Smash Bros. Canon Tournament! (Mario Vs. ????) - 06/14/10

§leepy God · Nov 27, 2009

♪ Donkey Kong's Thunder Clap will stun Peach and he'll pretty much perform a large number of attacks. †

Diddy Kong · Nov 27, 2009

Thunder Clap was from Mario Striker IIRC..? That was the first game where DK was actually the best character. =P Yeah, Soundwave Attack works kinda like that. Except weaker.

This match up isn't a draw btw. I think it's more on DK's favor, cause even if Peach would put DK into sleep, what are her options then? Psych Bomb from SMRPG is there yes, but it has it's limits. If she goes physical, DK would make up after the hit and then punch her. Since Peach doesn't have any other defence than the Parasol (or at least not as significant) DK could keep punching her untill she's KO'd.

justaway12 · Nov 27, 2009

Diddy Kong said:
But most of those Paper Mario items require some ... thing to do first. They don't activate instantly. Freezing time is a weird game mechanic, and using the item leaves Peach wide open.

So, if she wants to go offensive, instead of a time freeze... DK activates Going Bananas and can attack Peach at free will.

It leaves Peach wide open, yet it only takes 4 seconds, DK isn't that fast.

Going Bananas is a OHKO, right? Peach has an item to prevent that, and even if it isn't she can just use the mad vibe from Super Princess Peach.

She has more defenceive options than the Parasol, her Lasy Shell, for example, reduce all attacks to 1.

And Sleepy time put them into a deep sleep, the moment she hits him, he won't wake up. She can hit him repeatedly (sp?), besides, when she is stronger than Bowser with her Frying Pan in SMRPG.

WhatIsRaizen? · Nov 27, 2009

Guys, I'll let this match-up run for another 30 minutes to an hour. If we haven't got a true winner by that time, I'm giving it to the character who looks most likely to win.

Ganonsburg · Nov 27, 2009

It looks like a draw to me. Both characters seem to have invincibility at times, and both seem to have good, strong attacks. With DK seemingly having a better attack while Peach seemingly has a better defense, it really looks like a draw.

WhatIsRaizen? · Nov 27, 2009

Ganonsburg said:
It looks like a draw to me. Both characters seem to have invincibility at times, and both seem to have good, strong attacks. With DK seemingly having a better attack while Peach seemingly has a better defense, it really looks like a draw.

I agree with Ray and Ganon.

Moving on.

WhatIsRaizen? · Nov 27, 2009

Vs.

Current Match-Up:
THE LORDSMAN Vs. THE ELECTRIC MOUSE

Marth Vs. Pichu

Vs.

ichu:

Loser's Round 3, Match 6.

Kewkky · Nov 27, 2009

My heart says "Marth wins, hands down", but my brain's telling me "Pichu's better than that, he can actually do BAD stuff against him".

PowerBomb · Nov 27, 2009

My head says Marth wins no problem.

Seriously, what can Pichu do? FFS, his stats are worse than Pikachu.

Vonzar the Soulrender · Nov 27, 2009

Why are we taking stats into account? Stats cannot be translated into power at all.

The only things that are certain is that Pichu can control small bursts of electricity and that Marth is a very talented swordsman who wields the magical sword Falchion which can also be used to heal him.

missingnomaster · Nov 27, 2009

Pichu's stats mean that it is worse than Pikachu.

It also does not receive benefit from a light ball.

WhatIsRaizen? · Nov 27, 2009

@Cyner: That pretty much proves that Marth is the 'better' character.

Next round.

Current Match-Up:
THE PROUD WARRIOR Vs. THE GREEN DINO

Roy Vs. Yoshi

Vs.

Loser's Round 3, Match 7.

Vs.

That is a picture of Roy right? I always confuse him with his father.

missingnomaster · Nov 27, 2009

Something that hasn't been taken into account for Yoshi's previous matchups are his Paper Mario abilities. Unfortunately, I don't really know about them much, except that he has one where he calls a Yoshi stampede.
(Ironically, I main Yoshi but don't know that much about him as a Nintendo character...)
If his Paper Mario stuff is good enough, Yoshi may be able to win.

