lol at religous people, I mean really.

Man of Popsicle · Aug 14, 2009

Link to original post: [drupal=2173]lol at religous people, I mean really.[/drupal]

To start off I would like to pose a question:
Why do atheists care in the first place what Christians believe? I see threads all of the time (somewhat on this forum but mostly on others) started by atheists about "How the Bible is wrong", or "God can't exist because..." If we all go to the same place, why preach atheism? It's almost as if you try to destroy others faith for no seeming reason. It makes me wonder... why?

This is one of the things that irks me the most about the internet. All these people spewing this "be tollerant" crap and then totally hating on christianity. I'm really digging myself in a hole here, and I probably lost at least 100 respect points, but it's something I had to get off of my chest.
This blog is bad and I should feel bad.

Teran · Aug 14, 2009

I have a very close eye on this.
Any flaming/trolling and it's an immediate lock.

Omnicron's Baklava Enterprises · Aug 14, 2009

I agree with you.

This blog is not bad, I would not see why you would lose 'respect points' for this.
I am Agnostic, personally I enjoy reading up on different Religions, where they originated, what they view as good and bad, and what one must do in order to properly abide by the rules of said Religion.
There are many haters of many different Religions on the Internet, why? On the Internet, one can express their opinion and not be punished for it.

One may say that he/she hates homosexuals, hates Christianity, hates Islam, hates African Americans or hates Asians, and yet they cannot be harmed. Although the ones that cannot accept other human beings are ignorant and close-minded, you cannot change them, sadly.
It is irritating, I know, to see so much hate vented on the Internet, yet they only do it because they cannot in real life.

People mainly hate Christianity because they are the ones that seem to express their thoughts on how evolution is nothing, and that God created us, which they may take over the top at times.

I hate, absolutely hate, admitting this, but trying to change someone's opinion on a certain subject while on the Internet or in real life is impossible.
There are hypocrites everywhere, and yes, I to an extent am a hypocrite as well.

AlexoftheAura · Aug 14, 2009

I don't think this blog is bad.

First off, I am an atheist but I do not understand why people are preaching atheism since it doesn't really have anything to offer while religions have things such as heaven, 72 virgins, etc. to their devout followers.

Omnicron you said just about everything I was going to say, so thank you for saving me some time.

Barge · Aug 14, 2009

I didn't even know athiesm was a religion.
I thought it didn't even have a label.

The internet is full of ******* and idiots. And there are those who vent/flame for their own entertainment 0:

Omnicron's Baklava Enterprises · Aug 14, 2009

Barge said:
And there are those who vent/flame for their own entertainment 0:

Also known as: Trolls.

Those people have literally come onto the Internet to anger others for their own enjoyment. I can see why, angering people at the right time can have hilarious results.
Although it is not right or good to completely vent against a Religion when:
1. You hardly know what it is about.
2. You have never actually met a person from that Religion.
3. Throw out comments when you do not know what you are talking about.

Xivii · Aug 14, 2009

Most of the people who ~vent~ fit all three of those reqruirments. I think people feel they need to strongly oppose the religion is because many followers of the religion are very forceful and single minded in their beliefs. It's taught that if you don't believe 'this' then you go to hell. Of course people are going to be upset about that.

person701 · Aug 14, 2009

Some people are to thick headed to relize other people thing different ways. I myself am athiest and I can tolerate perfectly fine learning (not practicing) another religion or having someone talk about their religion. Basically, like I said before, other people are different and more than 3/4 (is this too little?) of the web are arrogant towards others beliefes. It hard to find an open minded person on the internet. I consider myself one of the few there are. =\ This is in no way a bad blog, though bringing up religion in a community this large could spark stuff.

TP · Aug 14, 2009

Man of Popsicle said:
If we all go to the same place, why preach atheism? It's almost as if you try to destroy others faith for no seeming reason. It makes me wonder... why?

Because it's the truth.

I can't think of any other way to word it. If someone is teaching a bunch of kids that the R in America is a capital letter or that 2+2=5, you would correct them, because the kids deserve correct information. I see atheism as correct as confidently as I see 2+2=4 as correct, so of course I am going to tell people.

Either you can accept that answer or you can't.

Falconv1.0 · Aug 14, 2009

Omnicron said:
Also known as: Trolls.

Those people have literally come onto the Internet to anger others for their own enjoyment. I can see why, angering people at the right time can have hilarious results.

God ****it we've been found.

I have to ask why is this called 'lol at religion' when it looks like it's about how atheists/non religious people lol at the bible and whatnot.

@TP-Treading thin ice bro, preaching that the bible and stuff, that is the truth, preaching there is 100% no God or afterlife for sure, that's a belief.

Kofu · Aug 14, 2009

Twilight Prince said:
Because it's the truth.

I can't think of any other way to word it. If someone is teaching a bunch of kids that the R in America is a capital letter or that 2+2=5, you would correct them, because the kids deserve correct information. I see atheism as correct as confidently as I see 2+2=4 as correct, so of course I am going to tell people.

Either you can accept that answer or you can't.

And yet people are free to choose what they want when they're older, so it doesn't make a whole lot of difference, does it?

And last I checked, religious people typically don't pose any real problems for atheists/agnostics (conversion argument aside, but that can be ignored), so it doesn't matter much if they agree with you or not.

SuSa · Aug 14, 2009

Having a fundie live upstairs, I had a lot more issues then just the conversion.

