The animation of the fireballs sent down is pretty long, becoming even longer if charged. At least the ending lag is minimal, as usual.

Missing with Light Shower is a mistake any player cannot afford to make.


N-Air:
Drain (2 Mana)


Tilting her head slightly upwards and closing her eyes, Amane will then put her arms out like a cross, and keep steady like Mario’s N-Air (same time length and similar hitbox). For the duration of this move, Amane will glow blue, which gradually fades away as time passes, and anyone who touches her will take 7% damage and moderate knockback. Amane, then, will gain 5 Mana! After hitting someone, Amane will revert back to normal. There is very little lag on either sides of this move.

So if Amane misses... she’s probably in for some damage, right? Well, a special property of this move is that Amane can use Remiel’s Grace to cancel Drain’s duration and move away! Plus, since you can also attack when blown away by Remiel’s Grace, there is another option for warding off someone trying to attack: hit them first. If Amane uses Drain while flying with the momentum from Remiel’s Grace, the power of this move will increase! Instead, it will deal 11% damage, high knockback, and Amane will gain 8 Mana, making it a possibly quick interruption attack. So, play it safe or go for some extra damage?

F-Air:
Energy Ball (2 Mana)

inb4pokemonsyndrome
Amane will rear her arm back, create a ball of energy (looks like an aura sphere, but with a much lighter shade of blue) as big as Kirby in her hand, shouth "ha!" and push it forward, sending it two stage builder blocks forward. The ball doesn't disappear when it hits something, rather, it just goes through enemies, dealing flinching knockback of 3% each. Again, little lag on both ends of the move. While the damage output isn't SPECTACULAR, it can be with the help of Boost, which (if you remember), increases the damage output of this attack by 2% per hit.

D-Air:
Spirit Blast (3 Mana)


Amane looks below here and pushes her right hand down, sending a small wave of blue energy one stage builder block below her. The wave travels relatively fast, about the time it takes for Lucario to start his D-Air. The attack also ends quickly. The wave deals 10% damage and has a set knockback of three stagebuilder blocks upwards. With a decent second jump AND Remiel's Grace, I'm sure finding a follow-up isn't hard.

This move also affects momentum like Lucario's D-Air in that it sends Amane half a stage builder block upwards at normal falling speed, stops her momentum completely at fast fall speed, and sends her Ness' height upwards with upwards momentum.

U-Air:
Holy Burst (2 Mana)


Looking upwards with her back to the screen, Amane will wave her hand in a "rainbow" motion back and forth three times. As she makes this motion, blue sparks will follow her hand, making a hitbox similar to Lucario's U-Tilt, but not as wide, and reaches slightly farther. The sparks damage in a way similar to Zelda's U-Smash, doing at the most 5 hits of 3% each. The knockback of the first four hits depend on Amane's momentum, slowly bringing the opponent down if Amane is falling, or gradually upwards if Amane is rising. The last hit, however, ALWAYS inflicts little downwards knockback. D-Air, maybe? Also note that there is little lag on both sides, but the move duration is only about .20 seconds shorter than Zelda's U-Smash, which is a bit long for an aerial.

B-Air:
Michael's Sword (3 Mana)


Could you imagine Marth's F-Air reversed? Well, in a way, this move basically is. Twisting her body slightly to face backwards, Amane will wave her arm down in the way Marth's sword travels in his F-Air. A blue wave of energy (with a hitbox and shape similar to a sword) will follow Amane's arm. This attack comes out a tad bit slower than Marth's F-Air, but has slightly longer range and deals 15% damage and high knockback. The ending lag on this move is also a bit more than most of Amane's attacks.

So, a near carbon-copy? Not exactly, because Remiel's Grace comes into play again! With the wind push from it, the reach of this move increases significantly! Hey, now it's even better for an approach.


Grab:
Holy Dance (1 Mana)


Amane will do a graceful, but quick pirouette with her right hand held out forward, moving slightly forward, about as far as Olimar's Yellow Pikmin goes. During this little dance, Amane will glow yellow. The first character Amane's bodyframe passes will be grabbed, shown as Amane's right hand (without the COMP) holding the foe's right hand in a competitive manner. If this grab misses, Amane will stop her pirouette and focus for .3 seconds to regain balance.

When this Grab is used while Dashing, it works completely differently. First, Amane will initiate what basically is Zelda's Dash Attack (Amane's is a tad bit shorter though, basically the same distance she travels in her regular grab). Also, foes won't be knocked away, but instead grabbed, held until the end of the Dash Grab, then thrown down to the floor, dealing 8% damage. Amane's Mana is then restored by 2 points. The foe will then bounce upwards, slightly forward to the point that Amane can chaingrab! Amane can chaingrab Mario until Mario is 40%, because then the knockback will be too high for Amane to chaingrab. This could also be a way of setting up for the "aftermath" hit of Amane's Forward Smash! (Sparks)

Pummel:
Mind Link


This pummel isn't really for damaging, but to regain mana! Here, Amane grasps her opponent's hand tightly, activating a blue aura around both Amane and the opponent's character frames, which lasts until Amane throws the foe or the grab is broken. This will raise Amane's Mana by 3. Doing another pummel will change the aura's color to purple, which raises Amane's Mana by 4. Doing ANOTHER pummel from then on will change the aura to red and raising Amane's Mana by 5. From then on, the cycle will repeat.

Another interesting thing to note is that although Mind Link isn't geared for damaging, Amane can indirectly damage the foe. Should Amane "overload" with Mana through Mind Link and reach over her maximum, the grabbed foe will take the same damage and knockback too. This isn’t very threatening to the foe, but it does break Amane’s grab, so avoid this happening.

Also, if Amane or the opponent get hurt by a hitbox that would normally only damage one of the two, the other character will take the same damage and knockback too. Basically, Mind Link will turn Amane and the grabbed opponent into one big hurtbox. Throws that hurt the foe will Amane is still holding him/her will not hurt Amane, however.

Note: Every one of Amane's Throw animations begin with Amane single-handedly opening her COMP with her free hand, then showing it forward to the grabbed opponent, glowing, and unleashing a new demon!

Another Note: You can click on the demon sprites to view more detailed artworks of them.

Forward Throw:
Pixie (1 Mana)

Pixies, in English Literature, are known to be mischieveous, woodland-residing creatures who love to play pranks on passerby! They are normally very small, sometimes even depicted as being as small as the palm of your hand.

Yes, this is the set-up move for Sparks mentioned earlier in the set. Here, a Pixie (slightly smaller than Pichu) comes flying out of the COMP, hitting the foe (and potentially anyone else caught) three stage builder blocks forward (*gasp*) and dealing 5% damage. The Pixie travels as fast as Captain Falcon’s Dash and travels four stage builder blocks forward, before disappearing in a puff of smoke.

Backwards Throw:
Power (3 Mana)

The sixth of the nine orders of angels, also called Authorities. Powers are said to be bearers of conscience and keepers of history. Their duties are to oversee the distribution of Power among mankind, hence their name.

Two stage builder behind the foe, a little coud of feathers as big as Bowser appears! From there comes out Power, who then will fly backwards right behind the little cloud (coming in contact with Power inflicts 5% damage and moderate knockback). Then, Amane will let go of the foe and step a stage builder block backwards (stopping at edges) as Power flaps his wings, sending the cloud of feathers directly at the opponent, going as fast as Sonic's Dash, dealing 9 hits of 1% each! The first 8 feathers do flinching knockback, but the last one is actually close at the ground, forcing the foe to trip! Amane can move only when that last feather hits and trips the foe. Since the foe is tripped, careful prediction of where they will get up can give Amane an easy dash-grab! I suppose the effects could be comparable to Snake's D-Throw.

Upwards Throw:
Angel (1 Mana)

Ninth of the nine orders of angels. The "watchers" who never sleep. Among these are the guardian angels who are assigned to every human at birth.

Behind the foe appears an Angel! The Angel will simply grab the foe from behind them, raising them to right above Ganondorf's height and two stage builder blocks backwards. The Angel will then let go (the foe still has his/her jumps). Finally, the Angel will fade away into the background as blue sparkles. Amane is free once the Angel starts flying. While this throw deals no damage or knockback, it is useful for setting up aerial attacks. The Angel will drop the foe just far enough out of Amane's grab range, so grabbing again isn't likely against a competent foe.

Downwards Throw:
Jack Bros. (12 Mana)

Two brothers that love to cause trouble are Jack Frost the snowman and Pyro Jack the Jack 'o Lantern! A signature of both is that they are very playful and often say "Hee-Ho!" and interject it within their speech. However, while they are innocent and lovable at first, when provoked, they are anything but.

(Prepare for a long, theatric animation) First, Jack o’ Lantern and a snowflake will appear above and behind the foe, respectively. Then, both will glow and the Jack o’ Lantern will reveal Pyro Jack, and the snowflake Jack Frost (in a similar way to when Pokemon evolve)! Pyro Jack and Jack Frost will then simultaneously send forward a red and blue “spark,” dealing 24% damage! The knockback, however, is the odd part of this move. If a player uses the D-Throw at 0%, the knockback will be JUST enough for Amane to Dash Grab the foe. However, at any higher percentages, the knockback will be too much for Amane to grab again. Either way, this throw is still a great damage-dealer (although Mana-costly).