Samochan · Nov 27, 2009

Why do I have a deja vu feeling..? <_>

Anyways, if yoshi manages to swallow Roy, it's game over for him. Yoshi transforms things he swallows into eggs, powerups or plain eats em. And Roy is a close ranged fighter, so this might be very troublesome to him. Other than that, Roy has the sword of seals and a very powerful swordsman imo. But yoshi's capable of taking many hits and he can even egg spam, while all it takes is one swallow to pwn roy.

justaway12 · Nov 27, 2009

missingnomaster said:
Something that hasn't been taken into account for Yoshi's previous matchups are his Paper Mario abilities. Unfortunately, I don't really know about them much, except that he has one where he calls a Yoshi stampede.
(Ironically, I main Yoshi but don't know that much about him as a Nintendo character...)
If his Paper Mario stuff is good enough, Yoshi may be able to win.

I brung him up before, but it isn't the same Yoshi, IIRC.

I'm 99% postive.

Altough, I'm pretty sure the Yoshi Tribe have the same abilities and I only know Flutter Jump + Ground Pound, don't know any other moves.

missingnomaster · Nov 27, 2009

True. They are obviously different ages... Or something

justaway12 · Nov 27, 2009

I think the Yoshi tribe all know the same abilities, I mean these are his abilities.

Ground Pound
Gulp
Mini-egg
Stampede

I'm pretty sure a normal Yoshi could do that, we'll have to see if Raizen allows it or not, I don't think it will change the match-up a lot, but at least Yoshi will have a projectile.

I haven't acctually played TTYD, so I'm not a lot of help.

WhatIsRaizen? · Nov 27, 2009

justaway12 said:
I think the Yoshi tribe all know the same abilities, I mean these are his abilities.

Ground Pound
Gulp
Mini-egg
Stampede

I'm pretty sure a normal Yoshi could do that, we'll have to see if Raizen allows it or not, I don't think it will change the match-up a lot, but at least Yoshi will have a projectile.

I haven't acctually played TTYD, so I'm not a lot of help.

Elaborate on the "Yoshi Tribe" a bit more.

justaway12 · Nov 27, 2009

A tribe of Yoshi's, basically, Yoshis with different colours, there have been games with different playable Yoshis, and they have all been able to do the same things.
Since every Yoshi (or most) have been shown to do the same thing, I think it would be a good assumption that Yoshi can learn the same thing as TTYD Yoshi, especially, since TTYD Yoshi was a new-born.

This won't effect the match-up much, since the generic Yoshi has been shown to ground-pound and gulp, though I think it would give Yoshi a projectile. I haven't played TTYD so I'm not sure

The only time it's different is when it's a change in colour and that only effects their diets.
* Red Yoshi – Apple
* Yellow Yoshi – Banana
* Green Yoshi – Watermelon
* Pink Yoshi – Apple
* Blue Yoshi – Grapes
* Light Blue Yoshi – Grapes
* Black Yoshi – Likes all fruit types.
* White Yoshi – Likes all fruit types.

Except the Black and White Yoshi's, both can their fire eggs that explode and whites can flutter with a full happy meter.

...

IIRC.

Lovely · Nov 27, 2009

"For those whom I must protect... I can't lose!"

Roy is powerful in his Master Lord class and he defeated people that are much stronger than Yoshi. Not to mention Roy's Sword of Seals can restore heath.

KoRoBeNiKi · Nov 27, 2009

Lovely said:
"For those whom I must protect... I can't lose!"

Roy is powerful in his Master Lord class and he defeated people that are much stronger than Yoshi. Not to mention Roy's Sword of Seals can restore heath.

his health I guess cannot be restored however if he is eaten

missingnomaster · Nov 27, 2009

@Lovely:
True. Yoshi also has a pathetic amount of health if not going by Paper Mario stuff (I think he can only take 3 or 4 hits)

Yoshi's tongue isn't long enough to effectively outrange Roy, and we've seen in Smash what happens when jointed hitbox meets disjointed hitbox...

justaway12 · Nov 27, 2009

I was going to bring that up, but I had seen no point =P
I won't think Roy needed it.

