Mod: Requesting Tom be considered for replacement. We're halfway through Day 1 without anything from him. So it's probably better to replace someone new into the game sooner than later. Tom essentially wasn't present all of Day 1 in wonderland mafia, and I'd rather not see it happen in this game too. I think he can replaced by any player, new or experienced. It's clear everyone here is simply new to SWF Mafia instead of mafia in general; so I doubt having 4 dGamers is as crucial as having a full roster of 12 active players.
------
You guys are beginning to get lost in your attacks against one another, going point for point against one another with very little backing down. Why do I say you're getting lost in it all? Because no one seemed to notice that I just went without posting for 3 days after being quite active. Notice how quickly I blended into the background? That is why lurking can be a powerful scum tactic. (I wasn't lurking though, I just flat out wasn't paying attention to this game with wonderland mafia finishing Day 1 and anime mafia being dead and inactive. I remembered I still needed to play this game when I saw I had a prod warning in anime mafia.) Disappearing from the main fray, then coming back in and sidelining every now and then makes it very easy to get through early days. It becomes easier when people draw themselves into very long-winded arguments. Being concise at times is sometimes better than being lengthy, although there is a balance needed.
Hey Cello!
I realize that some of my responses are to somewhat older comments, but I wished to address some of the points made.
There was nothing I saw concerning you that was concrete. But, as an example:
FrozenFlame has modded two games here; Trigun Mafia and Bad Idea.
In Bad Idea, he only wanted people with at least two games worth of experience.
This is completely understandable, considering the content of the game. However,
it does also imply that he would prefer committed players, i.e. ones that stuck around until the end; Ones that are committed.
In Trigun, he much more explicitly stated that he didn't want people who couldn't commit.
To this end, he states:
Yet, in this game:
The reason I'm posting examples from games in which he modded is that it offers a clear and unbiased view of his opinions. He clearly does not appreciate inactives who may cause a game to collapse. Yet, here he suggests that removing lurkers may be unhealthy for this game.
I have to wonder what the reason for this is.
It may very well be to clog up the game with other people that he can easily thrust suspicion onto.
You are right, of course. You would have plenty of time to think about your plan of action before committing to it.
I was unconsciously thinking, "Something to actually pick apart." At this point, these pressure votes are helping to bring people out from the shadows, but we should all make sure we receive responses that satisfy any questions, concerns or complaints each of us have. I think we should start pursuing these much more assertively, by group voting to L-2 or L-3 for each person. Going down the list as the mod has it:
I'm sure Tom's vote on Xiivi isn't serious, and Xiivi's responses address any major concerns I had, so we can skip him, if there are no objections.
Mister Eric's lack of a vote and style were explained, sort of, but I don't know if anyone else had anything else they wanted him to say. I'm still a little curious about that little rhyme, but I guess it's not that substantial.
The votes for Hilt were the most numerous, but they were mostly based on his not speaking much. He brings up a good point:
Delvro's riding the wolf thing pretty hard in his conversations with Ronike. Actually, I've been doing it myself, too, but I'll admit, in hindsight, my wolf insinuations against Xiivi were a bit farfetched. About Delvro's suggestion that we'll be able to distinguish the types of scum; how could we go about that?
We certainly don't have an "ironclad" method of doing so, but their choice of nightkills will be of use in that determination. Will they kill the experienced players because they can guide town toward effective scum hunting? Will they go for lurkers? If I were one, I'd go for the talkative experienced players. In any event, unless we lynch one of them for some reason, we'll have at least 3 IC players left. Unless they are ALL mafia, then we'll have at least one person who can inform us of important parts of the others' playstyles. Even then, if they were all mafia, they'd still help us get wolves.
Ronike, Mayling, and Delvro are providing ample information. About Delvro at least.
I think we've done all we really can by pressuring those that are active.
In other words, we should move on to Tom or Raptor, since S2 has joined us.
I don't think he's trusting of her rolewise, as much as getting a little riled up.
It's Greg. It's the way he is, not the way he plays.
You're coming off as taking that a bit hard, Greg.
Seeming emotional when you make your vote will just take credence away from your
reasoning. Is there anything else you can offer other than this "hounding" of May?
