Make Your Move 5

Hyper_Ridley · Apr 12, 2009

SeaLegend said:
I didn't see it in the first post, so I just wanted to ask... Is there a deadline for this? ^^; I'm going to work on a few Pokemon movesets this week (Yes, I know, overdone, but I'm too much of a Poketard to care)

We don't decide on a deadline until we feel that the thread has gotten enough posts/move sets. There's plenty of time to work on a move set. =)

JOE! · Apr 12, 2009

aww....spiderman didnt make the Char select

KingK.Rool · Apr 12, 2009

Sorry for being less active lately, guys - I've fallen from third in posts to tenth, heh. Need to get more reading of movesets done, although the chances of me continuing to comment on everything... well, let's just say they're not great.

SeaLegend said:
I didn't see it in the first post, so I just wanted to ask... Is there a deadline for this? ^^; I'm going to work on a few Pokemon movesets this week (Yes, I know, overdone, but I'm too much of a Poketard to care)

Not overdone at all! Pokesets are always great.

Welcome to MYM. As Spadefox says, there's still tons of time to go, about two months, I reckon.

Chris Lionheart · Apr 12, 2009

sandbags06 said:
Blinx the Time Controlling Cat

Overview: Microsoft’s failed attempt at a mascot falls into the SSB universe to prove himself to the likes of Sonic and Mario.

I never did give this moveset the comment it deserved (noone did). We really need to stop ignoring sets (or posting generic comments).

Anyway, hi, I'm Chris Lionheart, a former (and hopefully future) authority in Make Your Move. Welcome to the contest. I hope that you intend to stay and have fun with the rest of us. I'll be giving Blinx a little mini-review (the real ones I did as an authority figure went in-depth on every move) to show you that you have potential, but need to improve, learning from the work of others to develop your skills.

Normals:
The A combo was actually quite interesting. Far above the standard of a punch, punch, kick and it was balanced quite well. The dash attack on the other hand really needs more detail. You state that it deals multi hits and give a damage range, but you do nothing to state the damage % per hit and how many hits there are.

Tilts:
The Side Tilt is just plain cool. The Up Tilt is more generic, but it is very much in character and seems to be balanced, if not underpowered, though, again you need to state how much each hit does, not just give a total damage range. The Down Tilt is kind of funny, and the tripping effect is a nice feature for a nooby set. Does this deal 2 hits of 2%, 2 hits of 4% each, or one hit of 4%?

Smashes:
The F-Smash is a visual twist on a simple concept. I like it. With smashes, it is a good idea to include charge damage or charge effects (such as the move deals 2% uncharged to 7% fully charged on the first hit). The Up Smash is a visually appealing move, for sure, but more detail is necessary to judge its balance. The Down Smash is cool, even if it is rather Snake-ish, but it needs more detail. How big is the radial explosion? How far does it send you. It isn't enough to simply know that it can't kill.

Aerials:
The Nair is pretty simple in appearance and function. Including a sex kick is still pretty good, especially for a noob set. The Fair seems to be a bit of a Fox Fair clone. Again your multi-hit damage is confusing... is the 2-13% the total possible damage range for a single kick (with sweetspot and sourspot) or for the whole combo, in which case, you need to state how much each kick deals. The Bair is more detailed and interesting than most of your multi-hit attacks in function, though it's second half cloning Sheik's Fair in reverse direction isn't exactly the best move (cloned moves are not high placing set material). The Uair is a really nice concept, containing nintendo-esque physics and basically being a Star KO version of the F.L.U.D.D. The Dair was much less unique, basically being a cloned move (and a nearly useless cloned move at that).

Grabs/Throws:
Though it is easy to infer what the grab is, you really should state what it is, what it's reach is, and how it compares speed-wise to other grabs. Why are his F-Throw and B-Throw just reverse versions of eachother? The throws as a whole are actually pretty bland and useless (though him jumping on the down throw was a fairly interesting tidbit). Another detail is that Throws are supposed to deal damage. Basically, Blinx has the most useless throws ever.

Neutral B:
Projectiles are always nice if you can make them fairly unique, and this one is certainly more unique than any projectile in the real Brawl. It has some possible balance issues. What are the approximate % chances (or fraction chances) of each item being shot out? Some things, like the Super Bomb, really sound potentially broken, while the Heart Crystal just sounds annoying for the user. Moves with such highly random and luck-based effects are generally not very well appreciated, atleast not if some of the outcomes are potentially devastating.

Side B:
The Side B is kind of pointless as you have made it. If it's only use is neutralizing projectiles, rather than deflecting them or other effects, then this move won't compare to things like Fox's Down B. Some possible changes you could make to this move would be to make the copy controllable, make it move randomly, or deal the total damage of all projectiles it has absorbed to foes that it touches.

Down B:
Wait... another anti-projectile move? That is just overkill, especially considering this one is just a nerfed clone of the reflectors already in the game. Change this to something more useful and creative.

Up B:
Very interesting concept. I really like it, but it could be better. You should state how fast it can move left and right, as well as stating how far it goes up vertically. In addition, that 25% per stock seems to be to little. Maybe 40-50%? Atleast 30% for sure.

Final Smash:
Simple but fairly unique and well-balanced. Pimptastic... lol.

Necessary Details:
Damage Percentages (you have included these for the most part) for every hit a move causes.
Knockback for every hit a move causes.
The reach (how far does a move hit) of every hit. Reach is often given in terms of estimations (low, medium, good, great, high, etc.) or in terms of SBB's (stage builder blocks).
The priority of every hit.
The beginning + ending lag of the move.
The amount of hitstun caused by each hit.
The flight speed (of projectiles).
The projectile priority (of projectiles).
The projectile reach (of projectiles). This is often given in SBB's or in terms of how far it goes compared to Final Destination, or in comparison to another projectile.

Overview:
It was a shame that this set was so overlooked. It wasn't a bad newcomer set by any means and I believe that you have potential. I would compare this set to Make Your Move 3 sets, which is pretty good for a newcomer. Promising newcomers are becoming increasingly rare and increasingly ignored, but don't be intimidated, as becoming an accepted regular is rewarding and possible, even in MYM5. This moveset has decent creativity and kind of makes me wish that I had played the Blinx game(s?). It lacks many of the details listed above, however, which hurts it not only in the detail category, but makes its balance nearly impossible to judge.

Good luck to you.

sandbags06 · Apr 13, 2009

Chris Lionheart said:
Overview:
It was a shame that this set was so overlooked. It wasn't a bad newcomer set by any means and I believe that you have potential. I would compare this set to Make Your Move 3 sets, which is pretty good for a newcomer. Promising newcomers are becoming increasingly rare and increasingly ignored, but don't be intimidated, as becoming an accepted regular is rewarding and possible, even in MYM5. This moveset has decent creativity and kind of makes me wish that I had played the Blinx game(s?). It lacks many of the details listed above, however, which hurts it not only in the detail category, but makes its balance nearly impossible to judge.

Good luck to you.

i was actually thinking about a lot of the stuff you mentioned while making the moveset, i just didnt look at enough examples to get an idea of the detail that was demanded of the movesets. thank you for the constructive criticism, i have a much better idea of what to bring to the table next time thanks to you. i will probably go back and edit the moveset in the near future to make it more on par with the other ones listed, and i might add a general strategy section or something like that as well. thanks again for the feedback.

sandbags06 · Apr 13, 2009

made some adjustments to Blinx moveset on page 57. Some arials and B moves have been scrapped and replaced. more detail added to all moves overall. general strategy portion will be added in the future some time.

PK-ow! · Apr 13, 2009

Ouch,

I'm facing a tough decision with Will and Freedan. I don't think these guys can have a "third jump." At best, we get a sort of sideways boost and/or float-enabling move.

See, I can think of a third jump.. but it makes the other specials - in the slots that are left - look wrong.

So I just don't know. I can't possibly give either one super armor, and they don't fly (sadly...), so I think I'm forced to get a third jump.

.... urg.

How bad would it be if I used something other than down special for transform? I think it would be blasphemy. <.<
Oh yeah, and comments. Goddang comments. Need to do 'em. But I'm so busy...
How to give my own moveset proper attention, but keep from being selfish in that respect?

the thread is so big now, too.

I'm going to say right now though, honestly I can't stand a moveset like Arthas'. It just doesn't compute for me. You make too many mechanics different and it's brain death, you can't fight it. *shrug*

C~Dog · Apr 13, 2009

PK-ow! said:
How bad would it be if I used something other than down special for transform? I think it would be blasphemy. <.<

I think its perfectly reasonable to use a different button to transform. I'm thinking of using Side Special for one of my movesets, since it would fit better with the rest of the moveset. The only special i wouldnt use would be Neutral, since it would be far to easy to accidentally initiate a transform that way.

Wizzerd · Apr 13, 2009

Yeah, I think it's fine. I think that in Spadefox's Jonathan and Charlotte you switched with taunts.

Red Arremer · Apr 13, 2009

I never made Jonathon and Charlotte. However, in my JonathAn and Charlotte, that is indeed true: Switching happened through taunts.

Here's a link for reference:
http://www.smashboards.com/showpost.php?p=6030066&postcount=2777

dancingfrogman · Apr 13, 2009

Lol, just a bit nit-picky ay?

Of course a transform move can be a different button input. Hell, if we are allowed to make mechanics, multiple crawl/glide attacks, no actual aerials/throws, I don't think you'll be penalised for having a transforming a different button input lol.

