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Scar talks Lean Melee [2012YotF]

Scar

Scar

#HarveyDent
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
6,066
Location
Sunnyvale, CA
Or even just a grab from Peach, or getting knocked offstage vs Jiggs. That generally means 30% damage or death, respectively.
 
K

Kike_Ichigo

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
56
Actully most of the Times..... Falcon Off Stage = 1 Stock Less... Falcon has the worst Recovery in the Game... but Is fixed with his Easy ombo Starters and his Killer Knee.

Scar I have followed your advices Vs Doc Mario that you give me xD... Thx a lot It Works very well xD, now I Need advices Vs a MatchUp I didnt see in This Thread... What can I do against an IC´s?... I mean... I was just Camping and waiting for a Boost/Dair... and it works at lows % to a Knee yes... but when I fall in the F**ing Trap of the Shield > Dsmash I just get OWNED so... any another advice for **** an ICs? It will help xD
 
M

Meverse

Smash Cadet
Joined
Oct 23, 2008
Messages
41
Location
Mexico,Canada
Kike_Ichigo said:
Actully most of the Times..... Falcon Off Stage = 1 Stock Less... Falcon has the worst Recovery in the Game... but Is fixed with his Easy ombo Starters and her Killer Knee.

Scar I have followed your advices Vs Doc Mario that you give me xD... Thx a lot It Works very well xD, now I Need advices Vs a MatchUp I didnt see in This Thread... What can I do against an IC´s?... I mean... I was just Camping and waiting for a Boost/Dair... and it works at lows % to a Knee yes... but when I fall in the F**ing Trap of the Shield > Dsmash I just get OWNED so... any another advice for **** an ICs? It will help xD
Click to expand...
n my friends say that falcon is cheap cuz of his knee and speed >.>
 
K

Kike_Ichigo

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
56
Maybe cause They doesnt abuse the Bad Recover of Falcon... until they discover that... Use and ABUSE Falcon more that you can trust me you will miss that Days xD....
 
Scar

Scar

#HarveyDent
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
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Location
Sunnyvale, CA
lol Falcon is cheap, but nowhere near as cheap as other good characters.

Anyways I personally don't know the IC matchup too well, if you get grabbed by good ICs you do die, though. Their cg is inescapable for CF. So rule number 1 is: don't get grabbed.

Their smash attacks and edgeguards are extremely gay vs CF, and the fact that almost everything combos into grab (dasha, uair, utilt, low% usmash) means that you have your work cut out for you. But the matchup is winnable, and there are few ICs with that kind of vs. Falcon knowledge.

Kneeing their shield is a pretty good idea because the hitstun is too much for them to shieldgrab, do this to apply pressure. Try to land behind them with all of your aerials. Be very safe with grabs. I always just dair Nana over and over, if I hit her I dair her back down, then dair her back up, then knee and edgeguard her.

Falcon is one of the most gifted Nana rapists in Smash, abuse that because both ICs beat CF IMO.

Also, raptor boost is not always shieldgrabbed, which is good to know.
 
Reaver197

Reaver197

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 30, 2006
Messages
1,287
Well, I do as well, much more preferable over, say, Dreamland or Final Destination.

Having platforms also helps with jumping around and avoiding grabs.
 
K

Kike_Ichigo

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
56
I prefer Dreamland 64 to IC cause it helps in recovery moment for not been FSmashed/DSmashed xD... it helps alot.... and another.... I fight today with my friend and he mains Samus.... It takes me too long to see what I have too do.... (more grabs in this case) but.... almost what kind of % I have too do uair > Knee? sometims works for me sometimes no... U_U
 
Scar

Scar

#HarveyDent
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
6,066
Location
Sunnyvale, CA
CF ***** Samus, there is really not much she can do to him besides nair, which won't hit you if you are smart. Her quick smash attacks can be annoying but if she spams them, just camp your shield more. You can punish a shielded fsmash or dsmash by knee, which combos into knee with survival DI.

Just be fast, she's a big target, uair to knee is nice but with good DI you won't see much of them. Learn to edgeguard her, it's not that hard, just don't get mindgamed too bad.. more experience and you'll ****.
 
