New Rankings! Pennsylvania Player Finder and Power Rankings (10/31/07)

pockyD · Aug 18, 2007

cape may be off by a little; as we have mentioned countless times, his ranking was clouded by inactivity

vagabond was a big mistake, i will admit that.. No real excuses

xyt consistently outplaces all of you pghers at ccx and even alot of the std's; vagabond should probably jump him (and a few more people) but who else?

d29 - it's the FIFTEENTH SPOT; who do you propose take it? d20 got 7th at mowfest which is admirable. I would like to hear you who else you think should be considered for the list though (yes, please give a list if possible, we would like to see who we missed)

also keep in mind these were done over a month ago at this point, so the most recent of things (taki's 3rd in ohio in particular) were not considered

A-Laon · Aug 18, 2007

pockyD said:
cape may be off by a little; as we have mentioned countless times, his ranking was clouded by inactivity

vagabond was a big mistake, i will admit that.. No real excuses

xyt consistently outplaces all of you pghers at ccx and even alot of the std's; vagabond should probably jump him (and a few more people) but who else?

d29 - it's the FIFTEENTH SPOT; who do you propose take it? d20 got 7th at mowfest which is admirable. I would like to hear you who else you think should be considered for the list though (yes, please give a list if possible, we would like to see who we missed)

also keep in mind these were done over a month ago at this point, so the most recent of things (taki's 3rd in ohio in particular) were not considered

It was insisted before the list was even made that inactivity should not be considered in order to mar the rankings of the good players, hence it's no reason to lessen Cape's ranking.

Yes Vagabond was a mistake -- the type of blatant mistake exemplifying the lack of coordination in the panel.

As for xyt: what ccx / stds are you referring to? There were no ccxs or stds in Pitt (at least none anybody would attend), so if this is elsewhere, well, he better have outplaced us, because we weren't there. EDIT: Oh, and if we're taking recent inactivity into account, why are we ranking people in Korea?

Regarding D20: if Mowfest results were a considerable factor for this list, then why's Velocity so high? Is it because he's always done better than most people in the past? That sure didn't help Cape any.

pockyD · Aug 18, 2007

he wasn't punished for being inactive in itself per se

he was "punished" for not producing "good" results in the few tournaments he went to

lol are you saying there were never any ccx's or std's? kind of weird considering i've seen you at 4 or 5 of them. maybe you sleepwalk or something

of course mowfest was considered; but one or two results can easily be overshadowed by 8 or 9 more consistently positive results. velocity has been to tournaments like every week since then. cape and vagabond have been to one, maybe two tournaments in that time and even if so, no results were produced such that we would know the results

and of course this would be helped by having a central panelist or two, which we will for the next list

finally, once again please just give a list of players you consider in the next "tier" (since you love that system) along with d20 and xyt that you feel should be considered instead for the bottom part of the list

edit: anyway your act is getting a bit tiresome so i hope some other panelist steps in instead of me having to constantly reiterate the same points

A-Laon · Aug 18, 2007

pockyD said:
he wasn't punished for being inactive in itself per se

he was "punished" for not producing "good" results in the few tournaments he went to

lol are you saying there were never any ccx's or std's? kind of weird considering i've seen you at 4 or 5 of them. maybe you sleepwalk or something

of course mowfest was considered; but one or two results can easily be overshadowed by 8 or 9 more consistently positive results. velocity has been to tournaments like every week since then. cape and vagabond have been to one, maybe two tournaments in that time and even if so, no results were produced such that we would know the results

and of course this would be helped by having a central panelist or two, which we will for the next list

finally, once again please just give a list of players you consider in the next "tier" (since you love that system) along with d20 and xyt that you feel should be considered instead for the bottom part of the list

edit: anyway your act is getting a bit tiresome so i hope some other panelist steps in instead of me having to constantly reiterate the same points

So consistently beating almost everyone in the state with veritably random characters is 11th-in-the-state material?

If you're talking about ccx all the way back in 2006 -- Xyt went to a total of one of them, nearly an entire year ago now, back when Pittsburgh as a whole could barely be considered "competent." I guess that's what makes 12th.

And now, doing terrible in a major tourney but providing consistent placings in smaller, less significant tournies that are more your speed earn you placing among those who actually do well in the big events? Congratulations, you just qualified for 5th in PA!

