Sheik Matchup

gallax · Jun 7, 2009

Sheik

General Discussion

Soon to Come

Pika's Advantages

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Pika's Disadvantages

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Strategy for Winning

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Helpful Video's

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Overall Matchup

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AranOcean · Jun 14, 2009

Sheik is heavy enough to get CG'd. However, watch out for her massive camp skills (needles <.<).

Overall, Pika still has the advantage.

KayLo! · Jun 14, 2009

UltraNOVA said:
Sheik is heavy enough to get CG'd.

Sheik isn't heavy; she just falls fast enough for her to be CG'd easily.

AranOcean · Jun 14, 2009

That's what I meant... fast falling... <.<

Pika_Cam · Jun 15, 2009

She can beat pika's FF fair > grab combo by jabbing after the FF fair, so watch out.

King~ · Jun 15, 2009

looking past the CG its a very interesting/fun MU

sheik is fast enough to punish pikas mistakes first off, so dont go all wild tryin crap.

shes also fast enough o get away and space moves better imo.

upsmash kills early if sweetspotted, it canbe comboed into. L2DIFtilt

sheiks aerials are weird to me because they have lingering hitboxs. but most of them can be shield grabbed or punished with an OOS option.

i tried ducking under needles but no luck=/ but that jus means approching on the ground can be punished in a minor to medium way?????? and we have tjolt approaches which i think needles still go through

sheik isnt good at killing unless you mess up, now i know pika isnt either but hes better than shiek.

60-40 pika

KayLo! · Jun 15, 2009

King Yoshi said:
and we have tjolt approaches which i think needles still go through

Yeah, needles & tjolt go right through one another.

Fuujin · Jan 26, 2010

Lol Looking past the CG???
That's like playing Fox vs Sheik and Saying "Looking past the tilt lock".

Pikachu beat's Sheik pretty bad.
He's just as fast, stronger attacks, better recovery and not to mention the chaingrab that goes to past 50% I'm pretty sure.

Just hop on the edge as soon as she's knocked off and if she chain's too late shes dead and if she notices you on the edge before she chain's she'll be forced to vanish on stage and she can be punished..

Pikachu can camp her with Thunder Jolt, she can attempt needles but they aren't likely to hit if Pikachu is jumping while using Thunder Jolt.

The mest sheik has is punishing a missed D smash or Side smash with her speed.

This is one of her worse MU's imo.
35-65 Pikachu.

Pika_Cam · Jan 27, 2010

Ok, Fuujin, how do you plan to get the initial grab? I think a lot of what we ignore in these matchups is mindset. A normal character without a cg may be able to easily land a grab on a Shiek player because Sheik isn't watching out for it nearly as much. But with Pikachu, a Sheik player will just be incredibly careful and defensive the whole time forcing Pikachu to approach if he wants the grab, and this could definitely lead to the Pika player being overaggressive and getting punished badly for it.

I guess my point is, if you're only focused on getting the cg, then the Sheik player shouldn't have a very difficult time avoiding the predictable grabs and kicking the Pika player's @$$

-Mars- · Jan 27, 2010

King Yoshi said:
sheik isnt good at killing unless you mess up, now i know pika isnt either but hes better than shiek.
60-40 pika

Sheik has GR>DACUS on Pika......so yea you don't really have the advantage in the KO department in this matchup.

I agree with the ratio though.

Fuujin said:
Lol Looking past the CG???
That's like playing Fox vs Sheik and Saying "Looking past the tilt lock".

Pikachu beat's Sheik pretty bad.
He's just as fast, stronger attacks, better recovery and not to mention the chaingrab that goes to past 50% I'm pretty sure.

Just hop on the edge as soon as she's knocked off and if she chain's too late shes dead and if she notices you on the edge before she chain's she'll be forced to vanish on stage and she can be punished..

Pikachu can camp her with Thunder Jolt, she can attempt needles but they aren't likely to hit if Pikachu is jumping while using Thunder Jolt.

The mest sheik has is punishing a missed D smash or Side smash with her speed.

This is one of her worse MU's imo.
35-65 Pikachu.

This post kinda made me chuckle a bit.

Avoiding a grab is not that hard if you're really attempting to avoid it. Pika doesn't really have amazing grab range either so yea.

We can even just pull out the chain and let you hit us with tjolts until we are around 50% if we really feel like it. From my experiences though it isn't terribly hard to avoid the grab as long as I have some platforms to work with.

We're not going to shoot needle storms when your in the air......needles are used to cover landings......so if you jump while shooting a tjolt just be aware that you have to come down and get the landing frames.

Sheik has to avoid a grab at low percentages and you have to avoid a grab at high percentages.

Sheik has a lot more range than Pikachu(I realize this is probably the case in most of his matchups).

Bair is safe on block.

Sheiks recovery is mediocre so take advantage of that.

