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Ragnarok Mafia - Game over!

Seikend

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 16, 2007
Messages
415
Just a claim, please. I'd rather go ahead and get it out of the way now so that we can move on to someone else if the claim is believable.
No.

If you think I'm town, then you have no reason to force me to claim. That's horribly anti-town. Place your vote somewhere useful.

@DH

Who did you quote in your #518? What post number is it?
 

#HBC | Dark Horse

Mach-Hommy x Murakami
Joined
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Acrostic. It's a couple of pages back. I didn't quote it because it's much easier to copy and past on my phone
 

Seikend

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 16, 2007
Messages
415
Hmm. Nice catch DH.

@Killstic In your #486 you say you don't like me and that I'm a lynch candidate of yours.

But when I asked you in my #516 if you thought I was scummy or if you wanted me to claim, you said you just wanted me to claim.

Where did your scumread go?
 

Seikend

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 16, 2007
Messages
415
Joeyyyy.

Thoughts on my #523? Do you think it's a legitimate slip from Killstic?
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
Joined
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6,865
You're looking at it with a wrong perspective Seikend.

Killistic wants you to claim so if it's believeable enough, people will unvote you, without it, there's a highly unlikely chance that people will do so, unless you counter it with another wagon or show that you are not the right pick.

while it's bending and a bit of a role-fish, i see the reasons why, i really wish that Killistic stated his reasons for you being town instead of just wanting you to claim and hoping it gets somewhere, i don't like that to be honest.
 

Seikend

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 16, 2007
Messages
415
You're looking at it with a wrong perspective Seikend.

Killistic wants you to claim so if it's believeable enough, people will unvote you, without it, there's a highly unlikely chance that people will do so, unless you counter it with another wagon or show that you are not the right pick.

while it's bending and a bit of a role-fish, i see the reasons why, i really wish that Killistic stated his reasons for you being town instead of just wanting you to claim and hoping it gets somewhere, i don't like that to be honest.
I feel the wagon on me is pri weak honestly and wasn't going to result in a lynch, but meh. Maybe I'm wrong there.

The town read is what's setting the alarm bells off for me now too, yeah.
 

Armor

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jul 21, 2011
Messages
4
This comes off as "playing it safe"

You find me scum, yet you're not going for my lynch because "Most people have a town read on me?"

What a piece of ****.
Unless I'm wrong, I think several people agreed with me about that. So, mind explaining how it's wrong, mr go-against-the-flow
You're saying you didn't like how he played it safe, now you don't like how he's not, and going after you when it's not a popular decision? Bull****.

Also, what notice how J defends kill?

Calls kill noobtown

says my case is stupid

Possible buzzsaw with me and raz.

Really weak.
O_O... The first, and only, legitimate case on J so far.
@J: Response?
/doridori

Could someone quote SOMETHING of Seikend's that's scummy and give some good reasoning? I mean really, nothing seemed strange except his J vote and the stupid crap with tery.
 

Seikend

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 16, 2007
Messages
415
Unvote

Vote: Killstic


I'm quite sure that was a slip from Killstic. J can wait.
 

Dooms

KY/KP Joey
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JO_OEY's vote on raziek looks somewhat like a wagon, but he expressed small suspicions about him in page 27. Not sure whether to
take it as early bandwagoning or not, need to watch JO_OEY some more.


Raziek:

Obviously I don't like his meta fishing or his reasonings for it. I also don't like the fact that his callout early game against T-block was really weak since it was said right after JTB and Raziek didn't go into any details about why he didn't like the reaching or how it was reaching.
236 makes me feel better about meta-fishing before. His reasonings for it were still really bad though.
Wait... 239... was he trying to put pressure on Killstic for posting a summary of DH's play when right before that the hydra was kinda leading into a summary of DH's play? >_>'! I'll admit that more than half of that second paragraph was WIFOM, but the other half was not, and putting it all at wifom makes his attack look WAY weaker. Plus the last line with "FoS DH" looks like another attempt for a weak attack.
241/243 make me feel WAY worse about him. Going into mechanichs about FoS's and stuff looks like trying to fake an attack against Killstic, which is BS. 243 was being dishonest about Killstic's second paragraph. Either he didn't read it thoroughly or hes trying to paint Killstic as scum.
244... fine with his lynch. This post looks like ABSOLUTE GARBAGE. The post said WAY MORE than those 8 words.
The rest of his argument against Killstic looks slightly stronger, but the fact that hes still depending on the same BS as before makes it worse XD.
After that huge BS argument with Killstic... and then backing down right afterwards to say that it was just an annoyance? And that read list? 3rd strongest scum read at this point.

