New Smash Bros for WiiU

Arcadenik said:

But ultimately they got cut. I'm beginning to think it wasn't hesitation on Sakurai's part, but more like they were back-up additions in case he needed to make the roster bigger on a short notice. It would certainly explain Jigglypuff's late addition and her placement in the Brawl data.

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Probably the other way around. Likely those characters were not back-ups since the entire roster was decided in 2006. They were just those who were not involved in the Subspace Emmisary. They likely got cut because they could get away with it. It's not like they were on reserve. They were always planned. But due to certain circumstances, they were removed.

You can likely apply that Toon Link and Jigglypuff. It's not like every character must be involved in the story mode so they simply weren't included. As for Wolf, the scrapped data indicates Wolf was a "resurrected" character which would explain his absence.

^^^but jiggs was added late.

I'm not saying I agree or disagree but it is an interesting theory...

disfunkshunal said:

^^^but jiggs was added late.

I'm not saying I agree or disagree but it is an interesting theory...

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The only character added late was Sonic. Sakurai has told us this.

KumaOso said:

You can likely apply that Toon Link and Jigglypuff. It's not like every character must be involved in the story mode so they simply weren't included. As for Wolf, the scrapped data indicates Wolf was a "resurrected" character which would explain his absence.

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The only real evidence is that Wolf doesn't have a victory theme file. There isn't much to draw on that. They may have not added Wolfs and scrapped the idea before adding him.

Hey all, there is some actual Nintendo related news to talk about for a change. On December 27th Nintendo will be holding another "Nintendo Direct" online stream. If anyone remembers the last one several months back that is where Nintendo unveiled some new titles for the 3DS, main draw being Monster Hunter Tri G for the 3DS. Also, below the link on the story will be the URL to the future broadcast in case anyone wants to add it to their bookmarks in advanced.

Story: http://gonintendo.com/?mode=viewstory&id=169028
Stream: http://www.ustream.tv/user/Nintendo_Direct/shows

Of course I would caution any unreasonable expectations, but it is possible we may get some new information on some of the titles unveiled in the last event. It is a little strange that Nintendo is holding another event like this so soon. None the less it will be interesting to see what Nintendo has to show.

Mario Tennis 3DS got announced in the last conference, hopefully they'll give us some new tidbits on that game in this one

I am really hoping for some news on FE13. Krom wasn't impressive at all when he was originally shown and I want to see if he got any better.

Starphoenix said:

Hey all, there is some actual Nintendo related news to talk about for a change. On December 27th Nintendo will be holding another "Nintendo Direct" online stream. If anyone remembers the last one several months back that is where Nintendo unveiled some new titles for the 3DS, main draw being Monster Hunter Tri G for the 3DS. Also, below the link on the story will be the URL to the future broadcast in case anyone wants to add it to their bookmarks in advanced.

Story: http://gonintendo.com/?mode=viewstory&id=169028
Stream: http://www.ustream.tv/user/Nintendo_Direct/shows

Of course I would caution any unreasonable expectations, but it is possible we may get some new information on some of the titles unveiled in the last event. It is a little strange that Nintendo is holding another event like this so soon. None the less it will be interesting to see what Nintendo has to show.

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Nintendo usually hold a press conference in October. The last one was that. I'm not expecting much from this. If it's awesome, that's cool. If not, ehh. I don't expect much for a while.

Super Smash Bros. Fan said:

I am really hoping for some news on FE13. Krom wasn't impressive at all when he was originally shown and I want to see if he got any better.

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I do not know if we will see any more from Krom/Chrome/Crumb per se but I would not be surprised if we hear more about Fire Emblem 3DS since it is scheduled for a Spring release. In turn that will probably cause another surge of Fire Emblem discussion and Krom support. Regardless of the fact that not one person knows enough about him to develop genuine support...

SmashChu said:

Nintendo usually hold a press conference in October. The last one was that. I'm not expecting much from this. If it's awesome, that's cool. If not, ehh. I don't expect much for a while.

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Hence my warning from the start. I only expect some minor information updates to existing titles, and those that were revealed but not discussed in detail from the last event.

