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The Official Marth Video Critique Thread

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jays0nnn

jays0nnn

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Shaya said:
jays0nnn:

0:11 - Fsmash = bad
0:20 - Fsmash = bad
0:49 - Bad DI = bad
0:54 - Fsmash = bad
0:55 - Dsmash = bad
1:00 - Fsmash = haha oh how. So, 1 in 4 hits...
1:10 - Dsmash = bad
1:14 - Fsmash = could have done better with a dtilt/dancing blade
1:24 - The hell was that? Also, upsmash = bad.
1:36 - Dash attack = why?
1:41 - The hell? Was this on wifi?
1:44 - Grab'd = Bad. Why did you let him pummel you for so long?
1:53 - Fsmash = bad
1:58 - A dair = Bad
2:03 - A dair = good
2:14 - A dair = Bad CHOICE.
2:38 - Dash attack = bad.

Protip = Dtilt, Ftilt, Grab moar.

But seriously, your move choices were terrible. And if it was on wifi why'd you post it?
You dash attack for no reason... what the hell.
Click to expand...
this match was in person lol i was trying to pivot but i guess i keep getting it to come out with the dash attack when i want to fitilt or fsmash. 1:41 part was like i donno wtf happen there plus i let him pummel me so long because i knew i was going to lose the match really bad against aznforce. i only want to record this so i can try to see where i can improve on and what you do recommend if you were in the same situation as me at that point. But thanks for hte advice dude, i think i improve on some of these if i have time from work and school
 
feardragon64

feardragon64

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feardragon64

feardragon64

Smash Champion
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Messages
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Critiquing myself. Double post Please still critique me.

Snake video:

(0:05) Stupid, unnecessary rolls.
(0:12) More rolling. Stop rolling.
(0:14) Approaching with dancing blades. Bad.
(0:31) whiffed shield breaker
(0:37) more rolling
(0:49) Should have ledge-hopped or rolled on
(1:09-1:16) More rolling and poor spacing, followed by standing on a mine stupidly?
(1:44) More bad spacing
(1:58) Grabbing at nothing?
(2:03) More grabbing at nothing?
(2:18) Bad spacing again, even though fair hits.
(2:35) Fast fall to death. Stupid wifi lag.

MK match

(0:04) Bad spacing, get caught in the nado and unnecessary ds.
(0:16) Stop rolling behind opponent
(0:19) Should have dtilted or tried to get out of there.
(0:22) Messed up recovery
(0:28) Angry fsmash. lol
(0:34) Don't challenge mk in the air.
(0:40) Lag. Landed on stage.
(1:05) Bad DI.
(1:19) Stop trying to approach mk
(1:49) ^
(1:54) Poorly spaced fsmash
(1:59) Why counter?
(2:04) Dash attack.....ew
(2:30) Metaghey + lag = ds'ing too late


Overall:
-Stop rolling so much
-Need better spacing
-Dancing blade spamming at times
-Don't dtilt so many times in a row if they're not hitting
-Stop throwing out attacks for no reason if they're clearly not going to hit
-Camp with fairs properly
-Don't approach with dancing blade
-Learn to spotdodge(hardly bothered because it's wifi)
-Don't approach metaghey
-Stop sucking
-Stop sucking

I'm missing a bunch of stuff but that's the gist of it I think.
 
Retroking2000

Retroking2000

Smash Master
Joined
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Messages
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MK is too fast , one misguided/slow thought could be the death of you ,

this seems like general advice just think of your second move while doing your first .
especially online since most stuff you intend to do backfires - although since it was online the delayed frames sort of gave you time to think your attacks through you hardly messed up .
But since MK is faster timmy outplayed you , especially with the tilts/Dair .(heres a tip that i do with my marth tilt your shield backwards , so that you space your shield although MK is fast he hardly has range on his sword) also the dair well timmy likes(;p) to come after you when your recovering low to recovering high with neutralB/or by using your second jump eariler atleast he wont Dair you to death also you can play the airdodging game with him lawl .
very decent marth indeed ;)
there was a major problem when i saw that match Timmy's MK had no problem getting inside your range.
try your best to keep him out ,

if you feel like you cant get away spam grab , Grab has ( i think) Armour frame if you grab during the attack full comes out , sure you will take the % but you will be alive . During i did see attempted spacing ,
but i saw that your jumps were not fully spaced , but your fairs were semi-spaced ,

remember space you jumps to space your fairs . jump back /cstick forward

one tip that european styles have . we spam a air so it gets weak , so we can combo on it

spam fairs , so that you can do fair to tippers :)

very decent marth indeed ,

i would say more but i dont want to leek my secrets . :p
 
-Nana-

-Nana-

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Apr 7, 2008
Messages
496
Location
Wolcott, CT
Well for starters you roll too much and at times are too aggressive when it's unnecessary in that specific situation. You should try working on studying your opponents' pattern in matches. It's the most important part of playing IMO. A lot of the things he did especially as Snake were predictable and easily punished. There are also certain things that you did that could've been avoided.

