Sonic The Hedgehog: Community Matchup thread

Rickerdy-doo-da-day · Dec 22, 2008

:/

cat, I think I've got you on my list but I haven't had games with you before

And next up is...PKT...Squirtle...oh jeez >< I hate that stupid turtle

thecatinthehat · Dec 22, 2008

Hmm.. Rick we'll have to fix that.

I can play tomorrow. Willing to join me?

Rickerdy-doo-da-day · Dec 22, 2008

Probably, I'll see what I can do. Warning - there will be lag and probably lots

Back on topic, sorry if I've missed it but can Sonic's Side B jump over Olimar's grabs?

thecatinthehat · Dec 22, 2008

Rickerdy-doo-da-day said:
Back on topic, sorry if I've missed it but can Sonic's Side B jump over Olimar's grabs?

Yes.

Kinzer · Dec 22, 2008

Hrm... Pokeymanz Trainor huh... I wonder how Sonic will do... seems like Squirtle is a tiny target that is slower than Sonic but more mobile. His usual abiltiy to combo some characters doesn't work on Sonic, and he is the 2nd lightest character in the game (G&W is third).

I wonder how easy it ould be to gimp Squirtle... probably not too easy... but hey you know what, Sonic can play really gay here and play an evasive style to make Squirtle go fatigued.

I'll add more stuff when we get the pokeymanz Trainorz over here.

ROOOOY! · Dec 22, 2008

I always saw PT as.

45:55 against Squirtle.

60:40 Ivysaur

55:45 Charizard.

I HATE fighting Squirtles. But I'll wait until the proper discussion starts on the next page to contribute anything.

Jim Morrison · Dec 22, 2008

Number your posts on page now:

12

We shouldn't do all 3 at once, just the Turdle first.

Chis · Dec 22, 2008

What's the percentage for Olimar, so I can update the chart.

13

Browny · Dec 22, 2008

lmao ivysaur gets *****

my brother plays PT and ive actually got a few PT mains on my fc list which is cool. My bro doesnt even bother to use ivy against me and switches instantly, even if it means taking a full charge smash :/

My brother actually pulled out PT against my Sonic at last tournament winners finals and got 2-stocked

(same PT who jv 2 stocked my lucario >_>). I think Sonic is advantaged as a whole. Charizard is an absolute pain to deal with since rocksmash ***** ASC and just about everything else in the game.

imo
Sonic 45:55 Squirtle
Sonic lol:something Ivysaur
Sonic 50:50 Charizard

but then the whole 'play g@y' and abuse fatigue thing comes in to play, which i never do. idk how that changes things

Kinzer · Dec 22, 2008

most people agree like a 55:45 advantage for Olimar.

It's nothing serious.

I'll have PT on the next page, as well as Squirtle, we'll look at the pokeymanz individually.

14.

Don't type anything!

Kinzer · Dec 22, 2008

Okay, I got the page, let's talk pokeymanz now.

Sonic is at a 100:0 advantage on Haunter.

Pokemon Trainer

Introduction:

Behaviour:

Commonly Used Moves:

How to Win:

Recommended Stages:

Matchup Summary:

Squirtle

Introduction:

Behaviour:

Commonly Used Moves:

How to Win:

Recommended Stages:

Matchup Summary:

Ivysaur

Introduction:

Behaviour:

Commonly Used Moves:

How to Win:

Recommended Stages:

Matchup Summary:

Charizard

Introduction:

Behaviour:

Commonly Used Moves:

How to Win:

Recommended Stages:

Matchup Summary:

Sonic's matchups as of December 22, 2008

Chis · Dec 22, 2008

Please add this into your post Kinzer:

Kinzer · Dec 22, 2008

Ah but Chis, but which post, this one for PT?

Chis · Dec 22, 2008

The bottom of the PT image. So everyone can see it.

Browny · Dec 22, 2008

some serious lols right there @ that chart.

Yoshi in the same league as MK, wario. and Olimar same as Ness

:/ meh

Chis · Dec 22, 2008

The list is quite broad. More colours?

RenegadeRaven · Dec 22, 2008

Maybe, since some of the matchups can be misleading.

Kinzer · Dec 22, 2008

Well, the colors are fine to me, grey for 55:45 - 45:55, blue/red for 65:35 - 35:65, and green/black for 70:30 - 30:70 and worse.

Thing is, no character out there beats Sonic out to the black border, and Sonic doesn't have the things to get any character as an advantage for him...

...yeah, I think we need more specific colors, like Grey for dead even, blue/red for slights, and green/black for everything else.

Anybody want to make the export or would it be better I handle it myself since it's three chaarcters in one?

ROOOOY! · Dec 22, 2008

I think we should keep the colors the way they are now.

Chis · Dec 22, 2008

Alright. I'm on it.

ROOOOY! · Dec 22, 2008

Kinzer, whilst your idea is good for us Sonic's specifically, having one color for 60:40/40:60 + is way too broad, and may confuse people who are looking at it from other boards.

Chis, we also need a Sheik/Zelda column at the side.

thecatinthehat · Dec 22, 2008

IMO, we should just print the numbers directly onto the chart.