Baloo · Apr 13, 2009

For Marx I made the F Tilt and the Neutral B transform. So really any move, besides throws, can do that. Throws are a bit to situational. :|

In my M3E sets, the Down B switches though. The down B is the typical switcher, but if not, "down" attacks seems to switch most of the time for some reason.

Chris Lionheart · Apr 13, 2009

PK-ow! said:
Ouch,

I'm facing a tough decision with Will and Freedan. I don't think these guys can have a "third jump." At best, we get a sort of sideways boost and/or float-enabling move.

See, I can think of a third jump.. but it makes the other specials - in the slots that are left - look wrong.

So I just don't know. I can't possibly give either one super armor, and they don't fly (sadly...), so I think I'm forced to get a third jump.

.... urg.

How bad would it be if I used something other than down special for transform? I think it would be blasphemy. <.<
Oh yeah, and comments. Goddang comments. Need to do 'em. But I'm so busy...
How to give my own moveset proper attention, but keep from being selfish in that respect?

the thread is so big now, too.

I'm going to say right now though, honestly I can't stand a moveset like Arthas'. It just doesn't compute for me. You make too many mechanics different and it's brain death, you can't fight it. *shrug*

Tell me what is so impossible to contemplate about a mechanic that is auto-handled by CPU? Just because you don't like something doesn't make it any less good. Of course, why am I even talking to you.... if I recall, you were the same person who ignored my entire Leviathan set to comment on something as irrelevant as a loss pose, when in fact, the point you made was useless, as her loss pose was indeed a simple infinite loop like the rest of the cast.

And, honestly any special can be used for transforming. The down special is just the best option. You may even try something new, like assigning the taunt buttons to transform. That would certainly free up those special slots you are having so much trouble with. Or if that doesn't work, you could always do a Final Smash transform, like with Zamus. There is nothing wrong with simply giving a character multi-jumps or very effective jumps and no recovery special (think Yoshi).

Zook · Apr 13, 2009

Alright, I've done my first entry now. I'm not new to MYM- I submitted several movesets in one of the contests- but it's been a while. Anyways, tell me what you think, if I'm missing anything, etc.

**I copied and pasted the template from the Waluigi entry.

Wild Gengar Appears!

Overview

Gengar, the Shadow Pokemon, is a Ghost/Poison-type Pokemon, #94 in the National Pokedex, and comes from (you guessed it) the hit Pokemon franchise.

Gengar is described in the game as more of a playful poltergeist rather than a malicious demon. Its activities include mimicking shadows and scaring people. You can tell a Gengar is around you because they absorb heat from their surroundings- they “cool the area by nearly 10 degrees F.” In order to get a Gengar, you must trade a Haunter with a friend (or, in some cases, catch one in the wild).

This little dude has been a fan favorite since the beginning, and for good reason. Not only has he been blessed with one of the coolest character designs, but he also has some of the best special sweeping stats in the game. His base Special Attack (130) and Speed (110) are both far above average, and he has access to a wide variety of moves. Such diversity! Sadly, his physical capabilities are sub-par.

In the original Pokemon Mystery Dungeon games, Gengar appears as the main antagonist.

Stats

Size: 4.5/10 - Gengar is described as being 4’11, pretty average for a Smash character.
Weight: 3/10 - He’s a floating ball of poisonous gas. That’s pretty light.
Ground Speed: 9/10 - Much like a certain other Pokemon, Gengar prefers to float above the ground instead of use his legs. And, as his stats judge, he is FAST.
First Jump: 8/10 - Being a ghost, Gengar is able to rise high into the air with ease..
Second Jump: 8/10 - His second jump gets the same height as the first one. Gengar does a ghastly corkscrew as he rises in mid-air.
Fall Speed: 3/10 - He’s quite floaty.
Crouch: 8/10 - Gengar squashes his body into a pancake, and smiles up at his foes. His ‘ears’ poke up a bit, adding height and preventing him from having a truly great crouch.
Crawl: Yes. For this, Gengar waddles forwards or backwards.
Wall Jump: No.
Wall Cling: Yes.
Gliding: Yes. Gengar spreads his arms and flies Peter Pan-style.

Attacks

Jab Combo:

Shadow Claw
2 combos, first hit %3, second hit %2
Claws glowing in a dark energy, Gengar makes a quick swipe in front of him. This is a very close-range move, and comes out super fast. The second combo of this move has him swipe with his other hand, dealing slightly less damage but more knock back.

Dash Attack:

Rapid Spin
13 hits, 1% per hit
SPINSPINSPINSPINSPIN!!!! Floating horizontally above the ground, Gengar spins his body rapidly, trapping anyone who comes in contact with him in a vortex of pain. This is a multi-hit move, with a maximum of 13 hits (What an unlucky number), with the thirteenth hit knocking foes away. Although this move has extremely little startup lag, after the move finishes, Gengar becomes dizzy, and needs a while to regain himself.

Oh, yes, did I mention that none of Gengar’s “physical moves” (ones that utilize his physical body) are kill moves? He has a very low Attack.

Forward Tilt:

Lick
1 hit, 8%
Eeeew! Gengar twists around, his tongue darts out of his mouth and slaps the foe as he turns forwards. The tongue is about as long as Ivysaur’s body. He swings the tongue horizontally. Knockback is nothing special, but it sends opponents away at a 20 degree angle.

Fun fact: Lick was, in Red/Blue/Yellow version, the only Ghost-type move.

Up Tilt

Sucker Punch
1 hit, 9%
Gengar executes a swift uppercut. The move acts similar to Mario’s up tilt, but it can be aimed slightly left and right. During this move, Gengar does not move his body; instead, his fist stretches to the height of about ¾ another Gengar.

Down Tilt:

Lick
1 hit, 6%
While in his squished position, Gengar’s tongue darts out in front of him, low to the ground. This is one of his fastest moves, and has the same range as his forward tilt. However, this move is also capable of inducing trips!

Smashes

Forward Smash:

Toxic
No hits, ‘Flowers’ opponent
How devious! For his forward smash attack, Gengar makes a sick look on his face (if charged), vomits into his hands and receives a Toxic. Now, unlike most forward smashes, this move has no knock back, and it he uses it like an item rather than an attack. While Gengar is holding onto a Toxic, he cannot grab anyone, but is otherwise free to attack, jump, whatever. If thrown, the move has range similar to Bonsly, but is thrown at the speed of a normal item. Any foe hit with Toxic is ‘Badly Poisoned,” meaning that they gradually take damage. Instead of getting a flower head, however, they flash purple. The first bit of damage does 1%, then 2%, then 4%, then 8 %, then 16%, resulting in a grand total of 31 damage! If charged to the max, an extra 2% is added to each damage. Of course, Gengar is very vulnerable while preparing this attack, and the Toxic can be caught and used against him.

Up Smash:

Shadow Ball
1 hit, 2% uncharged, 19% charged
Hands raised above his head, Ghosty unleashes the signature Ghost move, Shadow Ball. Most of you probably know what it looks like. Remember Mewtwo’s standard B move? Yeah, that. However, Gengar utilizes the move in a different way. He still charges it and can store it, but Gengar launches a Shadow Ball above him. The move still has the same crooked trajectory as Mewtwo’s, but because resisting gravity, it doesn’t go as far. The move has similar range to Snake’s mortar. If you just tap an up smash, Gengar releases a ‘baby ball’ (that was the term, right?), which is the same size as Mewtwo’s uncharged SB. Fully Charged, it has the same power and size as Mewtwo’s fully charged Shadow Ball. A great KO move.

As you hold the attack button down, Gengar’s Shadow Ball grows (However, it does no damage if someone touches the charge). Press the sheild button to store it for later.

Down Smash:

Hidden Power
1 hit, 13% uncharged, 18% charged
Mysterious orbs of energy circle Gengar as he charges up Hidden Power. When he lets loose, he sends several orbs of energy from his waist (only two are capable of hitting, the rest fly into the foreground and background). If hit, the foe is sent at a downward angle with high knock back.

A cool thing about this move is that, depending on your tag, Gengar gets a different Hidden Power! There are 17 types in total: Normal, Dragon, Fire, Water, Grass, Ice, Bug, Fighting, Steel, Ghost, Poison, Dark, Ground, Rock, Flying, Psychic, and Electric. There is no difference in the actual attack besides the damage animation and appearance of the Hidden Power.

Aerial Attacks

Neutral Air:

Dark Pulse
1 hit, 5% sour, 14 % sweetspotted
Opening his mouth, Gengar lets loose a burst of dark energy from his jaws. The wave takes up the entire front side of Gengar and moves away from him, up to two Gengar lengths away. If the opponent is ‘in’ Gengar’s mouth (the sweetspot) as the pulse comes out, they suffer from high knock back. The further they are away from Gengar, the less damage and knock back they take.

Forward Air:

Shadow Punch
1 hit, 10%
Wham! Gengar swings his fists in front of him, smashing them together. This is a rather short-ranged move, but if the foe is caught in between his fists, they are sent downwards at a 45 degree angle.

Back Air:

Curse
1 hit, 24%
Casper here drives a giant nail through his front, which bursts out the other side. …Yow. In the games, Curse was a moved which functioned differently for ghosts- instead of gaining Attack and Defense but losing Speed, they would sacrifice some of their health and lay a curse on their foe. Gengar does just that. If anyone is hit by the nail, they take an astounding 24% and are flowered! However, Gengar is damaged by the whole nail thing, and takes 12%. Curse has little knock back.