SmashChu said:

The only real evidence is that Wolf doesn't have a victory theme file. There isn't much to draw on that. They may have not added Wolfs and scrapped the idea before adding him.

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Don't forget that Mewtwo and Roy had victory theme files as well. Wolf may have been left on the cutting room floor at the time those files were made, but was brought back at the last minute.

Hey, guys! I made this really awesome song! Check it out:
Star Fields

Just from before, I know it's unlikely both will get in, but in that case, would they keep Lucario in? Or would they go for another 4th gen? Or even 3rd gen if they really wanted. While 3rd gen has had it's chance to shine and is over, with enough support mfor a pokemon of said gen it could happen. 1st gen is ancient history to many and yet they still pull chars out for smash games. But then again, 1st gen is what started it all....

ANYWAY I'm getting off topic. was thinking out loud, i suppose, don't let me ruin the current conversation ^^

Merry Christmas!

SmashChu said:

I guess I started a Pokemon discussion. This one is moving well.

Mewtwo still seems VERY popular and still manages to pop up when ever he can. No doubt he's coming back. I don't think he'll steal a seat.

nLim8d made a good point in that I think we'll be surprised. Black/White is hard to pin down because no one really stands out. I thought N as he kind of does and if they were ever going to do a second trainer character, it would be with someone like him (a character people really like and is identifiable). The problem is would Sakurai just make another Pokemon Trainer? Then again, he did entertain the idea of another Ice Climber like character so you never know.

On the manga, how is N different. In the game, he is a messed up guy who sees Pokemon as these great things.

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Yep, N (nLim8d) is right, there really isn't a true stand out Pokemon for that Generation, in a similar vain to the 2nd and 3rd Gen. Although it is rather early to tell, it is falling to either Zoroark and Victini.

As for N, in the manga he's tough to discribe, but he really brings his game counterpart to life.

Starphoenix said:

Although I am inclined to believe that there is actually far less of a legitimate demand for a fifth generation Pokémon six slots would probably appease everyone. Well, except for HyperFalcon and Genesect supporters...

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This is true, and 6 slots is the best way to make the majority of people happy.

Starphoenix said:

Hey all, there is some actual Nintendo related news to talk about for a change. On December 27th Nintendo will be holding another "Nintendo Direct" online stream. If anyone remembers the last one several months back that is where Nintendo unveiled some new titles for the 3DS, main draw being Monster Hunter Tri G for the 3DS. Also, below the link on the story will be the URL to the future broadcast in case anyone wants to add it to their bookmarks in advanced.

Story: http://gonintendo.com/?mode=viewstory&id=169028
Stream: http://www.ustream.tv/user/Nintendo_Direct/shows

Of course I would caution any unreasonable expectations, but it is possible we may get some new information on some of the titles unveiled in the last event. It is a little strange that Nintendo is holding another event like this so soon. None the less it will be interesting to see what Nintendo has to show.

Click to expand...

I'm not expecting much out of this, if anything it'll just be more gameplay from upcoming games, and or another Wii U preview.

Super Smash Bros. Fan said:

I am really hoping for some news on FE13. Krom wasn't impressive at all when he was originally shown and I want to see if he got any better.

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Agreed. Although by the time Smash 4 comes out he won't be a promotional character like Roy was in Melee.

I hope everyone took advantage of today, if you're on break, resting, or relaxing with your family. Year's heading out and we're all growing in years, that's real yo.

Thank you who made my participation here interesting, I look forward to the gifts given to me that will work to busy up my agenda.

[COLLAPSE="Good mutha****in tithings"]-Tri-Hy for hooking me up with the latest Pokespe for when I feel the need to procrastinate

-FanMan and his sincere and intriguing thoughts in the form of an essay

-Hot Java for encouraging me to continue expressing my ideas

-Starphoenix for reminding us what this thread is actually about

-Inspiring movesets from Berserker

-Iblis for just being there when its important

-Brosis for being so dangerously promiscuous with his STRENGTH

-Kuma and Chu for introducing that realism factor with the scenario of relatives bickering about, not to mention some interesting POV's.