K

Kike_Ichigo

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
56
I see you need to know how to do Gentleman Cancell, because if you just do de first 2 punchs she will do de Dsmash and **** you Up... Its so annoying... and yes... I played against an IC and all I can do is Spam Dair/Boost > Knee and repeat xD
 
Bullet Bill

Bullet Bill

Smash Master
Joined
Feb 9, 2007
Messages
3,734
Location
UK - Southampton
Falcon dittos advice? I'm new to falcon and ont sure what combo's best. Whats the general game plan I should be going for anyway? Just look for grabs, Dairs?
 
J

JonaDiaper

Smash Champion
Joined
Jun 8, 2007
Messages
2,138
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Port Chester, New York
tech chasing if your good at it, dair to grab at low percents, raptor boost to grab, everything to grab until you can dair knee or you can try to gimp with weak knees for recovery. stay on the edge when they are trying to recover, then ledgehop knee or u air or dair depending on how far away they are.
 
Scar

Scar

#HarveyDent
Joined
Feb 11, 2007
Messages
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Location
Sunnyvale, CA
Magus420 said:
Tilt down & towards + Hold L/R and mash A.
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This is definitely the best way to deal with jab canceling, but honestly you can just roll away and start to dair her again. Samus really can't do anything when you're above her besides upB, which is just annoying but does no real damage. My general gameplan vs Samus is to get above her after she throws out a nair, then dair the crap out of her.

Bullet Bill said:
Falcon dittos advice? I'm new to falcon and ont sure what combo's best.
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Falcon dittos are a contest of dashdance nairs. Granted some people will be so good at the match that they will outprioritize your nairs with uairs or god forbid a knee, but by and large you're just going to run back and forth until you think it's a good time to jump at the other person and kick.

If the other person nairs first, it's your job to either shieldgrab it or run away and grab him after he lands, or maybe punish his lag with a nair of your own. But either way, once someone hits with a nair, it'll either combo into grab or you'll start all over again.

From the grab, you tech chase. Comboing is hard to do in dittos but it's all DI dependent. You get someone who likes to DI your nairs down and away, then there's literally no followup at any percent. Even a uair DI'd down and away will be hard to hit with a full-speed nair.

But if someone DIs into your combos, CF can juggle himself as well as anyone else but either your aerials need to come out really fast or your opponent's DI must be for survival purposes.
 
JBM falcon08

JBM falcon08

Smash Master
Joined
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glenwood iowa
Samus's wavedash is too good though. if she sees the roll happening or expects it then she can continue to do it.

Magus i do that, but i play marth so i didn't know if his(falcon) grab range was good enough for a samus who spaces her jabs well.
 
K

Kike_Ichigo

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
56
In Dittos You need too look is Grabs and Tech-Chase, Dthrow againts C. Falcon is annoying because if you dont Tech the other C. Falcon will Hit you in the Floor for been a Fast-Faller, and if you Tech, is too slow so probably you will get Tech-Grabed again.... the Trick is be more Smarter... you need too Make your Enemy to do a Mistake and abuse of that Mistake.... and abuse the Bad Thing of C. Falcon (obviusly you know that Bad things cause you play with the Same Player so you must know more about your character than your Oponent)... so... Basically is

Tech-Grab, Tech-Chase and Mindgames... in a Ditto both players have 50 - 50 for win.... the difference makes who moves better the Character so.... another advice.... Practice a lot you game with C. Falcon... and you will see how it makes more Easy too Fight in a Ditto ^^
 
Scar

Scar

#HarveyDent
Joined
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Messages
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Well, some people are bad at tech chasing grabs (me) and so they rely on nair combos and dair>**** combos at mid percents to the eventual uthrow knee ftw. It's style-dependent but yes Kike_Ichigo, I can see that you really like to tech chase regrab people haha. CF is the easiest to do it on.
 