2nd match- 00:30- your side b combo was shielded and punished. That could've been avoided. His shield was low so what you could've done which works well in a lot of situations is slow down your side b and end it with the down combo. This gives time for your opponents shield to depriciate so you can break it and get the hits in or they may let go of their shield. Also if you see yourself being shielded stop the side be and dash back, grab or jump away.

00:32- MK starts to combo you and you continually try to fight back in the air when his offense is stronger than yours. Being defense sometimes works the best especially in a situation like that. Retreat and re-collect yourself.

1:37, 41, 46- You could have up B'd him out of the tornado.

Lastly I would also say work on juggling with Marth because he's great at it. He's up throw works wonders with utilt and uair especially against heavy/fast-falling characters like Snake.
 
Ulevo

Ulevo

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feardragon64 said:
I'm going to break the wifi rule.
Because the only other person I can play is someone who doesn't even know what a tilt is.

Match 1: ZMT(Snake) vs WTF?(Marth)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWqYAxzM1_c

Match 2: ZMT(MK) vs WTF?(Marth)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CLDFQytU__4

Notes:
About 20frames of lag
Lots of stupid mistakes
I would have lost despite wifi lag.

Thanks zmt for recording =]
Click to expand...
As pointed out previously, you roll far too much. You should rarely roll ever, if at all. You're in close quarters too much as well, and your aggression messes up your spacing. You do not seem to really assess the match ups, and go by instinct. Things like Meta Knights DThrow - USmash should never happen. DI backwards and get ready to tech roll to avoid a follow up. It's things like that that you have to be constantly thinking about it a match.

Just some general critiques.
 
Z

zCasanova

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Messages
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Loser's and grand finals from last week's tourney.

Same Snake that beat me in the grand finals beat me in the winner's finals.

Tear me apart, tell me what I'm doing wrong vs. Snake, getting 3-0'd in the finals is embarrassing.

~LOSER'S FINALS~

Devin (Marth) vs. JMan (Sonic)

R1 - Forgot to record ;)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v9naJOT9mq8 - R2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mnKacgC-s1w - R3
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0kRkmJxLD7E - R4

~GRAND FINALS~

Ali (Snake) vs. Devin (Marth)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gB1fmqO2J5Y - R1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPQacvOwTCY - R2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8iv3cNVcDM0 - R3
 
Steel

Steel

Where's my Jameson?
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Casanova:

Match 1:

:46, you hit his shield with a fair, but then you just let him walk towards you as you hold up your shield and spot dodge randomly and get hit with an ftilt

:50, recovering mistake here, don't just jump once you get hit in a situation like this. it's safest to recover low

:59, why aren't you picking up that grenade? you could have easily glide tossed it at him and punished his nikita missile attack

1:07, you are letting him grenade camp you far too easily. If you see a grenade you are just waiting for it to blow up

1:26, should have thrown him up to get some % on him, instead you just whiff two fairs in front of his face

1:30, you should have punished the ftilt, instead you brought up your shield after your spot dodge and you were too late. you also didn't bother to slow down the dancing blade or anything, shouldn't have been hard since he shielded the whole thing

2:12... back throw? you just threw him onto center stage and lose your stock to an up tilt

2:26, you punish his missed tilt with an... ftilt. there are better faster options here. dsmash being one

2:30, he's on the corner of the stage, but you're just throwing your sword a character length away from him. you fail to apply pressure and he escapes with an up b.

-------

It's true you have to play very patient against Snake, but you were just standing there letting him throw grenades at you for the majority of the match. You weren't even using his nades against him. Pick it up, glide toss towards him, rush at him with your shield and let it blow up in his face, etc. Don't just wait behind a grenade and let him throw more **** at you.

Your grab game knowledge is severely lacking, not ONCE did I see an up throw. Not ONCE did I notice you try and juggle him. If anything, you just did a back throw. Back throw is terrible and usually lets your opponent land on his feet. Use your grabs to put your opponent in a bad position, don't just grab for the hell of it.

You seemed to play very scared vs Snake. You let him do something and then you would try and react. A lot of times there was just random shielding that would normally get you punished. You failed to apply pressure when it was needed and there were multiple times you did not punish appropriately.
 
Steel

Steel

Where's my Jameson?
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Feardragon:

vs MK

:04, you dash and jump right into his tornado.. then up b for no reason

:16, he fails to punish your roll

:23, you waited forever to up b and kill yourself

:36, you get hit by his up smash then jump right back towards him and eat a fair

:38, you jump off the platform and run right into his nair

:44, you put your shield up, why did you take it down? you eat a glide attack

1:00, your dair should have been punished

Everyone else pretty much covered it, i didn't see anything new. Your opponent failed to punish you for quite a few things that offline probably would have been punished. You got gimped way too easily, but I guess that's just him being a better player than you.

