Scar talks Lean Melee [2012YotF]

Scar · Mar 27, 2009

idk ill check

more on CF: DK stinks and I don't like him

my advice, play vs low tiers all the same. camp their balls off even though you don't like to play like that, dthrow cg works on basically everyone at low %s, if it doesnt then dthrow knee does and if not then dthrow tech chase works

go for safe, reliable, gay combos

PolMex23 · Mar 27, 2009

...my joke didnt reach your taste?...=(

Pakman · Mar 27, 2009

I do not have anything else except for some hungry box sets.

Leviathan741 · Mar 27, 2009

Alright here is the link to that video. plz enjoy and critique.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-u07X9ft1Y

TheManaLord · Mar 27, 2009

Scar said:
idk ill check

more on CF: DK stinks and I don't like him

my advice, play vs low tiers all the same. camp their balls off even though you don't like to play like that, dthrow cg works on basically everyone at low %s, if it doesnt then dthrow knee does and if not then dthrow tech chase works

go for safe, reliable, gay combos

Yeah, I have the most trouble with random low tiers, it's the only reason I don't like falcon as a main. I'd rather play v a good fox and struggle then a decent ness and just not know what to do.

Faithkeeper · Mar 27, 2009

Captain Falcon741 said:
Alright here is the link to that video. plz enjoy and critique.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-u07X9ft1Y

I watched all three matches. I'm not yet what I would consider "good" (even at the local level) but I can offer advice I think would be beneficial.

First I'll say what you did well:
You seem to have a decent grasp of the basic AT's that are essential to playing well, this is a good foundation to build on.
your dash danceing was very pretty, and you flowed well throughout all the matches (although with people that will not be as easy)

Improvements:
Really try to find real people to play, fighting cpu's is getting you into bad habits.

The knee is not a good approach. It's a good punisher, and nice to combo into, but a human will not let you run up and knee them.

Same thing with raptor boost, you can get it occasionally or as a tech chase, but real opponents will easily avoid it and punish.

I noticed you used the get up attack to get off the ledge most times. I wouldn't recommend this so much. If you are edgehogging , roll off edge is better. To attack an opponent off the edge, try ledgehoping a nair or uair, or if you are feeling lucky, even a knee.

Off-stage edguarding is very flashy, but against people is VERY risky, especially against certain characters.

Did you notice how ganon always DI'd back from the raptor boost, people mix up their DI, so forwardb>knee isn't always that automatic, you need to read their DI.

Overall, I think you've got the basics down well, find some real people to play and it shouldn't be much of a struggle to fix any potential problems I saw. Other people will be able to tell you more.

(note: If you [the reader] disagree with anything I said, say so, and I'm probably wrong. You can then effectively help two people (cf741 and myself) )

metashinryu · Mar 27, 2009

yeah last part i will take:i know some ppl that fear the knee to no end and so you can use it as a mindgame by approaching(they will roll out of fear just reacting and well...)

Leviathan741 · Mar 27, 2009

First of all what is the raptor boost and what and how do you do ledgehopping. Oh by the way scar can you plz look at it and tell me wut u think and anyone else willing to look at it.

metashinryu · Mar 27, 2009

raptor boost is the sides+b move,the one that makes an uppercut or something like that and puts em on fire sending them up

ledgehopping is pressing away of an edge and quickly jumping to the stage,preferably with an aerial XD

Faithkeeper · Mar 27, 2009

metashinryu said:
raptor boost is the sides+b move,the one that makes an uppercut or something like that and puts em on fire sending them up

ledgehopping is pressing away of an edge and quickly jumping to the stage,preferably with an aerial XD

A bit to add to that.

You can also press down off of the ledge to ledgehop, depends on personal preference for the most part. Another thing that you can do is a ledge hop to waveland. From what I understand that is one of the "safest" ways to get off the ledge. Likely one of the fastest as well.

To comment on the knee approach, if you do do it and they shield but don't roll away (I've never had anyone roll away, but I don't knee approach either....) They will likely shield grab, I believe you can avoid being shield grabbed by l-canceling the knee and jabbing. [possibly leading to a gentleman or jab>grab]

metashinryu · Mar 27, 2009

i forgot to tell the press down part on ledgehopping but indeed is better to press away because of fastfalling risk.

and i think the knee pushes/stuns a bit when shielded but if they do can grab you you should make the habit of l-cancelling it in case you need to avoid a grab XD

GooeyBanana · Mar 27, 2009

Alright, well I said I'd start getting videos here and there, and here's the first set against my friend's Marth

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1n5Dzkb09s

I've already noticed some problems that I need to fix, like DI'ing my nairs back more so both kicks hit, and to roll/full jump when I'm getting the utilt spam from him. I'm just curious, what else can be done? And btw, I basically never CP Pokefloats anymore after this xD...probably going to stick to Dreamland 64/FD

PB&J · Mar 27, 2009

question for scar..how do u **** pb&j's icy @ herb..lol

DippnDots · Mar 27, 2009

So.. tech chasing spacies:

Can you chase them from an u-throw purely on reaction?

