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You're giving Deltacodding too little credit.You are giving kirby way too little credit. I would say it is even. Kirby unlike jigglypuff can actually kill yoshi, and kirby aint that easy to kill. Dthrow combo still works ish, or he can just bait the nair that yoshi is basically forced to do. Kirby can also just walk up and ftilt us. Kirbys ftilt is like the best move in the game xD
Id say its very even. Id MM your yoshi with kirby delta
wtf no.Dash grab.
Oh, I guess the crouching thing makes sense because of the less hitlag thing, but it is still annoying. >_<
Kirby doesn't wreck us when he gets in. Learn to DI/Jump away from him. He can't really chase you well. Also, Dair > Fsmash? Uhhhhhhhhhh.
Positioning.
Pretty much this.I think it only true combos if you trip during the d-air. I've been able to shield it every time I haven't tripped.
Kirby's f-smash is also shield-grabbable. ^_^
It's not as bad a feeling as getting Kirbycided.
I just felt like quoting this because it's funny how little you know about Kirby and how us top Kirby mainers play. First of all, we never use stone during a match, never. It has a lot of start-up, is very linear (falls straight down), takes a while to transform back, we get RCO lag (when we land we get landing lag that we're not supposed to have), and you can just camp near us waiting for us to transform back if we land on stage while you're on stage. Never, never, never, this move we never use (unless you're an easy opponent or you put yourself on a bad position, like if a downB would be a 100% guaranteed stage-spike we'd do it, or you go too high to try to juggle us so we just downB straight to the stage)... As for dair, it's not as bad of a choice as downB (which is a bad choice both on-stage and off-stage), but we do get punished a lot because of it so we use it rarely if ever on-stage, and we use it to gimp off-stage. Anyway, enough about downB and dair, and me feeling awesome about how I found something to point out. No offense, but you don't have much Kirby experience from what I got reading your post.
Of course I don't know what i'm talking about, I haven't played a Notable Kirby main yet. And I even pointed out I played "Two Kirby Mains" I didn't feel like typing Random cause that'd basically be me saying they're terrible players.
I disagree. Yoshi can camp Kirby easily BECAUSE he doesn't move too fast horizontally. Yoshi is very quick in the air and on the ground, so even if you push us to the end of the stage, it's not hard to get past you at all. Egg Roll is exceptionally good at clearing space if you're air camping, as is our general movement speed and SH AD.
DI/SDI is INCREDIBLY important against Kirby, because with proper DI, a lot of your combo strings and thus, damage output, is limited. Throw combos don't work at all on Yoshi if we DJ out. In fact, we can DJ away from a lot of Kirby's strings in general, and since he's not fast horizontally, he can't really follow that well. Yoshi's ability to counter is very effective in messing with Kirby's strings.
But because you're not hitting us with eggs, we're approaching you without taking damage. See how it goes?
I didn't say it wasn't useful, just that even with DI/SDI, you'll still be taking string damage. Between strings we have some actual legit combos, like bthrow>bair/uair (depends on which character, and it's 100% guaranteed on some characters), dtilt>grab, dair>ftilt, utilt>utilt (unless you, by some holy miracle, manage to predict the frame-4 hitbox and DI/SDI out of it), dthrow>buffered utilt (just 1 utilt is guaranteed though), utilt>bair... Very short, but they're true combos nonetheless that can happen during a string or while Kirby is inside, which may lead to some chasing/edgeguarding.
That must just be you personally then. I'm way more afraid of throwing eggs at ZSS. You must be trying to jump through then which is kinda stupid. Eggs work far better vs aerial opponents as opposed to grounded ones. Especially with ZSS's running speed. She can run in and punish us on reaction.
We are none of those characters and our projectile doesn't work work like their projectiles do.
The way you worded this post makes me feel like you haven't exactly gone through this. I might be wrong there.
And this is all I want. Yoshi's anti approach game is AMAZING.
The thing about all of these small strings is that nearly all of them cause you to take counter damage if the Yoshi is paying attention. All he has to do is DJ Nair when he's hit and he'll eat the second hit and punish with his own damage. Yoshi really doesn't get combo'd easily by Kirby unless something really funky happens.
But the basic principle remains: you camp to keep your opponent out, dish out some extra damage, and/or create advantageous positions if they try to approach. So I guess it IS like other people's camping, eh? What else would you camp for besides those three reasons? Just because eggs work differently than grenades or lasers doesn't take away from the fact they're used for the same reasons and on the same instances, which would be 1) when you're safe, and 2) when you can have an effect on your opponent's behavior.
Nah, I got some decent experience. No USA Yoshis though, so you guys being from USA you're gonna have to trust me on this one like how europeans/japanese are trusted when they say they have experience.
It might feel like a very advantageous situation for you, but it also feels for a very advantageous position for me as Kirby. I mean, eggs can't be fired in quick succession like other campers can spam, or fly as fast as their projectiles go. With those facts in mind you can pretty much conclude that avoiding them while having multiple jumps, a decent fastfall, and being floaty on non-fast-fall conditions makes for an easy time avoiding projectiles while in the air... Much better than when having no notable disjoints, projectiles or fast ground-speed like Kirby does, all we can do is run towards you and then you have a disjoint advantage on the ground. We're forced to go to the air eventually, and we feel tons of options open up when we hit the air.
). But enough about that!Hence why he's such a good character, right? Such a big impact in the metagame thanks to his AMAZING anti-approach game right? I mean, you get some distance and some decent advantage and your opponent is now in deep trouble, which is why people consider him quite gay, I'm sure... Sarcasm aside, AMAZING is relative to the person who says it, and I personally feel like his anti-approach game is okay. Nothing special, but it does the job well.
The thing is, the things I named were actual legit combos. As in, you're not out of hitstun by when the next thing hits you. Now, as for actual strings? That's where good judgement comes in. If something will obviously hit Kirby, then I guess after the first or second time Kirby should start thinking of something smarter... Like waiting for Yoshi's action and following up by tracing his landing trajectory if he DJNair'd.
Eh, not as Kirby. There's only a couple of MUs where Kirby is better off in the air than ground, and those include Marth, DDD, Falco, Fox, and whatever else I can't think off the top of my head. We might be slower than on the ground, but our multiple jumps and decent rise/fall speed make it so that it's a great option to go into the air at times. And in my opinion as a Kirby mainer, like I told CelestialMarauder, I prefer being in the air while approaching as long as I do it smartly... Like jumping over them, or airdodging past them straight into the ground and shielding, or whatever else seems possible during the situation...
Typically, Yoshi loses MUs against characters he can't force to approach. Pivot Grab and Usmash alone just cover so many approach options they make me happy.
I don't think I've ever been hit by any of those legit combos and not been able to escape with a counter attack. @_@ Like, both combo hits WILL connect, but the counter ends up causing a trade in most cases. Iunno, maybe the player was doing it wrong. I don't have an incredibly large amount of Kirby experience.
It could just be you. Iunno. In general, Yoshi's anti air game is REALLY good, so I feel comfortable with most opponents being in the air, lol. You might just be doing something to beat the player. I feel like simply character-wise, Yoshi is in a better position if you're in the air. Not to say Kirby has no options, but I feel like it's better for Yoshi.
I disagree, but I can tell we'll be in perpetual disagreement. @_@ It's alright though, I like discussing things like this. Fleshes out ideas and sorta forces you to defend viewpoints you never thought much about, you know?
And you're not bad to discuss things with, unlike some other character boards we've had histories with.
That doesn't even sound like a good idea on paper.