Up Air:

Night Shade
1 hit, 10%
A black veil appears above Gengar, damaging anyone who comes in contact with it. In the games, Night Shade did damage equal to Gengar’s level. Of course, we can’t tell what level he is in SSB, so instead the damage and knock back is based off of his current %*.15. So, if Gengar was at 100%, Night Shade would deal 15% and good knock back. The move becomes a great kill move at higher percentages.

Sorry, Lucario.

Down Air:

Will-O-Wisp
4 hits, 4% per hit
A ghastly blue orb of fire is thrown downwards, setting opponents on fire. If hit, a foe will act as if trapped in a Charizard or Bowser Flamethrower, but only be hit 4 times. It can be DI’d out of. The Will-O-Wisp travels the distance of a platform on Battle Field to the actual stage.

Special Attacks

Neutral Special:

Sludge Bomb
Multiple hits, Bomb itself (fully charged) 17%, sludge 2% per sludge
Yuck. Gengar draws in dark energy from his surroundings to create a Sludge Bomb. As he charges the move, he stands still, purple gunk drawing into his hands as the sludge grows. When released, Gengar shoots the Sludge Bomb at an angle and distance, controlled depending how you tilt the control stick. This move cannot be stored. If it hits something, the bomb blows up into sludge. The initial explosion has very high knock back (if fully charged), but the patches of poison have none.

If the move is executed before full charged, Gengar flings Sludge, which causes flinching and minor damage.

Side Special:

Shadow Sneak
Infinite hits, 1% per hit
Gengar extends his shadow two body lengths away while looking devious. Although it has no knock back or flinch, anyone that touches the shadow rapidly takes damage.

Because it’s a shadow, this move only touches the ground. If used in the air, anyone directly below Gengar takes damage.

Up Special:

Levitate
“Look at me! I can fly!” Gengar levitates for 2 seconds. While levitating, he can move about freely in the air in any direction, and still execute attacks. He moves slightly faster than his normal air speed.

Down Special:

Hypnosis
This had to be on here somewhere. Gengar leans forward and several rings come out from his eyes. Anyone looking into them fall asleep. In the air, the opponent temporarily enters a freefall state.

The move acts more like Mewtwo’s Disable than Jigglypuff’s Sing.

Grab

Psychic
Eyes glowing blue, Gengar reaches out in front of him. The grab actually extends a bit beyond his hands. Anyone who is captured in this move has their eyes turn the same blue as Gengar’s and appear dazed.

Pummel:

Nightmare
2%
Gengar pumps bad dreams through his victim, cackling wickedly. The move is of decent speed.

Forward Throw:

Strength
9%
Gengar hurls the opponent over his head and chucks them with all of his physical strength. Which isn’t much. The opponent gets sent away at a 70 degree angle with low power. However, Gengar suffers very little lag from this.

Back Throw:

Shadow Ball
15%
He traps his foe in a Shadow Ball, then flings them backwards. This is Gengar’s most powerful throw, and kills Mario at 109%.

Up Throw:

Fling
Varying damage
Yes, this is an actual Pokemon move. Fling’s damage and knock back is based on how heavy the person being flung is. For Jigglypuff, it does 5% and very little knock back; Mario, 10% and medium knock back; Bowser, 16 % and high knock back.

Down Throw:

Dream Eater
3%
Gengar shakes in delight as he drains his victim’s dreams. Aside from doing damage, Gengar also recovers as much damage as he deals. After the move is over, the opponent is flung straight up with little knock back.

Final Smash

TM 64

When Gengar unleashes his final smash, he takes out TM 64, puts it on his head, and learns a new move.

Wait, what is TM 64, again?

Explosion.

Press the B button to learn the move, then B a second time to use it. Gengar will temporarily forget Sludge Bomb in place of Explosion. When Gengar uses Explosion, he- you guessed it- explodes. The blast radius is the same size as a Smart Bomb, but with the knock back of a Bob-Omb.

After using the move, Gengar is completely black for a second, then shakes off the soot and laughs.

Taunts

Up

It’s the taunt move from the game! 1:10

Side
Gengar looks at the screen, makes a creepy face, chuckles, then turns away.

Down
Gengar gives a quick chuckle.

Alternative Colors

Purple body, pink eyes (classic)
Dark blue body, purple eyes (Blue team, shiney)
Crimson Body, black eyes (Red team)
Radioactive green body, yellow eyes (Green team)
Black/grey body, white eyes (Classic Gameboy)
Pink body, light blue eyes

Victory Poses

1.
Gengar smirks while a caption reading “Gengar gained 1000 exp.!” is shown beneath his feet.

2.
Gengar is nowhere in sight. If the controller is left untouched, after 11 seconds, his face flashes on the screen, screaming.

3.
Gengar clutches a Pokeball in his hand, grins, and then crushes it.

Kirby Hat
Kirby turns purple, his eyes become pink, and he gets Gengar’s spikes.

Vicotry Theme
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Jmty_NiaXc

Jimnymebob · Apr 13, 2009

Gengar is a great set Zook, it has a nice layout, and has well detailed, and interesting moves that fit the character.
My favourite move is probably Curse, as it could give you the upper hand if you land it properly.

I have two questions though=
1. What attacks can you use while levitating? Just his tilts, his smashes or what?
2. When using Hypnosis, is there any lag, and can you use it in the air? If there is no lag, and you can use it in the air then that would be an insanely deadly gimping tool (you could just jump after them, Hypnosis and watch them fall).

Great set though Zook, Pokemon have great moveset potential.

majora_787 · Apr 13, 2009

Hey, I FINALLY found some time today to make my Camus entry. I'm actually working on it right now as we speak. The reason I'm saying it is because, I don't want people complaining about how I write it. I play the NTSC version. So if I had made a Shiida moveset, it would be Caeda. If I had made a Nabarl moveset, it would be Navarre.

Just so we're clear. I don't like back-seat moveset making.

Also, nice Gengar, Zook.

Chris Lionheart · Apr 13, 2009

Zook said:
Alright, I've done my first entry now. I'm not new to MYM- I submitted several movesets in one of the contests- but it's been a while. Anyways, tell me what you think, if I'm missing anything, etc.

**I copied and pasted the template from the Waluigi entry.

Wild Gengar Appears!

If the contest you were in was before MYM3, then we can basically say that you are new to MYM, as there have been huge changes since then.

Anyway, on the comments.

BB Code + Organization
The organization is good enough, though reading a centered moveset is rather annoying. There is a serious lack of color. Look at just about any moveset in this contest and you will notice that it uses a lot of colored font, atleast for section and move headers.

Stats
There is nothing really wrong with your stats section. What you have included seems balanced enough... the organization is again... an eyesore.

Normal Attacks
Your jab combo is pretty plain. You could easily see Lucario having animations very similar to this. The combo is balanced from what you have provided, but simply stating "the second hit deals more knockback" is not sufficient. How much knockback does each hit deal (low, medium, good, great, high, etc.)? Your dash attack is pretty generic visually, but a 13 hit move with a dizzy after effect is definitely interesting. Again, state how much knockback is dealt by each of the hits and state how long Gengar is dizzy afterwards.

Tilts
The Side Tilt is interesting just because it is a lick, but it lacks detail and is rather bland in funtion. How fast does it come out? How much ending lag does it have? How much knockback does it deal? Instead of making it straight-forward, why not have it stun the foe or gross them out or something? The Up Tilt is okay, even though it is a clone of Mario's Up Tilt, except with the ability to aim the punch a bit. Again, this move lacks many important details. Why is the down tilt another tongue move? This is a moveset for Gengar, not Lickitung. It's effect is simple and somewhat interesting? How often does it make the foe trip? It also lacks some other important details.

Smashes
The Side Smash is the most creative thing in the set so far. The detail here is what you would usually expect to find on the average MYM5 tilt. This could use some more details though. Aside from all the usual stuff, how much time is there between poison damages? The Up Smash was less creative, being a cloned move basically, with the only difference being flight distance and the direction he fires it. Simply put, that was fine in MYM3 and awesome in MYM2, but such excessive cloning is not winning material in MYM5. The Down Smash is simple... and I'm assuming it hits on both sides, but you don't state so, which you need to. The elemental effect is a nice visual touch... but you should really give each one a different effect. The idea of making it work based on your nametag is interesting... but what kind of name tags give you each element? A special move mechanic without elaboration is no better than the lack of a special mechanic at all.

Aerials
The Nair is interesting enough, it just lacks a lot of important details. The Fair, on the other hand, is even more generic than the name suggests. At the least, you can surround his fists in dark aura for something more visual and then give the move a lingering effect. Sure that will basically make it a Lucario-esque move, but it is better than what the move currently is. Try to think in terms of "what can this move cause?" Perhaps it could surround the foe in darkness, slowing them down, or giving them a chance to auto-miss with attacks? Just something to make this move more interesting. Curse, while one of the more unique moves in your set, is still pretty boring? Why re-use the "flowered" effect? Why not have it do something else... like make them temporarily take more damage from Gengar's attacks or temporarily remove their ability to block? Night Shade is easy enough to understand. It is basically Lucario's special mechanic, but only on a single move, making it somewhat unique. A lot of important details, such as the reach of the move, the duration of the move, the beginning and ending lag of the move, etc. are missing. Ok, so the Dair is a projectile that works sort of like a downwards (Ness's) Pk Fire. Not bad for a fairly new set maker. Being a projectile, this move needs things such as the flight speed of the projectile. Does this projectile deal any knockback? What is the beginning and ending lag of this move.