This is a really unprovoked response. In addition to the fact that I think you are lying about defending anyone else with such tenacity, or at least mistaken, I think you're overreacting to a simple question. He didn't even vote for you.
This typo, which I do believe it was, just implies that you were too heated to re-examine your post properly. You didn't properly cover your tracks; Are you suggesting we should just let that go? Even if you are town, lynching you now will whip the rest of us into shape, and prevent a mislynch at a crucial time.
I'm going to go ahead and vote for Delvro, but we do have 10 more days to gather information if we want to, although it may be wiser to think of it as 6 or 7 so we don't accidently go over time. If most of you think we should pressure Tom and Raptor before we conclude the day, we should. I think it's a good idea.
Vote: Delvro
You've said why you want to vote for Delvro. But, why should you be afraid to actually vote for someone you think should be lynched, or pressured? He was currently at L-4, so there's no danger of a quick hammer (though if it DID occur, that would make for interesting excuse making on Day 2). If it's because you don't want to "take away" from your suspicions of Mayling, just say so. If it's because you want to do more information gathering for the rest of the game, just say so. But to have driven so hard only to go 'full stop' and only issue challenges just seems like you just don't want to associate yourself with his lynch.
Somehow, I missed that S2 had actually voted for Delvro. I had thought it was just a question instead of an actual vote.
I wasn't voting for Delvro based on the direct case of his defending you.
It was because he claimed he'd defend anyone else in the same way, and because he tried to turn the tables on S2 by equating
their situations. Pages long argument versus single paragraph. I don't see what S2 said as "clearly defending" someone, although whether it's uncharacteristic of his personality or not is another story.
What I meant by "riding the wolf thing pretty hard" was in reference to a post Hilt had made.
Here's the full version. I had omitted two parts of it when I made my last post.
You can't deny Delvro was talking about wolves for...well, pretty much the whole game.
I thought Hilt's point was understated and that it didn't get enough attention,
especially since I agree with the first part.
I just assumed Sold2 was trying to avoid being prodded. I think what got Tandora and Ronike's attention concerning Mister Eric was the fact he put two posts, which would normally indicate he was trying to do 'something', whatever it might have been.
An inflexible mind would only be hurtful. I saw something that I thought had the potential to be signifigant. If I die, then I no longer have the opportunity to state, or remind people of, these little things. It's fine if he doesn't respond to it immediately; I may have been right about him, or I may be wrong.
But it's still something that he has done, has said, put in writing, that he cannot unsay. It's there for us to use as proof, whether we think it's against him or for him.
I'm willing to drop my case against Xiivi for now, because someone else seemed acting in a more suspicious manner.
Oh, that reminds me.
Was your use of "mafia" at the end of the sentence a typo, too?
After all, I doubt the wolves would know by instinct who's a seer and who's mafia,
although the person that is being suspected would certainly know.
Why would the wolves not kill someone even suspected as seer again?
As has been mentioned in various ways, we don't know each other here very well across the IC/Newbie divide. Yours and others previous actions are all that we have to use to help us evaluate our current actions. Bringing up your mod attitude and player attitude was to elicit a response we can evaluate, and a genuine curiosity in what I thought was a conflicting viewpoint.
I got a really bad vibe off of this the first time I read it.
At first, I thought it was a scum trying to figure out exactly what May was getting at so he
doesn't come off as defensive about an unrelated subject.
But, overall, another townie misunderstanding would be really bad.
I'm still inclined toward my initial reaction, but I don't know if it's worth it if I'm wrong.
What's the deal bro? Trying to find a case on a townie to fall back on?
So let me get this straight.... people are voting me because I think that killing a wolf today is the town's best option? I'm sorry, but this confuses me.
I had it all planned out in my head... where, percentage wise, killing one werewolf, then killing ALL the mafia, and lastly killing the other werewolf provided the GREATEST chances for town winning, because you're optimizing the werewolf vs mafia portion of the game.
How can you tell if someone is wolf or mafia? I figured you could do it the same way you discriminate scum from town. Player reactions. Voting patterns. NIGHT KILLS.
I can understand why you guys think that it's impossible to tell, but frankly I think you're wrong. Sorry. Perhaps it's impossible to tell on Day 1 when there are no lynches or night kills to go off of. That's fine, instead we just hunt scum.