:172:
Do I need more reasoning than this? Sure it was a wagon vote, since I was voting someone that was being wagon'd at the time. Does that mean I didn't have legit reason to jump on or that I don't think hes scum? Uhhh no.

-JO_OEY once again calls Oup scummy, but gives no reasons. Says he will vote soup, this is most likely just to get SOup to not reaction
test J. Disagree with JO_OEY, arguments are a great way to find scum.
Hold on. You're discrediting my stuff against Soup as "bad reasoning" AND saying that I didn't give reasons at all. Read my posts if you're going to say stuff like that. The reasoning doesn't have to be in the voting post if its obviously there. Note: I showed huge distaste for the GLG slot as well, which also means I didn't like Soupa when he came into the game. If you think I'm willing to vote Soupa for no reasons, then you either didn't know that Soupa was replacing into GLG or you just haven't read my posts. Also, I didn't say arguments were bad. I said arguments against players (NOT THE SLOT, PERSONAL PLAYERS) are bad. Now to pull quotes (ugh)!

How I feel about Soupa and GLG (they're the same slot and neither has made me feel better about the other so all points against them still stand):

Theres my summary. Bolded are points against him. I'll pull those three quotes too!



What I don't like about this post is that hes defending Dabuz based on how he would have reacted, but afterwards still put suspicion on Dabuz for it. Poor defense -> casting suspicion = ewwww.



There were quite a few other important things going on at this point, but instead of commenting on those, he commented on this kinda irrelevant thing. I don't see the point of asking anything like this, especially when he was inactive as all hell and didn't comment on that many important things beforehand.



Honestly, I think me not liking this post was me personally agree'ing with what Dark Horse was doing and me seeing the point of what he was doing (or assuming that I saw the point.) Not sure if we were on the same wavelength). I felt like this was a safe attack against Dark Horse, since it wasn't directly accusing him of being scummy, but it was still attacking him for his questions. Plus it looks like an attempt to defend kill since hes calling all of the questions Dark Horse was asking pointless.

:172:
I feel like Soupa is playing like its RVS again... :v.

Yeah I don't feel too well about Soup and he doesn't make me feel any better about GLG at all.

Soup - Can you explain all of your scum reads please? Also your read on Ryker. Your read on Ryker alone makes this list look like you took the names and used a random number generator to place people in that order ._.

:172:
Soupa's points against Raziek are complete and total **** and hes my second strongest scum pick behind Raziek.

That answer your question J? :p

:172:
I'm fine with a Soup lynch.

Soup can you stop being ********? It would be greatly appreciated!

Jk, but still, starting arguments between players (note: players as in not the slot) isn't going to get us anywhere ._.

:172:
Well I already found you scummy before all of this. Starting arguments with people instead of trying to find scum could very well push me into the ways of voting Soupa O_O.

:172:
All of these posts show my thoughts about Soupa/GLG at the current time. The GLG one has quotes in it so I suggest clicking that arrow to get the full feel.

By the way totally catching up!

:172:
 

Raziek

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Just a claim, please. I'd rather go ahead and get it out of the way now so that we can move on to someone else if the claim is believable.
WAT

I don't like this Seikend wagon at all. Completely fine with putting my vote back on Killstic.

vote: Killstic
 

Raziek

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Like really, what if he were to claim VT? What happens then?

"Oh, safeclaim, lynch him."

If he claims anything other than that, we lose a power role. I don't support this.
 

JTB

Live for the applause
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Messages
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Quick question before I leave for work.

@ J and Seikend, assume there wasn no wagon on Killstic. If you could get support for a Soup lynch, would you do it?
 