The strongest spell in the game: Megidolaon! This spell is certainly not merciful, doing Almighty damage (meaning it ignores resistences to elements) to ALL foes with the highest base power in the game.

When activated, a large picture of Remiel will appear in the background like Paletuna in Pit's Final Smash (even the same size) and the camera will then close in on Amane, who will face the screen and fold her hands into prayer position and close her eyes (even in midair). Then the camera will zoom out and Amane will stay put like so, while the image of Remiel will fade to purple, then explode (like the image in the header), covering the whole screen in an array of purple, blue, white, and pink for half a second before reverting back to normal! All foes (that aren't invincible) will take 150% damage! There is no knockback however) After this Final Smash, Amane will return to normal (entering free fall if aerial), and her Mana will automatically be set to 15.



Oh yes, Playstyle gets its own special header because it's just that important. Screw you, Kat.​

Amane is basically designed for grabs and aerial combos. That's it. Everything Amane will ever need is basically in those two sections. Of course, Amane gets more with her other moves, which really just lead into grabbing or aerial combos. Amane's life basically revolves around Aerials and Grabs.

Starting off the match with Amane depends really on the player's preference. There's the option of playing defensively with Angel's Grab and Higher Force, hopefully leading into a grab, or rushing onwards to the foe with Boosted aerials. However, starting off with Divine Intervention is ideal, as it's basically free Mana and a bit of health regeneration.

When the foe is grabbed, you basically have the choice to do ANYTHING. After some Mind Links, you could basically pull off any giant combo you could think of. Pixie is an easy set-up for a kill (and will probably be the main way of KOing), Power can potentially set up 40+ damage and regain you a lot of Mana, while Angel is an easy way to get a foe aerial. Finally, Jack Bros. is the safest way of getting a significant amount of damage in.

If you got the foe in the air, they will be scared, especially when you take into account Remiel's Grace. The special is incredibly flexible, letting Amane hit anything once more with the right timing (basically acting as another super-powered jump). With all of the moves doing good damage, and Spirit Blast and Holy Burst having a combo right there, Amane shines.

On the ground... Not so much. Sure, she's got some nice anti-air attacks in the form of Zio and Light Shower, and Radiance comes out a bit quickly, but the rest of the ground attacks are pretty situational and probably won't be used often. Double Palm may not have a Mana cost, but a competent player should be able to keep a decent flow of Mana in with her grabs, Drain, and Divine Intervention, which brings up another problem:

Steady Mana flow. It's easy to lose count of something like that under pressure from the opponent. Also, Amane can't really work against projectiles much. She's got her own, but even it's not that versatile.

Lastly, Amane has great trouble with faster, smaller characters. Since they're so agile, it can get tough to hit them. Plus, when characters like Pikachu are running around, zapping whatever they see with Thunder, things might seem rough. Amane's best bet against those characters is probably to play aggresively, keep the pressure on them high, and hope for the best.








Special thanks to Smady for introducing me to this great game and for making the headers and to Junahu and TWILTY for previewing this for me!!!

(kidding Kat (WARY))

And.... scene!~
 

TWILTHERO

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 19, 2007
Messages
1,880
Location
Canada
Playlist, Click Here!

Yuzu Tanikawa is one of the main playable characters of the game called Shin Megami Tensei: Devil Survivor and one of the best magic users in the game. Yes, she is a lightweight female protagonist. In the games, she actually acts like a typical high school girl, but when suddenly demons attack, and she's trapped in a lockdown, she has no choice, but to fight for her life. Other than attacking with magic and physically attacking, she can also summon demons via use of her COMP (which just happens to look like a DS). She'll then learn to be brave and stuff, though if you choose to get her ending, she'll choose to run away again, thus giving her the worst ending in the game which kinda makes me want to scream. In the games, her nickname is Yoohoo, though it pisses her off so...yeah. It is revealed that she may does have feelings for the main protaganist.

In Brawl, she'll be using alotta magic alright. With the abilities to summon demons...She's sure to show someone who's boss.



Size - 7.5/10
Around the same height as Zelda here.

Weight - 3/10
Being a lightweight female protagonist...well...means that she's a lightweight here.

Ground Speed - 7/10
Well...in the game, she does always want to run away, so she's at least decent at it.

Traction - 4/10
You think a high school girl would have better traction...

Jumps - 7/10
Also pretty good here.

Falling Speed - 3/10
She falls kind of slowly...



Special Trait - Demon Summoner
Like in Devil Survivor, Yuzu can summon demons. To not make it so complicated, she can summon from only 4 different demons. Now, at the start of the match, she will have none. However, she can summon them via her neutral special (which will be explained later...). Note that only 2 can remain with Yuzu at a time. She can switch use of them via using any taunt (taking half a second). These demons will also have their own stamina per stock. These demons will work as Yuzu's specials (excluding her neutral).

The demon that she is currently controlling will always be following behind her at her speed. The second demon will be in the background of the stage, unhittable, but always falling Yuzu. That demon in the background can also quickly jump out, and perform certain moves WITH Yuzu (will be explained later). If Yuzu is sent flying/in the air, the demon that's being controlled will follow her, staying on the same level as her, and right beside her. When you choose to switch between demons/current demon is defeated, the second one will automatically move by her side. These demons suffer no knockback whatsoever.

Neutral Special - Summon
Yuzu will concentrate and hold her hand to where her heart is, light surrounding that area. She will then flash her DS COMP into the air, with light flashing off the screen, which will take 1 second. This will allow Yuzu to summon a demon of her choice, depending on what direction she chooses after holding B.

Choosing no direction will summon Pixie, where side will summon up Jack Frost, up will get you Mothman, and down will summon Power. The demons when summoned will appear right in front of her. Pressing the sequence to summon Pixie for example, when she's already out, will call her back to the COMP. Let's get to see what these demons are made of!

Pixie
Pixie has the size advantage, where she's only the size the size of 2 pokeballs and always flying around Yuzu's chest level, so down attacks will be hard to hit with depending on what they are. Pixie has a weak 30% health though.

Side Special - Charm
Pixie lets out a kiss, direction depending on if you hold the control stick or not. If you do, Pixie will aim it forward in front Yuzu. Choosing not to will have it aim at Yuzu herself. Pixie will let loose a heart, travelling endlessly across the stage at the speed of an aura sphere. Anyone touching it will heal themselves 15% damage. This move takes a whole 2 seconds. Good healing move, but note that opponents can use it too.

Now for every third use of this move, they'll be an added effect. It isn't so hot, as it lowers your running speed, jump and recovery by half. Try and use this for some mindgames...

Up Special - Pixie Wings
Pixie will tap Yuzu gently on the forehead, taking only half a second. Suddenly, Yuzu will sprout wings similar to Pixie's, except cuter because it's Yuzu. Anyway, this allows Yuzu to gain temporary flight, allowing her to go in any direction in the air she chooses, at a speed of Ike's running speed. This will last for about 5 seconds. Yuzu can also perform any aerial in midair while remaining stationary because of her wings, so take advantage of this move.

If Yuzu is at least with 2 stage builder blocks above solid ground, staying on the same spot for a second will leave behind Pixie dust, which will stay for 20 seconds. Other than lowering your opponent's running speed, what else can it do? Well...it can interact with some moves...

Down Special - Recarm
Pixie will fly around Yuzu, spreading Pixie dust around her (kinda like the fairies in Zelda games). If there is a demon down and out, using this move will resurrect the latest one that died back from the grave, and be able to be summoned again, though with half their health. This will take about a second and a half. This is the only way to bring back dead demons. This has little beginning lag, and average ending lag. Best use it late, when your demons are down. It'd also be best to summon Pixie later on. This move does nothing if all demons are still okay.

If used in a team battle, using this on a fallen ally will resurrect them with a new stock. Kinda broken right? Well...they'll come back with 100% damage taken, regardless on how they died.

Jack Frost
This guy is around the size of Toon Link. He also an okay percentage health of 40%.

Side Special - Ice Breath
Jacky will jump in front of Yuzu and quickly fire out an icy breath, travelling a decent 2 stage builder blocks. Upon hitting an opponent, this will deal off 2% damage a second, with only flinching knockback. This has very little beginning lag, though somewhat heavy ending lag. After 5 seconds, the ice's range starts depleting, like Charizard's neutral special.

If Jack Frost manages to use this on the opponent for 3 seconds, he'll actually freeze the opponent for 2 seconds in a block of ice. Seize the moment. Also, if Jack Frost aims this move on the ground for 2 seconds, he can actually freeze the floor a stage builder block, causing anyone to trip when walking on it. Good support move against ground based opponents that like to run.

If you aim this to where Pixie dust is, magic happens, and that area freezes anything that comes near it for 2 seconds. The area stretches out for a stage builder block, and still lasts for 20 seconds. Isn't magic wonderful?
[ 2% ]

Up Special - Ice Stairs
Jack Frost will quickly let out a frosty breath around Yuzu's feet, which will quickly solidify into ice. Now picking a direction will have Jack Frost immediately build an ice path that's 4 stage builder blocks long, immediately carry Yuzu there, before the ice lets her go. Very little lag at both ends. When using this move, it'll leave behind the ice path, available for sliding like a regular ice slope, whether it be sliding opponents to their doom, or just for fun, though once someone goes down the slippery slope, they can't stop until they reach the end of it.