And if you want my idea of a list, make it best of 10 and actually make it accurate.

And my only act is debating what you're saying. If you're tired of me not agreeing with you, well, that goes to show the quality of the panel.

Pakman · Aug 18, 2007

It is hard to rank inactive players when we aren't considering their inactivity. The last time I played cape was probably over a year ago. I have never played most of the pittsburgh people cause pittsburgh is like 4538907338 miles from philly. Last time I played vagabond I could still hold my own against Cactuar (almost two years ago). I like to consider myself pretty active, too. I hit about two to three tournaments a month.

We had discussions about every placement and we agreed to put some people low, because they were inactive and needed to prove themselves. All some of us had to go on were matches played over a year ago. We also said this list was preliminary, so everyone needs to untwist their panties and be patient. We will make changes and we will consider all the debate going on. Make your comments about the listings and the placements, but don't insult the panel.

dot_eater · Aug 18, 2007

Nakamaru said:
Dude seriously, use some punctuation for god sakes. It makes you look a lot less of a ******. But hey if you want to keep doing it despite the fact that you learned it in 2nd grade (or were there to many stabbings in your area that you never learned anything) its fine with me.

Why is everyone so hostile towards velocity? Why is there an entire post in complete disrespect to him and his privacy? I havn't seen him boast about his playing ability without it being in good fun.

pockyD · Aug 18, 2007

A-Laon said:
So consistently beating almost everyone in the state with veritably random characters is 11th-in-the-state material?

ok LET'S GO who did cape "consistently beat" in the 6 months prior to the rankings release? sure "everyone"; let's have a list

If you're talking about ccx all the way back in 2006 -- Xyt went to a total of one of them, nearly an entire year ago now, back when Pittsburgh as a whole could barely be considered "competent." I guess that's what makes 12th.

SO WHO SHOULD BE HIGHER? i'm still waiting for that list of people you think should be considered in place of xyt and d20. haven't you realize that PA sucks?

And now, doing terrible in a major tourney but providing consistent placings in smaller, less significant tournies that are more your speed earn you placing among those who actually do well in the big events? Congratulations, you just qualified for 5th in PA!

lol "major tourney"; shows how unaware you are of all the 30+man tourneys velocity has attended and done well at (just look at smashtality), while mow's fest was even less than 30 people. how are they less significant? what was first prize payout at mowfest again? and that makes it a 'major tournament'?

And if you want my idea of a list, make it best of 10 and actually make it accurate.

a reasonable suggestion. but we felt more people would prefer to see where they stand rather than just seeing this elusive group that they have no idea how far they are from joining.

And my only act is debating what you're saying. If you're tired of me not agreeing with you, well, that goes to show the quality of the panel.

but you are rarely introducing any new arguments. you just bring up the same tired points that i've repeatedly addressed. i also have no problem with people disagreeing with me if they propose a valid solution. why don't we see YOUR top 10?

A-Laon · Aug 18, 2007

Pacman On Crack said:
Make your comments about the listings and the placements, but don't insult the panel.

Seemingly, they go together.

The Cape · Aug 18, 2007

Pakman, dont we still need to MM?

Pakman · Aug 18, 2007

The Cape said:
Pakman, dont we still need to MM?

I believe we have a $10 MM scheduled for Komo's.

Can't wait.

A-Laon said:
Seemingly, they go together.

no then don't. There is a difference between insult and arguing. You seem to be doing more of the former.

takieddine · Aug 18, 2007

I'm making deciding the list much easier, once everyone sees how nasty my marth got

j/k.

Seriously though arguing right now with no results to argue about (not since mowfest) seems pointless.

xyt · Aug 18, 2007

i honestly have a heck a lot to say about what's going on..
but i seriously can't articulate the words i want to use the to prove my point.
so i'll just list a couple that come to mind.

-as stated before the list is PRELIMINARY (i don't even know if i spelt that right..). In other words, IT'S IN THE WORKS/INCOMPLETE you name it! as pacman said.. be patient people. it's a work in progess and by the looks of it, one can obviously tell that not everyone is happy with it. Which means our panelists will work harder for a more accurate list for the next one.

