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"common knowledge" that a lot of people don't know

ihavespaceblondes

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 29, 2005
Messages
4,229
Location
Memphis, TN
I've experienced it several times... old noob habit of mashing jump because no one would wait for Samus' lack of hitstun comes back to haunt me. Then I remember and stop pressing it, but auto-jump into a knee a split second later anyway.
 

Dark Sonic

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 10, 2006
Messages
6,021
Location
Orlando Florida
The same is true of getup attacks (just asked Magus :p)

So if you knock someone over while they're mashing attack buttons (during multishines, rapid jabs, whatever) you canactually account for them getup attacking consistently.

20 frame buffers are so mean :p
 

JPOBS

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 26, 2007
Messages
5,821
Location
Mos Eisley
yea, i friggin HATE the getup attack buffer though.

happens to me so much in spacies matches and then i get combo'd to death.
stupid game.
 

MT_

Smash Ace
Joined
Nov 8, 2009
Messages
791
Location
Austin, TX
I just found out that in Kongo Jungle the Klaptrap can get caught in the barrel....whoa...

EDIT: and I just found out you can destroy the Great Fox's blaster on Corneria...!! HOLY CRAP. If you hit the blaster enough it'll eventually blow up and then you can't stand on it anymore.

I am just in full discovery mode today (to things that people probably already know haha)
 

X1-12

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 18, 2009
Messages
2,023
Location
Southampton, UK
The same is true of getup attacks (just asked Magus :p)

So if you knock someone over while they're mashing attack buttons (during multishines, rapid jabs, whatever) you canactually account for them getup attacking consistently.

20 frame buffers are so mean :p
what about rolling from the floor etc?
 

THeDarKnesS

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
209
I don't have a specific situation in mind or any evidence, but I don't think that's necessarily true; although, you could be right.
 

Pengie

Smash Lord
Joined
Nov 8, 2007
Messages
1,125
Location
Atlanta, GA
I think that your ability to do something after a jab reset (e.g. roll away, getup attack) is related to the strength of the move. That's why Jiggs's jab reset is so dangerous; her jab is to weak to roll out of the jab reset at low percents.
 

THeDarKnesS

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
209
Young Link has a sweetspot on his sword similar to Marth's sweet spot.
If you sweet spot his f-tilt, the knockback is increased. Same with his d-smash
It would be really sweet if you could tell us where YL's sweet spot is vs a simple fact that he has one.
 

Dark Sonic

Smash Hero
Joined
Jun 10, 2006
Messages
6,021
Location
Orlando Florida
I think that your ability to do something after a jab reset (e.g. roll away, getup attack) is related to the strength of the move. That's why Jiggs's jab reset is so dangerous; her jab is to weak to roll out of the jab reset at low percents.
It's actually based on the amount of hitstun the move causes (which is still based on the strength of the move I guess)

13 frames of hitstun or less=can only do normal getup (optionless jab reset)
14 frames of hitsun or more=can buffer any getup option by holding said option. (option jab reset)

Jigglypuff's jab reset is optionless until percents that don't matter.
Sheik's jab reset is optionless at low percents, but not past mid percents.

It'd be interesting if someone made a catalog of the percents where optionless jab resets turn into option jab resets.
 

THeDarKnesS

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
209
I kinda figured the part where I said "Like Marth's sweet spot" gave it away...
Not necessarily. Similar to marth YL has a sweet spot. Its just a bit more clear if you just say YL has a sweet spot on the tip similar to marths.

Sounds like I just interpreted what you said diffferently then how you meant it.

But its at the tip of the sword or is it slightly below or something like that?
 

Laijin

Smash Hero
Joined
Oct 10, 2004
Messages
5,848
Location
Rylai the Crystal Maiden's Igloo
Not necessarily. Similar to marth YL has a sweet spot. Its just a bit more clear if you just say YL has a sweet spot on the tip similar to marths.

Sounds like I just interpreted what you said diffferently then how you meant it.

But its at the tip of the sword or is it slightly below or something like that?
I'm not exactly sure where but its definitely the tip or around the tip. It only seems to matter on his f-tilt and his d-smash.

For example. A character's knockback will increase if you hit them with the tip of your f-tilt. If you hit them with your dmsash and they are too close to you, they get knocked up rather than away.
 

Metal Reeper

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 20, 2006
Messages
2,285
Location
Abington PA
EDIT: I ment about the buffer out of hitstun, I knew you could buffer resets. And I thought everyone knew that about Ylinks sword...
 

THeDarKnesS

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Mar 18, 2009
Messages
209
does it matter where you hit with the down smash to meteor spike them? or is that down tilt?

I know its the underside...but does it have to be sweet spotted as well?
 

Laijin

Smash Hero
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Rylai the Crystal Maiden's Igloo
Down tilt. I believe the only requirement is the character has to be in the air.
Not sure about any specific hit boxes or anything since I don't I have ever NOT meteor spiked anyone with d-tilt
 

BigD!!!

Smash Lord
Joined
Aug 13, 2009
Messages
1,833
metal reeper, most recently in the thread was a post saying that it was impossible for ganon to scoop fox with a rising uair, i was posting to say that it was

if it was posted much earlier in the thread, i dont know about it, but the last post i had seen in this thread concerning ganon's rising uair vs fox said that it didnt hit him
 

X1-12

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 18, 2009
Messages
2,023
Location
Southampton, UK
It's actually based on the amount of hitstun the move causes (which is still based on the strength of the move I guess)

13 frames of hitstun or less=can only do normal getup (optionless jab reset)
14 frames of hitsun or more=can buffer any getup option by holding said option. (option jab reset)

Jigglypuff's jab reset is optionless until percents that don't matter.
Sheik's jab reset is optionless at low percents, but not past mid percents.