Dooms

KY/KP Joey
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Wow there is a lot of...silliness in the little section about me. Easy to correct though.

1.) I did not make a case on Soupa, nor did I try to.
2.) How is being friendly scummy? Couldn't two townies be friendly towards each other? Also being friendly/cordial with another person isn't bad, just saying. =P
3.) How would any of my scum-picks flipping scum make me more town to you?

And that's the majority of that. However you repeat I am null-leaning scum twice but that may just be do forgetfulness, but I find it funny for another reason. You spent the most time justifying your read on me whil your stronger scum-picks only get one liners, you also bring up Joey as null-leaning scum but never say why he got that way. Is it because you think Joey and I are connected? If that's the case, the answer is we are not.....yet ;)

*side-note*

But I would like to offer Joey my hand this game. =o Surprising for me, but yes I am pretty confident in Joey this time and the current time see no reason why I shouldn't trust him.

*/side-note*

Why did you write that much about an apparant null you are waffling on?

Can you tell me what you think of Gova?


:172:
 

#HBC | Dark Horse

Mach-Hommy x Murakami
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You're saying you didn't like how he played it safe, now you don't like how he's not, and going after you when it's not a popular decision? Bull****.
He had nothing backing him up, and he mentioned that my case on kill was bull, so it read to me like a buzzsaw.

That's the basic gist.
 

Seikend

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 16, 2007
Messages
415
Quick question before I leave for work.

@ J and Seikend, assume there wasn no wagon on Killstic. If you could get support for a Soup lynch, would you do it?
nope.

Afterwards can you tell me your current opinion of Killstic please? Thanks.
 

JTB

Live for the applause
Premium
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nope.

Afterwards can you tell me your current opinion of Killstic please? Thanks.
The business with his last post is null. I pushed kuz for the same exact thing (trying to get as many claims as he could) in Newbie 12 and he ended up flipping town.

I'll hit you up with a real stance when I get home.
 

Dooms

KY/KP Joey
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I've read.

By the way, J is scum.

Vote: J

Counter-wagon baby, you wanna dance?

your play reeks of trying to horde a bunch of blind sheep into cliffs, you play up to seem active and a 'discussion leader' but really you just ask mundane questions about people and your vote on someone who gave conflict and chase to you, if we're talking about tentative knee-jerks, i'd say that you've done them alot, your vote on Razi, meh, that was alright, i agreed with that, but reading back, you deteroirate what Seikend was attempting to get out of you by basically calling fodder statements like "xD omgus!" or "jee pickin' on lil' ol' me, i haven't even caught up yet! :3c" it would frustrate me too, Seikend's vote was warranted, OMGUS, but warranted.

i've got a question, J, why don't you actually do something besides ask questions, why do i feel you're just hiding behind looking pro-town, but in reality you aren't?

why does looking at your posts make me want to puke?

is your counter-arguement going to be that you've done more then me, that you've lead discussion, blah blah, or is it going to be something of worth, and something you've tooken time to do?

hey seikend, wanna hold my hand?
Your attack on J looks really weak. Look back at the Seikend vs J. The vote really looked like OMGUS since J was just showing suspicion of Seikend and then Seikend pretty much changes his vote right away. It also looks like you're voting him for personal distaste and poor reasoning. He has attacked players and showed how they're scummy as well. Don't act like the only thing hes done is asked questions, because thats not it at all. Seriously this looks SO bad. The second to last statement trying to generalize what his counter-argument will be shows how weak your attack is and just gives you another reason to jump onto him if his counter-argument is that.

:172:
 

Seikend

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 16, 2007
Messages
415
The business with his last post is null. I pushed kuz for the same exact thing (trying to get as many claims as he could) in Newbie 12 and he ended up flipping town.

