God **** It! (pardon the pun)

Darkslash · Aug 7, 2009

3mmanuel said:
Yeah, I agree. It is unfair. After reading the entire Bible, I concluded it was stupid how one had to go through infinite sffering for finite sins.

Oh, and don't worry. I was christian until two montsh ago.

Wait what?

Also, doesn't it seem a bit unfair that someone has to go through infinite suffering for finite sins? And if you think Jesus was all good and stuff, read Matthew 11:20-24, among other passages.

If you have a sense of reading comprehension Matthew 11:20-24 is the equivalent of you lending thousands of dollars to some people who REFUSE to pay back. But these people could just repent. Yet they choose to continue what ever the hell they do there.

If that's the case, then why does the Christian Bible have both the Old and New Testament, rather than just the New Testament?

Old testament is really for cross referencing. Really the old testament should not be treated as"THE WORD AND TRUTH" as some people make it out to be. There are too many historical inaccuracies in some of them. And the OLD TESTAMENT where written originally by JEWS not CHRISTIANS. The New Testament was written by Christians.

The old testament was more of a Jewish based book than a christian based one. The Old testament is only in the bible to find all these prophecies and because Christianity was originally a branch off of Judaism.

P.S: Jesus was never Catholic/Protestant/Anglican/ect.

DK_047 · Aug 7, 2009

I think darkslash is right

JustKindaBoredUKno · Aug 7, 2009

I feel like ranting. So here's the situation.

My friends mom HATES him being around one of our friends, because he's agnostic. Not even atheist, just agnostic. She honestly assumes he's just a bad person all around because of it. Can't drive well, can't do anything well.

So now I'm starting up my "older generations need to accept that this and newer generations simply aren't religious anymore" rant.

According to a study done by Penguin Books, 2/3rds of teenagers polled don't even believe in God.

And furthermore, 6 out of 10 teens think religion has a negative impact on the world.

I just don't understand why the religious community needs to point the finger and shout HEATHENS! at every person who doesn't believe in exactly what they do.

I have faith that in the future, agnostics will be the majority. That people will do what is right, not because some book tells them to, but because its common sense, a human instinct to further ourselves as a whole for the improvement of society in general.

So in regards to the current situation:

It depends on age. You could convince a 9 year old God is really a Pokemon if you tried hard enough. But if its someone roughly your own age, and you know your stuff, I support you 100%. Nowadays I see so many parents shelter and seclude their kids from the real world, then the poor child doesn't know what do to. I say, let everyone know all their choices. Let them decide their lives.

Which is happening more and more. Which could explain why more and more people choose to be Agnostic.

Reaver197 · Aug 7, 2009

I heard about this thread and decided to swing by.

Yeah, it sucks that you're forced to go Bible Camp, and that your parents aren't very accepting of your stance on religion. My parents are somewhat religious (well, my dad is from a pretty Christian family, my mom is just some weird new age whackaloon), yet, I am lucky in the fact that they didn't react too negatively about me being an atheist, which was something that I was worried about. Now, I just have to see how the extended family and grandparents handle it, ha ha.

Never hide who you are. Don't be shy about your beliefs, stand them out the in open, and be confident in yourself.

Anyway, I also am of the opinion that it is unfair and somewhat immoral to instill a certain religious mindset, thought, or belief in children, because they do not have the experience or the cognitive ability to discern whether it is something they really want. People really ought to let children explore the possibilities and formulate their own opinion instead of limiting them and, essentially, brainwashing them with certain beliefs.

mountain_tiger · Aug 7, 2009

Well, my family is Christian, but not strongly so. As in, they don't go to church and the like. But they do seem to be rather iffy about certain things. Here's a conversation I had once:

Me: I'm not sure if I ever want to get married.
My mum: Oh, you never know. You may meet a girl you love, and who you want to have children with, and then you'll decide to get married.
Me: Hey. I never said anything about not having children.

Cue a very awkward silence and a rather scary stare.