Grabs/Throws
The grab is kind of cool visually. It just needs an approximate reach compared to other grabs and an approximate beginning and ending lag compared to other grabs. The Pummel is simple and you describe it's detail adequately. The F-Throw is bland, but atleast it has the proper details. The Back Throw is fairly cool, but this one needs its lag and knockback described (just saying "kills *insert character* @ *insert %* isn't good enough). Ah, okay. The Up Throw improves with the opponent's weight. That is pretty creative. All you really need for this is the lag. If you really wanted to be noticed, you would give the amounts for every Brawl character, or give an estimated range. Making Dream Eater a throw wasn't a bad move, considering most make it the pummel. It was described pretty well, though including its lag would be a good idea.

Neutral B
Well... the attack is okay, but it could definitely be better. Judging by its current description, it has an initial explosion and also poisons that spot for some time. How much time does the poison last? Perhaps if you really wanted to make it more unique, you could have the struck foe(s) also become little poison bombs themselves (they release poison at regular times, dealing damage to themselves and to foes next to them). Another troubling detail is the reach of the move. You say it changes based on angle, but you fail to give approximate reaches with the different angles (which I would assume are the 4 cardinal directions and the diagonals). Being a projectile, a flight speed is also helpful. How large is the blast radius of the initial explosion?

Side B
Umm okay... this move would actually make a great A combo. You state it deals potentially infinite hits of 1% each. How many hits are there per second (estimated)? How much beginning and ending lag does this move have? Perhaps, to make this move more interesting, you could change it's function, like have it be an extension of Gengar himself, able to perform things such as grabs, attacks, etc. (just not specials as you are holding the B button). Another idea would be to keep its current effect, but have the shadow extend the longer you use the move.

Down B
Okay... this move is really kind of boring, basically being a mix between Disable and Sing. But if you aren't going to change it's effects, atleast describe things like its reach and lag, as well as the amount of time it puts the foe to sleep.

Up B
The Up B is basically a short duration version of Pit's Up B that allows Gengar to attack. Well... atleast it works and isn't exactly like anything in Brawl. Perhaps you should increase its duration to 3 seconds?

Final Smash
There isn't much to say about this. Atleast it isn't a ghostly Landmaster, right? Anyway, this should have a damage percentage (if it deals damage) and state how much time it take him to explode and how much time it takes him to shake off his soot and laugh. You deserve some credit for making it work like the Pokemon version of the move (making him forget Sludge Bomb temporarily), rather than just making him explode outright. If you wanted to be more unique, you could turn this into a final smash with a duration (somewhere between 10-20 seconds should do it) and have him explode every time you use Neutral B.

Necessary Details
Damage Percentages
Knockback (usually given in estimations like low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Attack Reach (how far does an attack reach? Often given in SBB's, or Stage Builder Blocks, Bodylengths, or by comparing them to another move, or perhaps just with estimations like low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Beginning Lag + Ending Lag (though some include estimated or exact times or frames, most just say something along the lines of low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Priority (if this attack collides with another attack, does it overpower the other attack, are both attacks neutralized, or does the other attack overpower this one, again, this is usually given in estimations like low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Hitstun
Flight Speed (for projectiles)
Projectile Reach (for projectiles. Most often given through SBB's, Bodylengths, or by comparing it to the distance of other projectiles or by stating how much of Final Destination the projectile would travel).
Projectile Priority (if this collides with another projectile, which one wins?)
Move Duration

Overview
You may say that you are not a newcomer, but you are pretty close. This isn't a bad set for someone who is inexperienced, though it definitely isn't up to standard. While this set would excel in MYM2 (not factoring in the popularity + rigged voting systems of that contest) and it would fit in with early and even some late MYM3 sets, it needs improvement to fit in with MYM5 sets. You show potential, but you need to develop your skills.

Welcome to Make Your Move and good luck.

Zook · Apr 13, 2009

Chris Lionheart said:
If the contest you were in was before MYM3, then we can basically say that you are new to MYM, as there have been huge changes since then.

Anyway, on the comments.

BB Code + Organization
The organization is good enough, though reading a centered moveset is rather annoying. There is a serious lack of color. Look at just about any moveset in this contest and you will notice that it uses a lot of colored font, atleast for section and move headers.

Actually, that is the reason I did a simple, white text post- A lot of the others are pretty hard to look at.

I'll change the positioning.

Normal Attacks
Your jab combo is pretty plain. You could easily see Lucario having animations very similar to this. The combo is balanced from what you have provided, but simply stating "the second hit deals more knockback" is not sufficient. How much knockback does each hit deal (low, medium, good, great, high, etc.)? Your dash attack is pretty generic visually, but a 13 hit move with a dizzy after effect is definitely interesting. Again, state how much knockback is dealt by each of the hits and state how long Gengar is dizzy afterwards.

Will do.

Tilts
The Side Tilt is interesting just because it is a lick, but it lacks detail and is rather bland in funtion. How fast does it come out? How much ending lag does it have? How much knockback does it deal? Instead of making it straight-forward, why not have it stun the foe or gross them out or something? The Up Tilt is okay, even though it is a clone of Mario's Up Tilt, except with the ability to aim the punch a bit. Again, this move lacks many important details. Why is the down tilt another tongue move? This is a moveset for Gengar, not Lickitung. It's effect is simple and somewhat interesting? How often does it make the foe trip? It also lacks some other important details.

I'll be sure to add in more info on the knock back and lag. And utilt isn't really a clone of Mario's, the hitbox is much smaller because of Gengar's puny arms. I guess I should've made that more clear.

One of Gengar's signature moves in the cartoon was Lick.

Smashes
The Side Smash is the most creative thing in the set so far. The detail here is what you would usually expect to find on the average MYM5 tilt. This could use some more details though. Aside from all the usual stuff, how much time is there between poison damages? The Up Smash was less creative, being a cloned move basically, with the only difference being flight distance and the direction he fires it. Simply put, that was fine in MYM3 and awesome in MYM2, but such excessive cloning is not winning material in MYM5. The Down Smash is simple... and I'm assuming it hits on both sides, but you don't state so, which you need to. The elemental effect is a nice visual touch... but you should really give each one a different effect. The idea of making it work based on your nametag is interesting... but what kind of name tags give you each element? A special move mechanic without elaboration is no better than the lack of a special mechanic at all.

I don't see why a description that takes up a full paragraph is better than a shorter one. If it gets the job done, it should be fine.

I was going to have the Up Smash launch a fully-charged Shadow Ball, but I figured that would be broken. I don't see why a move that is, literally, the same move as another should be much different.

Aerials
The Nair is interesting enough, it just lacks a lot of important details. The Fair, on the other hand, is even more generic than the name suggests. At the least, you can surround his fists in dark aura for something more visual and then give the move a lingering effect. Sure that will basically make it a Lucario-esque move, but it is better than what the move currently is. Try to think in terms of "what can this move cause?" Perhaps it could surround the foe in darkness, slowing them down, or giving them a chance to auto-miss with attacks? Just something to make this move more interesting. Curse, while one of the more unique moves in your set, is still pretty boring? Why re-use the "flowered" effect? Why not have it do something else... like make them temporarily take more damage from Gengar's attacks or temporarily remove their ability to block? Night Shade is easy enough to understand. It is basically Lucario's special mechanic, but only on a single move, making it somewhat unique. A lot of important details, such as the reach of the move, the duration of the move, the beginning and ending lag of the move, etc. are missing. Ok, so the Dair is a projectile that works sort of like a downwards (Ness's) Pk Fire. Not bad for a fairly new set maker. Being a projectile, this move needs things such as the flight speed of the projectile. Does this projectile deal any knockback? What is the beginning and ending lag of this move.

Sure thing.

Also, I'm trying to keep true to Gengar as a character. He is a relatively weak, unimpressive physical fighter, which is why I make his physical moves unimpressive.

Grabs/Throws
The grab is kind of cool visually. It just needs an approximate reach compared to other grabs and an approximate beginning and ending lag compared to other grabs. The Pummel is simple and you describe it's detail adequately. The F-Throw is bland, but atleast it has the proper details. The Back Throw is fairly cool, but this one needs its lag and knockback described (just saying "kills *insert character* @ *insert %* isn't good enough). Ah, okay. The Up Throw improves with the opponent's weight. That is pretty creative. All you really need for this is the lag. If you really wanted to be noticed, you would give the amounts for every Brawl character, or give an estimated range. Making Dream Eater a throw wasn't a bad move, considering most make it the pummel. It was described pretty well, though including its lag would be a good idea.

Uh, yes, saying "kills Mario at 109%" IS good enough, because all characters are based off of Mario's weight.

But yeah, I'll be sure to add more detail.