-Many others whom did me the honor of making up or simply giving me something neat to argue about.

_And to the rest of you who kept things going, even when things were the driest of dry.[/COLLAPSE]
Thanks, its been real!

N is Soaring South for the Season.

[COLLAPSE="I Suppose Tijuana will do for this Shiznit."] [/COLLAPSE]

KumaOso said:

Don't forget that Mewtwo and Roy had victory theme files as well. Wolf may have been left on the cutting room floor at the time those files were made, but was brought back at the last minute.

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Again, there is no evidence to support that idea. There can be any number of reasons. Maybe they never decided against it as they were getting to him. It's hard to say anything. We know for a fact he was in the roster since the early days (as was everyone else). So you have to explain why he's there with no theme. Saying he was cut, re-added, and than cut again doesn't make sense. If they also cut him, why is he still in the and Roy and Mewtwo not. Sonic was clearly what drove the cut, but why was added and than re-added and the other two gone? See how it raises more questions.

I tend to go with KISS. There is likely another reason where he just didn't have one.

--- said:

Merry Christmas!

Yep, N (nLim8d) is right, there really isn't a true stand out Pokemon for that Generation, in a similar vain to the 2nd and 3rd Gen. Although it is rather early to tell, it is falling to either Zoroark and Victini.

As for N, in the manga he's tough to discribe, but he really brings his game counterpart to life.

Spoiler

Anyone who can convince a starter Pokemon to leave their trainer and then leave their former trainer to fall to their death is really something else...

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It's really that a single Gen 5 Pokemon had caught on. There are some popular Pokemon, but not a single one. I've really said Zoroark because he does stand out.

I will disagree that Gen 3 had a memorable one. It may be why it doesn't have a character. Hmmmmm....maybe it wont. But I am entertaining the idea of N or the starters in some form.

Going through a list would kill me, but you've all inspired me for different reasons.

Since i've been on this thread (pretty much when i started realy paying atention to the boards), you guys have taught me about smash, you've given me statistics and whatnot on popularity, and given me essays on why or why not certain characters should/should not be in smash 4, you've encouraged me to think of stages, you've liked my music selections, you've offered critique on said stages, you've made me derp, and you're cheerful about it, too.

Thanks guys, and merry christmas! :-D

SmashChu said:

It's really that a single Gen 5 Pokemon had caught on. There are some popular Pokemon, but not a single one. I've really said Zoroark because he does stand out.

I will disagree that Gen 3 had a memorable one. It may be why it doesn't have a character. Hmmmmm....maybe it wont. But I am entertaining the idea of N or the starters in some form.

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N < Victini/Zoroark. Just saying.

I don't see N coming in as a playable character because, well, Gary never did. The reason why I say this is because Gary was more popular than N wish he could be, yet Melee never brought him into the scene. Besides that, a PKMN Trainer, being the hero of the story, has much more probability of entering, rather than the rivals, or in N's case, "Misunderstood Villian". So, in otherwords, N < Hero, White or Black, for example. I'm not Sakurai'in around, but still, N seems very unlikely...
...
...And sadly, Victini is following...

But off topic, I'm making music, now! I'm making an album called "TechSea" by "AuraSage". It'll have 10 different songs, inspired by Smashboards and Serebii. Once again, thanks alot, guys!

asage94 said:

N < Victini/Zoroark. Just saying.

I don't see N coming in as a playable character because, well, Gary never did. The reason why I say this is because Gary was more popular than N wish he could be, yet Melee never brought him into the scene. Besides that, a PKMN Trainer, being the hero of the story, has much more probability of entering, rather than the rivals, or in N's case, "Misunderstood Villian". So, in otherwords, N < Hero, White or Black, for example. I'm not Sakurai'in around, but still, N seems very unlikely...
...
...And sadly, Victini is following...

But off topic, I'm making music, now! I'm making an album called "TechSea" by "AuraSage". It'll have 10 different songs, inspired by Smashboards and Serebii. Once again, thanks alot, guys!