Like I said before, I think that Roniker was purposefully putting down the prospect of hunting down wolves in particular and just saying "Hey guys it doesn't matter what they are just get em all"... of course saying that sounds Mafia but it was a risk that I was willing to take. I really don't understand why nobody else sees it my way. I see NO REASON at all to believe that, on Day 1, killing a wolf would NOT be better than killing a Mafia. Like I said earlier, killing mafia is best once one of the wolves die, because every day the other wolf is feeling the pressure of being the last man standing, as well as the fact that wolves can kill mafia with night kills.
Huh? He DID vote for me. Anyway, perhaps my response was a little too heated. The reason for that is cause I feel that s2 is being a hypocrite -- he attacked me for defending Mayling (which I felt was more of an attack on Roniker), but at the same time he was defending Roniker with very little justification other than "hey Greg you're argument sucks". Which I don't think it does.
Do with you want with the typo. But I'm not the only person to have done something like this. You youself point out Xiivii's excessive usage of the word "wolf" rather than "scum", and he has yet to respond to it. However, I don't deny the possibility that you are right.
However, I think the real reason that me and Xiivi have made these typos is because I play a game called "mafia" all the time in which there are mafia and wolves do not exist. Perhaps Xiivi plays a game called "werewolf" in which the only anti-town group are wolves.
Hmm, let's look at my posts!
vote: mayling
she's a big bad werewolf
My joke vote in the RVS.
Hello, new players, welcome to the
RVS. Please drop a vote for whatever random reason you please. Make sure you pay attention to the number of votes a player has and the number needed to lynch though! I won't forgive anyone for dropping a vote at L-1 (The number of votes required for a lynch [7] minus one [6]) and claiming they didn't realize it! Unless it's Mayling who we lynch. Feel free to drop some votes on her because she's a big bad
werewolf.
Ronike mentioned
Lynch All Liars. This is a good policy to enforce! However, Ronike actually lied in that post he made there. In FFVII mafia, he lied about his role! He knew he was lying! Yet he didn't vote himself. Thus it's plainly obvious he does not believe in LAL and was lying in that post as well. Feel free to drop your votes on him for this.
Finally we have Tom. Tom's vote is a good example of
OMGUS. Once he saw that I had found out his
werewolf partner Mayling and voted for her, he immediately took to the offense and voted me in return. Another great lynch candidate!
Here is a
Glossary of mafia terms and
abbreviations.
Don't be afraid to ask questions.
Continuing the jovial stuff in order to introduce terms into the game (but it's clear you guys aren't as 'newbie' as I thought).
Please explain to me what Mayling should be defending against.
Too Helpful, too townie same thing.
'Cause that's what she is.
So you're saying I'm a
werewolf eh? That's what you're implying after all.
You get everyone to participate in the RVS until someone does something that draws attention. You build a case off of something small/quite possibly meaningless which pulls the group out of the RVS and into discussion. If people don't participate in the RVS the game could stall out because of it. Essentially you're helping to pull us out the RVS right now.
It's very easy for people to make a vote that is a hammer-vote and feign ignorance over the fact the person was at L-1. If you remind people, it prevents scum from making this ploy and getting away with it. Any reason you felt the need to make sure Tandora and raptor were labeled as new right now? After all, this is supposed to be a "newbie" game. Seems a bit like early buddying.
It's on the first page of the dGames forum here. I'd recommend you read through some of the completed games here if you're looking to find meta.
Of course it's OMGUS. I voted Tom's
werewolf partner, and he responded by "Oh my god you suck for voting my
werewolf partner. Vote: you" Just in better words.
Why are you bringing up bussing?
The games I've played with Tom are currently ongoing.
If you want meta, I'd suggest checking this forum here and reading through the games.
Now, the final question. Why no vote?
Going to buddy right back him, eh?
Why no vote?
vote: soaring-raptor-blast
Post for us, you're friend has already brought your name up afterall!
First time: Calling out what Cello implied.
Second time: Defending my joking with sarcastic/reaching reasoning. [Because you aren't getting a serious defense for a non-serious joke. That's just silly.]
If you notice, when making a serious point explaining the hammering situation, I use scum instead of werewolves. Because my use of werewolves was while I was joking.