Down Special - Mind Charge
Jack Frost will concentrate, grabbing his head. You will then see psychic ice energy surrounding his head. Moving the control stick into Yuzu's direction will have him send the mind energy to Yuzu, taking very little lag at all, while aiming it outside will have the mind energy travel endlessly across the stage at the speed of Aura Sphere (similar to Pixie's Charm).

If someone is hit by the green blast, their projectiles (including stuff like Magic..) are boosted up by 1.5x the ordinary damage though it lowers their physical attacks by a quarter. If Pixie's Charm is used during the effects, the negative effects will be cancelled out.

Mothman
Like Pixie, he's always levitating off the ground, making him really hard with to hit with down attacks. He is however about the size of Mario, making him an easy target with up attacks...with a health of 40.

Side Special - Foul Breath
Mothman will let loose a foul stench from his mouth, reaching 2 stage builder blocks and about the size of a stage builder block. This takes half a second to perform, and another half to cool off. Anyone getting caught in this foul stench will be enraged (must be that bad of stench), which will increase their next 3 attacks by 5% damage. While some might think giving your opponent an attack boost is bad, it actually forces the opponent to attack, as they'll automatically rush up to Yuzu to perform an attack (will do neutral A by default if nothing is selected). They'll be doing this for 10 seconds. Yuzu can optionally walk into the stench herself, which will stay there for 10 seconds, getting the same effects.

If Jack Frost's mind charge passes through, it will change color, doing the opposite of what it's supposed to do (lowers projectiles by half, and raises physical attacks by 1.5x) If Pixie's charm passes through, instead of healing, it'll deal off 15% damage. What kind of stench is that?

Up Special - Flight Of The Moth
Mothman quickly grabs Yuzu from her back, giving her flight for 5 seconds, similar to Pit's recovery, but it's a bit heavier to control. Pressing A during the middle of the flight will have Mothman fire, well, umm...moth dust from his mouth, reaching a stage builder block. Upon hitting someone with this, they'll be blinded in midair, unable to do anything for 2 seconds. This will have little lag on both ends, though it's only usable 2 times per up special. If you're at least within a stage builder block near the ground, the dust will fall down, and stay on the ground for 15 seconds. What's the point of that you ask? Well..

Mixing Pixie dust and Moth dust will create a moth trap. You see, when opponents walk over it, many small moths will appear from it, slowing down opponents to be as slow as Zelda, having double the attack lag, and lowering their jumps as well. They'll stick on them for 10 seconds or until they do an attack that hits all around. Ice breathing the moth dust will create a 2 stage builder block lengthed slippery ice slope, doubled the size from Jack Frost's regular one. Can be really useful...especially when combined with Yuzu's later moves.

Down Special - Devil Speed
Mothman starts having a green aura surrounding him, stretching out a stage builder block. Anyone within that reach (this automatically includes Yuzu unless she's knocked away before this happens) will have their attack speed, and running speed increased by 1.5x the regular amount. This takes a second to perform and a half to cool down. This will hurt Mothman 10% damage though. Pretty useful move, though it can effect opponents too.
Power
He's about as tall as Ganondorf, and has 50 health. Best not let him take too many hits...

Side Special - Spear
Power prepares his spear, as he'll harpoon it straight forward, travelling half of final destination. It moves rather slowly, at the speed of Toon Link's arrows, but it can through anything (walls, you name it). This has half a second of lag at both ends. It'll also instantly destroy any obstacles in the way, and will break through shields, though it'll only do half damage. Speaking of damage, it'll deal off 12-13% damage with knockback that KOs at 130%. Useful for getting rid of obstacles, which will be explained later...
[ 12-13% ]

Up Special - Wings Of An Angel
Power will grab Yuzu, and carry her upwards with his wings. Like Pixie's up special, this allows Yuzu to gain temporary flight, allowing her to go in direction in the air she chooses, at a speed of Ike's running speed. However, instead of doing her aerials, inputting A will have Power use his side special for self defense. If Power is near the ground, he'll leave behind...feathers? They'll stay for 20 seconds. What could they be used for...?

How about some interactions? Feathers landing on Moth breath will have them turn black, and anyone touching them will have their recovery cut down by half. For a final one, ice breathing the feathers will have them turn razor sharp, creating spikes of the sort, with anyone touching them will suffer 10% damage, and knockback KOing at 200% damage. Up to you how you want to use this move.

Down Special - Aggravate
Power triumphantly points his spear into the air, where he'll start glowing. Anyone within a stage builder block of range (meaning Yuzu can be knocked away while using this) will have every third hit they perform to be 1.5x the ordinary damage. This lasts for 10 seconds. This takes half a second to perform and another half to cool down. This will deal off 12% damage to Power, so be careful.


Neutral Combo - Attack
Yuzu will swipe her hand forward, initiating 3 shockwave slashes hit on the opponent. This will do about 2-3% damage per hit, which KOs at around 180% damage on the last hit. This move is really fast, with hardly any lag at all. Reaches about half a stage builder block forward, and has little priority. Standard jab for Yuzu.
[ 2-3% x 3 ]

Forward Tilt - Agi
Marcus Agidius jumps out of nowhere in front of Yuzu where he'll attempt to wrestle the opponent for 12-13% damage, though it has a bit of startup and above average ending lag. This also...wait, wrong agi? Whoops, my bad. >_>

Anyway, what really happens is that Yuzu puts her palm forward, where a spark of flames, the size of a smash ball, will appear in front of it. Hitting opponents will deal off an okay 10-11% damage, with knockback KOing at 120%. This takes hardly any beginning lag, but ending lag comparable to Ike's side tilt. This will also melt anything that's ice related in less than a second. A decent move, and a good way to get rid of stuff.

Using this near Mothman's breath will ignite it, causing an explosion the size of the breath, for 15% damage with knockback KOing at 90% damage. What kind of breath does Mothman have? If Yuzu uses this move near feathers will light them up, creating a burning area, with anyone walking through it will be covered in flames for 5 seconds, suffering 2% damage per second, with their attack power lowered by half.

[ 10-11% ]

Up Tilt - Bufu
Yuzu raises her right arm above her head, creating an icicle the size of Mario. Anyone near it will suffer 5% damage and auto freezing the opponent for a second. This has very little beginning lag, but average ending lag. Mainly used for freezing opponents when they come close.
[ 5%]

Down Tilt - Zio
Yuzu crouches down, and puts her hand to the ground. This will fire out an electric spark from her palm, and anyone touching will suffer 10-11% and horizontal knockback KOing at 110% damage. This takes about half a second to perform, but no ending lag. This has decent priority, and if used near one of the ice slippery slopes, it will actually bounce off it, creating a projectile, travelling at the speed of Link's arrows.
[ 10-11% ]

Dash Attack - Zan
Yuzu will start having a tornado, the size of Link, surrounding her, as she spins a stage builder block forward. This does 9-10% damage, with horizontal knockback that sends oponents 2 stage builder blocks away. This has little beginning lag, but above average ending lag. This also has good priority. This is great for spacing opponents away, so you can set up, or if you push them over an edge, and managed to set up an ice slope via Jack Frost's up special, it can help GIMP as well.

[ 9-10% ]



Forward Smash - Bufudyne
Yuzu will motion her palm forward. Now, depending on the charge, an icicle the size of Ganondorf will appear about 1-3 stage builder blocks in front of her. Anyone above the icicle will suffer a heavy 20% damage with knockback KOing at 80% damage. This has above average beginning lag, but only little ending lag. Pretty basic KO move right? Well...there's a bit more...

If Yuzu makes an icicle appear over a slippery slope, it'll actually stay in place for 20 seconds, creating an impassable barrier for her. Of course, the icicles can be breakable with 40% damage, and using this move on the same spot where an icicle is already will auto destroy it. Useful for stall purposes...but that's not all. If you use Jack Frost's ice breath on it, it'll actually slowly increase in size, and after using it for 3 seconds, it can be twice as large as Bowser in both height and width. Using Power's side special on it will not only destroy it, but can also collapse downwards, dealing the same amount of damage and knockback, which can be easy or hard to hit with depending on its size. If friendly fire is off, friend projectiles can go through it, though not the teammate him/herself. Very useful obstacle against opponents.

[ 20% ]

Up Smash - Ziodyne
Yuzu points upwards, causing a thunderbolt to fire from her finger, the size of Pikachu's thunder. Now, it only travels a stage builder block upwards, but you can choose to move it diagonally if you wish. Then, you can then choose to aim whenever you want, reaching another stage builder block, kinda like Pikachu's up special, except easier to control. Anyway, hitting opponents will deal off 14-20% damage with knockback KOing starting from 120% to 85%. This has above average beginning lag, but only a little ending lag.
[ 17-23% ]

Down Smash - Agidyne
Yuzu concentrates, and suddenly, a burst of fire quickly engulfs her, spreading around her entire body, and stretching out about the size of a pokeball. Upon hitting, this deals off 17-23% damage with knockback KOing at 110% to 75% damage (depending on charge). This surprisingly has little beginning lag, but above average ending lag. This has decent priority. Good KO move, but it'd be kinda hard to hit with right?