Also, I saw someone dair -> jab -> regrab, but whenever i try to get a grab after a jab it i end up getting jabbed myself, thoughts?

Mogwai · Mar 28, 2009

just grab, jab grab is foolish and doesn't work.

JonaDiaper · Mar 28, 2009

ok so if you guys havent seen the ss matches from mango juice watch them, ss is easily the best falcon in the universe. dont give me the "oh you cant tell anything from matches" blah blah blah

he ***** taj's marth which i thought was amazing, he ***** all the other usual people, apparently he lost to zhu, i have no idea how that happened but anyways he beat mango's puff, like for real.. and then he almost beat mangos fox but he went down there and died :[

anyways now we know hes good vs marth's, an basically everyone. darkrain is not the best, ss is. <- period

DrewB008 · Mar 28, 2009

did you watch that match

taj didnt do ****, and DI'd straight in to all those combos

it really wasnt anything special

not saying ss isnt good, cause he is

but the match he ***** taj's marth in did not prove anything

he beat mango's puff in one match and lost one match, and i would expect him to lose to zhu because he usually loses to zhu im pretty sure.

basically nothing new has been achieved here, save maybe beating wobbles

i didnt see ss do anything i didnt think he could already do, so i still think darkrain is better.

tell you who impressed me though was zelgadis' sheik, didnt know that guy had it in him, i was liking his tricks. props to falcomist too for being decent at all at edgeguarding falcon, both dudes barely lost their sets to ss, quite exciting matches

Cia · Mar 28, 2009

i don't care for SS' falcon either.

and honestly, i really don't think mango tries too much in WC. he always appears to not be doing anything. and when his opponents gain the slightest lead, he turns it up.

so.. yeah it may look like they're doing something to him.. but no.

darkrain, scar, hax , ss imo

hoopspr226 · Mar 28, 2009

VaNz said:
i don't care for SS' falcon either.

and honestly, i really don't think mango tries too much in WC. he always appears to not be doing anything. and when his opponents gain the slightest lead, he turns it up.

so.. yeah it may look like they're doing something to him.. but no.

darkrain, scar, hax , ss imo

Haha wow what an insanely biased and thoroughly un-objective remark. How people can still doubt SS is amazing to me. Thats just willful ignorance at its best.

Be honest with yourself. I'm sure even you realize that even if Mango weren't playing 100%, he would still thoroughly annihilate hax or scar. Easily 2 or 3 stock both of them.

The only one that you can even legitimately argue is better than SS is Darkrain.

Also, I have no idea what DrewB is talking about as far as Zelgadis and Falcomist barely losing. Collectively they got 9-0'd by SS, at least on the youtube set.

Cia · Mar 28, 2009

i honestly just don't see it. i watched his set w/ mango. and wtf. it was so stupid. mango didn't even rest. not once. sooo many opportunities and he was just like.. "uhh.. i'm just gonna do another fair"

then he dumbs it down (as you can clearly see) and SS closes the gap.

Crowd - HYPE!! HYPE!! HYPE!!

Mango - ::oh ****.. level 2::

mango loses round 2.

mango - ::hmm, that was fun. let's just go to corneria. and for added fun, let me switch to my secondary and just run around. i'm a rapist anyway, so this will work out::

if you compare those videos to any of those videos of him @ revival (-grand finals <_<) you will see what a joke the mango juice matches are.

sry if you don't like my two cents.

hoopspr226 · Mar 28, 2009

There's some legitimacy to what you are saying. It doesn't always seem like Mango is trying his best.

However, I still think that he's significantly better than Hax or Scar, who I am pretty sure would lose badly even to a "level 1" Mango. Regional pride nonwithstanding, I'm sure you'd agree.

Anyway, I think Mango's proven that his secondaries are legit. His spacies go even/beat both Mew2King and Shiz, so I don't see how anyone can even argue that fact.

papermarkis · Mar 28, 2009

Darkrain and SS are the two best. It's not even an argument.

DrewB008 · Mar 28, 2009

my bad actually i didnt realize those were finals sets, i just remembered seeing some close ones and knew there were 3 matches

but regardless, i stand by the rest of what i said, but i gotta say i think ss is better than hax, sorry hax

i wouldve said scar too, but scar ***** **** last weekend so now its unclear

TheManaLord · Mar 28, 2009

darkrain ss

metashinryu · Mar 28, 2009

Mogwai said:
just grab, jab grab is foolish and doesn't work.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ERhPnQYOgk4&feature=related

well darkrain uses it quite well

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9YoADn2_CHo

and if half nair is considered a jab then look at this ss vid

Mogwai · Mar 28, 2009

well, jab grab works more than it should and if your opponent falls for it, sure, do it to your heart's content, but if they're getting out of it, it's because it doesn't work in reality and you're better off switching to just grab in situations where you can.

PB&J · Mar 28, 2009

lol @ ss being better than darkrain..darkrain is a monster..hopefully he will go to genesis and **** face there....i love youtube fanboys..just goto a tourny when darkrain is there

Cia · Mar 28, 2009

hoopspr226 said:
There's some legitimacy to what you are saying. It doesn't always seem like Mango is trying his best.