[QUOTE]
Neutral B
Well... the attack is okay, but it could definitely be better. Judging by its current description, it has an initial explosion and also poisons that spot for some time. How much time does the poison last? Perhaps if you really wanted to make it more unique, you could have the struck foe(s) also become little poison bombs themselves (they release poison at regular times, dealing damage to themselves and to foes next to them). Another troubling detail is the reach of the move. You say it changes based on angle, but you fail to give approximate reaches with the different angles (which I would assume are the 4 cardinal directions and the diagonals). Being a projectile, a flight speed is also helpful. How large is the blast radius of the initial explosion?
[/QUOTE]

Will add.

Side B
Umm okay... this move would actually make a great A combo. You state it deals potentially infinite hits of 1% each. How many hits are there per second (estimated)? How much beginning and ending lag does this move have? Perhaps, to make this move more interesting, you could change it's function, like have it be an extension of Gengar himself, able to perform things such as grabs, attacks, etc. (just not specials as you are holding the B button). Another idea would be to keep its current effect, but have the shadow extend the longer you use the move.

I'll try to come up with something more creative.

Down B
Okay... this move is really kind of boring, basically being a mix between Disable and Sing. But if you aren't going to change it's effects, atleast describe things like its reach and lag, as well as the amount of time it puts the foe to sleep.

'K.

Up B
The Up B is basically a short duration version of Pit's Up B that allows Gengar to attack. Well... atleast it works and isn't exactly like anything in Brawl. Perhaps you should increase its duration to 3 seconds?

I need to add more detail to it. lol

Thanks for the critique, nonetheless.

Dr. Albert W. Wily · Apr 13, 2009

Wow, these look nice. I'm going to have to step it up if I want to place high with any of my sets.

Anyway, I have lurked on this website for some time, but haven't really found anything to make me want to join and post until now, y'know?

I might post a moveset some time this week, and it's gonna be for this guy:

I am a hardcore Mega Man fanboy, so expect Robot Masters from me, lol. I hope I do well.

BKupa666 · Apr 13, 2009

Welcome to Make Your Move, Dr. AWW

Dr. Albert W. Wily · Apr 13, 2009

BKupa666 said:
Welcome to Make Your Move, Dr. AWW

Thanks, BKupa666. Nice PINGAS/What is Love avatar.

BKupa666 · Apr 13, 2009

Dr. Albert W. Wily said:
Thanks, BKupa666. Nice PINGAS/What is Love avatar.

LOL I just changed it to my Sin avvy, but yeah, I liked that one.

In case you haven't picked up by my username, I am a huge Bowser fan.

Dr. Albert W. Wily · Apr 13, 2009

Yep.

Arthur is frightening, in an awesome way.

Hyper_Ridley · Apr 13, 2009

Oh great, Megaman's arch nemesis just joined MYM. Now we'll all be forced to help him create robot masters to defeat Megaman. XD

dancingfrogman · Apr 13, 2009

Welcome to MYM Wiley (your username is just so long), and good luck with your set.

And your avi and location just makes me think about Agis Air man set (and the B-air literally sucking)

Theres been a good amount of megaman sets thus far, now Sonic will be coming back with its sets. Sonic_will_not_die.

Hyper_Ridley · Apr 13, 2009

dancingfrogman said:
Theres been a good amount of megaman sets thus far, now Sonic will be coming back with its sets. Sonic_will_not_die.

Oh yes, Sonic is indeed coming back. My secret move set is in fact a Sonic character, one that required some creative liberties to even function as a playable character. In fact, I think I've already revealed it to you Frogman.

Dr. Albert W. Wily · Apr 13, 2009

Hyper_Ridley said:
Oh great, Megaman's arch nemesis just joined MYM. Now we'll all be forced to help him create robot masters to defeat Megaman. XD

LOL

It's nice to see a fellow MM fan. I love your Bass and Treble set.

dancingfrogman said:
Welcome to MYM Wiley (your username is just so long), and good luck with your set.

And your avi and location just makes me think about Agis Air man set (and the B-air literally sucking)

Theres been a good amount of megaman sets thus far, now Sonic will be coming back with its sets. Sonic_will_not_die.

Thanks. That is a nice moveset, I'd like to meet this Agi fellow.

Baloo · Apr 13, 2009

Gengar is pretty cool. But more color would be nice. Liked Curse, broken damage ftw.

Welcome Dr. Aww. I'm just gonna call you Aww.

Blinx looks a lot better now, sandbags.

majora_787 · Apr 13, 2009

Camus is almost done. It's hard to make him work...but I can manage.

Also, someone tell Spadefox that this one won't give him "eye cancer."

Dr. Albert W. Wily · Apr 13, 2009

Baloo said:
Gengar is pretty cool. But more color would be nice. Liked Curse, broken damage ftw.

Welcome Dr. Aww. I'm just gonna call you Aww.

Blinx looks a lot better now, sandbags.

HOW DARE YOU INSULT THE GREAT DR. WILY!

...jk, thanks.

Also (so this won't be spam), can a character have grounded super armor while crouching as a special mechanic? Or is that broken?

Chris Lionheart · Apr 13, 2009

majora_787 said:
Camus is almost done. It's hard to make him work...but I can manage.

Also, someone tell Spadefox that this one won't give him "eye cancer."

I am looking forward to this set. An FE set is always nice, and Camus has to be one of the most awesome characters in the series. Too bad he isn't playable without hacking.

majora_787 · Apr 13, 2009

Finally, General Camus is done. So my list looks some thing like this:
~~Camus~~ - Cacturne - Mello - ReDead

General Camus
http://images4.wikia.nocookie.net/fireemblem/images/3/3b/CamusDS.jpg
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[\[Bio]/]

The commanding officer and one man army of Grust's Sable Order. Despite his liege's alliance with the Manakete empire of Dolhr, he fought only for his country and its honor. He saved the princess of Archanea from execution and sent her to Aurelis for her safety, and was thought dead after a battle with Marth some time later. However, he had simply taken on a new identity and reappeared under the name Sirius. Camus is also the holder of the legendary lance Gradivus.
==========================================================
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[\[Stats]/]

[Power] 7/10 Camus is a powerhouse with his lance, swinging it with one arm Ike style.
[Speed] 4/10 Camus isn't fast. Then again, he doesn't even try to run.
[A. C.] 1/10 Camus is weilding a lance. He can't do anything well in the air. Even his landing is bad.
[Recov] 3/10 Camus can't recover by himself, he needs a cleric of the Sable Order.
[Cntrl] 1/10 Camus isn't easy to control His lance is very long, making it hard to handle on the battlefield.
[Ovral] 5/10 Camus is the biggest double-edged sword there is. He's useless in the hands of a newbie, and a regular nuke in the hands of a master.

[Wall Jump] No
[Wall Cling] No
[Crawl] No
[Jumps] 2
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[\[Special Attacks]/]

[N Spcl] Gradivus: Lengthen
Gradivus is a very long lance, capable of dispatching archers and mages in Fire Emblem, despite being a melee weapon. In Smash, Camus has the ability to attack with his lance at normal length, or he can lengthen it. Camus will hold his lance out, pointing away from him, and it will extend about the length of one of Battlefield's platforms. When it extends, it pushes opponents just outside its attack range and deals 5% damage. When Gradivus is extended, Camus becomes slower in every way. His attacks even become slightly weaker. However, he gets a greater range, and attacks both sides in the majority of his attacks. The lance will remain extended for 20 seconds, or until Camus takes 20% of damage.

[S Spcl] Impale
Camus stretches out his hand, and his horse rides by from nowhere. Holding onto the side, he will skid his feet along the ground and impale anyone in front of him with his lance. Despite how the attack looks, all of the damage comes from Camus. Not the horse. While it may look like you'll be knocked for a loop, you'll be impaled on the end of Gradivus, and Camus will let go of the horse. Camus lets go of the horse when he reaches the end of a platform or hits a wall, as well. After releasing the horse, Camus will flick the lance to remove you if he hit you. If he didn't he will be wide open to attack for two or three seconds. The attack its self is easy to dodge, if you dodge the tip of the lance. However, when used in conjunction with Lengthen, that can be far easier said than done.

[D Spcl] Aggravate
Camus dismisses an opponent within his range(Half of Battlefield), as long as they are making eye contact. The opponent will, against the player's wishes, run toward Camus and grab him. When grabbed, Camus asks where his
lance is. The opponent looks up, and Gradivus falls from above, stabbing between them and Camus. The opponent
flies away and is left with 15%. The knockback is pretty decent. The startup is obvious, especially if you're looking at Camus. His lance will disappear, and he will change idle poses noticeably to one where he's facing the screen and looking at the target. The actual attack will hit immediatly if someone is in range, but if they are doing a roll to turn away, are not facing him, or there is an item like a crate or barrel between the two, the attack will fail and Camus will be open for about four seconds before his lance lands and he is ready to fight again.

[U Spcl] Warp
Camus doesn't have a way to recover with his lance. However, he has a vast army at his disposal. He abuses this
fact by summoning a Cleric or Curate to his location. The Cleric/Curate will use the Warp spell, which is extremely
similar to Mewtwo's teleport. It goes very far, but is generally hard to control. If you used Warp from the ledge of
Final dDestination, you would end up grabbing the opposite ledge. It does no damage to anyone, but is a very decent
recovery.
==========================================================
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[\[Final Smash]/] The Sable Order
Camus puts his lance away and motions for something to come from the side of the screen. The stage begins to shake as hundreds of horseback riders spawn on every platform behind Camus, stampeding in the direction he's facing. Camus is invincible during this attack, but the horses are not. They can be defeated with a single smash attack. However, they come very fast and very close together, so it isn't recommended. The smash will go on for seven seconds. After the soldiers vanish, Camus will mount his horse and will be able to move around the stage at very high speeds while swinging Gradivus. This lasts fifteen seconds.