GTA_Hater_331 · Aug 7, 2009

Don't get me wrong, anyone. I'm grateful that my mom's atheist and my dad's agnostic. I was a very obstreperous child, and if I would've gone to church on Sundays, I'd have been sealed in a side room during every single service. It's a stark contrast to my keep-the-cool nature today, but that's besides the point. The only ways I could see myself controlling people's lives is not letting them smoke, drink, do drugs, eat greasy food, or have unsafe sex. Why? Not because any dogma is against that stuff, but because they're unreasonably dangerous. I value personal freedom and choices, but I just can't stand for needless illness and death!

cookieM0Nster · Aug 7, 2009

GwJumpman said:
I'm late, but when Emmanuel says there is no hell, it's just as bad as Catholics claiming there is[/s] hell. So please, let him say what he wants, he's just as able to say what he thinks as religious people.

If he's smart, then he shouldn't care about saying that Hell doesn't exist.
And I am not Catholic fyi.

But I think that it is absolutely unfair that he is not repectful of religion, and I am respectful of atheism. However, I do NOT like athiests like him, who say that religion is BS and stuff like that.

Falconv1.0 · Aug 7, 2009

It's foolish to demand respect, earn it, don't just tell people to respect your beliefs and expect them to care. If he doesn't have the right to say Hell doesn't exist you don't have the right to tell you think he shouldn't say that. Free speech isn't just for when it suits you.

Clownbot · Aug 7, 2009

Falconv1.0 said:
It's foolish to demand respect, earn it, don't just tell people to respect your beliefs and expect them to care. If he doesn't have the right to say Hell doesn't exist you don't have the right to tell you think he shouldn't say that. Free speech isn't just for when it suits you.

Yeah, that's cool. I just don't respect him outright saying that there is no hell when there's no evidence to it. That's not expressing freedom of speech, that's acting like your belief is undeniably true, which is what it seems a lot of you guys seem to be angry at most Catholics about.

Once again, I can already sting from the replies this comment's going to get.

thumbswayup · Aug 7, 2009

Straked said:
You forgot the most important retort, MoP.

Noob is right. Morons, the bunch of you.

LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL

I think a George Carlin quote is suitable here:

"Christian, which I was, until I reached the age of reason"

mountain_tiger · Aug 7, 2009

Clownbot said:
Yeah, that's cool. I just don't respect him outright saying that there is no hell when there's no evidence to it. That's not expressing freedom of speech, that's acting like your belief is undeniably true, which is what it seems a lot of you guys seem to be angry at most Catholics about.

Once again, I can already sting from the replies this comment's going to get.

Look at it this way. Let's say that I claimed that the tooth fairy was real and lived 40 million lightyears away. You can't prove that there is no tooth fairy, can you? Yet if I were to sya that such a tooth fairy should be praised and worshipped, then you would think I'm insane. Yet if a book that's 2000 years old told you to do so, then people would worship said tooth fairy, even if there is no evidence to suggest its existence.

Most Catholics are fine IMO. Though I hate the Pope. He once went to Africa and said that condoms spread AIDS. I mean, condemning contraception is bad enough, but having the nerve to say that it actually helps to spread STIs... I hope he dies a horrible, slow, painful death.

Reaver197 · Aug 7, 2009

cookieM0Nster said:
But I think that it is absolutely unfair that he is not repectful of religion, and I am respectful of atheism. However, I do NOT like athiests like him, who say that religion is BS and stuff like that.

Uh...the whole point of atheism is that there are no gods, and thus religions are nothing but man-made myths.

Falconv1.0 · Aug 7, 2009

Clownbot said:
Yeah, that's cool. I just don't respect him outright saying that there is no hell when there's no evidence to it. That's not expressing freedom of speech, that's acting like your belief is undeniably true, which is what it seems a lot of you guys seem to be angry at most Catholics about.

Once again, I can already sting from the replies this comment's going to get.

That was aimed at cookiemonster who is acting suuuuuuuuuuper self righteous. I've pretty much ignored you lol.

Darkslash · Aug 7, 2009

Reaver197 said:
Uh...the whole point of atheism is that there are no gods, and thus religions are nothing but man-made myths.

That doesn't give you the right to look on top of other people, FYI. Insulting people who commit their life to their religion is the equivalent of slapping them in the face, and punching them in the gut.

If this thread showed me any thing, its that some, not all, atheists think that if they don't want to believe in a God, they can go out and spit in the faces of those who do.