It would be very easy to write off something suspicious/scummy they did as "Oh, well like I said before, they're the most new to the game. Can't fault them for that."
Where did Cello imply that it is lynch-worthy?
For those who agree about this whole "sub-conscious" thing and accusing someone of the alignment you are in the RVS:
The mafia faction can scumhunt by actively looking for
werewolves.
The
werewolf faction can scumhunt by actively looking for mafia.
It would make more sense from my eyes for one to consciously accuse someone of being the other faction if they are scum.
Regardless, do you have any backup to this subconscious theory?
If people really want to look into my random vote, I'll lay it out for you.
I scrolled up some from Marshy's daystart post. I saw Mayling's Pit avatar. That made me decide to pick her for my random vote. I thought of Tom's "Vote Hylian: He's Mafia" post in Grammys Mafia [can't show you guys since it's in a private forum] and essentially copied it. I don't see
werewolf games often, and took the chance to call someone a big bad
werewolf.
There you go, pull what you want from it. Just don't reach too much.
Keep in mind it's always easy to attack the most vocal players, since they are the ones who put themselves out there after all. Which is why not participating in part of the game, be it the RVS or the discussion process itself (lurking) is anti-town. If everyone simply sat back and waited for things to happen, then whoever takes the first step is the easiest to fault. Simply sitting back and waiting to place your vote on someone causes people to not get a good read on you and less likely to trust you.
What I'm getting at is:
Not participating in the RVS is simply waiting for others to do the work for you. If you are town you are simply sitting and waiting for scum to direct you. When everyone participates in the RVS, discussion does arise and things get serious faster without forcing a select few players into controlling a lot of the discussion by themselves. This makes it easy for them to suspect each other which is something scum would love to see. This is what makes active lurking scummy.
As for the comment about game flavour. This is a basic set-up with none. However there are many games we host here that do have flavour, and it is very important that people only claim their name/role/etc... when they absolutely have to (being at L-1, LyLo, etc...). If we all had names and corresponding roles, everyone claiming them would only benefit the scum. Scum would be able to lie and blend in with everyone else, while seeing the town's claims and getting a better judgment on who to kill at night as a potential powerrole. "This person claimed Tiki Tiki the Witch Doctor. They're probably the Seer. Let's nightkill them." See what I'm getting at?
Town should not rely on flavour/power roles/nightkills to do their scumhunting and instead do it the old fashioned way.
unvote: vote: mister eric
Let's get the ball rolling. Mister Eric, why do you make a post which makes it seem as if you're wanting to make a random vote (eenie meenie miney vote implies randomness from my view) and then proceed to not make one and explain that you don't like the RVS?
I talk about werewolves while discussing semantics and thought processes, as well as answering Cello's question (Something you said I didn't do Delvro. How's the skimming going bro?) In fact, for the reminder of the post, I use the catch-all of "scum" (which includes both mafia and wolves) to address the anti-town factions. Man, I really am obsessed with the wolves aren't I?
#
138 ; #
131 ; #
128
Notice how in these posts my mind is completely set on werewolves and I mention them a lot and never refer to them as scum. Oh wait, nevermind, I actually was focused on finding
scum the whole time and didn't mention werewolves!
Let's rephrase this as:
"Please explain the thought process behind distinguishing between
wolf and mafia on Day 1."
and ask Delvro to answer.
Aw darn, I said wolf again. Looks like you've caught me.
However, you dear Delvro, have been discussing wolves quite a bit! Specifically mentioning how you really want to catch wolves instead of mafia!
Now that we've pinpointed me and my obsession (I mean, man, look how many times I've talked about werewolves in this post, woah!), let's go back to what I highlighted in read.
So let me get this straight.... people are voting me because I think that killing a wolf today is the town's best option? I'm sorry, but this confuses me.
I had it all planned out in my head... where, percentage wise, killing one werewolf, then killing ALL the mafia, and lastly killing the other werewolf provided the GREATEST chances for town winning, because you're optimizing the werewolf vs mafia portion of the game.
How can you tell if someone is wolf or mafia? I figured you could do it the same way you discriminate scum from town. Player reactions. Voting patterns. NIGHT KILLS.
