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Lessons from Pound.

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-Ran

Smash Master
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Let's try and learn from this debacle. Please, let's try and further our community out of the ruins of the event series.

1) Do not let your venue fee barely pay for the venue. Always project 10~20% more of the actual expense. If there is excess after paying for your venue, roll it into the pot.

2) Do not expect Smashers to change their habits for your event. Players are going to do whatever they can do avoid added cost to their trips to an event. If you're allowed free-refills if you buy a cup, three players will split their drink. If they have to rent a hotel room, they'll shove ten to fifteen people in it.

3) Due to the above, do not make contractual obligations that would put yourself at risk. If you MUST make a contract, then it's time to make yourself a Limited Liability Company [LLC] to handle your tournaments. This will prevent the debts of the company from becoming your personal debts.

4) Do not agree to sliding-scale agreements. Get a per head cost agreement. We cannot accurately judge how large tournaments are going to be. Since there are deviations, these agreements are going to negatively impact your finances.

5) Attach yourself to other large events, such as an Anime Convention. This will allow you to have a significantly better deal, more thru-traffic to the event, and less overall individual burden. [Whobo.]

I really find that the most important aspect I can think of would be the formation of an LLC. In doing so, you pretty much keep yourself from personal liability, outside of the few things the LLC would own, which would amount to a TV, perhaps a Wii, and a few other things. Now, I'm not saying the goal is going to default on your debts with your LLC and let it collapse. Rather, you can use it as protection IN CASE this happens.
 

Eggm

Smash Hero
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Yes, this is a good thread. Lets learn as a community from the mistakes at pound 5 to further the good of it. Nice thread. This is much better than just taking a **** on plank.
 

-Ran

Smash Master
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Individual To's could create their own LLC's for their local smash stuff, if they have plans of having a national tournament. The larger the company, the more you'll have at risk, and thus the larger the liability.
 

Life

Smash Hero
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Or could all the TOs ban together and form one or two LLCs?

And does this get us taxed? For that matter, can we actually _get_ an LLC for this (Brawl is kinda shaky with gambling laws in certain states)?
 

Flayl

Smash Hero
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May 15, 2006
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There's nothing wrong with turning a bit of profit off the excess of the venue fee. As long as the estimate is fair, which people can check on via venue fee.
 

-Ran

Smash Master
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Or could all the TOs ban together and form one or two LLCs?

And does this get us taxed? For that matter, can we actually _get_ an LLC for this (Brawl is kinda shaky with gambling laws in certain states)?
We wouldn't want to be linked together. Also, gambling laws weren't written from playing video games, but for Video Gaming, which is the sugar-coated name for Video Poker/Slots/Etc. Those laws have nothing to do with us.
 

CY

Smash Ace
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Lamar University, TX
lessons from pound: if you plan on paying for the venue like plank did, let the people know that there could be a chance of no cash prizes.

if you run an event, make sure you prepare for the worst. this means having enough funds to pay off debts.

but don't worry guyzzzzzzz, every1 had fun so its k!!!!!!!!!!!!!! plank is the man!
 

Mic_128

Wake up...
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Keep your posts in this thread constructive only. There's enough plank hate in the other threads.
 

ranmaru

Smash Legend
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SW-0654 7794 0698
True. I agree with not picking a sliding scale agreement. I'd rather have a flat price. That is quite scary.

Also I would never expect people to come, life happens.

Also, if this ever happened to me, I'd at least try to help the winners get some of their money back in a way. I wouldn't say "Sorry, I'm negative, thanks for coming to America though". It would be a gentlemans clause.
 

mallu000

Smash Cadet
Joined
Apr 18, 2009
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64
Location
Finland
I'm glad to see first thread about Pound that makes sense and isn't full with BS.


Limited Liability Company would be great. I have actually always thought about something like that especially when I was studying business in vocational school and doing my study on different kind of company forms. At one time I actually thought making my final project about LLC for video game communities. You should really go for it!

I talked about this incident with a friend of mine who knows esports scene well and really is a smart guy overall. He said the way Pound and others tournaments were handled was just plain stupid. One guy in charge of basically everything and nothing on writing and no sponsors, he said it's amazing how anyone even went there expecting to get some money. He said things like SCREDDIT are the way to go. Starting from a scratch and slowly growing up and getting sponsors and the big names in the area interested. Imo Smash Community has grown the wrong way and the things my friend said are really a good point of view from a starcraft guy and maybe a wake up call to start handling the things like they should be handled. As for the Company itself, would it be possible to use maybe the Backroom as a basis and create a nation wide Company wich sets the rules and standards?

I really see this and the whole incident as a possible turn point for the community to start doing things the right way and maybe then gain the trust and respect of the other communities and the really big scenes. And I see that as an important thing not just that everyone could get respect as a smasher or some thing like that but for the community to get credibility and that the Starcraft [just an example] guys could say to sponsors "These guys are cool and their community is realiable" at the moment there's no one to say that and the community doesn't deserve that at the moment.

E: Sorry for any misspelling or confusion. I rarely write in english.
 

DeLux

Player that used to be Lux
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We wouldn't want to be linked together. Also, gambling laws weren't written from playing video games, but for Video Gaming, which is the sugar-coated name for Video Poker/Slots/Etc. Those laws have nothing to do with us.
I don't think there is a precedent for a distinction between the two at this time, at least in the Gaming Commissions of most states.

Supporting this is their isn't any sort of laws in place on the federal level protecting skilled games (HR 2610 died in subcommittee) on the federal level. If the states had a distinction as such on individual basis, there would be no need to even bring that bill into the House docket.

Although I can't think of an incident where a Gaming commission shut down a tournament because of the non-distinction either. Although based on my knowledge, I would think that it would still be in their executive discretion to do so.
 

MLG_JV

Smash Ace
Joined
Sep 24, 2008
Messages
859
Its a nice constructive thread. Unfortunately we are trying to keep everything in one thread. So gonna have to close. Sorry
 
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