-the panelists have discussed and placed EVERY SINGLE ranker with care and caution. WHAT MORE COULD THEY HAVE DONE? I mean.. they tried they're ***** off! PLEASE! be curtious of the fact that they took the time and effort to do so. As stated over and over again, if you have a dispute, go right ahead and discuss away but be nice about it. DON'T INSULT. there is absolutely no need for harsh feelings here.

-it just seems to me that some of the people arguing against the current panel and power rankings are forgetting that, for lack of a better phrase, WE'RE ALL ON THE SAME SIDE. i thought we were all tryin to work this out together in an effort to better the community. THERE IS NO CONSPIRACY HERE. These rankings are NOT a way to discredit certain people while giving undeserved credit to others. PLZ! GROW UP!

-i happen to share some of the same opinions too. i feel cape is too low and velocity is too high. i also feel certain ppl should be above certain other ppl. BUT, since i've decided to put my trust in the panel we have, i'm gonna leave it to them to practice sound judgement. I'm not saying nor am I expecting them to come up with THE PERFECT LIST and I also find it nearly impossible to satisfy everyone. HOWEVER, I have high expectations for the panel to discuss/argue/debate/analyze and place people with the available statistics/results (MM, friendlies, tournies you name it) in a democratic and organized manner. WHICH THEY HAVE! All has been done to it's full potential with the given materials at the given time. so please! BE NICE.

i notice that i probably opened myself up to alot of flaming and I also notice that this post is possibly as pointless and inaccurate as my everyday spam. But come on now... the word is LOVE ppl! @_@)..!!

A-Laon · Aug 18, 2007

pockyD said:
ok LET'S GO who did cape "consistently beat" in the 6 months prior to the rankings release? sure "everyone"; let's have a list

I'm afraid I haven't recorded every tournament victory of Cape's over the last half year, so I'll just leave the example to Mow:

"lol. g/j cape, way to beat everyone in tournament except me and cactuar and still be 11th."

Oh, and you say 6 months, yet you're supporting xyt for his accomplishments all the way last year. Make up your mind on what you're basing this on.

SO WHO SHOULD BE HIGHER? i'm still waiting for that list of people you think should be considered in place of xyt and d20. haven't you realize that PA sucks?

As said, nobody should be higher -- it should only go to 10th place. Why go to 15 when the bottom is so admittedly insubstantial and random?

lol "major tourney"; shows how unaware you are of all the 30+man tourneys velocity has attended and done well at (just look at smashtality), while mow's fest was even less than 30 people. how are they less significant? what was first prize payout at mowfest again? and that makes it a 'major tournament'?

Mowfest exhibited substantial representation from all parts of PA (probably the best until Komo's tourney), which made it a good basis for accurately comparing PA players, and, apparently, PA > Velocity.

but you are rarely introducing any new arguments.

As you're not debasing mine.

why don't we see YOUR top 10?

1- Cactuar
2- Mow
3- Javi
4- Triad
5- Cape
6- Komo / Vagabond
7- Komo / Vagabond
8- Velocity
9- Swiftbass

Pacman was the only person I'm mostly clueless of, so I'd need to consider him more if I were to finalize this and get it to 10, and 7-9 is a little rough, but here's the idea.

pockyD · Aug 18, 2007

A-Laon said:
I'm afraid I haven't recorded every tournament victory of Cape's over the last half year, so I'll just leave the example to Mow:

"lol. g/j cape, way to beat everyone in tournament except me and cactuar and still be 11th."

just list a few instead of once again stooping to "everyone" (see what i mean when i say you don't introduce any new arguments?)

Oh, and you say 6 months, yet you're supporting xyt for his accomplishments all the way last year. Make up your mind on what you're basing this on.

i just assumed that you hadn't met cape until 6 months before the ranking (i seem to recall that as being the first time I met him at least, and i remember you introducing yourself as if it was your first

but fine, if you have anything, go up to a year then. i would still like to hear it

As said, nobody should be higher -- it should only go to 10th place. Why go to 15 when the bottom is so admittedly insubstantial and random?

No one's admitting that it's "insubstantial and random"; that's just your claim that you're refusing to back up. if you could provide 3-4 names that could reasonably be put above them that would be appreciated. but once again, you don't actually address anything i'm saying

Mowfest exhibited substantial representation from all parts of PA (probably the best until Komo's tourney), which made it a good basis for accurately comparing PA players, and, apparently, PA > Velocity.

i think it would (for EXAMPLE) be more significant if I beat mew2king in an out of state tournament than if i beat aloan in an in-state tournament. just food for thought.