It'd be interesting if someone made a catalog of the percents where optionless jab resets turn into option jab resets.

bonus info, you can SDI out of all resets, and ASDI out of some. Magus made a list of what percents (with no SDI or ASDI) you can roll from sheiks jab for each character

Nah, by A/SDIing up you can jump out or land on your feet in normal air to ground landing lag. Whether you can choose your getup or are forced into stand only when you don't successfully avoid the reset is based on the hitstun (knockback).
The first thing Unknown said is if they do jab you when you don't tech. If you get jabbed by Sheik above around 32% on a non-tech you can hold up to get high enough from the jab that you avoid the reset. Below that, you will need to SDI her jab.

The 2nd part was if they don't jab. They don't need to jab you to be able to punish a non-tech, so it's not some kind of solution to escaping Sheik's techchasing.

When talking about CF's jab reset on FFers, if they're able to roll and attack it's because his jab has more KB/hitstun. It's not a universal thing that you can always go by percentages. Jigglypuff's jab for example has weaker KB and doesn't let them roll/attack until like 80-90 or something really high. Peach's jab has fixed KB and doesn't allow people heavier than Falco/Pikachu to ever roll/attack at any dmg, but anyone that weight or lighter will always be able to.
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=9872129&postcount=28

There's no special treatment for spacies. If the hitstun is above a certain point you can roll/attack. If it isn't you can't.

This is for Sheik's jab, and if their damage after the jab hit is at this percent or higher they can roll/attack. If it isn't they are forced to stand only.

Bowser .... 45
DK ........ 44
Samus ..... 44
Ganon ..... 43
Yoshi ..... 43
CF ........ 42
Link ...... 42
Dr Mario .. 42
Luigi ..... 42
Mario ..... 42
Ness ...... 40
Peach ..... 39
Sheik ..... 39
Zelda ..... 39
ICs ....... 39
Marth ..... 39
Mewtwo .... 38
Roy ....... 38
Y Link .... 38
Falco ..... 37
Pikachu ... 37
Fox ....... 36
Kirby ..... 35
Jiggs ..... 33
G&W ....... 33
Pichu ..... 32


^^ That's the option aspect of it which already assumes you are forced into a getup by being on the ground when the down damage animation (what you go into when hit by a move that does less than 7.00% during a bounce/laying on the ground) ends.


Depending on the strength of the vertical KB, your DI, and the character's fallspeed though that may not even happen. This is also for Sheik's jab, and if they hold up (ASDI) this is the damage after the hit they'll start getting high enough off the floor to avoid getting reset in the first place:

Fox ....... 71
Falco ..... 43
CF ........ 33
Sheik ..... 25
Roy ....... 20
DK ........ 19


^^You can escape earlier than that by SDIing up
 

Metal Reeper

Smash Champion
Joined
Oct 20, 2006
Messages
2,285
Location
Abington PA
this kid thinks fox lasers reset. flame him.
Lol, I know they don't when I played Colbol I just hit up on the control stick :)

metal reeper, most recently in the thread was a post saying that it was impossible for ganon to scoop fox with a rising uair, i was posting to say that it was

if it was posted much earlier in the thread, i dont know about it, but the last post i had seen in this thread concerning ganon's rising uair vs fox said that it didnt hit him
Yeah I think I just misread earlier, thought it said that you could, hah sorry about that BigD
 

ranmaru

Smash Legend
Joined
Feb 10, 2008
Messages
13,296
Switch FC
SW-0654 7794 0698
stop mashing r/l and learn to tech.
I think people who click the button all the way down to wavedash/L cancel should try to learn to half click or whatever, to be able to tech more than usual.

Even I need to learn that, haha.

(Meaning not pressing the button all the way down)
 

ranmaru

Smash Legend
Joined
Feb 10, 2008
Messages
13,296
Switch FC
SW-0654 7794 0698
^^Airdodging requires a full press (as does wavedashing).
I mean when possible. : D

Like, L cancelling doesn't need a full press, Airdododging does. I guess we should be careful when wavedashing. : D
 

FoxLisk

Smash Lord
Joined
Jun 18, 2007
Messages
1,851
yeah, i retrained myself to do that a couple years ago. it doesn't help as often as i expected it to, but it is worth doing since it's strictly better.
i actually divided it up so I use L for full clicks (air dodges (inc. WD), techs) and R for light clicks (L cancelling, shielding)
 

KAOSTAR

the Ascended One
Joined
May 20, 2008
Messages
8,084
Location
The Wash: Lake City
I realized why I miss hella techs vs falcon. Its trying to powershield **** that ****s me up. or when Im getting tech chased and I try to get a shield out quickly and I full press but I get hit b4 the shield====no ****ing tech if they start a combo.

These all start your tech window:

Wavedashing
Airdodging
powershielding

These can start ur tech window with a full press

l cancel
shielding

Getting shield poked from a fully depressed shield, can get u ****ing *****. USE THIS TO UR ADVANTAGE WHEN ON THE OFFENSIVE!
 

ranmaru

Smash Legend
Joined
Feb 10, 2008
Messages
13,296
Switch FC
SW-0654 7794 0698
Thing is I use L for L cancelling and Shielding, R for Airdodging/Wavedashing.

I always L cancel with a full press. I should practice light pressing it. : ]
 

KAOSTAR

the Ascended One
Joined
May 20, 2008
Messages
8,084
Location
The Wash: Lake City
R and L are on the same timer so it doesnt matter which button you use.

Yu should def practice L canceling with a light press, or switch to using Z to L cancel.
 
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