EDIT: Not trying to sound self righteous or any thing. But some how this thread is making me feel more proud to be a catholic. Its a shame I can't find the energy to sit in church for a hour because I'll just fall asleep. :/

EDIT2: And for God and my sanity. PLEASE CHANGE YOUR TITLE. It irks me that the word Pun is being used in the wrong context.

Mewter · Aug 7, 2009

Manny, how long do you plan on being sick?

cookieM0Nster · Aug 7, 2009

Darkslash said:
That doesn't give you the right to look on top of other people, FYI. Insulting people who commit their life to their religion is the equivalent of slapping them in the face, and punching them in the gut.

If this thread showed me any thing, its that some, not all, atheists think that if they don't want to believe in a God, they can go out and spit in the faces of those who do.

EDIT: Not trying to sound self righteous or any thing. But some how this thread is making me feel more proud to be a catholic. Its a shame I can't find the energy to sit in church for a hour because I'll just fall asleep. :/

EDIT2: And for God and my sanity. PLEASE CHANGE YOUR TITLE. It irks me that the word Pun is being used in the wrong context.

I agree 100% with you. If we respect the fact that you guys do not believe in God, I think that it is more than fair that you respect the fact that we do, instead of telling us how our logic and belief are flawed. Which they are not.

And I am not trying to sound like a self-rightous priss, but I am proud to be a Christian. I honestly don't care if you think I am, Falcon.

Some of my best friends are athiest, but they at least say "I don't believe in God, but you may, and I respect that." That is a whole lot more fair than your logic, that if you don't think there is a God, that you can say it in front of us, some of which are religious, and do believe in God.

And

:mad: · Aug 7, 2009

Religion is serious business. Far be it from us to express our disbelief in a public forum. Good **** coming into a thread about atheism and how to avoid vacation bible school.

Mah lord and sayveyore.

Beren Zaiga · Aug 7, 2009

cookieM0Nster said:
I agree 100% with you. If we respect the fact that you guys do not believe in God, I think that it is more than fair that you respect the fact that we do, instead of telling us how our logic and belief are flawed. Which they are not.

And I am not trying to sound like a self-rightous priss, but I am proud to be a Christian. I honestly don't care if you think I am, Falcon.

Some of my best friends are athiest, but they at least say "I don't believe in God, but you may, and I respect that." That is a whole lot more fair than your logic, that if you don't think there is a God, that you can say it in front of us, some of which are religious, and do believe in God.

And

You see, that is the problem right there, you are treating the fact he is saying that "There is no God" in front of you, as if he were committing slander and/or libel. Saying that you respect the fact that they don't believe in God, and then shooting someone down who says it in front of you sounds really hypocritical, and from my view of this, it is. It makes you look like self-righteous like Falcon said.

Saying and doing are two different things after all, and right now, you are saying one thing, and you did the other.

Clownbot · Aug 7, 2009

Beren Zaiga said:
You see, that is the problem right there, you are treating the fact he is saying that "There is no God" in front of you, as if he were committing slander and/or libel. Saying that you respect the fact that they don't believe in God, and then shooting someone down who says it in front of you sounds really hypocritical, and from my view of this, it is. It makes you look like self-righteous like Falcon said.

Saying and doing are two different things after all, and right now, you are saying one thing, and you did the other.

I didn't go back to see what cookiemonster wrote, but I can say for myself that I did nothing of the sort. All I did was point out (and rather calmly point out, at that) that he didn't know for a fact that there was no hell. I even pointed out in my response that we don't know for sure that there IS a hell, either.

REL38 · Aug 7, 2009

If I respect other people's beliefs and morals then they'll have to respect mine :D

That train of thought doesn't work. Just because your nice to someone else doesn't mean they'll return the favor. Besides, there are only a few christians that "respect" athiesm/ other religions. Most go off into arguement, try to convert them or feel bad for them. People react on how the majority of the group responds.

Just because a few christians "respect" the views of athiests doesn't mean that they'll "respect" the views of someone who represents something that they're very much against. In this case, christianity.

:mad: · Aug 7, 2009

There's too much respect in this thread.

You're all horribly off-topic.

PassWurD · Aug 7, 2009

This one time at bible camp..

Lythium · Aug 7, 2009

Straked said:
There's too much respect in this thread.

You're all horribly off-topic.

We just have to wait for Falcon's return. Then all is right with the world, atheists and Christians alike.

