Pivot question

If you're in a neutral frame when you pivot, could you not also jab or ftilt? Any advantages? I'm guessing it'd be better to grab if you could, but for stopping an attack has anyone encountered a time when this would be handy?

you can, but it's insanely hard to pull off

why you see pivot smashes/grabs 99% of the time

if you watch tipman's combo vid, he shows pivots with tilts and thunderpalms

Pivot jabs are relatively easy. Flick and release the control stick in the opposite direction to do the pivot then press A right after since you're just standing still at that point. Tilts are a LOT harder. I do it similarly to the jabs, but do it with a VERY specific timing so that A is pressed a moment sooner on the frame when the control is snapping back to neutral but is still between neutral and the threshold for dashing (if it's still in the latter you won't pivot anyway and will dash).

It may be my controller or just my timing, but I always have a far easier time doing pivoted f-tilts to the left, and get jabs more often to the right but if I try faster to the right I often get smashes. To do d-tilts you can do the same thing for f-tilts except flick the direction and roll it downward extremely quick before releasing. I have an easier time doing those to the right however =P

If you can do them reliably pivoted f-tilts are very useful for their quick speed and substantial range while still having the mobility of a DD. Also keep in mind you don't have to do them on the pull back, but you can get a lot of unexpected range by full dashing/foxtrotting towards then tiny dash away then pivot it back forward again so you basically get a full dash towards and then f-tilt towards right from there to cover a lot of ground at once.

Thanks, both of you.

i wish i could pivot >.< anyone wanna help me learn how to? im trying what you said magus, flicking the control stick but i have only done it like twice.

What's happening when you don't do it? If you turn around and dash attack you didn't release the stick fast enough. If you dash attack in the same direction you hit A a fair amount too soon, and if you pivot an f-smash you hit A like a frame or 2 too soon. It's usually best to begin by just DDing and doing the flick on the control stick to get used to the pivots and releasing it fast enough first. You should instantly stop in place facing the other way out of the DD as long as you release it quick enough.

Pivoting grabs is too error prone to be efficient. It is much easy to just jump cancel a grab on the after the first frame of turning. It'll come out a frame later than the pivoted grab, but it is sure to work, even if you don't time it right.

Pivoting just takes practice, that's all. Jabs and fsmashes are easy, but the ftilt still doesn't happen every time I want it to.

I've been trying it. Pivoting w/ anyone is hella hard.

To add to the way I was suggesting to pivot jabs b4, make sure your analog works with the flick method to pivot in the first place. I realized yesterday that my analog stick got worn or something recently and I guess when I flick it it doesn't always snap back to completely neutral in time. I could only get it to cancel the dash like 1/10 tries while another controller worked 100% basically. I was wondering why it'd been so finicky the last time I tried pivoting jabs/tilts in matches and ended up just not trying after awhile cuz I kept dash attacking. Luckily it was just the grip which I was able to just swap with a good one.

Another way to pivot f-tilts is to move the analog a little slower than usual when you go to turn around and don't go all the way to the side, then press A when it's about 3/4 of the way to the side. You should also be sure to lighten the pressure you put on the stick right around then so it begins to move back right after reaching the 3/4 point. You actually press A right after it starts to move back since the threshold of stand/dash and tilt/smash are at the same spot. Basically you tilt just past the point that causes you to turn around then lay off it slightly to go back into tilt range immediately after which is when you press A.

I also came up with a way to pivot d-tilts very easily that lets me do them pretty consistently. Essentially it's similar to the above f-tilt method of not pressing all the way except right after passing the dash threshold you do a quarter circle downward while staying within tilt range so you get the d-tilt and not d-smash. Not the greatest thing for Ganon, but I gotta try this out with my Marth . I'm still better at doing them to the right tho haha.

All I can say to you Magus, is:

Good $hit.

i can do it consistantly with ganon, but only ganon, but i mean, he's one of the few that make good use of it (marth....maybe others)

but jsut keep doing it, we can't tell you how to do it, it's just timing based on your dash dance

for example, i'm a slow dash dancer, which means i like to make an almost full dash animation before turning around, you might be a fast dash dancer which you just dash dance as fast as you can, now you gotta get your timing based off that

mood4food77 said:

but jsut keep doing it, we can't tell you how to do it, it's just timing based on your dash dance

for example, i'm a slow dash dancer, which means i like to make an almost full dash animation before turning around, you might be a fast dash dancer which you just dash dance as fast as you can, now you gotta get your timing based off that

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I wasn't asking how to do it. I was wondering if anyone else had pivoted non-forward smashes / found any uses for doing them. The post Magus made about certain ways to pivot wasn't by request (although very much appreciated, especially the pivot to d-tilt).

Some uses for pivoting besides f-smashes:

1) Pivot to jab - this is mostly useful for dashing away from an attack and then quickly retaliating with a jab.

2) Pivot to retreating fair - not sure how often it will work, but you can use this similarly to the pivoted jabs.

3) Pivot to bair for approaching - this works well if a normal bair isn't going to hit your opponent. Dash toward the opponent, pivot away, and then attack with the bair.

Ganon can use pivots somewhat, but he's no Marth (Marth is top tier for using pivoting).