The horse stampede is very fast. They will hit for 10% a piece, and will carry you offstage with them if you aren't
careful.

Camus is invincible in his enhanced state, and his range is enormous. He will hit for 20% with each swing. However,
he must wait three seconds between swings, and the lance only knocks opponents just outside the attack range.
==========================================================
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[\[Standard Attacks]/]

[Stndrd] Fool
Camus drops the lance down on the opponent's head. The opponent takes 5%. No knockback, but the opponent is briefly stunned.

[U Tilt] Invert
Camus brings the handle-end of Gradivus up under his opponent, and swings them over his head and down onto the ground behind them with the lance. 7%, no knockback. The opponent is briefly stunned.

[F Tilt] Contact
This is probably the only move where Camus doesn't hit the opponent with Gradivus. He jabs it into the ground, and
spins around it, doing an airial kick to both sides. The kick does 9% and has small knockback.

[D Tilt] Meteor Needle
Camus jumps in the air straight up, and places gradivus underneath him. He then lands on the lance, which impales
the ground, or the opponent underneath him for 10% and very small knockback.

[Dshatk] Path Maker
Camus runs with gradivus like he's about to joust, and impales everyone in his way. This dash attack is unique in
the sense that it doesn't stop Camus, and won't deactivate until he stops running altogether. The attack does 2%
and pulls the opponent with Camus for as far as he plans on going. Opponents can stack.

[Ledge1] Grappling Hook
Gradivus extends longer than normal and impales the edge. Camus then flips over the lance and pulls it out. The
recovery does 1% with moderate knockback.

[Ledge2] Light of Gradivus
This recovery is very useful. Gradivus lets out a bright light, and anyone on the ledge becomes stunned. No damage
is dealt. Camus slowly climbs onto the stage, leaving him just enough time for either an escape or a quick tilt.
==========================================================
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[\[Smash Attacks]/]

[U Smash] Smackdown
Camus flips the opponent straight up with Gradivus as he does in his up tilt, but he then slams the lance down on
them, spiking them straight into the ground. If it misses, obviously, Camus is left WAY open. The initial swing
does 6%, and the smackdown does 10%. The first swing has low knockback.

[F Smash] Heart Stopper
Camus takes a large step forward and stabs Gradivus forward as hard as he can. The attack does 20% and pushes the opponent all the way outside Camus's attack range.

[D Smash] Fissure
Camus stabs Gradivus into the ground, and the ground cracks from the blow around him. Enemies who are hit with this fly up a short distance and take 13%.
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[\[Aerial Attacks]/]

[U Air] Air Flip
Camus spins in the air, making a 360 with Gradivus pointing away from him at all times. It's slow and easy to dodge
doing 7% but moderate knockback.

[F Air] Bludgeon
Camus slams Gradivus straight down ahead of him. It does 12%, and has moderate knockback at the tip. At the handle, it shares stats with the Air Ring.

[B Air] Scrape
Camus tries to mimic is forward airial by swinging the lance backwards over his shoulder. This, of course, only does
4% and has low knockback.

[D Air] Air Trip
Camus stabs the lance downward while falling. This makes him fall much more slowly than before. When it hits an
opponent, they take 8% and moderate knockback.

[N Air] Air Ring
Camus tries to mimic Pit by spinning Gradivus in a slow circle as he falls. It does 3% and has very low knockback.
==========================================================
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[\[Throws]/]

[ Grab ] Preperation
Camus stabs the lance forward, and the opponent gets stuck with it going through them.

[Pummel] Execution: Slow
Camus spins Gradivus, dealing 2% to the opponent.

[U Thrw] Disposal
Camus flings the opponent straight up with the lance. The knockback is low, and they take 4%.

[F Thrw] Fair Fight
Camus releases the opponent. This throw is really useful in 1v1 fights, because the opponent can't attack Camus
when he's vulnerable from this throw. Knockback is low, and damage is 8%.

[B Thrw] Waste of Time
Camus flings the opponent from the lance over his shoulder. The opponent takes 8% when they land.

[D Thrw] Execution: Fast
Camus rips Gradivus out, jumps over the opponent, and slashes the lance through them in a spin before he lands.
There is little knockback, and the opponent takes 13%.
==========================================================
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[\[Playstyle]/]

Camus is slow and powerful, but both in weird ways. Camus simply walks quickly for his run, for an unknown reason.
Maybe he just wants to look cool. Anyway, his lance attacks all push the opponent just outside the attack range.
This requires a strategy where you move the opponent to the edge and then attack with the lance to the point where
the end of the lance passes the blast line. It's really the only way for him to KO.

Camus's tilts rely on blunt melee with the lance while his smash relies on stabs and swings. When Gradivus is in
the upward position, his tilts come out slightly faster. When his lance is in the forward position(See picture),
his smash attacks come out faster.
==========================================================
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[\[Poses]/]

[Idle] Camus stands quietly as he does in the picture, gripping his lance either upward or forward, depending on when he last attacked.
[Entry] Camus jumps from his horse and retrieves Gradivus, which was tied to the side of it.
[Select] "We both know this fight is unavoidable."
[Taunt1] Camus takes out a small cloth and cleans Gradivus, then puts the cloth back away.
[Taunt2] Camus presents a battle-ready position similar to Ike's counter.
[Taunt3] Camus points his spear forward. This taunt makes him carry his spear in the upward position.
[Vctry1] Camus ties Gradivus to his horse and walks with it offscreen.
[vctry2] Camus is seen talking to some Grustian soldiers, and they both walk offscreen. Camus doesn't turn to face the camera, or even notice it.
[vctry3] Camus is not even here for his final victory.
[ loss ] Camus goes missing again...like in the game, he doesn't people to see his sore loser face.
[Dizzy] Camus holds his head with his hands and breaths heavily.
[Sleep] Camus leans on Gradivus, which is in the ground, and snores loudly. Who knew?
==========================================================
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[\[Other]/]

[Shield] Camus stands behind his lance and uses it as somewhat of a barrier.
[F Dodg] Camus does a frontflip and lands facing the opposite direction.
[B Dodg] Camus pushes himself backwards a ways with Gradivus.
[A Dodg] Camus defends himself with Gradivus, making him invulnurable.
[Unlock] Get 5,000 KO's with Marth or play 5,000 versus matches on a Fire Emblem stage.

[Kirby]
Kirby gets Camus's hair and a small Gradivus. However, it merely lengthens in an attack. It does not effect
Kirby's fighting style in any way.

[Alt Clr]
black with gold trim
Red with Black trim
Green with Gold trim
Blue with White trim
Black with Red trim, also gives Gray skin and Red eyes
White with Yellow trim

[Codec]
Snake: Otacon, there's a guy here with a really...really long spear.
Otacon: That's the leader of the Sable Order Knights, Gen. Camus. And the spear he's holding is the legendary Lance, Gradivus.
Sn: Huh. What's so special about him?
Ot: He's known as the greatest warrior alive. He never loses his calm in the heat of battle, and is known for his ultimate skill with the lance.
Ot: That's why he has Gradivus to begin with. Gradivus has the ability to extend, and it always holds enemies at a distance.
Sn: I'll just blast him from back here, then.
Ot: His lance will bounce your grenades in your face and cut your missiles open. You'll need to attack from above or below, Snake.
Ot: Oh, and one more thing: Don't give him a chance to call for backup. That could be the last mistake you make.

ALSO!! Before ANYBODY complains about ACCURACY... ONE WORD: NTSC

EDIT: I'm REALLY sorry bout the picture there, it wasn't that big when I opened it. It like...mutated.

Sun-Wukong · Apr 13, 2009

Two things. One, why is the picture so big?

Two...

majora_787 said:
[Vctry1] Camus ties Gradivus to his horse and walks with it offscreen.
[vctry2] Camus is seen talking to some Grustian soldiers, and they both walk offscreen. Camus doesn't turn to face the camera, or even notice it.
[vctry3] Camus is not even here for his final victory.

Victree?

majora_787 · Apr 13, 2009

Sun-Wukong said:
Two things. One, why is the picture so big?

Two...

Victree?

One, I fixed and explained that.

Two, I abbreviated some terms so they would stay the same length in the brackets. It helps me keep up with what I'm doing at the very beginning, and I don't go back and change it.

ALSO, new thing. I'm color-organizing my moveset. Cyan is Data, which includes the name, bio, picture and special mechanic(s). Red is Combat, which is where all of the attackes are.Lime is Extras, like the codec and kirby hat. Also where I put the stuff I finish movesets up with.

flyinfilipino · Apr 13, 2009

Just a word of advice, majora: I'd bold the headers for each section (i.e. Special Attacks). It'd make certain moves in the set easier to find.

majora_787 · Apr 13, 2009

flyinfilipino said:
Just a word of advice, majora: I'd bold the headers for each section (i.e. Special Attacks). It'd make certain moves in the set easier to find.

I didn't do it when I posted it because I was lagging horribly. I'll go back and fix it tomorrow or something.