Hive Mind · Aug 7, 2009

I feel you man. I've got to go to a ****ing youth group.

thanortinzak · Aug 7, 2009

Hive Mind said:
I feel you man. I've got to go to a ****ing youth group.

Hey, I have to go to youth group too.

In fact, I'm going in around forty minutes.

Mewter said:
Manny, how long do you plan on being sick?

Two days. And done it already. Pulled it off successfully

UPDATE: VBS volunteering is finally over! Hooray!
I ended up meeting five kids who didn't want to be there though. Oh, and I also met two volunteers like me who also didn't want to be there xD

Nihongo-ookami · Aug 7, 2009

Ah, the glory of being Satanist. Nobody's prejudiced, most religions hate you equally. All of the others don't care.

Although, they only really hate you if they are uber-religious. I have quite a few Catholic friends, who know I'm Satanist, and don't care.

Everyone convert to Satanism, now. If not, well, we don't lose anything.

I got kicked out of boy scouts for being satanist, and having a large collection of demonic and satanic books.

I wasn't born into satanism, though. I converted of my own choice.

Sucks for you, though, the youth group and shizz. Hope it goes well for you. Tell the kids that Satan says Hi.

J-man24star · Aug 7, 2009

Nihongo-ookami said:
Ah, the glory of being Satanist. Nobody's prejudiced, most religions hate you equally. All of the others don't care.

Although, they only really hate you if they are uber-religious. I have quite a few Catholic friends, who know I'm Satanist, and don't care.

Everyone convert to Satanism, now. If not, well, we don't lose anything.

I got kicked out of boy scouts for being satanist, and having a large collection of demonic and satanic books.

I wasn't born into satanism, though. I converted of my own choice.

Sucks for you, though, the youth group and shizz. Hope it goes well for you. Tell the kids that Satan says Hi.

It's sad.... Choosing an eternity of suffering for temporal pleasures on Earth....

cookieM0Nster · Aug 7, 2009

Beren Zaiga said:
You see, that is the problem right there, you are treating the fact he is saying that "There is no God" in front of you, as if he were committing slander and/or libel. Saying that you respect the fact that they don't believe in God, and then shooting someone down who says it in front of you sounds really hypocritical, and from my view of this, it is. It makes you look like self-righteous like Falcon said.

Saying and doing are two different things after all, and right now, you are saying one thing, and you did the other.

I said that I respect the fact that he doesn't believe in God, but I do not respect them talking, in front of Christians saying that God is stupid, and religion in general is a bunch of crap. You don't understand what I am saying. I am saying that IF YOU RESPECT THE FACT THAT I BELIEVE IN GOD AND NOT SAY IN FRONT OF ME THAT EVERYTHING THAT I BELIEVE IN IS A LOAD OF CRAP IS DOWNRIGHT DESPICABLE. I DON'T SAY THAT WHAT YOU BELIEVE IN IS A LOAD OF CRAP, SO JUST KEEP THESE THOUGHTS TO YOURSELF.

:mad: · Aug 7, 2009

cookieM0Nster said:
I said that I respect the fact that he doesn't believe in God, but I do not respect them talking, in front of Christians saying that God is stupid, and religion in general is a bunch of crap. You don't understand what I am saying. I am saying that IF YOU RESPECT THE FACT THAT I BELIEVE IN GOD AND NOT SAY IN FRONT OF ME THAT EVERYTHING THAT I BELIEVE IN IS A LOAD OF CRAP IS DOWNRIGHT DESPICABLE. I DON'T SAY THAT WHAT YOU BELIEVE IN IS A LOAD OF CRAP, SO JUST KEEP THESE THOUGHTS TO YOURSELF.

I think you need to get out before you get this thread closed. Kindly leave, Mr. M0Nster.

PassWurD · Aug 7, 2009

cookieM0Nster said:
I said that I respect the fact that he doesn't believe in God, but I do not respect them talking, in front of Christians saying that God is stupid, and religion in general is a bunch of crap. You don't understand what I am saying. I am saying that IF YOU RESPECT THE FACT THAT I BELIEVE IN GOD AND NOT SAY IN FRONT OF ME THAT EVERYTHING THAT I BELIEVE IN IS A LOAD OF CRAP IS DOWNRIGHT DESPICABLE. I DON'T SAY THAT WHAT YOU BELIEVE IN IS A LOAD OF CRAP, SO JUST KEEP THESE THOUGHTS TO YOURSELF.