I'll hit you up with a real stance when I get home.
It's not pushing for claims that's bothering me so much , it's him having me as a scumread, and that turning into a townread 30 posts later out of nowhere.

http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=13194410&postcount=523
 

Dooms

KY/KP Joey
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lolhands. But seriously Joey, you yourself posted your points against buddying early on. Going directly against that raises HUGE red flags.
Fos: Joey
b-b-b-b-but no one has ever asked me to hold hands ;_;

But seriously, I really trust J as a town read, so I have no reason to not be his hand-holding buddy. Plus he made re-read and realize that Raziek is scummy, something I wouldn't have done on my own. Give me two reasons why I shouldn't buddy J that aren't "HES SCUMMY D:!" and I'll reconsider it. Until then, I have no reason not to have J as a hand-holding buddy.

:172:
 

Armor

Smash Rookie
Joined
Jul 21, 2011
Messages
4
He had nothing backing him up, and he mentioned that my case on kill was bull, so it read to me like a buzzsaw.

That's the basic gist.
I agree to that case against him, but that's not relevant to your quote. You didn't like him making a decision because it was popular, then you didn't like his unpopular decision just because it went against you. It's self-serving crap.
 

Dooms

KY/KP Joey
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Joeyyyy.

Thoughts on my #523? Do you think it's a legitimate slip from Killstic?
Wow... Nice catch.

Seriously. That was really smart. The fact that Kill doesn't want to lynch you but has you as a scum read really is suspicious. O_O

I think its a legitimate slip, yes.

:172:
 

Killstic

Smash Rookie
Joined
Aug 5, 2011
Messages
21
Hi hi! Acrostic here. Will try to catch-up as soon as possible. Apologies for coming back with the deadline so close.
 

#HBC | Dark Horse

Mach-Hommy x Murakami
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I agree to that case against him, but that's not relevant to your quote. You didn't like him making a decision because it was popular, then you didn't like his unpopular decision just because it went against you. It's self-serving crap.
The main point of that was how J didn't back it up, not the he attacked me.

Joey, I wouldn't say so. I attacked soup in the same post I attacked j, and just recenly attacked kill for something.
 

Armor

Smash Rookie
Joined
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Messages
4
b-b-b-b-but no one has ever asked me to hold hands ;_;

But seriously, I really trust J as a town read, so I have no reason to not be his hand-holding buddy. Plus he made re-read and realize that Raziek is scummy, something I wouldn't have done on my own. Give me two reasons why I shouldn't buddy J that aren't "HES SCUMMY D:!" and I'll reconsider it. Until then, I have no reason not to have J as a hand-holding buddy.

:172:

Well, I suppose *based on the argument against buddying that i don't feel like pulling up* that it just shows how strongly you think J is town.
/doridori
Care to bring support for an argument against J-wagon? I'm finding a lot of legitimacy in DH's few points against J.
 

T-block

B2B TST
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Guys, Killstic has been playing this safe, non-confrontational style all game long.

His tendency to justify things after the fact (and poorly) shows he is faking content. He states in 166 that my 122 seems forced, and both DH and I ask him to explain. In 171, he says the question at the end "irks" him, and that it seemed forced because "turning it into a question seemed inappropriate and his explanation on dabuz seemed scattered based on [his] criticism for the lack of clarity in #163". There is no criticism of clarity in 163 from what I can see, and I don't see how anyone would jump to the conclusion that asking questions = forced, especially from a player they've never seen before. This very much looks like fabrication of reasoning after the fact.

Moreover, in 163 he says dabuz's 95 is important, and then extracts two nulls from it. It's only after he is confronted that he provides any reasoning (171, 179). With such a conclusion, why wouldn't you state it when you first mention it? I can't see any reason to delay the actual conclusion, and I doubt we would have seen it from him at all if others hadn't asked him about it.

In 128 he puts an FoS on me for asking a question without giving my opinion. He votes me in 144 for that reason. Then in 227 when he's been confronted for that, he says it was just for pressure, implying there was never anything scummy about it in the first place. Yet in 179 he openly states 122 was scummy, and still in the same post he says he sees nothing from me that makes me scum. He unvotes in 230... seems to have a null read at this point.

But then, I question his use of the chainsaw accusation which comes in post 234, where he says Dark Horse has been attacking the people attacking me, and calling him scummy because of it. Does this not imply he thinks we're scummates? From 299 it's clear he knows what a chainsaw is.