I dunno, can't really critique wifi that accurately. It's awkward to watch.
 
S.B.Soldier

S.B.Soldier

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pretty good marth Sora_Kurisu.. just work on some of your speed a bit only because zelda landed some hits she shouldnt have landed... I'm not as good at critiquing as the rest of you but its not like you'd be an easy win for any of us ya know... if it was out of ten your roughly 7.0

**anybody watch my vid I NEED critique before TGA tourney this weekend!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZNGMkuo74M
 
Sora_Kurisu

Sora_Kurisu

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S.B.Soldier said:
pretty good marth Sora_Kurisu.. just work on some of your speed a bit only because zelda landed some hits she shouldnt have landed... I'm not as good at critiquing as the rest of you but its not like you'd be an easy win for any of us ya know... if it was out of ten your roughly 7.0

**anybody watch my vid I NEED critique before TGA tourney this weekend!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZNGMkuo74M
Click to expand...
yeah i know but the match was in wifi and the lag messed up my air dodging and other stuff.
 
grandmaster192

grandmaster192

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Joined
Apr 27, 2008
Messages
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Minnesota:
3DS FC
3196-5457-3748
Sora_Kurisu said:
Can you guys rate my marth.

Katsu(Marth) vs. SKSK(Zelda)
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Your Marth lack basic fundamentals, Sora.

You need to get back to the basics and learn how to play from the inside out. There are too many times you give up your positioning advatage by rolling. Rolling is not very good, and it only works well on wifi. Additionally, you spot dodged a lot where Marth's shield game would have worked very well. In fact, you hardly punished out of your shield at all. Examples are -- you would approach with an aerials; however, when it missed, you would spot dodge things like Zelda fsmash. And, on top of that, you failed to punish out of your spot dodge almost every single time. If you would have shielded instead, you would have had far more options that would have been 100% sure punishment. You could have easily done an up b out of shield against pretty much all of Zelda attacks. There's really no way Zelda should be touching Marth's shield without taking punishment, I'm not sure if that's even possible.

Your spacing and decision making could use work as well. Even if you are aggressively attacking, you want to stay behind Marth's sword in a safe position where he can attack constantly without being attacked back. But you opted to do shot hop double fairs, which put you in a bad position. Instead of doing that, try fairing while moving backwards and fast fall it. This will give you more control, which means more attack options.

Look around these forums, read guides, ask questions, and you WILL improve a lot. Your Marth will be so much better just by simply learning Marth's bacis tactics.
 
Sora_Kurisu

Sora_Kurisu

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grandmaster192 said:
Your Marth lack basic fundamentals, Sora.

You need to get back to the basics and learn how to play from the inside out. There are too many times you give up your positioning advatage by rolling. Rolling is not very good, and it only works well on wifi. Additionally, you spot dodged a lot where Marth's shield game would have worked very well. In fact, you hardly punished out of your shield at all. Examples are -- you would approach with an aerials; however, when it missed, you would spot dodge things like Zelda fsmash. And, on top of that, you failed to punish out of your spot dodge almost every single time. If you would have shielded instead, you would have had far more options that would have been 100% sure punishment. You could have easily done an up b out of shield against pretty much all of Zelda attacks. There's really no way Zelda should be touching Marth's shield without taking punishment, I'm not sure if that's even possible.

Your spacing and decision making could use work as well. Even if you are aggressively attacking, you want to stay behind Marth's sword in a safe position where he can attack constantly without being attacked back. But you opted to do shot hop double fairs, which put you in a bad position. Instead of doing that, try fairing while moving backwards and fast fall it. This will give you more control, which means more attack options.

Look around these forums, read guides, ask questions, and you WILL improve a lot. Your Marth will be so much better just by simply learning Marth's bacis tactics.
Click to expand...
thank you for the advice. Ill take this advice to heart and try to remember everything you say and hopefully ill be able to beat this zelda next time we play.
 
3xSwords

3xSwords

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S.B.Soldier said:
pretty good marth Sora_Kurisu.. just work on some of your speed a bit only because zelda landed some hits she shouldnt have landed... I'm not as good at critiquing as the rest of you but its not like you'd be an easy win for any of us ya know... if it was out of ten your roughly 7.0

**anybody watch my vid I NEED critique before TGA tourney this weekend!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dZNGMkuo74M
Click to expand...
.......seriously man. We want real matches not practice vids, but fine.

There is only one thing to say to this. And that is your Marth needs A LOT of work. I can only point out one thing, and that was spacing. You're playing like a lvl 3 cpu and all you do is fair 90% of the time and only 15% of them actually tipper. Judging from your lack of a solid grip on Marth's spacing, I can also say your gameplay overall would be lacking, and it is only due to the content of the video that I can not tell you the rest of your mistakes.

That said, get a read match. And gl at the tourney.
 
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