As you're not debasing mine.

you must have a strange definition of the word "debase". But i am trying to address your concerns and yet you aren't providing me with concrete opinions up to this point

1- Cactuar
2- Mow
3- Javi
4- Triad
5- Cape
6- Komo / Vagabond
7- Komo / Vagabond
8- Velocity
9- Swiftbass

Pacman was the only person I'm mostly clueless of, so I'd need to consider him more if I were to finalize this and get it to 10, and 7-9 is a little rough, but here's the idea.

what's the idea exactly? basically, what criteria did you use to come up with this (i'm curious; was it your 'friendlies' system?)

A-Laon · Aug 18, 2007

Answering the only question that wasn't already addressed, wasn't fueled by oblivion, or actually meant anything:

pockyD said:
what's the idea exactly?

That list is everything I've gathered from more experienced players than myself regarding the past performances, recent improvement, and current skill levels of the PA players. My ideas of those players are not originally my own, but those of the players who know them better. I simply gave it what I see to be an appropriate arrangement.

It actually is possible to determine skill level without relying entirely on little numbers to the left of everybody's name on the results page.

pockyD · Aug 18, 2007

btw have you actually read the rankings criteria that we're using

what you have here is basically a list, constructed by a group of panelists, on a different set of criteria. Once again, a rankings list incorporating different viewpoints, simply on a different basis. i don't see you can say that is definitively better

and that was a very nice dodge on those questions that you are unable to answer ALT-TAB ALT-TAB

A-Laon · Aug 18, 2007

pockyD said:
what you have here is basically a list, constructed by a group of panelists, on a different set of criteria. Once again, a rankings list incorporating different viewpoints, simply on a different basis. i don't see you can say that is definitively better

Because Velocity isn't 5th, for one.

and that was a very nice dodge on those questions that you are unable to answer ALT-TAB ALT-TAB

Actually, I just didn't feel like wrapping quote tags around all your paragraphs and disecting the argument again when I could just answer the meaningful question and get to the point.

pockyD · Aug 18, 2007

nice dodge again

have you ever even played velocity, by the way? why do you hold such animosity towards him? or are you just latching on to whatever mow says and taking it as gospel? why don't you ask what cactuar thinks of velocity?

all i want is the list of people see on sheik and d20's level. this isn't even an accusation, i could come up with such a list with a few people on it myself, but i'd like to see what your thoughts are

and a separate list of even a few people that "cape beat consistently" over the past year would be cool too since you said there exists a such a group

so i'm going to try my hardest to be done until you provide me with at least one of these lists

A-Laon · Aug 18, 2007

Fine, quote tags it is, though I thought you were bored of this. I know I am.

pockyD said:
have you ever even played velocity, by the way? why do you hold such animosity towards him? or are you just latching on to whatever mow says and taking it as gospel

Personally, I only ever played Velocity when he came to the ccx way back when, though I'm not bothering to consider this as we've both improved substantially since then, I'm sure. I don't have anything against Velocity.

And sorry for not answering your question, but I'm not going to state explicitly which people gave me my idea of Velocity's ability as of now, as they do not deserve to be dragged into this at my voalition.

all i want is the list of people see on sheik and d20's level. this isn't even an accusation, i could come up with such a list with a few people on it myself, but i'd like to see what your thoughts are

As I've said repeatedly, there's no list for this because it's so interchangeable. Regardless, if it will satisfy you -- people unlisted whom I consider equal / comparable / better than xyt / d20 (in no particular order, mind you):
-Taki
-Harm (assuming he even plays anymore)
-TSK
-Naka
-Myself

and a separate list of even a few people that "cape beat consistently" over the past year would be cool too since you said there exists a such a group

I, personally, can only say "everyone" as this is what multiple sources have told me as a generalization. Again, sorry if you want specifics, but I'm not giving you those sources against their compliance.

Unless you have something totally new to bring up, for the sake of keeping people out of this, my argument ends here.

D20 · Aug 18, 2007

A-Laon said:
-Harm (assuming he even plays anymore)

His name is actually Dead Aim now.

