Ledgeteching

If anyone could offer me some insight, that'd be awesome.

A few months ago, I started ledgeteching with my characters, namely Marth. I use Motion-Sensor Bombs on training, Final Destination. First, I would roll back into the edge, dthrow the mine and then jump off. I would then hug the wall as close as possible during my Dolphin Slash, then click R and ASDI into the stage with the Control Stick.

This would work for two hits (56%, 28% per hit) and then I would die on the third hit. I found that after the two hits, I could only ledgetech by using Smash DI (more specifically quartercircle DI, going from straight towards the stage downards, so I don't walljump)

This was fine and all and I would survive multiple hits this way, but then recently, I decided to try with Samus. With the same ASDI method, I would survive three hits (84%) through ledgetechs before being blown off the screen. Past that, I had to use SDI again.

So my questions are...

Why does ASDI stop working after a while?

Why are the percentages different for the two characters?

I ran over several possibilities in my head, but none of them made sense. Since the damage is all the same, the hitstun should also be the same, and thus the timing for the tech shouldn't change. Also, since ASDI takes place before the character is sent flying away, it shouldn't matter what percent they're at, as they should move the same way regardless of their damage. It doesn't seem to make sense that ASDI would suddenly and consistently stop working at a certain percentage.

I did note that Samus and Marth threw the mines in different places, but since I was hugging the wall closely, the point of impact should have been the same. Again, as ASDI takes place before the character is sent flying away, it shouldn't matter how heavy/floaty they are, and they should survive to the same percentages.

The only other error that could have occurred is human error, but I tested for about an hour and the results were very consistent. So I'm lost. What's going on?

You are mistaken about ASDI. It occurs on the 1st frame of knockback, and so the movement from ASDI is combined with the movement from the 1st frame of knockback. Basically, when the knockback's movement away from the wall is more than the ASDI's movement towards the wall you won't collide with the wall on the 1st frame of knockback and won't be able to tech.

SDI however occurs before any knockback and will allow you to tech at any damage so long as it is strong enough to knock you down.

Also, not all characters hug the wall as well as others. Ganon & Falcon for example push themselves away from the wall near the end of their up-Bs when they flip and the up-B is not reversed, which makes using ASDI to tech like that much less effective and will more often require SDI to hit the wall.

Oooh, I see. Awesome, thanks, totally didn't know that bit about the ASDI. That explains a lot =)

leave it to Magus

SDI = Smash DI
Excuse my ignorance. But what's ASDI?

smashwiki said:

Automatic Smash DI

Automatic Smash DI functions similarly to Smash DI, but it occurs the frame after the attack's hitlag ends. The character will move, but not as far as in normal Smash DI.

A tactic is double stick DI which involves pointing both the control stick and the C-stick in 2 different directions so the player can alter the trajectory with the control stick and use the C-stick to control the Automatic Smash DI into a different direction from the direction being held on the control stick. This was later found out to be quite useful, especially when used to get the lowest angle of knockback while ASDI-ing straight downward to tech along the ground and survive high damage hits well beyond what is possible by taking the hit into the air.

Click to expand...

Smashwiki holds many answers. It even has a firefox search plugin!

Don't trust smashwiki. This was the shine spike article.

The shine spike is one of Fox's edge-guarding techniques. It consists of using Fox's down B to spike an opponent who is already off of the stage down and away, to prevent their recovery. Note that the term 'spike' is used loosely here, because it is not technically a spike, but what many like to call a 'pseudo-spike'. This is because it doesn't send the opponent straight down, but rather, at an angle to the side. Theoretically, Falco's Down B from Melee could also work. Other infamous pseudo-spikes are Link's Spin Slash and Peach's D-smash. Other lesser known Shine Spikes include Captain Falcon and Ganondorf's Neutral Aerial attacks, and Jigglypuff's Up Aerial. They are most likely lesser known because they do not work as well, (specifically Ganondorfs, as he is heavy and falls faster than many opponents).

Click to expand...

rofl that's funny.

Someone needs to change that. Jigglypuff Uair = shine spike? *shudder*

Jigglypuff Uair = shine spike

ROFL