WhatIsRaizen? · Nov 27, 2009

Moving on then.

Current Match-Up:
THE SPACE FALCON Vs. THE KING

Falco Vs. Dedede

Vs.

Loser's Round 3, Match 8.

Vs.

Ray_Kalm · Nov 27, 2009

Notice how all "low tiers" are in the top 4 at the moment.

@Current match-up: Falco has his arwing, what does King Dedede have?

BSP · Nov 27, 2009

I don't see how meta could stand up to sonic. We've established that sonic can destroy the Halberd, then he's got his remaining super time, and when that's out, he still has his crazy speed and time stopping (plus warping). No one ever answered when i asked how could meta defend himself from a time stop.

Current Matchup

Can D3 stop an arwing?

missingnomaster · Nov 27, 2009

He's too slow. And small. And most his attacks only work well on grounded foes.

WhatIsRaizen? · Nov 28, 2009

These last two match-up won't need much of a discussion, so let's do them together.

Vs.

Current Match-Up:
THE PSYCHIC CHILD Vs. THE ROBOT

Lucas Vs. R.O.B.

Vs.

Loser's Round 3, Match 9.

Vs.

Current Match-Up:
THE ELECTRIC RAT Vs. MR. GAME & WATCH

Pikachu Vs. Game & Watch

:pikachu:

Vs.

Loser's Round 3, Match 10.

missingnomaster · Nov 28, 2009

Yeah, they really dont need any discussion at all.

Though if you switched the matchups, ROB could almost do something to Pikachu if he had Mario Karts.

_clinton · Nov 28, 2009

It’s kind of late but…

I like how Samochan’s lack of good reading comprehension was repeated in posts from missingnomaster, and Powerbomb as well…

God people…just because I think some anime has more rights to be called canon than others (and I even gave the reason for why that said anime has more rights for being canon) doesn’t mean I automatically think every anime is in the same definition of canon…

F-zero’s should be seen as canon though…it has two games for the GBA based off of it, in fact they are the newest games for the series: F-Zero: GP Legend and F-Zero: Climax

And those even make references to plenty of the things in the F-Zero anime…Captain Falcon is Jody Summer's brother in both the anime and these two games for example IIRC…

Oh and I like how you guys make such a big deal about this saying it isn’t canon…which is funny…because I’m not the one saying that Diddy Kong; a 90 - 115 pound monkey can take a hit from (at least) a 3,000 pound car traveling at around 1200 kilometers per hour…just because he has eaten some sort of banana…

Oh and w/o looking into Falcon’s anime game canon…and instead looking at his games that came before the anime+games…he still looks like a good fighter…god people robbed his DNA just so they could make a clone of him…

Plus for the 1st game in the F-Zero games…they do have Falcon using his gun + his Falcon Flyer…so if you think Falcon can’t fight:
http://www.replacementdocs.com/download.php?view.1304

Then please…Read the 8 page comic that came with that F-Zero’s Instruction book ^

Also in regard to the Pokedex…please people…would you explain to me how it is fake when a certain number of pokemon actually do stuff like that in the game that is in the pokedex? Gyarados for example:
http://bulbapedia.bulbagarden.net/wiki/Lake_of_Rage

Hell things like Ninetails has a history as well:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kitsune

Pidgeot being able to fly at mach 3 speed somehow and bend trees just by flapping it’s wings is by far more impressive of a description than just saying the number 91 for its base speed (what I’m saying now is that…the moves pokemon learn, and the stats don’t mean **** except for in a few rare cases)

Of course…I like how you people think the pokemon world is normal when it’s not (Talk about it’s setting for me people if you would)…but whatever

Oh and in regards to Samus’ speed booster…her being invincible is a game mech…Super Sonic speed doesn’t mean that she is invincible when she is running…like I said before…it’s just a Sonic boom…but if we are going to talk about this some more…than I should point out that how come Samus can’t run on spiked floors if she is truly invincible? Oh and…again people…Nintendo didn’t make her invincible with it…for 2/3 of the GBA games they have told what it really was…