Let's say you wanna expand that range. Well, if this move is used under Pixie dust, the magic helps expand the range by allowing it to stretch to 1.5 stage builder blocks. This is allows Yuzu to hide behind an ice wall, while quickly melting it, and attacking the opponent. This also has the same interactions Yuzu's side tilt has. Be warned that if this is used near Moth dust, it'll burn it up, thus making it unusable, so be careful.

[ 17-23% ]


Neutral Aerial - Mazan
Yuzu swipes her hand forward, which causes a small tornado (size of Toon Link) to fly 2 stage builder blocks forward, at a speed of Toon Link's boomerang. Anyone getting hit by the side of the tornado will be pushed away 2 stage builder blocks with 5% damage, and anyone on the top with be sucked in, being carried along the way of the tornado. This has above average beginning lag, but little ending lag. Mainly should be used to keep opponents away in the air.

[ 5% ]

Forward Aerial - Mabufu
Yuzu holds her palm forward, creating a small gust of ice the size of a Pokeball around it. Anyone touching it will instantly be frozen, though only for a second with 2%. This takes very little time to startup. If Yuzu holds this move out for a whole second, it'll quickly form an ice block the size of Luigi, and it'll drop down to the ground, with anyone in the suffering 10% damage, with knockback KOing at 100% damage.

If this lands on solid ground, it breaks. If it lands on a slippery ice slope, it'll stay in place, creating an impassable small barrier. If this stacks up on another ice block (like the ones from her forward smash), it'll stack up on that too, help building a bigger wall, while adding an additional 5 seconds to how long it lasts.

[ 10% ]

Backward Aerial - Lightning Blade
Yuzu lets out a quick thunder wave behind her, giving her range similar to Ike's back aerial. Upon hitting, this does a little 8-9% damage, but it does have horizontal knockback that KOs at 95% damage. This has little lag at both ends, but in exchange, it does have little priority. Nothing really special here. Can be used as a quick surprise attack though.
[ 8-9% ]

Up Aerial - Drain
Yuzu shines her palm upwards, with light surrounding it. Suddenly, anyone within a stage builder block will be...drained. This results in for the next 5 seconds, all their attacks will do 5% less damage for the next 5 seconds. This will deal off no damage, and has little beginning lag. If you decide to hold the up aerial for an extra second, the light will turn yellow, and anyone still within reach of her will be healed up 10% damage (including herself). This part requires to have drained an opponent first though. There will then be little ending lag. Useful for stopping heavy damage rackers, and then healling yourself up a bit.

Down Aerial - Zandyne
Yuzu lets throws her palms downwards, which lets out a blast of wind downwards, that reaches out a stage builder block, and has a large hitbox. Anyone within reach will be pushed straight downwards 3 stage builder blocks, and if they managed to reach the ground, they'll crash onto it, suffering 14% damage with them being grounded. This has above average startup, but little cool off. The cool thing about this move is that it actually boosts Yuzu upwards a stage builder block, making this a decent recovery option. In exchange though, she moves rather slowly, which makes her an easier target for spikes. If Mothman is out, the range is extended by half a stage builder block.
[ 14% ]



Grab - Magic Hold
Yuzu throws her palm out, which lets out pink waves and anyone with 1.5 stage builder blocks will be grabbed, with the magic waves. This has very little beginning lag, but causes her to trip upon missing.

Pummel - COMP Power
Yuzu brings out her COMP, which just happens to look like a DS. She gets it out of her pocket or something...there! Not a prop! (H) She brings out her stylus (huh...maybe it IS a DS after all). She'll then write in her COMP with it, and the opponent starts floating away with magic surrounding them, seeming to be struggling (uh... never mind).

Anyway, you get to choose where the opponent goes by moving the control stick, while holding A which prevents you from doing any throws. You can move them at a speed of 1 stage builder blocks per second. They can free themselves like how they breakaway from an ordinary grab, but Yuzu will be able to use this move for at least 2 seconds. During this time, Yuzu has super armor, so she can't have outside interference when using this move. What's interesting is that both of her demons will constantly be following her grabbed opponent, 1 via the background, 1 by their side. I wonder what Yuzu has her sleeves...considering she has none.


Forward Throw - Power Throw
This throw can only be used if Power is summoned. Yes, the 4 throws require a specific demon to be summoned in order to be used, although when you use a certain throw though the demon's not summoned, it'll automatically summon that demon, replacing the one in the background, though it'll take an extra second, so pray that your grab doesn't break by then. Power will deal off fierce swings with his spear, before ending it with a fierce stab, which does 15% damage, with forward, slightly diagonal knockback, KOing at 90% damage. This is mainly used to keep opponents away from Yuzu, and could be a viable spikish move at later percentages.
[ 15% ]

Backward Throw - Pixie Throw
Pixie quickly sprinkles dust on the opponent. This will cause the opponent to not be able to do a certain set of moves for 10-15 seconds. For example, if the opponent did their up aerial, and Yuzu uses this throw, the opponent will not be able to do aerials. This works for all their moves. This is useful for Yuzu as you see, when using this throw, Yuzu's grab does not let go, allow you to quickly follow it up with a forward throw or something.

Up Throw - Mothman Throw
Mothman starts lifting the opponent up a stage builder block, and fires out moth dust from his mouth. Now then, the opponent will be hanging like a web, unable to do anything for 2 seconds. Yuzu can then use the opponent like a punching bag, though they won't suffer any knockback until Mothman lets go. Mothman will automatically let go if there is outside interference, attacking Mothman (despite him not suffering any knockback).

Down Throw - Jack Frost Throw

Jack Frost breathes ice around the opponent, creating,...an ice prison? The opponent will be stuck inside there. In the air, the ice prison will drop to the ground, shattering upon contact, dealing off 15% damage, with knockback KOing at 90% damage. If used on the ground, the opponent will be trapped in the ice prison where the thrown was used.

Now, the thing is, the opponent can actually attack the ice prison to break themselves, attacking either side will break the entire thing as long as 40% damage is done to it (any projectiles they do will pass through though). Fire will automatically melt it obviously. Depending on how much knockback a move does to the opponent, it can actually push the ice block forward, though it'll be only 3/4ths as strong, and they can't be sent into the air, besides pushing them off a stage. The opponent is however safe from actually being hurt, though moves like Yuzu's down smash have the potential to reach them.

[ 15% ]


Megidoloan
Yuzu throws her hands upwards, which will let out a yellow ball from her hand, which will go upwards a stage builder block. It'll then shine brightly, and anyone within 2.5 stage builder blocks of it will suffer an intense 35% damage with knockback KOing at 50% damage. Ouch. There's a second of beginning lag, although Yuzu is invincible when using this move. Use to move to unleash a big bang to the opponent.



So you read the moveset. Now you're probably asking just what do you do with the moves? Well, Yuzu has a couple of options. Let me run through them with you.

Demon Setup And Placement
You'll always want to have a demon on you. I suggest immediately summoning Jack Frost and Power/Pixie. Jack can set up ice slopes via his up special that can force opponents to slide downwards to their doom. He can also create slippery ice slopes with his neutral special to always cause the opponent to trip and help Yuzu set up her forward smash. If you can, use Mothman's dust to help create an ice slope twice as large.

As for Pixie/Power, you might wanna lay low when using their up special in order to spread those feathers/dust. When you're recovering, you can even lay a few of them while doing so, especially near the edge. I suggest putting away Pixie when you're done, so you can revive/heal demons and Yuzu later. I'd save Mothman for later, though when you do use him, use his breath to help create black feathers to render opponent's recoveries less useful.

Now just how do you use this to help effect you? Well, if you breath ice on the Pixie dust, you can create a freezing area, that gives either gives you time to think, or attack. As mentioned before, using Yuzu's forward smash on a slippery ice slope gives her a wall. Using Jack Frost's ice breath can make it even bigger. Now, just what you do with all these traps?

Damage Racking And Waller
If the opponent is smart enough to try and avoid these traps, use Yuzu's pummel to force them into the traps. Lure them into ice feathers to do some damage, and fire feathers to prevent foes from doing serious damage. It'd be smart to force the opponents into as many traps as you can. Now, you do want to deal off some damage. She can even damage racker through traditional means, with her standards and smashes. This will work well with Yuzu's Mothman throw, as it turns the opponent into a punching bag. Use Power's down special, and Jack Frost's down special for an extra boost, considering the majority of Yuzu's moves are magic based.

When your opponent has enough, knock opponents to the other side, create an ice block near an edge with her forward smash, make it a bit bigger with Jack Frost's neutral special, and start hiding. This is assuming you've made the necessary set ups, you should be ready. You can even use Yuzu's forward aerial to stack up on the ice block, which can even freeze opponents for a bonus. If there are ice spikes or some sort of damage dealer there, you can always force them to stay on the other side for said damage. If you set up an ice slope from Jack Frost's up special, it just makes it all the more harder for them to recover. I suggest you hamper their recovery with feathers + moth breath though. You can even use Mothman's breath to irritate opponents.