I can understand why you guys think that it's impossible to tell, but frankly I think you're wrong. Sorry. Perhaps it's impossible to tell on Day 1 when there are no lynches or night kills to go off of. That's fine, instead we just hunt scum.
Like I said before, I think that Roniker was purposefully putting down the prospect of hunting down wolves in particular and just saying "Hey guys it doesn't matter what they are just get em all"... of course saying that sounds Mafia but it was a risk that I was willing to take. I really don't understand why nobody else sees it my way. I see NO REASON at all to believe that, on Day 1, killing a wolf would NOT be better than killing a Mafia. Like I said earlier, killing mafia is best once one of the wolves die, because every day the other wolf is feeling the pressure of being the last man standing, as well as the fact that wolves can kill mafia with night kills.
Huh? He DID vote for me. Anyway, perhaps my response was a little too heated. The reason for that is cause I feel that s2 is being a hypocrite -- he attacked me for defending Mayling (which I felt was more of an attack on Roniker), but at the same time he was defending Roniker with very little justification other than "hey Greg you're argument sucks". Which I don't think it does.
Do with you want with the typo. But I'm not the only person to have done something like this. You youself point out Xiivii's excessive usage of the word "wolf" rather than "scum", and he has yet to respond to it. However, I don't deny the possibility that you are right.
However, I think the real reason that me and Xiivi have made these typos is because I play a game called "mafia" all the time in which there are mafia and wolves do not exist. Perhaps Xiivi plays a game called "werewolf" in which the only anti-town group are wolves.
"Just because I made a slip doesn't mean you can interrogate me for it! (Yes we can.) Xiivi did it too and you mentioned it, and he was left completely speechless! (Actually not at all.) I think you're right about Xiivi but not me. (They'll never catch you now!)
However, Xiivi and I made these typos (You decided my posts were typos now?), was because I play 'mafia' and because Xiivi plays 'werewolf'. (Great conclusion there!)"
So once you are called out on something, you grasp for straws and attempt to push the focus on someone else. Without even checking if you were really right or not! (After all, you thought I didn't present a defense!) Seems like a scum tactic to me, don't you think? Wait, let me rephrase that as 'Seems like a wolf tactic to me, don't you think?' since that's all I understand in this game.
All right, I'm not sure how this turned from a simple suggestion of town strategy (in the long-run) into some kind of war.
Ronike (and I'm sorry about getting your name wrong before), I already said many particular ways in which we can catch a wolf red-handed. I also said that it may not be possible to do so on Day 1, in which case we just hunt for scum. In NO way am I purposefully trying to confuse people (honestly I don't see how my proposition is that confusing to begin with), nor am I saying that we will FOR SURE be able to detect a wolf (minus the seer but I don't really want the seer to get involved in this). After all... if we COULD... then wolves wouldn't have much of a chance now would they?
And also please please don't point out that someone might be seer. You're just asking to get that person nightkilled. ;___;
If someone is suspected seer, chances are they will die. We have no doctor. And if they don't die, that's probably because they are mafia.
Also, the above post is a booboo... Mayling left work and I hopped on and immediately jumped to the mafia thread without realizing the account was still on. My Bad.
But dearest Delvro, if your plans for finding wolves won't work on day one, what about your optimal strategy!
So let me get this straight.... people are voting me because I think that killing a wolf today is the town's best option? I'm sorry, but this confuses me.
I had it all planned out in my head... where, percentage wise, killing one werewolf, then killing ALL the mafia, and lastly killing the other werewolf provided the GREATEST chances for town winning, because you're optimizing the werewolf vs mafia portion of the game.
How can you tell if someone is wolf or mafia? I figured you could do it the same way you discriminate scum from town. Player reactions. Voting patterns. NIGHT KILLS.
I can understand why you guys think that it's impossible to tell, but frankly I think you're wrong. Sorry. Perhaps it's impossible to tell on Day 1 when there are no lynches or night kills to go off of. That's fine, instead we just hunt scum.
Like I said before, I think that Roniker was purposefully putting down the prospect of hunting down wolves in particular and just saying "Hey guys it doesn't matter what they are just get em all"... of course saying that sounds Mafia but it was a risk that I was willing to take. I really don't understand why nobody else sees it my way. I see NO REASON at all to believe that, on Day 1, killing a wolf would NOT be better than killing a Mafia. Like I said earlier, killing mafia is best once one of the wolves die, because every day the other wolf is feeling the pressure of being the last man standing, as well as the fact that wolves can kill mafia with night kills.