Chris Lionheart · Apr 13, 2009

Camus

Ok... here is a picture (shown above) that isn't so huge. http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb180/albedo238/Fire Emblem Pics/Camus.jpg

In addition, here is his original FE1 portrait (alternate outfit).
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c69/WindSety/Fire Emblem/Fire Emblem 3/Sirius2.gif

And here is his original FE3 appearance as Sirius, his alternate identity.
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c69/WindSety/Fire Emblem/Fire Emblem 3/Sirius1.gif

Ok.. now onto the comments.

Being the resident FE fan, I know more about the characters than just about anyone here. I have to say, Camus is one of my favorite characters in Shadow Dragon.

BB Code + Organization
The set is a real eye-sore, even now that you've gotten rid of the huge picture. Having entire sections be one color is not much better than not having color at all. Generally, you want to make your section titles and move names a different color than your text (this is the generally accepted font).

Stats
Okay... control isn't a stat unless you are talking about traction. Nothing really wrong with what you have provided... though you need to include stats such as height, weight, jump heights, falling speed, etc.

Neutral B
A really simple concept. I didn't actually know Gradivius could do that... then again I don't use the Shadow Dragon legendary weapons (or really have need of them because they are nearly useless, with the exception of Falchion and Starlight). While the concept of this move isn't bad... it is underdetailed and possibly underpowered... how far does it increase your attack range... how much does it slow you down... how much does it decrease your damage? And is the time limit and damage % cancel really necessary or practical? Seems like it would be more fair to just let him return it to normal by pressing B again.

Side B
This is actually a unique way to implement Camus's mount. You didn't even bother stating the damage of this move. You also neglected its beginning lag and its normal ending lag (if he doesn't miss). In addition... there is way to much lag if this move fails... it is hardly powerful enough to warrant that much lag.

Down B
A fairly unique attack... I'm not sure if it is really in character, because characterization in Shadow Dragon is just deplorable. Anyway, other than missing details, the only thing wrong with this move is the huge amount of ending lag... even 2 seconds might be overkill

Up B
The Up Special is creative enough..., though frankly it is very underdetailed, and Camus isn't exactly a prime candidate to use warp. The Neutral B could have really been a recovery option, like a tether. You fail to state how much beginning lag and ending lag this has and how far it allows you to recover. In addition, this puts your stats section into question. "[Recov] 3/10 Camus can't recover by himself, he needs a cleric of the Sable Order." Sounds like he always has a cleric at his disposal.... what the heck?

Final Smash
I don't really know what to think of it. It seems like a combination of (a modified) Ganondorf's Final Smash with the typical character buff (except this character buff sucks). By your vague description, it sounds like the horses will run right off the sides of the stage with you, running on air. o.O

Normal Attacks
The neutral A combo seems pretty lame... And where are the lag and reach stats of the move? The Dash Attack is kind of funny.... CAMUS INVENTOR OF THE SHISH KABOB! Perhaps you should buff its damage up to a more reasonable 5% or higher... and include the necessary details such as beginning lag, ending lag, and how far his spear reaches.

Tilts
The Side Tilt is simple and yet kind of awesome. It still needs a lot more detail. In addition, you could add in things like "misses small characters" or "causes Camus to dodge low attacks." The Up Tilt is unique enough. Brings the foe from air to ground, giving it some combo potential, seeing as how Camus is likely ground-based. Again.. how much beginning lag does it have. How much ending lag does it have, and how far upwards does it go. How far away is the opponent from Camus when they are slammed to the ground. The Down Tilt seems kind of useless, seeing as it hits where Camus is standing. It is unique enough... but it needs some sort of extended hitbox, such as a shockwave, to actually be useful. Perhaps this move could knock grounded foes within a short distance of him to the ground, tripping them.

Smashes
Okay the Side Smash is kind of generic in appearance, but by the sound of it, it is high damage and no killing potential (but some spacing potential), making it fairly unique. I like it, even if it does need MOAR DETAILZ. The Up Smash is just an extended version of the Up Tilt, which really hurts creativity. Perhaps you could have it cause a pitfall effect on the foe to mix things up a little. Again.. moar detailz plz. The Up Smash is cool, but it is largely the same story as the other moves. How far do the cracks extend the move's range? Does this strike aerial opponents? Another problem that affects all of your smashes is that you failed to include the affects of charging the smash. Most of the time, this just increases damage to a certain maximum (that you need to include), though some opt to be more creative and have it boost priority, reach, etc.

Aerials
The nair is very generic, but atleast it has a bit more detail, as you have stated it is slow to come out. Is it slow or fast to end? How far does the spear reach (you have so far failed to state how far the maximum reach of the spear is, both normal and extended). The Fair is also generic, basically just being Ike's Fair but with a sweetspot-sourspot effect (though it even seems inferior sweetspotted). It could use a buff at the sweetspot and, as usual, more detail. Not only is the Bair a mirrored version of the Fair (a tabuu even greater than uncreativity in MYM5) but it is also completely useless, dealing only 4% and low knockback. Generally, Bairs are better than Fairs. The Dair is okay. Kind of like a reverse version of Link's Dair (slowing him down rather than causing him to fall faster). It's still pretty gener and underdetailed. Okay... not only is the Uair a clone of Pit's Uair, but it is a lame cloned version too. I'm pretty sure that the one man army of Grust can do better than this!

Grabs/Throws
The grab is unique (yet predictable) enough, but it needs to have a grab range and lags compared to other grabs. This Grab would never get in Smash though.... imagine how badly children would be offended.... ouch that pummel sounds painful. You need to compare the speed of this pummel to that of other pummels. The throws all seem pretty pointless, except the down throw... they all do like no knockback at all... why not pick the one that deals the best damage? Seriously... you need variety in the throws section (some of them have to do good knockback). Atleast you included damage and knockback though. Might want to include beginning lag, duration, and ending lag.

Necessary Details
Damage Percentages
Knockback (usually given in estimations like low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Attack Reach (how far does an attack reach? Often given in SBB's, or Stage Builder Blocks, Bodylengths, or by comparing them to another move, or perhaps just with estimations like low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Beginning Lag + Ending Lag (though some include estimated or exact times or frames, most just say something along the lines of low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Priority (if this attack collides with another attack, does it overpower the other attack, are both attacks neutralized, or does the other attack overpower this one, again, this is usually given in estimations like low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Hitstun
Flight Speed (for projectiles)
Projectile Reach (for projectiles. Most often given through SBB's, Bodylengths, or by comparing it to the distance of other projectiles or by stating how much of Final Destination the projectile would travel).
Projectile Priority (if this collides with another projectile, which one wins?)
Move Duration

Overview
Camus really shows a lack of innovation, unlike Blinx, and, to an extent, Gengar. It is far from the worst set in this contest, but it really needs improvements. This, unlike the other two, does not have the advantage of being called a newcomer set, as Majora has been in MYM since MYM3. It wasn't all bad... atleast some of the moves were remotely interesting, and there was some detail. You could certainly see the character fitting into Smash. A problem with this set is that it has no real personality at all... you could stick any FE spear user on their and it would fit. This is made even worse in the fact that you made him rely so little on his horse, making him not even a Palidan. All in all, it could really be a lot better. I hope you do take something from this comment, Majora, rather than maintaining your current level, but if you don't, that is your own choice.

majora_787 · Apr 13, 2009

Chris Lionheart said:
Camus

Ok... here is a picture (shown above) that isn't so huge. http://i209.photobucket.com/albums/bb180/albedo238/Fire Emblem Pics/Camus.jpg

In addition, here is his original FE1 portrait (alternate outfit).
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c69/WindSety/Fire Emblem/Fire Emblem 3/Sirius2.gif

And here is his original FE3 appearance as Sirius, his alternate identity.
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c69/WindSety/Fire Emblem/Fire Emblem 3/Sirius1.gif

Ok.. now onto the comments.

Being the resident FE fan, I know more about the characters than just about anyone here. I have to say, Camus is one of my favorite characters in Shadow Dragon.

BB Code + Organization
The set is a real eye-sore, even now that you've gotten rid of the huge picture. Having entire sections be one color is not much better than not having color at all. Generally, you want to make your section titles and move names a different color than your text (this is the generally accepted font).

Stats
Okay... control isn't a stat unless you are talking about traction. Nothing really wrong with what you have provided... though you need to include stats such as height, weight, jump heights, falling speed, etc.

Neutral B
A really simple concept. I didn't actually know Gradivius could do that... then again I don't use the Shadow Dragon legendary weapons (or really have need of them because they are nearly useless, with the exception of Falchion and Starlight). While the concept of this move isn't bad... it is underdetailed and possibly underpowered... how far does it increase your attack range... how much does it slow you down... how much does it decrease your damage? And is the time limit and damage % cancel really necessary or practical? Seems like it would be more fair to just let him return it to normal by pressing B again.

Side B
This is actually a unique way to implement Camus's mount. You didn't even bother stating the damage of this move. You also neglected its beginning lag and its normal ending lag (if he doesn't miss). In addition... there is way to much lag if this move fails... it is hardly powerful enough to warrant that much lag.

Down B
A fairly unique attack... I'm not sure if it is really in character, because characterization in Shadow Dragon is just deplorable. Anyway, other than missing details, the only thing wrong with this move is the huge amount of ending lag... even 2 seconds might be overkill

Up B
The Up Special is creative enough..., though frankly it is very underdetailed, and Camus isn't exactly a prime candidate to use warp. The Neutral B could have really been a recovery option, like a tether. You fail to state how much beginning lag and ending lag this has and how far it allows you to recover. In addition, this puts your stats section into question. "[Recov] 3/10 Camus can't recover by himself, he needs a cleric of the Sable Order." Sounds like he always has a cleric at his disposal.... what the heck?