Of course, the opponent isn't going to just stay on the side forever. Use Yuzu's neutral aerial for a projectile that blows them to the other side, which will be easier if Mothman is summoned. Alternatively, use Yuzu's back aerial for a quick strike that sends opponents away, or if they are below Yuzu, use her down aerial to blow them downwards, and if they touch the ground, you can do a little damage. You can even force them to the other side with her pummel, and then forward throw them away. You may also optionally use Jack Frost's down throw instead, which sends them down in an ice cage to their doom. You may want to perform Pixie's back throw to prevent them from doing any moves that may help them though.

That's all well and good, but how do you, well, KO them? Well, if you managed to create an ice block, but it's not thick enough to prevent you from grabbing them, you can use her forward throw on them, spiking them to their doom. You also home in on them with Yuzu's up smash, KOing at higher percentages, but still allowing Yuzu to hide behind an ice wall. You can even choose to burn the ice with her down smash, and if you managed to have Pixie dust under her, you have a great chance of hitting them. If they are right next to the ice block, use Power's side special to have the walls crumble on them.

We're not quite done yet though. What really Yuzu excels in is...

Support
Yup, helping out teammates. She has a lot of options too. Obvious ones include the previously mentioned traps. The moth breathified feathers can seriously help with GIMPing characters. The ice spikes/electrified water can help characters do extra damage for those who like rushing in and pushing opponents. If Yuzu managed to freeze them, it makes it all the more easier to attack. Yuzu can even use the ice block from her forward smash to hide behind them for setting up, or camping, as team projectiles go through it remember? She can even boost their projectiles with Jack Frost's down special, though you may want to make sure they don't plan on physical attacks...

She can even fix them up with a little healing, thanks to Pixie's Charm, and can mindgame opponents to take the bait every 3rd time to ruin their recoveries. She can even make opponents deal less damage to her teammates, via her up aerial (where she then can quickly heal her team), or her fire feather traps, which will deal off a little damage. She can even bring them back to life with Pixie's down special.

And...that's it. It's a whole lot to take in, but Yuzu has plenty of options, thanks to her magic, and her demons, so use her well. ;D.

Up Taunt
Yuzu takes her COMP out, and plays with it a little while.
Side Taunt
Yuzu will look forward, seriously, and say, "Uhh...the only one going down is you."
Down Taunt
Yuzu will let a out peace sign to the screen, looking happy while she does so.
Victory #1
Yuzu will hug her currently controlled demon, happily. Needless to say, the demons look embarrassed.
Victory #2
Yuzu returns her demons back to her COMP, and she lets out a happy, "Mission Accomplished!"
Victory #3
Yuzu looks all determined, and says, "I won't runaway again."
Lose Taunt
Yuzu looks kind of down, and sits down playing her COMP.​


Author's Note: Fun set is fun. I would like to thank Smady for the headers, and wrk for introducing me to this great game. While I feel that most people will still prefer Edgeworth for my best set, I had the most making this set in this MYM. Hope that others can enjoy this set as well :3.






Conquer your demon

Break your barricade
































Let's survive.
 

KingK.Rool

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 26, 2005
Messages
1,810
Amane: At first, mana counter draws an eyeroll. Stock numbers-based meter mechanic, done and done by MYM 3. Then there's that little healing twist, which immediately sets my mind racing on all the ways you can juggle healing with damage output to make an exclusively irritating character.

Now, the problem with anime characters is that they're essentially one big in-joke, laced with references to the subject matter and accuracy to character that makes them devilishly hard to get interested in if you're totally unfamiliar with and uninterested in where they're coming from. This is what Aname suffers from most, like most Silver sets and quite a few TWIL ones. The best anime/manga characters are larger-than-life villains with eccentric powers.

Since Amage is not a larger-than-life villain with eccentric powers, you have considerably less to work with to get your audience really into it. Technically, it's a great set. Everything about Agame is well-handled, professional, and crisp - just not fascinating. The playstyle is clearly drawn - it's just not as promising as it starts off sounding, although, of course, if it had followed that healing road, I don't doubt it'd be OoC.

So either way, it's a success for you and another marker on your path to VICTORY but won't be regarded as one of your best early works when you make it big (which should be soon).

Skeleton: Why, what a handsome set this is! That obtuse organization... pretentious writing style... unnecessary verbiage... frustratingly low detail... lack of regard for balance altogether... hell, it's so rushed it looks like it was written in two hours! And now it can't even be edited to take out blatant mistakes like that walking-up recovery!

Kind of fitting for an undead set to have a banned poster, though. I'll grant that.
And I'm sorry, Silver - I don't know where Cincinnati came from, but it wasn't deliberate 9_9
 

Darkslash

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 1, 2008
Messages
4,076
Location
Strangereal Equestria

Totally related due to PLAYLIST​


Amane

Ohhh a Devil survivor set! :mad:. While not the biggest fan of the Shin Megami Tensei branch (I'm more of a PERSONA PERSONA PERSONA guy), it's nice seeing a set from a series that hasn't been represented all that much yet.

So Amane is a Mana user huh? While not the most imaginative thing, I guess it does work out. She is a heavy magic user in Devil survivor, so I would expect her to rely on magic really heavily. And rely on magic heavily she does. Using her magic attacks to get the opponent into the air, and then doing aerial combo's is a different premise for a magic user(I could be wrong though).

While I don't see a lot of major flaws, I do want to point out that I am disappointed in the lack of persona's, demon usage here. Seeing how they're confined into the throws makes me somewhat disapointed, but I could be incorrect into the usage of Amane using Demons, mostly due to the fact on the differences between the usage of Demon's and Persona's.

Over all nice set for a underrepresented series. NOW GO MAKE A PERSONA 3 SET (D)

Yuzu

Ohh look, another Devil Survivor set! This time, it's the other heavy magic user, Yuzu.

Yuzu in addition to her magic, also depends on her demons, which does fits the game in question. Summoning them with different inputs and then using them on their own, complimenting each other, or using them to augmenting Yuzu's magic attacks was overall a nice touch indeed.What I found here is that Yuzu manages to create a balance between magic and Demons, which in my opinion is pretty good, so it feels like neither magic or demon seemed shoehorned into the set.

While I can't find any major flaws in this set (it's 11:42 right now lol), I'm sure some one might pick it up.

So great job on working on a Shin Megami set TWILT. NOW GO MAKE A PERSONA 3 SET (D)
 

HeoandReo

Smash Apprentice
Joined
May 16, 2008
Messages
157
Time for this old veteran to throw his hat in the ring again.

It's been more than a year since I've last participated in this contest,(Not since MYM 3, actually) and it's surprised me that it's grown this fast. It grew too quickly for me to catch up on back in the day, but I'm coming out of retirement for a bit to give this a shot once again.

I've been working on a few movesets since I left, and here's one I'm ready to post here.
There'll be more to come, hopefully.

(OK, let's see if I can fix this. I'll fix format first, then maybe change a few things if I get an idea to.)


----

Watch out whippersnappers, and respect your elders! The great Loremaster, Strago Magus, is here to show these Brawlers what it really means to fight!






Entrance: Appears just like in when he prepares for battle in FF6. Quickly moves to his spot, spinning once as he does so.

Series: Final Fantasy 6

Logo: Terra in Magitek Armor

Trivia: In the Japanese version, his name is announced as 'Stragus'.

Wiimote Sound: The chime of a Blue Magic spell/Lore.



Costumes:​

Black shirt, Red cape, blue pants (Standard)
Green shirt, Red cape, yellow-gold pants (Game appearance)
Green shirt, Lime-green cape, yellow pants (Green Team)
Light brown shirt, Red cape, blue pants (Red Team)
Light blue shirt, Dark Blue cape, blue pants (Blue Team)


Alternate Costumes​

His suits. Imagine a mascot costume, only the head part is instead a hood which he wears behind his head. The costumes have different head parts.

Chocobo Suit (A yellow suit with a Chocobo motif)
Nutkin Suit (A reddish suit with a squirrel motif) (Red Team)
Tabby Suit (A prussian blue coloured suit with a cat motif) (Blue Team)
Behemoth Suit (A green suit with a Behemoth motif)(Green Team)
Moogle Suit (A white suit with a Moogle motif)



The Mage's Stats

Speed: 2/5
He's a 71 year old man. A very spry one, yes, but a 71 year old man all the same.

Jump: 4/5
Well, Dragoonboots could help, and he was shown to be a great jumper at the Fanatics' Tower.

Size: 2.5/5
He's 4'11", according to official data. The shortest character in the game, barring Mog.

Weight: 1.5/5
He's less than 100 lbs. And has very frail bones.​


Can he...

Crawl?: No.
Walljump?: No.
Wallcling?: No.
Glide?: No.


Strago's Style

Strago is an extremely technical character. Many of his attacks can be extraordinarily effective, as long as you keep watch over the damage being done, and other aspects you wouldn't normally think about. Strago is a character who demands dedication, as learning how to use his different Lores can be a challenge in the heat of battle, but if you use them effectively, Strago can easily destroy any 'stock' one might have against him.

For the purpose of this moveset, the original FF6(FF3US) Lore names will be used. Sorry if I can't find pictures at the moment, but I'll put in a link as a compromise.

http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Lore

This contains every single Lore that Strago can use, for visual reference.



Normals and tilts​


Jab:

Rippler.