Vex514 · Nov 28, 2009

I'd like to make a correction to something here. Although Ike's my favorite brawler and such, your reasoning behind his victories is completely false. Ike CAN be hurt by weapons not blessed by Ashera. The one who can't is the Black Knight, not Ike. Also that was only the Black Knights armor anyway not even him. In the end game when you receive Ragnell to fight Ashera, any enemy can hurt Ike. HOWEVER I would like to add that we can take Skills into account such as Aether which heals himself the damage he inflicts, resolve which raises his stats when low on health, Wrath which adds 50% to his crit when low on health. Also Nihil which completely nullifies enemy's combat related skills which I feel would be pretty important here.

Just thought I'd mention that

_clinton · Nov 28, 2009

Vex514 said:
I'd like to make a correction to something here. Although Ike's my favorite brawler and such, your reasoning behind his victories is completely false. Ike CAN be hurt by weapons not blessed by Ashera. The one who can't is the Black Knight, not Ike. Also that was only the Black Knights armor anyway not even him. In the end game when you receive Ragnell to fight Ashera, any enemy can hurt Ike. HOWEVER I would like to add that we can take Skills into account such as Aether which heals himself the damage he inflicts, resolve which raises his stats when low on health, Wrath which adds 50% to his crit when low on health. Also Nihil which completely nullifies enemy's combat related skills which I feel would be pretty important here.

Just thought I'd mention that

Meh...this thread doesn't really seem to care about old matches...

Like for example....Lucas has equipment that gives him a true OHKO on anything and makes him invulnerable...yet because of the BS behind it...I haven't brought it up...

However...considering how this thread works...

How is Samus going to counter the Pork 'n Beans, the Saturn Cruiser, or the Coffee Table if this thread doesn't mind my asking?

sinickranger · Nov 28, 2009

Rob could drive into boxes from Mario Kart and get lots of stars making him invincible, or boos making him invisible (also invincible.)

Im not so sure on how fast Lucas can attack though.

Pikachu obviously wins the 2nd match.

Crystanium · Nov 28, 2009

_clinton said:
Oh and in regards to Samus’ speed booster…her being invincible is a game mech…

Prove it.

_clinton said:
Super Sonic speed doesn’t mean that she is invincible when she is running…

The Super Metroid Instruction Booklet says she's invincible when she uses the Speed Booster. Who am I going to believe?

_clinton said:
like I said before…it’s just a Sonic boom…

What's a sonic boom? If you're saying that "invincible" means "sonic boom" in this context, you'll have to provide proof.

_clinton said:
but if we are going to talk about this some more…than I should point out that how come Samus can’t run on spiked floors if she is truly invincible?

I am not sure how you can find a place to run on spiked floors. I may offer two reasons, however. 1. If the spikes are protruding a bit higher, making jumping the only option, then the moment Samus jumps off the ground, she is no longer using the Speed Booster. The moment she lands, the Speed Booster will have ceased to be active, thus causing Samus to take damage. 2. Similarly to the first reason, if spikes are ground level to where Samus could "run" over them, she ceases to use the Speed Booster again, because she is removing herself from the ground she was running on, thus causing a slight cessation, which means she takes damage, because the Speed Booster stopped the moment Samus ran right onto the spikes.

_clinton said:
Oh and…again people…Nintendo didn’t make her invincible with it…for 2/3 of the GBA games they have told what it really was…

Really? Where? You have Super Metroid, Metroid: Zero Mission, and Metroid Fusion. Those are the only three games Samus uses the Speed Booster. Super Metroid says Samus runs at "super high speed" and she is "invincible." Metroid Fusion and Metroid: Zero Mission say that Samus runs at "supersonic speeds." It doesn't say she's invincible, but that's beside the point, because Super Metroid isn't any less credible or canonical. I don't care if two of the three games with the Speed Booster do not mention "invincible." That's an argument from silence.

_clinton said:
How is Samus going to counter the Pork 'n Beans, the Saturn Cruiser, or the Coffee Table if this thread doesn't mind my asking?

Explain what these three things are and what they do. I tried looking up these on Google, and I'm not getting anything.