Final Smash
I don't really know what to think of it. It seems like a combination of (a modified) Ganondorf's Final Smash with the typical character buff (except this character buff sucks). By your vague description, it sounds like the horses will run right off the sides of the stage with you, running on air. o.O

Normal Attacks
The neutral A combo seems pretty lame... And where are the lag and reach stats of the move? The Dash Attack is kind of funny.... CAMUS INVENTOR OF THE SHISH KABOB! Perhaps you should buff its damage up to a more reasonable 5% or higher... and include the necessary details such as beginning lag, ending lag, and how far his spear reaches.

Tilts
The Side Tilt is simple and yet kind of awesome. It still needs a lot more detail. In addition, you could add in things like "misses small characters" or "causes Camus to dodge low attacks." The Up Tilt is unique enough. Brings the foe from air to ground, giving it some combo potential, seeing as how Camus is likely ground-based. Again.. how much beginning lag does it have. How much ending lag does it have, and how far upwards does it go. How far away is the opponent from Camus when they are slammed to the ground. The Down Tilt seems kind of useless, seeing as it hits where Camus is standing. It is unique enough... but it needs some sort of extended hitbox, such as a shockwave, to actually be useful. Perhaps this move could knock grounded foes within a short distance of him to the ground, tripping them.

Smashes
Okay the Side Smash is kind of generic in appearance, but by the sound of it, it is high damage and no killing potential (but some spacing potential), making it fairly unique. I like it, even if it does need MOAR DETAILZ. The Up Smash is just an extended version of the Up Tilt, which really hurts creativity. Perhaps you could have it cause a pitfall effect on the foe to mix things up a little. Again.. moar detailz plz. The Up Smash is cool, but it is largely the same story as the other moves. How far do the cracks extend the move's range? Does this strike aerial opponents? Another problem that affects all of your smashes is that you failed to include the affects of charging the smash. Most of the time, this just increases damage to a certain maximum (that you need to include), though some opt to be more creative and have it boost priority, reach, etc.

Aerials
The nair is very generic, but atleast it has a bit more detail, as you have stated it is slow to come out. Is it slow or fast to end? How far does the spear reach (you have so far failed to state how far the maximum reach of the spear is, both normal and extended). The Fair is also generic, basically just being Ike's Fair but with a sweetspot-sourspot effect (though it even seems inferior sweetspotted). It could use a buff at the sweetspot and, as usual, more detail. Not only is the Bair a mirrored version of the Fair (a tabuu even greater than uncreativity in MYM5) but it is also completely useless, dealing only 4% and low knockback. Generally, Bairs are better than Fairs. The Dair is okay. Kind of like a reverse version of Link's Dair (slowing him down rather than causing him to fall faster). It's still pretty gener and underdetailed. Okay... not only is the Uair a clone of Pit's Uair, but it is a lame cloned version too. I'm pretty sure that the one man army of Grust can do better than this!

Grabs/Throws
The grab is unique (yet predictable) enough, but it needs to have a grab range and lags compared to other grabs. This Grab would never get in Smash though.... imagine how badly children would be offended.... ouch that pummel sounds painful. You need to compare the speed of this pummel to that of other pummels. The throws all seem pretty pointless, except the down throw... they all do like no knockback at all... why not pick the one that deals the best damage? Seriously... you need variety in the throws section (some of them have to do good knockback). Atleast you included damage and knockback though. Might want to include beginning lag, duration, and ending lag.

Necessary Details
Damage Percentages
Knockback (usually given in estimations like low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Attack Reach (how far does an attack reach? Often given in SBB's, or Stage Builder Blocks, Bodylengths, or by comparing them to another move, or perhaps just with estimations like low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Beginning Lag + Ending Lag (though some include estimated or exact times or frames, most just say something along the lines of low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Priority (if this attack collides with another attack, does it overpower the other attack, are both attacks neutralized, or does the other attack overpower this one, again, this is usually given in estimations like low, medium, good, great, etc.)
Hitstun
Flight Speed (for projectiles)
Projectile Reach (for projectiles. Most often given through SBB's, Bodylengths, or by comparing it to the distance of other projectiles or by stating how much of Final Destination the projectile would travel).
Projectile Priority (if this collides with another projectile, which one wins?)
Move Duration

Overview
Camus really shows a lack of innovation, unlike Blinx, and, to an extent, Gengar. It is far from the worst set in this contest, but it really needs improvements. This, unlike the other two, does not have the advantage of being called a newcomer set, as Majora has been in MYM since MYM3. It wasn't all bad... atleast some of the moves were remotely interesting, and there was some detail. You could certainly see the character fitting into Smash. A problem with this set is that it has no real personality at all... you could stick any FE spear user on their and it would fit. This is made even worse in the fact that you made him rely so little on his horse, making him not even a Palidan. All in all, it could really be a lot better. I hope you do take something from this comment, Majora, rather than maintaining your current level, but if you don't, that is your own choice.

Thanks for the criticism...but one thing to note.

It took me five minutes to remove the picture. The computer is horrible, and I had to fix spelling errors that came from sentences I had written being EATEN.

I'll fix all of this up when I have a fast computer to do it on. Right now, I can't promise ANYTHING. Sorry if the incident dissapointed you, though.

EDIT: My original draft of specials was FOR a horseback Camus. But people complained about the horse making him cheap (Apparently a fast heavyweight with long range is bad.)

Also, I didn't know HOW Gradivus did it, but in the game it could allow Camus to fight back against Mages and Archers. I assumed it was just a really long Lance.

And the taunt special, I presented the wrong image. I can tell. What it was supposed to consist of was Camus not wanting to waste time or effort on fighting an unnecessary battle, and the enemy would take offense from that and attack.

I'll tweak EVERYTHING there as soon as possible, and will get back to you.

NOTE 1: About the pummel...I don't know what you WANTED me to do there, I mean, ESPECIALLY if there's no blood I don't see it being too out of place in a T-rated series.

NOTE 2: I didn't give him flashy, amazing, original aerials for a REASON. I figured a lance would be a weapon that would be HARD to use in the air, and almost useless in aerial combat.

Chris Lionheart · Apr 13, 2009

majora_787 said:
Thanks for the criticism...but one thing to note.

It took me five minutes to remove the picture. The computer is horrible, and I had to fix spelling errors that came from sentences I had written being EATEN.

I'll fix all of this up when I have a fast computer to do it on. Right now, I can't promise ANYTHING. Sorry if the incident dissapointed you, though.

It wasn't really all that dissappointing. I wasn't expecting much from a generic character.

EDIT: My original draft of specials was FOR a horseback Camus. But people complained about the horse making him cheap (Apparently a fast heavyweight with long range is bad.)

And for this reason, you decrease other stats or give him other weaknesses for balance purposes. You can't expect a horserider to have a great recovery, air game, etc. You could also see him as not fairing well against foes who get up in his face. Perhaps you could even knock Camus off his horse, causing him lag as he gets back on.

Also, I didn't know HOW Gradivus did it, but in the game it could allow Camus to fight back against Mages and Archers. I assumed it was just a really long Lance.

Like I said.... I don't use Gradivus, but it is very similar to The Wishblade of FE9/10. By that I mean, it can be thrown like a Javelin.

And the taunt special, I presented the wrong image. I can tell. What it was supposed to consist of was Camus not wanting to waste time or effort on fighting an unnecessary battle, and the enemy would take offense from that and attack.

I got the right image... it just doesn't seem all that fitting of Camus. You could easily see him doing something more practical. A whole cinematic movie for an attack just seems annoying.

I'll tweak EVERYTHING there as soon as possible, and will get back to you.

NOTE 1: About the pummel...I don't know what you WANTED me to do there, I mean, ESPECIALLY if there's no blood I don't see it being too out of place in a T-rated series.

I personally didn't see anything wrong with the pummel. I was kind of joking. Just be sure to compare it's speed to that of other pummels.

NOTE 2: I didn't give him flashy, amazing, original aerials for a REASON. I figured a lance would be a weapon that would be HARD to use in the air, and almost useless in aerial combat.

See Sheeda (page 57.)

Replies in yellow.

Wizzerd · Apr 13, 2009

Something I perhaps should have said earlier: about a week ago, I e-mailed to Kyle Gabler and Ron Carmel- the two people in 2D Boy, the indie studio that made World of Goo- my moveset for The Goos. I'm awaiting a response.

Make Your Move 5

Smash Champion

Smash Hero

Smash Lord

Smash Champion

Smash Cadet

Smash Cadet

Smash Lord

Smash Champion

Smash Ace

Smash Legend

Smash Ace

Smash Ace

Smash Champion

Perpetual Lazy Bum

Smash Champion

Smash Hero

Smash Champion

Perpetual Lazy Bum

Smash Rookie

Barnacled Boss

Smash Rookie

Barnacled Boss

Smash Rookie

Smash Champion

Smash Ace

Smash Champion

Smash Rookie

Smash Ace

Smash Hero

Smash Rookie

Smash Champion

Smash Hero

Smash Journeyman

Smash Hero

Smash Master

Smash Hero

Smash Champion

Smash Hero

Smash Champion

Smash Ace

Information

Network