Strago spins in place, hitting his opponents with his wildly flailing arms. Since Strago spins round, the attack can hit both ahead and behind him. Releasing(Or no longer tapping) the A button causes Strago to stop and end the attack in the direction he last faced while striking. It does not necessarily reflect what Rippler actually is, but hey. Name fits. 1-2% each hit.


Forward Tilt:

Rod hit


Strago hits his opponent over the head with his Mithril Rod. The attack moves in an 90 degree arc, starting from when he brings his arm over his head to hit. He sends it down in a way that it hits downward. Knockback sends the opponent forward, and at high enough percents,(170-190%) it can kill. 7-10%.


Up Tilt:

Pep Up.


Strago jumps upwards ecstatically, hitting opponents with his head. For the purposes of our hero, though, he does not vanish, and it does not restore anyone's health. 5-9%.


Down Tilt:

Magus Sweep


Strago does a spinning crouch kick with his right leg. The attack trips on contact. 6-11%.



Smashes


Forward Smash:

Aqua Rake.


Why not have Strago's most famous Lore as his fsmash? Strago sends a volley of bubbles a short distance ahead of him, about the width of a Bowser. Does great knockback(Enough to KO at 75% for the lightest characters), and has a slight 'blowing' effect to send back opponents that are juuust in front of the attack. (Like F.L.U.D.D. or Spitball Sparky) Can work as a finisher if the opponent is close. 14-25%.


Up Smash:

Step Mine.


Strago charges himself up in his Lore pose, and sends up a 'Step Mine' up a distance as long as the A button is held. The damage depends on how much distance Strago has walked in the match, and the height it travels depends on the charge time. The Mines have fixed knockback as they go up, but when they land, their knockback becomes higher, again based on the distance Strago has walked during the match. To prevent spamming the attack, the damage amount resets whenever Strago is KO'd.

Less than 1 mile: 1-8%
1-1.5 miles: 9-16%
1.5-2 miles: 17-25%
2+ miles: 26-35%

Due to not knowing the distance one has traveled during a match, one should not rely on this move too much to finish off an enemy.


Down Smash:

Cleansweep.


Strago faces the player(or the background), crosses his arms, then jumps slightly to create a torrent of water on either side of him. The water blasts upwards, and have higher height the longer it is charged. An uncharged Cleansweep is as high as Snake, while a fully charged Cleansweep is twice the height. Knocks players upwards, and can work as an upward KO move at 90+ damage. 12-21%.



Aerial Attacks​


Neutral Aerial:

Lore Kick.


A generic sexkick. It gets stronger the more Strago leaves it out, like Dr. Mario's did, although it has higher knockback if Strago hits with it immediately, like all sexkicks are like. 6-11%.


Forward Aerial:

Lv. 5 Doom.


Strago swings his arms ahead of him, as if holding a scythe. Black fog in the shape of the weapon accompanies the attack, creating a length the size of Mario to attack ahead of him. The sweetspot in the attack is the very edge of the fog-scythe, and if it hits, a skull appears and sends the opponent further than if the attack was hit up close.
If the opponent's damage level is any number divisible by 5, the attack has the knockback of a Bowser fsmash, and can kill at very low percents.(55% for Mario)
Strago's best overall kill move due to its range, although it has horrible lag upon landing. 8-14%.


Back Aerial:

Lv. 4 Flare.


Strago sends a quick fireball backwards, like Zelda's uair-style. While the attack has a good amount of knockback on its own(Same as the aforementioned Zelda flare) Like Lv. 5 Doom, the attack has much higher knockback if the opponent's damage is a multiple of 4. (Strictly. So 2%, 6%, 10% are safe, but 4%, 8%, 12% are not.) Like Lv. 5 Doom, it also has a fair amount of lag upon landing, so one should avoid using this close to the ground. 8-15%.


Up Aerial:

Lv. 3 Muddle.


Strago lifts up his left arm, and a small, yellow bird flies out of his sleeve to hit. Initial knockback sends the opponent up a very small distace, but sends them down instead if their damage is a multiple of 3. It has fixed knockback, and does not send them down fast enough to be a spike. 2-6%.


Down Aerial:

L? Pearl.


Strago spreads his legs to either side and throws his hands down, conjuring a small white magic ball from them, which sends the opponent downward. The knockback is fairly small, making the opponent go down slowly. It does not significantly spike unless the opponent's damage is a multiple of Strago's 'ones' damage digit. (0 never spikes, and 1 always spikes.) 5-10%.



Special Moves​


Standard Special Move:

Sour Mouth.


Hold down the B button, and Strago charges himself to release a powerful breath. This breath makes the opponent sleep, creates a flower on their head, and slows them down. It has pitiful range, initially having only the range of an uncharged Wario Waft, but holding the button down longer makes the range bigger, to the size of Bowser after 3 seconds. Does no damage on contact, but it'll add up due to the poison. The attack also has slight knockback, slight enough to keep the opponent in place.
However, Strago must stay stationary when he is charging the attack, so it is somewhat unreliable unless if is done quickly.


Side Special:

Stone.


Strago picks up a rock and throws it ahead at an opponent. The rock moves in an arc, like a real stone does, and can cover a distance that is a little over half of Final Destination.(Maybe 5/8s) The damage and knockback is based on their damage compared to his.

Generally, it will do 6-12% damage, and knock the opponent back slightly, as if they were hit with a light item(Like the Banana Peel or the Smoke Ball).

If the tens digit is the same,(i.e. if Strago has 25% and the opponent has 21%) it does 12-24% damage and has more knockback, like if the opponent was hit with a barrel or a crate.

If the exact number is the same, it does 30-60% damage and has immense knockback.


Up Special Move:

Aero.


A small swirl springs and sends Strago spinning skywards. Try saying that 3 times fast. In essence, a small tornado forms just under Strago, and spins him upwards, doing damage to anyone who comes in contact with him, and sending him up and slightly forward. Contact with Strago causes 7-11% damage, while contact with the tornado under him causes 3-7%.


Down Special Move:

Forcefield.


Strago brings forward his right hand, launches a forcefield ahead of him, as a small, slow-moving ball of light when you hold down the button. When you let go, the ball explodes, creating a wall the size of Bowser to block out opponents. Projectiles are also unable to pass through the forcefield, hitting it as if the forcefield was a wall. The wall lasts for a short time, and does no damage, but it can be effective in buying some time, or for stopping up recovery.


Throws​


Grab:

Strago grabs his opponent with his left hand, with the trusty Mithril Rod in his right.


Grab hit:

Strago hits them over the head with the rod, possibly disciplining them over bugging him. 1-3%


Forward Throw:

Exploder.


Strago... explodes, and sends the opponents forwards. Despite the fact that he... you know, exploded, it does no damage to Strago, and he appears fine. Burnt for a second, but fine. Due to the nature of the attack being a small explosion, the attack has a fair amount of knockback, and can kill off the side at a high enough percentage. 6-10%


Back Throw:

Reverse Exploder.


Same type of throw as the standard version of Exploder, except it sends the opponent backwards. 6-10%


Up Throw:

Dischord.


Strago hits them upwards for small damage, but the opponent is unable to control themselves(aside from direction of fall) until they reach the ground, like as if they broke their shield. They cannot double-jump, or do an aerial. The throw sends them high in the air to have a wide area to fall down. Strago can theoretically chainthrow with this. 3-5%


Down Throw:

Condemned.


Strago leapfrogs over the opponent's head, and sets a timer above them to 20 seconds. After the 20 seconds pass, the opponent takes 4% damage, and are dizzied. (Length of dizziness depends on damage taken) The opponent can 'pass' the timer along like Snake's C4, and even Strago himself can be hit by it.



Final Smash: Grand Train

Strago gets on a train and runs over the opponents. Like Captain Falcon. WOO WOOOO!!!

No. I tell a lie. Instead, Strago activates his greatest Lore, the Grand Train! A triangle opening the rift to space appears in the centre of the stage, heavily damaging and knocking back any who get in its way! The size of the Train depends on the size of the stage. Bigger stages create a bigger Train!

Damage is done based on how close the opponent is to the centre to the triangle. Damage ranges between 20% to 50% based on if the opponent is close to the triangle's perimeter, or at the very centre of it. Opponents are knocked back off the stage(If they are on the left side, they get knocked left, and vice versa) on contact with the Grand Train.

After 15 seconds of the Grand Train, it decreases in size, and eventually disappears entirely. The triangle no longer damages at this time.


Extras​

Up Taunt:
Strago spins around with his arms raised like a lunatic, like when he's Muddled. Hold the button to continue the taunt.

Side Taunt:
Strago scratches his chin/beard, and brings his other hand up, which shoots bubbles into the air.

Down Taunt:
Strago does a quick exercise, but hurts his back. He brings his hand to his back and straightens it.

Credits Music: Save Them!!


Victory Taunts:

Victory Theme: Strago's remixed them from 'Balance Is Restored'.
(From 2:55 to 3:05)

Crosses his arms like he means business. "A 'kid' like me doesn't know the meaning of defeat!"

Strago picks up a Stone and throws it up into the air. It falls on his head and he rubs where it fell.

Strago appears next to a portrait of himself, standing in a dignified manner, presumably painted by his granddaughter, Relm. The resemblance is uncanny.


Kirby Hat: Kirby gets Strago's mustache and mohawk. Sour Mouth retains the same properties, such as its low range that increases when the button is held. The hitbox is just adjusted to suit Kirby's low height.