Pikachu ftilts really well. whoever said something earlier about DI'ing ftilt.....i'm assuming you mean DI'ing correctly towards Sheik....and I can still just turn around and continue ftilting....it's a true lock after 30%. One missed grab could equal 40-50% for you so be cautious and only attempt grabs to punish mistakes.

60-40 Pikachu imo.

KayLo! · Jan 27, 2010

Again, this thread is ridiculously outdated, soooo.... :dizzy:

But uh. Thanks for the updated tips and stuff.

-Mars- · Jan 27, 2010

oh whoops didn't check all that lol your guys' matchup discussions suck i figured it was new or something lol.

Scissors Sir · Jan 29, 2010

-Mars- said:
Avoiding a grab is not that hard if you're really attempting to avoid it. Pika doesn't really have amazing grab range either so yea.

We can even just pull out the chain and let you hit us with tjolts until we are around 50% if we really feel like it. From my experiences though it isn't terribly hard to avoid the grab as long as I have some platforms to work with.

We're not going to shoot needle storms when your in the air......needles are used to cover landings......so if you jump while shooting a tjolt just be aware that you have to come down and get the landing frames.

Sheik has to avoid a grab at low percentages and you have to avoid a grab at high percentages.

I agree avoiding grabs isn't hard. But anyone can get at least one off in a match. Even the most inexperienced player fighting a very knowledgeable person can get at least one grab in.

And the using needles on our landing won't always work on the first jolt. By this I mean it becomes a mix up game. pika can do an early fh jolt and double jump at a height that would keep him out of harm from the needles. This second jump can be used to throw another jolt or to qa towards you while the jolt goes toward you as well. The mix up comes into play when you

1) try to throw it on the first jolt jump or
2) throw the needles on the second

Keep in mind a qa can be done after the first or the second jump jolts. Needles are very good for the purpose you stated though. Just wanted to clear up that it's not a freebie on pika's fh jolt. I hardly ever do the regular fh jolts anymore.

I probably should've posted this when I wasn't tired as hell.

I'm sure it looks like a big pile of poop

Fuujin · Feb 9, 2010

Scissors Sir said:
I agree avoiding grabs isn't hard. But anyone can get at least one off in a match. Even the most inexperienced player fighting a very knowledgeable person can get at least one grab in.

And the using needles on our landing won't always work on the first jolt. By this I mean it becomes a mix up game. pika can do an early fh jolt and double jump at a height that would keep him out of harm from the needles. This second jump can be used to throw another jolt or to qa towards you while the jolt goes toward you as well. The mix up comes into play when you

1) try to throw it on the first jolt jump or
2) throw the needles on the second

Keep in mind a qa can be done after the first or the second jump jolts. Needles are very good for the purpose you stated though. Just wanted to clear up that it's not a freebie on pika's fh jolt. I hardly ever do the regular fh jolts anymore.

I probably should've posted this when I wasn't tired as hell.

I'm sure it looks like a big pile of poop

As he said if the Pikachu is good enough he/she is going to get at least one grab in.
This is the same mentality people have against the IC's, it's almost impossible to avoid getting grabbed during the match even if he has poor grab range.
When Sheik needs to kill shell be using Vanish or Dacus, maybe side smash.
Unless you get faked out by Vanish just interrupt Dacus with Thunder Jolt or block and theres your free grab.

Pika_Cam · Feb 10, 2010

I guess my point is that it's not that easy to land a grab when they are expecting it. Pika's grab range is not very good. I can't tell you how many Pikas I've seen face a good Sheik and get killed because they are focusing so much on grabbing.

-Mars- · Feb 10, 2010

Fuujin said:
As he said if the Pikachu is good enough he/she is going to get at least one grab in.
This is the same mentality people have against the IC's, it's almost impossible to avoid getting grabbed during the match even if he has poor grab range.
When Sheik needs to kill shell be using Vanish or Dacus, maybe side smash.
Unless you get faked out by Vanish just interrupt Dacus with Thunder Jolt or block and theres your free grab.

Uh no.

I never use side smash unless on accident lol.

If Sheik can't kill pika before 150% with GR>DACUS then she will most likely use the strong hits of bair or nair to kill. Dsmash can kill as well at really high percents.

And there is no reason for me to randomly DACUS when I know you're looking for a grab so yea.

Sheik Matchup

gallax

Smash Hero

AranOcean

Smash Ace

KayLo!

Smarter than your average wabbit.

AranOcean

Smash Ace

Pika_Cam

Smash Ace

King~

Smash Champion

KayLo!

Smarter than your average wabbit.

Fuujin

Smash Champion

Pika_Cam

Smash Ace

-Mars-

Smash Hero

KayLo!

Smarter than your average wabbit.

-Mars-

Smash Hero

Scissors Sir

Smash Ace

Fuujin

Smash Champion

Pika_Cam

Smash Ace

-Mars-

Smash Hero

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