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I actually think N wouldn't be completely out of the realm of possibility because he is the closest thing that Pokemon has had to like... a real character... ever. However, 3 Gen 5 Pokemon certainly don't deserve to be playable since only Pokefans care about them. It only works with the nostalgic Gen 1 ones.

Sakurai has tweeted something about Nintendo Direct, not sure if trolling though

As you may or may not know, I am putting together a roster. But not just a wishlist or prediction roster. This roster was made to look at the potential candidates for SSB4, look at the choices that would make the most sense and one that would represent Nintendo the best. This model as to how I explain my choices is somewhat based off the one SmashChu used when doing his roster. Note that this roster does not aim for realism, just for what I think would be the best for it.

There are fifty-five characters, transformations included: Not likely to be reached, but possible if Sakurai is given 3+ years to develop this game. While I would be satisfied with a small roster, a large roster is what I feel would truly represent Nintendo's history the best and considering that there are plenty of good choices, there wasn't really much problem with diving in. You have quite a few relatively important additions left from existing series along with many new franchise added and I can name over 20 good choices that have not been in Brawl and this roster gets the majority in.

No cuts have been made: One thing that ticks me off about the community is their cut-happy behavior towards Brawl characters. They assume that because cut happened in Melee that cuts are needed to make room for more newcomers or "flavor-of-the month characters" (especially the latter) due to patterns that do not exist. Cuts were easy to make in Melee because many characters were added in as clones to buff up the roster and as such, could easily be cut (and even then, only Pichu and Young Link were intentionally cut, Dr. Mario, Roy, and Mewtwo were all victim of time restraints). When Mewtwo was found to be cut, many fans went into an uproar and Mewtwo has found itself to be among the most wanted characters for SSB4 (a similar case can be applied for Roy as well). Sakurai have also went on the record to say that he loves all his characters, meaning that he enjoys playing with all the characters he made and the work he did on them. If Sakurai gets his way, he will try to ensure that no Brawl vets owned by Nintendo are cut and given that he's been able to delay Kid Icarus for over a year, it is not out of the realm of possibility. However, if we absolutely must have cuts, Sakurai will likely take out Sonic and Snake first due to the legality issues surrounding getting these characters, even saying that it is harder to make third-party fit then making the game itself. I may expand on why I think no cuts on Nintendo characters is possible and why it shouldn't happen, but for now, I'm saying no to cuts.

Roy and Mewtwo are brought back with Young Link as costume for Toon Link, Dr. Mario as costume for Mario, and Pichu as costume for Pikachu: This way, every vet is brought back in at least an alt costume. Roy and Mewtwo return in full form because both were planned for SSBB but cut due to time restraints and are highly wanted to return. Roy would also represent Fire Emblem much better then Krom would (unless Krom proves himself to be unique from the others) and would also represent the first character that started in Smash. Mewtwo has recently regained relevancy thanks to Nobunga x Pokemon in which he will likely play a major role and is possibly the most wanted character for Smash. So with that being said, here's the roster and my explanation for it:[COLLAPSE="Starting Roster"] [/COLLAPSE][Collapse="Final Roster"] [/COLLAPSE]Toad: The bar to a fifth Mario rep are extremely high. So far, we only have the absolute core characters of the series in. If any other Mario character could be justified as an absolute core character, it is Toad. They have been with the series since the very beginning and since then, have appeared in most every mainstream games and the roles of Toad increasing since Brawl was released (and in Paper Mario 3DS, there is a Toad partner that goes with Paper Mario). The importance and relevance of Toad (which were already obviously noticeable) have grown throughout the past few years to where they are almost are well-known as the four characters in Brawl and along with it, the fan base. Mario has a very good chance of getting a fifth slot and Toad is the most likely to occupy the spot.

Mii: They aren't the most exciting choice for potential newcomers, but they have every reason to be in this game. The Mii's are synonymous with the success of the Wii and have become incredibly important to Nintendo consoles (they will remain important). Regardless of what a few people on the Internet say about Mii's and how much they whine about it, it is Mii's importance to Nintendo that make them so highly deserving of a spot.