Huh? He DID vote for me. Anyway, perhaps my response was a little too heated. The reason for that is cause I feel that s2 is being a hypocrite -- he attacked me for defending Mayling (which I felt was more of an attack on Roniker), but at the same time he was defending Roniker with very little justification other than "hey Greg you're argument sucks". Which I don't think it does.
Do with you want with the typo. But I'm not the only person to have done something like this. You youself point out Xiivii's excessive usage of the word "wolf" rather than "scum", and he has yet to respond to it. However, I don't deny the possibility that you are right.
However, I think the real reason that me and Xiivi have made these typos is because I play a game called "mafia" all the time in which there are mafia and wolves do not exist. Perhaps Xiivi plays a game called "werewolf" in which the only anti-town group are wolves.
Seems all is lost, I suppose. ;_;
Also the points you brought up...
So let me get this straight.... people are voting me because I think that killing a wolf today is the town's best option? I'm sorry, but this confuses me.
I had it all planned out in my head... where, percentage wise, killing one werewolf, then killing ALL the mafia, and lastly killing the other werewolf provided the GREATEST chances for town winning, because you're optimizing the werewolf vs mafia portion of the game.
How can you tell if someone is wolf or mafia? I figured you could do it the same way you discriminate scum from town. Player reactions. Voting patterns. NIGHT KILLS.
I can understand why you guys think that it's impossible to tell, but frankly I think you're wrong. Sorry. Perhaps it's impossible to tell on Day 1 when there are no lynches or night kills to go off of. That's fine, instead we just hunt scum.
Like I said before, I think that Roniker was purposefully putting down the prospect of hunting down wolves in particular and just saying "Hey guys it doesn't matter what they are just get em all"... of course saying that sounds Mafia but it was a risk that I was willing to take. I really don't understand why nobody else sees it my way. I see NO REASON at all to believe that, on Day 1, killing a wolf would NOT be better than killing a Mafia. Like I said earlier, killing mafia is best once one of the wolves die, because every day the other wolf is feeling the pressure of being the last man standing, as well as the fact that wolves can kill mafia with night kills.
Huh? He DID vote for me. Anyway, perhaps my response was a little too heated. The reason for that is cause I feel that s2 is being a hypocrite -- he attacked me for defending Mayling (which I felt was more of an attack on Roniker), but at the same time he was defending Roniker with very little justification other than "hey Greg you're argument sucks". Which I don't think it does.
Do with you want with the typo. But I'm not the only person to have done something like this. You youself point out Xiivii's excessive usage of the word "wolf" rather than "scum", and he has yet to respond to it. However, I don't deny the possibility that you are right.
However, I think the real reason that me and Xiivi have made these typos is because I play a game called "mafia" all the time in which there are mafia and wolves do not exist. Perhaps Xiivi plays a game called "werewolf" in which the only anti-town group are wolves.
Delvro's guide to catching werewolves:
1: Player reactions.
"When someone mentions werewolves, they are most likely obsessed with them (Case: Xiivi), and thus are a werewolf."
[Give a more concrete reason as to what player reactions will distinguish between a "scummy" player, a "mafiay" player, and a "werewolfy" player. After all, if you can distinguish between "scummy" and "werewolfy" you should be able to know how to get "mafiay" too!]
2: Voting patterns.
"When a town is lynched, I bet you there were some werewolves involved!
When a mafia is lynched, I bet you there were some werewolves involved!
When a werewolf is lynched, I bet you there wasn't any bussing!"
[Voting patterns are always a good source for scum hunting. However this is only useful after one wolf flips and is only useful for finding the second wolf. (Since before then, both town and mafia can be wolf-hunting. Yet bussing can throw a wrench in this, and wolf are also capable of mafia-hunting. So it's possible for both factions to be "scum-hunting".) So overall, this isn't too helpful and doesn't make me believe we should be tunneling on finding wolves instead of finding scum in general as you want to suggest.]
3: NIGHT KILLS.