Snake Codec: (With Colonel)


S: Colonel, isn't that guy a little... you know... old to be fighting?
C: Oh, that's Strago Magus.
S: Strago... what?
C: Strago Magus. From where he comes from, he's one of the world's best mages. He's learned many spells through watching the monsters of his land, over and over again until he got it right.
S: Now that's dedication.
C: Yes. He may look a little frail, but if you're not careful, he can hit you where it hurts in a split second. Watch your damage meter.
S: ... Don't tell me this is like Psycho Mantis all over again.



Strago's Strategy

Because of the many different effects of Strago's Lores, it is important to note just which ones can be useful in a particular situation.

Most of Strago's aerials have special effects based on the damage percentage of the opponent. However, new Strago players may find these effects occurring without rhyme or reason. It is important to study your opponent's damage meter, and land one of Strago's Level-based attacks at a proper number. Opponent's already at 100%? Go for Lv.5 Doom! Even if it's not sweetspotted, it'll still pack a punch! And so on. It will surely give the opponent a good case of the blues.

(OK, I couldn't resist that horrible pun.)

Strago's specials all have different effects. Sour Mouth can be good when your opponent is very up close. Aero is best suited for recovery. However, Forcefield and Stone are probably his two best specials, and should be cornerstones for every Strago player.

Forcefield has a variety of applications. It's good for stopping up those pesky runaway characters, such as Fox or Pikachu, as their projectiles cannot pass through the forcefield, forcing them to adopt a new strategy to try to attack Strago. It can also do wonders for halting enemy recovery. While it has to be timed, since the opponents cannot move through it, it's great for protecting yourself from their return.

Stone, simple as it seems, being a projectile, is good for a variety of things. It can damage from a good distance, and thanks to its damage-based effects, can actually be very dangerous to your opponent if they don't pay attention.

While much of Strago's strategy relies on synergizing his damage meter with the enemy's, don't forget that the enemy can do the same thing, and if they're lucky, they can avoid the percent-based attacks simply by having a damage number like 67%. Strago has to control the match to make sure that any move that hits will have devastating effects.
 

darth meanie

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 6, 2008
Messages
452
Amane

It's good to see another set from you wrk! Amane is a fairly interesting new set. I like the connection from the Up Special to the aerials, and the way you can affect her grab-game. That said, there are a few flaws, most of which fold out of your mana mechanic.

One thing that you have to keep in mind with any sort of ammo mechanics like these is the economy to it. Almost every move Amane has requres mana, including some of the few that regain her mana. She simply can't keep up mana production to the level of mana expenditure. Further, mechanics like these usually aren't too well liked, even I made an ammo moveset that bombed pretty badly.

The movest does have some level of playstyle, but it doesn't really come together into anything really interesting. It could use some more focus and a more interesting thing to focus the set around. That said, mechanically you've done a much better job at making interesting moves and flow here than in Gengar, making this an improvement in my eyes.


Yuzu

I recently wrote an article on move interactions that you can read on the Stadium. It advises on a few ways to do move interactions, and specifically on how not to do them in the way you did in this set.

All of the various summon moves that interact come off as pretty forced, with some seemingly random effects attached to them. Much like Empoleon, although there are strategies you can come out of with this, mixing Pixie Dust with Ice Breath to make 'magic' happen and create a trap breaks suspension of disbelief for the reader.

While that's bad for her specials, what's worse is that most of the tilts and aerials are moves with special effects that happen only when one specific summon is in the background, most of which are just more damage or range. This has the effect of encouraging the player to only use a handful of moves when they have a summon out instead of a wider variety of attacks, limiting the player's options instead of expanding them.

What's most frustrating is that she can only use her throws when she has a specific summon out. You're shutting out parts of her moveset based on what summon she has out at any time. If these combinations were really moving towards specific strategies, or different tactics you can take, I'd be more appreciative of it, but the playstyle doesn't seem to develop beyond spamming different effects to overwhelm the opponent. Not a bad playstyle, but it could've been better.


Strago Magus

Well, welcome back from a very long time ago then! I can't say I've met you, although I did briefly visit in MYM2. Our contest has changed quite a bit since back then, so let me offer some suggestions.

I do like the creativity around playing with the foes damage level with some of the aerials, it could've been interesting to see this as a more major part of the set. As it is though, most of the moves are fairly simple and short, and they don't really flow together all that well. We've changed the way we organize our movesets since MYM3 as well, and like bigger headers and more meat in the move descriptions.

That said, it's great to see a returning member, and I hope to see you improve and continue to post new and better sets.
 

TWILTHERO

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 19, 2007
Messages
1,880
Location
Canada
Yuzu
I recently wrote an article on move interactions that you can read on the Stadium. It advises on a few ways to do move interactions, and specifically on how not to do them in the way you did in this set.
Yes, an article by you automatically makes it correct. >_>
All of the various summon moves that interact come off as pretty forced, with some seemingly random effects attached to them. Much like Empoleon, although there are strategies you can come out of with this, mixing Pixie Dust with Ice Breath to make 'magic' happen and create a trap breaks suspension of disbelief for the reader.
Yes, an interaction where it just simply helps you freeze stuff more easily is totally unimaginable. Oh heavens no! Spraying a little ice on pixie dust to create a freezing area that helps her is sooooooo forced!

While that's bad for her specials, what's worse is that most of the tilts and aerials are moves with special effects that happen only when one specific summon is in the background, most of which are just more damage or range. This has the effect of encouraging the player to only use a handful of moves when they have a summon out instead of a wider variety of attacks, limiting the player's options instead of expanding them.
Alright, I'll agree with you here a bit. Just a question, if Yuzu didn't have any of those specific summons which you claim to be so bad, would you like the set a little more? I could probably edit it out in 5 minutes. >_>

What's most frustrating is that she can only use her throws when she has a specific summon out. You're shutting out parts of her moveset based on what summon she has out at any time. If these combinations were really moving towards specific strategies, or different tactics you can take, I'd be more appreciative of it, but the playstyle doesn't seem to develop beyond spamming different effects to overwhelm the opponent. Not a bad playstyle, but it could've been better.
Oh no! A throw she can only use when she summons one out of 4 demons, being allowed to have any 2 out a time, and only take a second to summon! Yeah, that's so bad.

Sorry if this seems like I'm whining, but this comment makes me feel that this set that I really enjoyed making was a waste of my time (and I'm really not that kinda guy), and as bad as, no worse than Joshua. >.> I'm surprised you think it's so bad as I feel that Red has worst interactions that were more forced AND less useful.

That said, thanks for the comment. I apologize that you couldn't like this set more, but it's your opinion. *includes :bee: so post isn't so negative*

EDIT: Removed the demons assisting Yuzu moves, removed some unneeded interactions, and make the grab more versatile.
 

HeoandReo

Smash Apprentice
Joined
May 16, 2008
Messages
157
Strago Magus

Well, welcome back from a very long time ago then! I can't say I've met you, although I did briefly visit in MYM2. Our contest has changed quite a bit since back then, so let me offer some suggestions.

I do like the creativity around playing with the foes damage level with some of the aerials, it could've been interesting to see this as a more major part of the set. As it is though, most of the moves are fairly simple and short, and they don't really flow together all that well. We've changed the way we organize our movesets since MYM3 as well, and like bigger headers and more meat in the move descriptions.

That said, it's great to see a returning member, and I hope to see you improve and continue to post new and better sets.
Thanks for the comments. Taking a cursory look at the other movesets seemed to tip me off that a lot of the methods I used to succeed in the past won't quite work as well here. I haven't looked into an MYM topic since I left MYM3, so a lot of my work is kind of stuck in the past, and is a little bit minimalist compared to now, as that was my old writing style.

Regardless, I'm doing a little bit of research on the new aspects of this contest since then, and I'm impressed at the amount of evolution that's occurred. Not sure if I'll be able to stay here with my methods, but I'll do what I can.

That said, I've already started some work on another character, Kilgore Trout. I'll try to pull all the stops for that one, and make it more descriptive than Strago was.

Can't Sleep Edit: OH WOW. I just took a look at the new MYM format. It's almost mind-blowing to me, considering my old one was okay for when I did it. I'll fix Strago's format after I finish up Kilgore Trout.

(It's almost done anyway, but I'll wait for some more comments before I post it.)
 

half_silver28

Smash Ace
Joined
Apr 25, 2008
Messages
862
Location
MYM, Ohio
Half_Silver's
Episode Four: The Robo-Devil Survivor Pokemon Final Finale



So it's the last ep of my Ketchup. I'll be covering 6 sets this time, so I'll just get on with it because my tired brain can't think of anything witty to say here.


So first we've got Hugo. A 5-in-one character, Hugo would obviously be a very hard character to play, and having to use shield to use standards is extremely awkward. But the core playstyle of the set of relying on Hypno's hypnosis and the focus on incapacitating the foe and making it hard for them to turn around so it can be pulled off is terrific. Stuff like Machamp's forward throw sticks out: you can essentially push them into any other hugely damaging move or just force them to face Hypno. There's also Golbat's potent annoyance tactics in mean look and pursuit which are awesome. I'd say that Hugo is broken, but not that much so since all of his pokemon besides Hypno are presumedly gone forever once they get KOed, which makes it all that much harder to play effectively. I would assume that Raticate would end up KOed often with his uber-aggressive nature: Golbat can't ALWAYS be there to save him. & I'd honestly just set Raticate to CPU when playing him anyhow so I have less to actively manage. Of course Hypno is the main reason that Hugo leans towards overpowered: I don't have a problem with him hypnotizing in one second if foes are up close, but I think it should take a full 10 seconds if they're a whole FD away from him. But those are just more numbers. This is certainly a great set, though I would place Dark Bowser above it.