King K. Rool: Not as much of a sure shot as Diddy Kong was in Brawl, but his absence in DKCR will not stop him from returning in a main title or even in SSB4 and I do sincerely think he highly deserves a place. King K. Rool remains as important to the series as ever thanks to starring in the revolutionary DKC trilogy and in the very popular Donkey Kong 64 and remains loved by millions of fans to this date. Appearing in the 2008's Super Mario Sluggers show he hasn't been completely forgotten either and it is very likely he will return in a main DK installment eventually. DK is due for a third rep and he is the best choice for it.

Dixie Kong: But if anyone can beat K. Rool to the spot, it is Dixie (or perhaps both will exist in a fourth slot situation) Dixie Kong is another important character in the series and was placed over K. Rool for consideration for Brawl. Given that Sakurai tends to add contents he missed from the last game, it is plausible to assume that a few planned characters from the Forbidden 7 will get in and this plays a good part as to why Dixie Kong has a slot of getting in.

Takamaru: Zelda's sister series, so it already has a piece of Nintendo's history and in 2009, Takamaru got a side game in Samurai Warriors 3. If Sakurai were to consider this enough of a new game, expect him to be in SSB4. Also seems to be a decently popular choice in Japan.

Ridley: How long is it going to be before the size issue finally dies? Because I sure haven't seen anything that indicates that Ridley is too big for Smash. He is the most deserving character for Smash 4. His relevance to the series along with importance and massive popularity from the Brawl era that carries on to this date. Excluding him is a huge mistake (as it was in Brawl).

Palutena: If there is only one new Kid Icarus character, it will be Palutena. She is the only major Kid Icarus character to be in all three games and is the most important character to the series next to Pit himself. There is also that Sakurai is developing the game, so unless the game bombs and is mediocre in reception, she is very likely first. However, there is a decent chance of us getting a third rep. Which lead us to...

Medusa: as the second new Kid Icarus character. Also a major player in the Kid Icarus series, next to Palutena in importance. Basically, copy paste everything else except her being first.

Samurai Goroh: Not exactly the most exciting addition, but I do think that F-zero should get a second rep after not getting it for so long and many have been asking for a second character. With Samurai Goroh being from the series since the start, receiving the AT treatment in Brawl, and that he appeared in the Melee intro, I do think he is the best suited for it.

Little Mac: Should be on every roster by now along with Ridley, K. Rool, and Mewtwo. Little Mac is likely the first new franchise that will get bidding. Sakurai looks towards the west and western fans absolutely love him, not to mention that the Punch-Out!! series is influential and his series is about fighting and Smash is a fighting franchise, so they should fit together like PB&J. Having a revival in May, 2009 also helps.

Isaac: Could be called the Marth of Golden Sun. He is the main character of Golden Sun, important in The Lost Age, and also has a small role in Dark Dawn, so most people are going to associate with Isaac, especially with his title being the most well known. They will likely opt for the most important character and not the most relevant (Matthew).

Starfy: This choice is somewhat iffy as well, but out of of a pool of Starfy, Saki, and Ray to choose from, Starfy is by far the most recognizable. Thanks to finally going international and it likely getting another game in the near future, Starfy should expect to see his series grow. A great way to represent that is to place him in SSB4.

Victini: The 5th gen rep (if any) will be between Zoroark and Victini. Out of those two, I find Victini to be the better choice.

Victini is the 1st Pokemon to receive two movies at the same time and the second Pokemon to star in two movies (Mewtwo was the first). The movie is also the closest to the beginning of SSB4's development, so already, this is something that the Pokemon Company will look into when deciding the 5th gen rep. Also interesting is that it is 000# on the Unova Pokedex, something that has never occurred before and is the first Pokemon to do so. It is also making a name for itself and is becoming one of Black & White's stand out Pokemons, having appeared in the Pokemon Center logo for the latest store and was in the largest event in Pokemon history with the Liberty Garden event (along with an event that's going on now here and the Liberty Garden event is more accessible then Zoroark's event). Not a guarantee by any means, but if anyone aside from Zoroark is picked as the 5th gen rep for SSB4 (and it is a real possibility), Victini is very likely to be that character.