K

Kike_Ichigo

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
56
I love do that but with Floatis that is another story XD... yesterday I Played against a Peach and I was like " **** No tech-grab... well lets do Nair" and my other friend who play with Fox/Sheik said too me "Are you playing different right" cause he only see me Fight with Tech-Chase/grab Hahahaha... the bad thing is I dont have too much experience against a Peach so some times I winn with 2-0 and some times I lose with the same Score >_< xD
 
DtJ Jungle

DtJ Jungle

Check out my character in #GranblueFantasy
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dont use alternates...just get as good as you can and as knowledgable as you can about the matchups :)
 
K

Kike_Ichigo

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
56
Well for me... Falco os Harder than Sheik... and Sheik is Harder than fox.... just in my case i dont know Scar or another CF xD
 
Scar

Scar

#HarveyDent
Joined
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Messages
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Location
Sunnyvale, CA
Ryzol said:
Who makes a good alt for CF, so falco and sheik are more manageable battles?
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CF's weaknesses aren't really complemented by any other character, just because his weaknesses are (HELLO) Fox/Falco/Sheik. They are the best characters in the game. If I had to pick up an alt it would definitely be Fox, but honestly picking up either Falco or Sheik would probably be the best idea. I think Falco wins vs Sheik so just get incredible with Falco, ditto people and use him vs Sheik and don't get gimped.

This is of course assuming you don't want to learn Marth vs Sheik, Marth is an okay idea but objectively I'd say no.

CF 4 lyfe

Kike_Ichigo said:
Well for me... Falco os Harder than Sheik... and Sheik is Harder than fox.... just in my case i dont know Scar or another CF xD
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I agree, Sheik and Fox are about equal but the difference is that mid-level Foxes are easier than mid-level sheiks, but high level I think the opposite might be true. Sheik is more frustrating without a doubt.

Meverse said:
scar, how du u practice tech chasing??
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I've found it to be extremely difficult to tech chase computers, mostly because they never tech throws. If you really want to practice, get a friend who plays Fox/Falco/Falcon and every time you grab, just uthrow or dthrow tech chase.

It's frustrating if you miss and get punished for it since you're just working on something new and you don't want to lose for it (surely), so if you can get them to let you tech chase them for a good 10 minutes you'll be way better than before.
 
K

Kike_Ichigo

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
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Recomendation... Is easy too tech-chase a Falco/Fox if you Utrhow In Low and Middel % cause It gives him more chance too Tech-Roll... and Tech roll have less recovery in comparation with Tech in the same place... if a Falco Tech in the Same place.. or Fox, will easy jab/shine you.... but with a Roll you have more time too think where and catch them with a Stomp/Re-grab xD.... with Falcon... es almost the same but Falcon is more easy to Tech-Grab for his slow Tech-Roll xD
 
J

Ja

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Aug 4, 2007
Messages
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Location
Greenville, SC. Hit me up for melee
Meverse said:
scar, how du u practice tech chasing??
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What I did was I watched videos of CF v. Spacies, and counted techs. I'd then watch vids and try to predict techs. I'm not sure if counting techs is the best way to tech chase, but at least you're paying attention to how they tech. I'm not good at tech chasing, but I am slightly less sucky.
 
papermarkis

papermarkis

Smash Lord
Joined
Sep 23, 2007
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A-Town, Kansas City
Kike_Ichigo said:
Scar see this fight and tell me what I have to do for make me better xD

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_cd4Jrgpeb0
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I know I'm not scar, but I'll give you some help.

Too many bairs and dairs. Dairs really only good when you tech chase it, it makes a horrible approach and you tried to approach with it many times. Also your bairs seem really random.

You also need some tech skill paractice. A lot of missed WDs, some dash attacks that were likely suppose to be nairs, and d-smashes that likely were suppose to be dairs.

I didn't see any tech chasing or grabbing except to do a knee. The entire basis of Falcon's game is tech chase grabbing so that's definitely something you want to try to do more often. You mostly tried to get lucky hits in and combo off of them instead of doing the more guaranteed and safe tech chasing. Also, when you combo'd I didn't see you ever use uair. Uair is a really combo move.
 
K

Kike_Ichigo

Smash Cadet
Joined
Sep 6, 2007
Messages
56
Thx all help is good.. yes I know most of de Dsmash were supposed to be Dair... sometimes when I get presion of the Opponent ( Sheik and Falco most ) I feel the pressure and... Makes me get Mistakes... but Thx... and the Grab thing was cause Sheik Has an Horrible recovery with her Nais so... Is most of the Time imposible for tech chase... and her roll is so ****ing ****... but Ill try more grabs know and see when and how to do it Thx xD
 
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