Next up is Cacturne, an interesting take on an otherwise traditional camping character. Sandstorm is obviously the vocal point of all this: allowing him to space foes and his own spikes effectively, force approaches and potentially even push them off-stage. The rest of his set flows together quite nicely, littering the stage with projectiles and spikes, slowing down foes with cotton spore, dealing a lot of passive damage and embedding himself in the ground with Ingrain. There's a lot going on as far as repealing foes: Cacturne can either set up further attacks or play defensively with faint attack, payback or sucker punch. Or of course, just knock them away with prick. And he can potentially grab them, which can result in a ton of damage. My complaints about this set are mostly focused on individual moves: I don't really see how growth adds much of anything to cacturne's play, & it doesn't last long enough to be that useful, and sand attack should NOT be lagless if it stuns them for a full second. And the back throw really seems kind of awkward to me, & it wouldn't really benefit foes at all to stick to that spot against cacturne. Other than that, this is a terrific set that at least matches Scarmiglione in quality for me. Great job with this one!
And the down throw is epic.


Now we're up to Napalm Man, another agi RM! At first glace he appears to be your standard camper: littering the field with napalm bombs, missiles and fire, making it a challenge to approach him. But there's so much more to like about him. His beacons combined with the related air strike allows for mindgames when it comes to accurately catching foes in the bombing, and cease fire can catch a foe by surprise and give napalm man an opening. But the most interesting thing are his treads, which let him actually approach while continuing to bombard his foes: the equivalent of a tank slowly rolling towards enemy lines and firing away. Foes also have the up special and grab to fear up close: not to mention that you can position them where the air strike will occur while you have them grabbed and blast them at the expense of hurting yourself as well. And of course, that dair of his is an awesome gimper if you don't manage to kill them with a bombing or up special. To be honest, there aren't really many flaws I can pick out of this set, it's a great twist on the traditional camper set with far more depth than one would expect from an RM like Napalm Man. I don't feel that Napalm man was a step back for you at all agi :[



Next we've got Amane, the first of the back to back Devil Survivor sets and wrk's second set. I have no experience with the SMT series, so yeah. An improvement from Gengar, Amane certainly has flow with her neutral and side specials focusing on leading into grabs, and the usage of her up special to attack while moving, and a bit of aerial combo potential boosted by the up special. Most of her ground moves do fit into this somehow: her anti-air moves can catch foes by surprise alongside a use of up special, and she has others like the down tilt that knock them into the air. Though there are a few moves that depart a bit too much from the playstyle like the jab and the forward smash (despite it having a move that leads right into it). Restoring mana with Mind Link is obviously the main reason its important to land her grab, but her other throws are rather useful in giving her chances to predict a tripped foe, regrab or force them into the air.

Now my biggest complaint about this set really is the mana thing. And as DM said, you should rethink it a bit: only one move requires no mana, so I think you should either decrease the amount you need for moves or give her more moves that don't need it. Then there's Boost: it becomes far too obvious what she's going to do when she uses this, and the buff to her dash-grab isn't really worth 4 mana. As for the other buffs, you should really just buff Amane's stats and aerial move damage to reflect her aerial focus. There are also a few instances where you need to give us more information, like on the down special (does she stay possessed for 7 seconds or does it take 7 seconds to go through the possession - it lasts way too long if its the second). The down tilt is also a culprit: with no mention of lag it seems pretty broken taking range into account. Finally, I'm finally starting to get a little what Rool is always saying about anime sets (no, larger-than-life villains are not > all other anime characters). While Devil survivor is not an anime, it nearly qualifies as one. You randomly introduce demons in the throws without telling anyone exactly what they are, and you even add in quips about what they are. The average person who is reading this set, honestly won't really care about information like that. In fact, even I don't care about information like that <.<. There's also the frequent mentions to Remiel, which can further turn off the average reader (in other words, a pic of him would be nice).

Now my specific complaints aside, this was a large step up from Gengar in terms of presentation and flow, and an enjoyable read. You're really improving at a rapid pace: keep at it!



And now Yuzu, the second of the Devil Survivor sets. Now I'm doing things in a different order this time & talking about the interactions first. The interactions with the moth and pixie dust and the fire spells with generally everything are pretty cool, but a lot of them seem simply thrown in and a few don't make ANY sense whatsoever. The interactions between the feathers and the moth breath and ice seem kind of random (though I see the usefulness of the interaction the moth breath). Then there's ice + moth breath = longer ice slope. How does that even work? 8-). And there’s also ice and pixie dust, where you just explain the interaction with "magic happens". (But the main problem is that the freezing effect doesn’t last long enough to be of much use) It still seems that you're forcing certain interactions into the set (though still not as bad as using Iron Tail on rocks). I see you did already edit the set to take out some interactions due to DM’s comment though, which is definitely a good step to take.

Now that that's out of the way, there's this summon thing. It really starts out promising with each summon specializing in a different thing. Healing/support, projectiles, speed and KOing. The buffs that they give are very conscious of this, either boosting Yuzu herself or boosting the foe to make them act in a certain way. The problem is that Mothman and Power don't really add that much to the set. Though I have to say that there is a lot of potential for effective camping and creating traps by lighting stuff on ph13r. And then there are the ice slopes. You can put ice blocks and icicles there to block off foes, or even bounce Zio off it. Now it doesn't make sense to me why the ice blocks stay still when put onto the slope: wouldn't it be awesome if she could slide the blocks straight at the foe using the slope? Just another idea I got. And the throws come off as rather irrelevant and random, excluding the forward throw which is a straight-forward KO move. Though the pummel is pretty cool with it being able to move the foe into your traps and such. So Yuzu's biggest flaw is ultimately that a lot of what she does with her summons doesn't really contribute much to her playstyle, and random interactions. But you had fun making the set and I think you're aware of what you have to work on, so it's all good. Yuzu was a fun set to read for sure, so keep the sets coming! :D




Finally, we have Strago Magus, who marks the end of my Ketchup =O. Oh and he’s made by... HeoandReo?! Wow, I didn’t expect one of the big players from MYM2 to reappear like this, much less start contributing sets again immediately. Obviously you’re already aware of the much, much higher standards MYM has compared to MYM3 when you made Chun-li and Dan IIRC. I wouldn’t say Strago’s creativity is that far behind most MYM sets (though pulling a weapon out of nowhere is generally frowned upon unless they actually have the ability to conjure things out of nowhere). And you mostly provide a lot of the needed detail: you generally just need to mention lag on your moves and be a tiny bit more specific on attack range. There is a lack of playstyle, but that’s to be expected with how long your absence has been. Like darth_meanie said, the whole focus on specific attacks being more powerful depending on the foe’s damage percent is a pretty cool concept that I could see a playstyle being based around. Also there are some articles on playstyle and other aspects of set-making on The Stadium, which is linked in the opening post of the thread. There’s also the MYM chat linked there, which you may want to check out if you have the time (though you might want to focus on your set first). But anyway, from a fellow MYM2 vet, it’s good to have you back!



 

HeoandReo

Smash Apprentice
Joined
May 16, 2008
Messages
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Finally, we have Strago Magus, who marks the end of my Ketchup =O. Oh and he’s made by... HeoandReo?! Wow, I didn’t expect one of the big players from MYM2 to reappear like this, much less start contributing sets again immediately. Obviously you’re already aware of the much, much higher standards MYM has compared to MYM3 when you made Chun-li and Dan IIRC. I wouldn’t say Strago’s creativity is that far behind most MYM sets (though pulling a weapon out of nowhere is generally frowned upon unless they actually have the ability to conjure things out of nowhere). And you mostly provide a lot of the needed detail: you generally just need to mention lag on your moves and be a tiny bit more specific on attack range. There is a lack of playstyle, but that’s to be expected with how long your absence has been. Like darth_meanie said, the whole focus on specific attacks being more powerful depending on the foe’s damage percent is a pretty cool concept that I could see a playstyle being based around. Also there are some articles on playstyle and other aspects of set-making on The Stadium, which is linked in the opening post of the thread. There’s also the MYM chat linked there, which you may want to check out if you have the time (though you might want to focus on your set first). But anyway, from a fellow MYM2 vet, it’s good to have you back!
It's good to be back, I suppose. I'm slowly getting the hang of what constitutes a good moveset here, and I've done some reading of the articles to catch up.
Although I might hold off on modifying Strago until I post my next moveset or two, so that I can get a feel of what the new standards are. I'll post it soon enough, though.

While I hate to say it, I've already made my next set, Kilgore Trout have the ability to conjure things. But I'll try to justify it in the post. It's going to be what I'm calling a 'fancy' set, where I call out to references in his universe.

But I'm reading up on flow, and my next set will be more focused on that.
 
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