Now, nothing new on me until 284, when he says he "still" doesn't like me. Still? His reasoning here is my response to earlier pressure and the fact that I took forever o respond to several questions. Where did this come from? I didn't see any mention of this in previous posts, and this comes out of the blue. Moreover, he qualifies this read here by saying there's not enough scumminess to be clamoring for a lynch. He's staying totally safe. His read on me has been hopping around quite a bit, and it's impossible to follow his reasoning for it, as it's simply not present.

486 is more overly safe stuff. He leaves a back door with every single read.

Then there's the whole Seikend issue that we're in right now.

Yeah... this is the play of the day imo.
 

Dabuz

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Ok, so, lol cause i fell asleep when responding to J's post last night. Ill get to stuff later, but, WTF just happened? It looks like everyone is in their own conversation, some people want to vote DH, others for killstic, someone is going for J or Seikend, urgh, someone summarize please? Im confused
 

Dooms

KY/KP Joey
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Ugh. Neither lynch looks good :/. Anyone care to quote why one of those two is scummy? O_O

Armor: I'm not going to fight J's battles for him. Which means that I'm not going to respond to Dark Horse saying how wrong he is until J gets to say how wrong he is.

:172:
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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Your attack on J looks really weak. Look back at the Seikend vs J. The vote really looked like OMGUS since J was just showing suspicion of Seikend and then Seikend pretty much changes his vote right away. It also looks like you're voting him for personal distaste and poor reasoning. He has attacked players and showed how they're scummy as well. Don't act like the only thing hes done is asked questions, because thats not it at all. Seriously this looks SO bad. The second to last statement trying to generalize what his counter-argument will be shows how weak your attack is and just gives you another reason to jump onto him if his counter-argument is that.

:172:
It's a tip of the iceberg, this is just a small fraction of what bugs me about J, but i wanted to show some sort of thought-process behind it, a case will be made in some time, but this is my GENERAL disliking for J, weak or not.

my goal wasn't to get the lynch on J, but to show a dis-taste, so yes, in a way i am attacking J in that matter, aforemention, the semantics will be dealt with later.
I do have a question, though, how do you take J's buddying and offerings?

do you feel J is being selective with who he buddies, and who he hunts?

tell me your general opinion, do you feel J is using his classical AtE scheme to gain more populous among townies?

why, why not?

I disagree that Killistic has slipped, but i have stated other reasons for not liking them, if people want to vote Killistic by a slip, fine by me, but i prefer an old fashioned way of doing things.

I'm going to wait for Killistic to explain himself.
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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Raziek, your opinion of J?

also, you stated that buddying is anti-town, is this going to affect the answer i get from you?

consider this an ultimatum question.
 

Raziek

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Raziek, your opinion of J?

also, you stated that buddying is anti-town, is this going to affect the answer i get from you?

consider this an ultimatum question.
I first thought him Town, but some of the points regarding his questioning and AtE are beginning to change my opinion. I'm less comfortable with him right now, but I wouldn't agree with his lynch over Killstic.

Just because I believe buddying is anti-Town won't necessarily change my answer. I've seen J do it in the past as Town, so I'm not going to call him scum for it. I don't like it, but I can't stop it.
 

#HBC | ѕoup

The world is not beautiful, therefore it is.
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could you explain your town-read on him before the recent questioning?

i feel this is the same trap Joey is falling into, he states that he likes J for what he does on the surface that is indeed pro-town manner, but needs to look at who/why J is pressuring, AFAIK, his first vote was you, for reasons stated, then Seikend, someone who confronted him, it's all kneejerk in my opinion, but this a parrot of things already said.

bonus question: how do you feel about J's vote on you? how do you feel about mine?

besides Killistic, where would your vote go toDay if something else happened?
 

Raziek

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Can you clarify "recent"? As in a post number perhaps?

J's vote on me feels kind of hypocritical, considering he's voting me largely because I was pressuring Killstic based on meta and playstyle, yet that's J's primary reason for voting me, unless I'm mistaken.

I didn't even notice you were voting me, I kinda skimmed to catch up.

I could be persuaded to vote for J, not sure who else at this exact second.
 
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