In other news. I got a warning for a one liner. I'm not mad. At least he's doing his job.

Kinzer · Dec 22, 2008

Roy, with that same idea, we shuold also have a colum for PT as a whole, as in to know how much Sonic loses/wins with all the Pokeymanz combined.

The other three individual are okay as they are.

I'll go make the export, better to get them in here now and help us with the matchup for Squirtle.

Browny · Dec 22, 2008

i played a PT a while back, he knocked me away with squirtle and then once he saw me charging a spindash in mid-air he quickyl switched pokemon, since im not going to be able to attack him out of the vulnerability frames with a spindash. but i actually did an ASC-shield cancel, landed right in front of him and got a full charge fsmash off. hes like WTF how did you cancel the spin

omnomnom

Zephramrill · Dec 22, 2008

wow what a ****** PT just switching like that XD.

I don't know the sonic matchup well enough but from what I do know I think Sonic vs Squirtle will be really even maybe slight advantage for Sonic.

Edit: Ill add more **** here later, also someone WFC me tonight in 3 hours?

thecatinthehat · Dec 22, 2008

Zephramrill said:
wow what a ****** PT just switching like that XD.

I don't know the sonic matchup well enough but from what I do know I think Sonic vs Squirtle will be really even maybe slight advantage for Sonic.

Edit: Ill add more **** here later, also someone WFC me tonight in 3 hours?

I play you sometime later tonight.

I need some PT experience.

Kinzer · Dec 22, 2008

3 Hours... that's about 7 o' clock my time (PST).

Uhm, yeah sure why not, if you either make a post here or contact me on AIM, I should be available.

I'm kind of thinking it would be even, as Squirtle is one hard mofo to hit, thanks to his small size, decent speed, and subpar mobility, add that with Sonic's "ability to K.O." and you got a problem. Sonic can, however, escape most Combos Squirtle usually doom other characters, is not exactly easy to kill himself, Speed (duh), and overall it's just who can get more attacks in faster.

Steeler · Dec 22, 2008

Well, from my experiences with Umby, he once mentioned that Squirtle may have a slight advantage due to the fact that Sonic struggles with characters that do well in the air. idk, something i recall from a while ago. Squirtle's "combos" work on almost anyone, by the way. utilt to uair stuff will still do upwards of 40% at a minimum when done correctly. This stuff works on MK, so it can work on anyone not named Jigglypuff.

Kinzer · Dec 22, 2008

We have the Spring, it's like our escape button.

ROOOOY! · Dec 22, 2008

With invincibility frames.

Til about full hop height.

Kinzer · Dec 22, 2008

Squirtle with his Utilt will either cancel the Spring projectile or take the 4% damage.

Spring is too good, but is there anything else to add?

ROOOOY! · Dec 22, 2008

Only that I've had the Spindash hop jump over a crouching Squirtle without hitting him =_=.

Use Spincharge instead. Either that, or play on stages with odd slanted edges (like Yoshi's Island (Brawl)), in that if you do Spindash at an edge then you don't actually get the hop, it basically works as a Spincharge. I don't know if it still retains it's invincibility from the hop though.

Jim Morrison · Dec 22, 2008

Actually, there's no Yoshi's Island in Melee levels. It's called Yoshi's Story. But yea, you get invincible frames for the roll. A normal person with a mind jumps though, or shields.

But I don't like fighting Squirtle, it's like fighting an Olimar. He's just so tiny and odd... Like fighting oneself. You have no real tactics/strategies to use, no good approach. Just run into him. Dash Attack is my option. Also, note: Squirtle has 1 frame jab.

Chis · Dec 22, 2008

The spring is over rated. It vastly limits your options once you use it.

Jim Morrison · Dec 22, 2008

Chis said:
The spring is over rated. It vastly limits your options once you use it.

I'd rather spring out of an attack barrage and see what happens then to just let him continue. Be quick and autocancel D-air, or be totally evil and D-air on the Spring, THEN D-air again and again and again, and then auto-cancel

Chis · Dec 22, 2008

When I spring, usually I get punished worse than if I hadn't used the spring at all. (From good players). They will most likely pridect the Dair. The spring is used to break out of combo's (you're not grounded) alot. So landing on the spring is not an option.

Jim Morrison · Dec 22, 2008

Don't D-air, just land if they predict it. Just switch up what you do after a Spring, they shouldn't be able to predict.

Chis · Dec 22, 2008

DI? It's so slow that they can just follow you and shield any attacks.

Fearmy · Dec 22, 2008

dair cuts through specials... but hell i bet sonic players have better comboes then just Down and Side B.

But i for some reason, i think this is neutral.... Squirtle is so darn small, and almost impossible to hit, and sonic isn't really known for OMG I HIT EVERYWHERE moves. i dunno if water gun will stop sonic's moves... but hey it's worth a shot. Sonic can go all over squirtle if he gets one hit.

oh well jsust my two cents

Chis · Dec 22, 2008

I'll be using this to redo the chart.

Edit: BTW, is it big disadvantage or soft counter? I can still change it.

Sonic The Hedgehog: Community Matchup thread

What is Sonic's worst match up?

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