All he said was there is no hell.

Spread the peace.

J-man24star · Aug 7, 2009

PassWurD said:
All he said was there is no hell.

Spread the peace.

As much as i'd like it, it's not going to be that way, i'm going to act calm and take this cooly, but here's a good explanation to why there is so much friction in Religious wars:

And I will put enmity
between you and the woman,
and between your offspring and hers;
he will crush your head,
and you will strike his heel."- Genesis 3:15

i'll let you make this out.

REL38 · Aug 7, 2009

The direction this blog is taking saddens me . . .

Back on topic.

I've found that in youth group, there are always those kids that are all about God and then there are those who only come to be with friends. But there's always that kid that's all by themselves the entire time . . .

Edit:

J-man24star said:
As much as i'd like it, it's not going to be that way, i'm going to act calm and take this cooly, but here's a good explanation to why there is so much friction in Religious wars:

And I will put enmity
between you and the woman,
and between your offspring and hers;
he will crush your head,
and you will strike his heel."- Genesis 3:15

i'll let you make this out.

This is where God finds out that Adam and Eve eated the fruit (apple, grapfruit, tomato, whatever you see it as) that they weren't supposed to eat. He hears what Adam says, He turns to Eve who tells him that the Serpent tricked her.

12 The man said, "The woman you put here with me—she gave me some fruit from the tree, and I ate it."

13 Then the LORD God said to the woman, "What is this you have done?"
The woman said, "The serpent deceived me, and I ate."

14 So the LORD God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this,
"Cursed are you above all the livestock
and all the wild animals!
You will crawl on your belly
and you will eat dust
all the days of your life.

15 And I will put enmity
between you and the woman,
and between your offspring [a] and hers;
he will crush your head,
and you will strike his heel."

He was talking to the Serpent (Devil), not Adam or Eve. God condems the Devil to characteristics that we generally associate Snakes with. Verse 15 is saying that woman are pretty much gonna hate Snakes. The last two lines are saying that men are going to kill Snakes while the only thing Snakes will do is bite at their legs.
He doesn't punish Adam and Eve until the following verses.

16 To the woman he said,
"I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing;
with pain you will give birth to children.
Your desire will be for your husband,
and he will rule over you."

17 To Adam he said, "Because you listened to your wife and ate from the tree about which I commanded you, 'You must not eat of it,'
"Cursed is the ground because of you;
through painful toil you will eat of it
all the days of your life.

Tricky, tricky.

Trying to manipulate Bible text by taking them out of context.
btw not gonna get more in-depth with this stuff. Don't wanna stray off topic or start up an arguement.

Beren Zaiga · Aug 7, 2009

cookieM0Nster said:
I said that I respect the fact that he doesn't believe in God, but I do not respect them talking, in front of Christians saying that God is stupid, and religion in general is a bunch of crap. You don't understand what I am saying. I am saying that IF YOU RESPECT THE FACT THAT I BELIEVE IN GOD AND NOT SAY IN FRONT OF ME THAT EVERYTHING THAT I BELIEVE IN IS A LOAD OF CRAP IS DOWNRIGHT DESPICABLE. I DON'T SAY THAT WHAT YOU BELIEVE IN IS A LOAD OF CRAP, SO JUST KEEP THESE THOUGHTS TO YOURSELF.

No. Just no.

What you do not understand is that he did not anything that he said in that sort of manner, your taking what he said and blowing it out of proportion by at least ten times. He said "there is no Hell" and "there is no God", I do not see anywhere where he said that everything Christians, Catholics, or anything anyone else believes is a load of crap or anything of the sort. You are letting simple statements that had no intention of being inflammatory get to you, and are turning them into inflammatory statements based on that, are throwing ill-aimed feelings at him solely for that reason.

This is the last time I am going to explain this to you, if you cannot acknowledge or understand the facts, that he did not say those things in the manner it seems you have devised and welded into your head...Then I must honestly say you are hopeless in this situation.

Virgilijus · Aug 7, 2009

Virgilijus said:
Any more insults or flaming and this will be immediately closed.

Tensions have gotten a little too high. Apologies for those that remained respectful and calm

God **** It! (pardon the pun)

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