On a side note, I <3 everyone.

EDIT: However, I can't wait til PockyD and A-Laon play eachother again.

pockyD · Aug 18, 2007

what's it matter

i don't care whether you are good or bad at the game when i argue with people; i argue with mow just as much as i argue with alan

A-Laon · Aug 18, 2007

Actually, I retract my entire argument to state that D20 should be ranked purely for his consistency of always showing up in the heat of conversation to interject with something radically egotistical, intriguingly intellectual, or just petty and stupid but still way cooler than whatever anybody else was discussing.

<3

takieddine · Aug 18, 2007

oh wow you guys are good at constructing complete sentences...

The Cape · Aug 18, 2007

Taki, MM at Komo's?

takieddine · Aug 18, 2007

The Cape said:
Taki, MM at Komo's?

I'll wait and see. If I make it and have enough $$ for MM.

Nakamaru · Aug 18, 2007

dot_eater said:
Why is everyone so hostile towards velocity? Why is there an entire post in complete disrespect to him and his privacy? I havn't seen him boast about his playing ability without it being in good fun.

Yea, the IM conversation is CLEAR proof of that. :laugh:

Pakman · Aug 18, 2007

Nakamaru said:
Yea, the IM conversation is CLEAR proof of that.

Yeah its a clear disrespect to his privacy.

A-Laon · Aug 18, 2007

Pacman On Crack said:
Yeah its a clear disrespect to his privacy.

Well hell, talk **** out loud or don't talk ****.

CanISmash · Aug 18, 2007

philly smashers.
temple smashers
im me at k1dg0tskillz.
ill be down there forever starting on the 23rd.

pockyD · Aug 18, 2007

yeah well to be fair velocity pasted that conversation around

though i don't know if he intended for it to be posted

Pakman · Aug 18, 2007

pockyD said:
yeah well to be fair velocity pasted that conversation around

though i don't know if he intended for it to be posted

Well in that case, I apologize, Mr. Laon, and Velocity does talk plenty of **** out loud.

xyt · Aug 19, 2007

so... what's the conclusion to all the arguments...? @_@)..

Pakman · Aug 19, 2007

xyt said:
so... what's the conclusion to all the arguments...? @_@)..

The next list will be he result of putting 15 random smashers names into a hat and defecate in it. We shake it around a bit and then defecate some more. We then pick out players randomly and whatever order they come out it we post as the list and our hands smell like **** for the rest of the day.

Nakamaru · Aug 19, 2007

sounds like a good plan to me.

Velocity · Aug 19, 2007

Wtf is everyone talking about and whoevers talking **** oh well get mad idont care what my post look like and you shouldnt either get a life and smash is all in good fun so dont take me so serious i mean pocky is too good at arguing

open your eyes people

Renth · Aug 19, 2007

pockyD said:
lol "major tourney"; shows how unaware you are of all the 30+man tourneys velocity has attended and done well at (just look at smashtality), while mow's fest was even less than 30 people. how are they less significant? what was first prize payout at mowfest again? and that makes it a 'major tournament'?

30+ ..... here in Florida every fest has like 30 people and every tourn has atleast 80 people :dizzy:

edit: i forgot how small PA tourns were

Cactuar · Aug 19, 2007

@Nakamaru: It's one thing to talk **** about someone when referencing their smash skill, but NEVER insult another player personally. That entire post of yours talking about stabbings where he grew up and whatever else went way too far. You don't have the right to insult another person like that. This is one of those moments where an apology would be appropriate, but you are probably too proud to do so. Your post really pissed me off. I usually go out of my way to be nice to everyone and help as many people as I can, but you will not get that equal treatment as you have deemed yourself unworthy until proven otherwise.

takieddine · Aug 19, 2007

Cactuar's such a gentleman. <3

Seriously people you are getting too serious, I remember a time where everyone was cool, and getting competitive only to get better at the game...

A-Laon · Aug 19, 2007

Wtf is going on anymore?

slikvik · Aug 19, 2007

C3 tournament yesterday. around 70+ people

1.M2K
2. Azen
3. Chu
4. KM
5. Cort
5. Doll
7. Husband
7. Velocity
9. Meep
9. InfernoOmni

This is probably one of the most difficult tournies to place high in. I think some of you are trying to unfairly underrate velocity

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