However, I still think that he's significantly better than Hax or Scar, who I am pretty sure would lose badly even to a "level 1" Mango. Regional pride nonwithstanding, I'm sure you'd agree.

Anyway, I think Mango's proven that his secondaries are legit. His spacies go even/beat both Mew2King and Shiz, so I don't see how anyone can even argue that fact.

you should really see some recent hax stuff.. you're right, i could be wrong about him being better than ss. but his tech chasing and general intellegence is way up there. so.. we'll see.

bolded text - god i hate m2k. but i guess people actually thinking he'll legitimately lose to mango's secondaries is his fault anyway. so.. w/e

DAMMIT MEW2KING

tubes · Mar 28, 2009

PB&J said:
lol @ ss being better than darkrain..darkrain is a monster..hopefully he will go to genesis and **** face there....i love youtube fanboys..just goto a tourny when darkrain is there

This. Anyone who tries to compare other falcons to Darkrain clearly has never seen him play. Combo videos are edited to show only the best moments of a particular player. Darkrain doesn't make combo videos because he does not need them. His regular *** matches are combo videos in themselves.

That dair to halfnair grab loop SS did on GERM was pretty sick though.

Also @ Scar: Did you play Tope at H.E.R.B. and was it recorded?

JonaDiaper · Mar 28, 2009

PB&J said:
lol @ ss being better than darkrain..darkrain is a monster..hopefully he will go to genesis and **** face there....i love youtube fanboys..just goto a tourny when darkrain is there

have you been to a tourney were ss has been? if no then you cant say that, because that would be being a hypocrite kinda.. i havent seen either of them so idk

but from what ive seen ss on youtube, ss is better hands down. he's just so smart, he plays falcon like no other

and he ALWAYS does something amazing in every match, every single one.
plus ss tech chasing is twice as good as darkrain's,
and ss combos just as well if not better then darkrain..

but when genisis happens and ss is like top 5 and darkrain and some others are down low, yea we'll see, also falcon dittos.

i think genisis would be like

mango
m2k
pc
shiz
ss

i also think that besides mango the rest could be interchangeable

papermarkis · Mar 28, 2009

We'll judge SS when we see him combo someone with good DI other than Mango. Right now you have no evidence and everything you've said about SS can be applied to Darkrain as well.

JonaDiaper · Mar 28, 2009

well darkrain got ***** by m2k and cactuar every time he lost, when he won it was close

ss plays mango and does well against him and mangos better then both m2k and cactuar..

stupid logic but you know what im trying to say

plus he doesnt even need to combo you when he can just tech chase the crap outta you, darkrain doesnt tech chase that well..

also ss has amazing di, he like never dies lol

Ja · Mar 28, 2009

JonaDiaper said:
plus he doesnt even need to combo you when he can just tech chase the crap outta you, darkrain doesnt tech chase that well..

Magus420 · Mar 28, 2009

Sadaharu Inui said:
well darkrain got ***** by m2k and cactuar every time he lost, when he won it was close

ss plays mango and does well against him and mangos better then both m2k and cactuar..

DippnDots · Mar 28, 2009

JonaDiaper said:
stupid logic but you know what im trying to say

darkrain doesnt tech chase that well..

improper use of the transitive property

and straight up wrong

If you guys are going to make stupid arguments and use youtube videos as evidence you might as well be arguing on youtube with the other *******.

papermarkis · Mar 29, 2009

Darkrain doesn't tech chase that well? OK, you're obviously insane. There's no point in arguing with you anymore.

Scar · Mar 29, 2009

yeah jona i'm about to give smack you with an infraction after that one bro

Cia · Mar 29, 2009

^ LOL. I wouldn't be surprised if you started giving infractions for bad grammar.

:laugh:

CanISmash · Mar 29, 2009

WOW EXACTLY WHAT I WAS THINKING. did everyone miss magus' post of the year.

also scar i need help. how do you play against falco on ys. my friend tends to be up on me 3 stocks to 1 but sometimes i get lucky and **** him, i wanna erase the luck what do i do?

Scar · Mar 29, 2009

my eyes/brain hurt from SS fanboyisms here, the kid is really good but the quote "now we know he's good vs marth an basically everyone" is the silliest thing i've ever heard

and plz no johns for mango, he wins what he wins and we really haven't seen him lose so who cares if he 1, 2, or 3 stocks anyone because he's playing at "level 3".

finally and on a very serious note, people who say SS is better than darkrain are the same kinds of people who say that darkrain can't tech chase well. the same kind of people that don't understand that SS does not travel and Darkrain goes to (and wins) major huge national OOS tournies and that SS frequently places outside the top 5 locally.

right now they are the 2 best but darkrain has accomplished WAY more.

tubes said:
Also @ Scar: Did you play Tope at H.E.R.B. and was it recorded?

i played tope in loser's finals and won the set 3-1, hopefully we'll rematch @ spoc to see if it was a fluke or not

Scar talks Lean Melee [2012YotF]

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