"Night kills is in CAPS because it is the most important and flawless way of finding wolves. The following thought will never cross the wolves' minds: "Man, X got into a huge confrontation with Y and pushed on Y hard. If we kill X, we can push for Y really easily." Or: "Cello said he'd kill a talkative experienced player. Let's kill one and then push him hard!"
[Using night kills for "wolf-hunting" is nothing more than chasing ghosts.]
I realize that some of my responses are to somewhat older comments, but I wished to address some of the points made.
There was nothing I saw concerning you that was concrete. But, as an example:
FrozenFlame has modded two games here; Trigun Mafia and Bad Idea.
In Bad Idea, he only wanted people with at least two games worth of experience.
This is completely understandable, considering the content of the game. However,
it does also imply that he would prefer committed players, i.e. ones that stuck around until the end; Ones that are committed.
In Trigun, he much more explicitly stated that he didn't want people who couldn't commit.
To this end, he states:
Yet, in this game:
The reason I'm posting examples from games in which he modded is that it offers a clear and unbiased view of his opinions. He clearly does not appreciate inactives who may cause a game to collapse. Yet, here he suggests that removing lurkers may be unhealthy for this game.
I have to wonder what the reason for this is.
It may very well be to clog up the game with other people that he can easily thrust suspicion onto.
You are right, of course. You would have plenty of time to think about your plan of action before committing to it.
I was unconsciously thinking, "Something to actually pick apart." At this point, these pressure votes are helping to bring people out from the shadows, but we should all make sure we receive responses that satisfy any questions, concerns or complaints each of us have. I think we should start pursuing these much more assertively, by group voting to L-2 or L-3 for each person. Going down the list as the mod has it:
I'm sure Tom's vote on Xiivi isn't serious, and Xiivi's responses address any major concerns I had, so we can skip him, if there are no objections.
Mister Eric's lack of a vote and style were explained, sort of, but I don't know if anyone else had anything else they wanted him to say. I'm still a little curious about that little rhyme, but I guess it's not that substantial.
The votes for Hilt were the most numerous, but they were mostly based on his not speaking much. He brings up a good point:
Delvro's riding the wolf thing pretty hard in his conversations with Ronike. Actually, I've been doing it myself, too, but I'll admit, in hindsight, my wolf insinuations against Xiivi were a bit farfetched. About Delvro's suggestion that we'll be able to distinguish the types of scum; how could we go about that?
We certainly don't have an "ironclad" method of doing so, but their choice of nightkills will be of use in that determination. Will they kill the experienced players because they can guide town toward effective scum hunting? Will they go for lurkers? If I were one, I'd go for the talkative experienced players. In any event, unless we lynch one of them for some reason, we'll have at least 3 IC players left. Unless they are ALL mafia, then we'll have at least one person who can inform us of important parts of the others' playstyles. Even then, if they were all mafia, they'd still help us get wolves.
Ronike, Mayling, and Delvro are providing ample information. About Delvro at least.
I think we've done all we really can by pressuring those that are active.
In other words, we should move on to Tom or Raptor, since S2 has joined us.
I don't think he's trusting of her rolewise, as much as getting a little riled up.
It's Greg. It's the way he is, not the way he plays.
You're coming off as taking that a bit hard, Greg.
Seeming emotional when you make your vote will just take credence away from your
reasoning. Is there anything else you can offer other than this "hounding" of May?
This is a really unprovoked response. In addition to the fact that I think you are lying about defending anyone else with such tenacity, or at least mistaken, I think you're overreacting to a simple question. He didn't even vote for you.
This typo, which I do believe it was, just implies that you were too heated to re-examine your post properly. You didn't properly cover your tracks; Are you suggesting we should just let that go? Even if you are town, lynching you now will whip the rest of us into shape, and prevent a mislynch at a crucial time.
I'm going to go ahead and vote for Delvro, but we do have 10 more days to gather information if we want to, although it may be wiser to think of it as 6 or 7 so we don't accidently go over time. If most of you think we should pressure Tom and Raptor before we conclude the day, we should. I think it's a good idea.
Vote: Delvro
That's where Cello threw that out.
All right, I'm not sure how this turned from a simple suggestion of town strategy (in the long-run) into some kind of war.