Mega Man: The only new third-party addition. This one I'm more flexible about removing as it all depends on the number of slots made available and if third-party returns. But if only one third-party return, it will most likely be him since he has yet to appear in a Smash game (whereas Sonic and Snake has and they may get axed if Sakurai's guest policy means a guest can come in only once). Mega Man is by far the most popular third-party choices for SSB4 and the only one that has more supporters then detractors right now. He also has an extensive history with Nintendo, with over half of his games having originally appeared on Nintendo's systems and even more that were ported to Nintendo consoles. It is also what put Capcom in the spotlight and helped contributed to them being so successful. Capcom is also planning big things for Mega Man next year and it is possible that it could involve a Mega Man reveal for SSB4 (and/or new games for the franchise).

Please tell me what you think of this roster.

Arcadenik has tainted yet another poor soul.

If a roster such as this were put in to effect, i can't say i'd have any real qualms. ^^

asage94 said:

N < Victini/Zoroark. Just saying.

I don't see N coming in as a playable character because, well, Gary never did. The reason why I say this is because Gary was more popular than N wish he could be, yet Melee never brought him into the scene. Besides that, a PKMN Trainer, being the hero of the story, has much more probability of entering, rather than the rivals, or in N's case, "Misunderstood Villian". So, in otherwords, N < Hero, White or Black, for example. I'm not Sakurai'in around, but still, N seems very unlikely...
...
...And sadly, Victini is following...

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We already have Pokemon Trainer, which is who the hero is. N is something different. He's an anti-hero of sorts and fills a different role. And if the poll is anything to go by, Japanese players like him.

Oasis_S said:

Arcadenik has tainted yet another poor soul.

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I'm surprised anyone actually took him seriously.

That's awesome Fan, I envisioned close to 55 characters myself.

Give or take Professor Layton and a character from Operation Rainfall.

Of course I do a bit of cutting/replacing for a bit of dynamism: like Krystal if they can't revamp Wolf or Ryu Hyubasa as a type of throwback just like Snake.

Can anyone else see FanMan's Roster Pic?

I can't see the whole thing :-/

I can see it now.

Aiyo! Quick question: Does Sonic actually have a decent chance of returning?

Also, no Saki Amamiya?

Sonic has a better chance than Snake imo

Well Sonic does have the biggest fanbase for Smash

I'd argue that Diddy, Wario and Meta Knight where just as much wanted but your probably right...

I doubt any character was wanted as much as Sonic

In regards to 3rd parties that is but now that you say that I don't doubt that either...

I'm huge Sonic Fan but I wouldn't invite the Crazies...

Every fanbase has its share of nuts, Sonic just happens to have a little more than the usual

I can't see them cutting Sonic unless they aren't licensed to use him or something. If anything I'd think they'd add to the series by adding Tails.

SmashChu said:

We already have Pokemon Trainer, which is who the hero is. N is something different. He's an anti-hero of sorts and fills a different role. And if the poll is anything to go by, Japanese players like him.

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This is true, although I didn't know that the Japanese liked N (what poll?).


@SSBF: I can't see the whole pic.


@Fanbases: There are always a few crazies, heck, some might say we're crazy.

Either way, Sonic's return is reconizable. Mario and Sonic Olympics is still running, therefore, there's no doubt the trade deals still in affect.

I separated both the starting and the final roster. Hopefully now everyone can see it.

@SmashChu: If third-party characters do not return, when do you expect we'll find out about it?

nLiM8d said:

Does Sonic actually have a decent chance of returning?

Also, no Saki Amamiya?

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It's a 50/50 chance for me. He'll be back if third-party characters are allowed to return, but not if guest policy outlaws a guest to return more then once. I would say he is the second least likely character to return, next to Snake himself.

I like Saki and I would love for him to be in SSB4. He also seems to be slightly more likely the Starfy since Sakurai seems to be bias towards Sin & Punishment. However, I choose Starfy because he is more recognizable to the general public and would give less of a "WTF" reaction. That being said, if this roster were to expand to 60 characters (transformation included), he would definitely be on it.