Samochan · Nov 28, 2009

Lol at "me lacking reading comprehension". I think it's fairly good, considering I usually only skim posts and english is only my secondary language. But the paragraph where you're trying to proof anime's a credible source of canon information stood out to me. Even though some games might be based on anime, do you see Falcon using Falcon punch on the actual games? No? Is the pokemon anime similar to games or do you see us using anime as a canonical source? Again, it's a no. It doesn't matter ONE BIT if some anime might be based on game or vice versa, the fact stays it's a different product altogether, prone to change and not a canon game. Unless you're the one lacking in reading comprehension here, you should understand that this topic thread title is "true to their games". Anime =/= game, just as pokemon anime (which is more accurate btw) =/= pokemon games and thus irrelevant in this discussion by default. It has been so as early as from the earlier thread that preceded this.

Kewkky · Nov 28, 2009

The Pork 'n' Beans, Saturn Cruiser and Coffee Table are all vehicles. Samus can just get on her spaceship and shoot missiles at 'em, carpet bomb 'em, or fly over them and grapple... From what I saw with all 3 of them, they does nothing but run and fly.

If Ness and Lucas are the only ones with vehicles, then Samus can just Speed Boost until either they run out of gas, or Samus gets bored and just rams 'em.

WhatIsRaizen? · Nov 28, 2009

_clinton said:
Meh...this thread doesn't really seem to care about old matches...

Like for example....Lucas has equipment that gives him a true OHKO on anything and makes him invulnerable...yet because of the BS behind it...I haven't brought it up...

However...considering how this thread works...

How is Samus going to counter the Pork 'n Beans, the Saturn Cruiser, or the Coffee Table if this thread doesn't mind my asking?

This thread does care about previous match-ups, in fact I've changed at least 5 previous match-up results (some even multiple times).

@Vex: I think it was Nid who gave a good explanation of how "anyone" was able to damage Ike after he got his Ashera.

Anyways, new MU soon.

Crystanium · Nov 28, 2009

Samochan said:
Lol at "me lacking reading comprehension". I think it's fairly good, considering I usually only skim posts and english is only my secondary language. But the paragraph where you're trying to proof anime's a credible source of canon information stood out to me. Even though some games might be based on anime, do you see Falcon using Falcon punch on the actual games? No? Is the pokemon anime similar to games or do you see us using anime as a canonical source? Again, it's a no. It doesn't matter ONE BIT if some anime might be based on game or vice versa, the fact stays it's a different product altogether, prone to change and not a canon game. Unless you're the one lacking in reading comprehension here, you should understand that this topic thread title is "true to their games". Anime =/= game, just as pokemon anime (which is more accurate btw) =/= pokemon games and thus irrelevant in this discussion by default. It has been so as early as from the earlier thread that preceded this.

About the Falcon Punch, we never see Captain Falcon use it in-game, but I wouldn't be surprised if he is able to do that. The characters in F-Zero do have abilities. Black Shadow uses some kind of ability and binds Captain Falcon in the Story Mode. Then there is Deathborn, who sends Black Shadow to some other dimension for failing to defeat Falcon in the F-Zero Grand Prix. The Skull is another example. He was raised from the dead by the use of science and black magic. Another thing I would like to point out is that when you complete the Story Mode in F-Zero GX, when the credits are playing, the person singing does bring up "Falcon Punch." So, while it is never shown, I'd say it is implied that Falcon can use a Falcon Punch.

WhatIsRaizen? · Nov 28, 2009

Wins +3:

,

Wins +2:

,

Wins +1:

,

,

, :mewtwo:, :pikachu:

Neutral:

,

Loss -1:

Loss -2:

,

,

ichu:,

,

Loss -3:

,

Loss -4:

,

Kewkky · Nov 28, 2009

WhatIsRaizen? said:
I won't be able to do the overlook thing anymore due to smilies restrictions.

So, from now on, I'm just going to start linking the overall results for a round to a single post.

Did you reserve a post under the first one? Use it to continue, the one you reserved for changes.

Smash Bros. Canon Tournament! (Mario Vs. ????) - 06/14/10

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