Ronike (and I'm sorry about getting your name wrong before), I already said many particular ways in which we can catch a wolf red-handed. I also said that it may not be possible to do so on Day 1, in which case we just hunt for scum. In NO way am I purposefully trying to confuse people (honestly I don't see how my proposition is that confusing to begin with), nor am I saying that we will FOR SURE be able to detect a wolf (minus the seer but I don't really want the seer to get involved in this). After all... if we COULD... then wolves wouldn't have much of a chance now would they?
And also please please don't point out that someone might be seer. You're just asking to get that person nightkilled. ;___;
If someone is suspected seer, chances are they will die. We have no doctor. And if they don't die, that's probably because they are mafia.
Also, the above post is a booboo... Mayling left work and I hopped on and immediately jumped to the mafia thread without realizing the account was still on. My Bad.
"Yep, only the seer can confirm wolf and non-wolf. But let's not talk about the seer.
Oh speaking of the seer, don't say that someone might be seer. They'll get killed.
Like really, if we think they're seer, they'll die.
But if we think they're seer and they don't die, then they're mafia.
Because we will all be communicating who we think is the seer in plan day just like I said we shouldn't. And then our suspected seer we're all talking about won't die and we have to lynch them.
Can you guys tell I really want to bring up the seer to get us talking about the role so it's easier for the scum to gauge reactions and figure out who the seer is?"
That's what I see there.
Someone stated earlier that Roniker tends to hunt aggressively for wolves. I'm beginning to think that this may have been a simple case of overzealousness. His OMGUS vote still makes me suspicous, but I'll unvote for now.
UNVOTE
Also, I think Xiivi is right... the group as a whole, myself included, are jumping down people's throats because there are only so many people posting. There are a fair amount of people lurking in corners at this point, and I'd really like to see those who have not contributed to do so.
"Oh dear, people are catching on to me! What do I fall back on!? Oh yeah, Xiivi said something about active players focusing too much on other active players and letting the inactive ones slip, let me use it and mention how I'm going to wait for inactive people to post so they cool down a bit."
-------
So after this post, I'm going to go ahead and
vote: Delvro (lots of stuff),
FoS: Cello (wishy-washy inconsistency).
If you're wondering why I did full-quotes instead of snippets of what mattered, it's because people have the tendency to cry when you cut out part of their post and attempt to discredit you because of it. Which is meh because I'd prefer to just edit out everything except what matters whether I'm scum or town, but I've been yelled about doing in while in both situations and have learned it's better to just not give people something meaningless to make a big deal out of. [Early this game Mayling botched a quote and put my name as the poster of the quote instead of someone else. However I realized it was just her learning multi-quoting and didn't hound on it being a scumtell much like Ronike did when she edited his post. Which spurred a very silly argument in my opinion. In fact, both Mayling and Ronike have more than double the posts in this thread than anyone else. Shut up you two.]
Code:
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=37736"]Ronike[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=37736&searchthreadid=255114"]34[/URL]
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=134294"]Mayling[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=134294&searchthreadid=255114"]31[/URL]
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=160900"]Tandora[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=160900&searchthreadid=255114"]14[/URL]
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=45554"]Xiivi[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=45554&searchthreadid=255114"]14[/URL]
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=135593"]Mister Eric[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=135593&searchthreadid=255114"]13[/URL]
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=129294"]Delvro[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=129294&searchthreadid=255114"]12[/URL]
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=35538"]Tom[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=35538&searchthreadid=255114"]10[/URL]
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=94662"]-Hilt-[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=94662&searchthreadid=255114"]9[/URL]
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=20381"]frozenflame751[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=20381&searchthreadid=255114"]8[/URL]
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=160861"]soaring-raptor-blast[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=160861&searchthreadid=255114"]7[/URL]
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=160429"]Cello_Marl[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=160429&searchthreadid=255114"]7[/URL]
[URL="http://www.smashboards.com/member.php?u=160424"]Sold2[/URL] [URL="http://www.smashboards.com/search.php?do=finduser&userid=160424&searchthreadid=255114"]7[/URL]
Note that only 2 of Tom's posts in this thread were after the game started. Don't let the 10 fool you, he's really inactive. :/
Let's post this and hope formatting didn't go jank on me.