I was not allowed to play my guitar in front of his kids, lest I play "Stairway to Heaven" because that is "Teh Devilz Moosic".

To walk outside of my own house, I'd have to take off my Slipknot sweatshirt for whatever reason. I think the masks scared his kids.

Why did I follow this? Because if I didn't, I got a 15-20 minute religious rant from him. If I just walked off or ignored him, he'd ***** at my Dad about how I'm not respecting him or his family or his religion.

I'm so glad I got the ******* to move.....

tl;dr
What Twilight Prince said.

Jam Stunna · Aug 14, 2009

There's no room for compromise when it comes to religion. There are only two groups: those that say, "How can you believe that?" and those who say, "How can you not believe that?". We're constantly at each others throats because the side opposite to our own is totally incomprehensible to us.

SuSa · Aug 14, 2009

Jam Stunna said:
There's no room for compromise when it comes to religion. There are only two groups: those that say, "How can you believe that?" and those who say, "How can you not believe that?". We're constantly at each others throats because the side opposite to our own is totally incomprehensible to us.

You forgot about Agnostics.

Jam Stunna · Aug 14, 2009

SuSa said:
You forgot about Agnostics.

Agnostic means that you believe you can't prove your opinion about God, not that you don't have an opinion. Here's something interesting I found on the subject:

http://www.nyphilosopher.com/2008/12/parallel-structures-agnosticism.html

El Nino · Aug 14, 2009

A lot of atheists tend to be reactionary. That is, a lot of them seem to have developed their atheism in response to their own religious upbringing. So, when they argue with someone over religion, it's really more of a self-affirmation. It's like they still need to defeat the demon that once oppressed them because religious indoctrination is like any other indoctrination. It's mindcontrol. I think a lot of atheists argue with religious people for their own sake, to keep themselves from falling back into their old thought-behavior patterns.

On one hand, I understand. A lot of religious doctrine falls into dogma, and a lot of it can be oppressive (multiply that by a really high number if you're talking religious-political institutions). On the other hand, some people need religion. They don't all need the same religion, of course, but I wouldn't want to get in the way of that either.

cookieM0Nster · Aug 14, 2009

Man of Popsicle said:
Link to original post: [drupal=2173]lol at religous people, I mean really.[/drupal]

To start off I would like to pose a question:
Why do atheists care in the first place what Christians believe? I see threads all of the time (somewhat on this forum but mostly on others) started by atheists about "How the Bible is wrong", or "God can't exist because..." If we all go to the same place, why preach atheism? It's almost as if you try to destroy others faith for no seeming reason. It makes me wonder... why?

This is one of the things that irks me the most about the internet. All these people spewing this "be tollerant" crap and then totally hating on christianity. I'm really digging myself in a hole here, and I probably lost at least 100 respect points, but it's something I had to get off of my chest.
This blog is bad and I should feel bad.

Sir, you earned so much respect from me. I have been saying the very same thing for ages. Please accept my friend request, you seem like a really cool guy.

Related, why is this blog called "lol at religious people, I mean really."? It sounds like you are bashing on religion. Which you are totally not doing, lol.

Man of Popsicle · Aug 14, 2009

SuSa said:
I was not allowed to play my guitar in front of his kids, lest I play "Stairway to Heaven" because that is "Teh Devilz Moosic".

To walk outside of my own house, I'd have to take off my Slipknot sweatshirt for whatever reason. I think the masks scared his kids.

See 'extremist'. Most religous people aren't that weird about secular music.
And that's not a reason to think the religion is stupid.
"I met an atheist and he thought a moose was a kind of fish so all atheists must be stupid and are super wrong."

cookieM0Nster · Aug 14, 2009

Man of Popsicle said:
See 'extremist'. Most religous people aren't that weird about secular music.
And that's not a reason to think the religion is stupid.
"I met an atheist and he thought a moose was a kind of fish so all atheists must be stupid and are super wrong."

Yeah, that's unfair bias.

Fatmanonice · Aug 14, 2009

Man of Popsicle said:
Link to original post: [drupal=2173]lol at religous people, I mean really.[/drupal]

To start off I would like to pose a question:
Why do atheists care in the first place what Christians believe? I see threads all of the time (somewhat on this forum but mostly on others) started by atheists about "How the Bible is wrong", or "God can't exist because..." If we all go to the same place, why preach atheism? It's almost as if you try to destroy others faith for no seeming reason. It makes me wonder... why?

This is one of the things that irks me the most about the internet. All these people spewing this "be tollerant" crap and then totally hating on christianity. I'm really digging myself in a hole here, and I probably lost at least 100 respect points, but it's something I had to get off of my chest.
This blog is bad and I should feel bad.

Agreed. I'm agnostic-theist but it really is garbage that people preach about tolerance and yet Christianity gets lambasted in pretty much every form of entertainment in the States. (I don't know about Canada and from what I noticed while I was in Europe, they really don't care.) I left Christianity for my own reasons but I have met some of the most genuine, wise, and insightful people I will ever meet through it and, for that reason along, I will never be able to bash it. Criticize some of the logical fallacies it has but never antagonize it.

@ Barge: Oddly enough, yes, atheism is a religion because it pertains to spirituality. As my Mother says, whether or not you believe in a god, the beliefs you hold regarding it still form a part of your spirtual self. In other words, everyone is a spirtual being regardless of the beliefs you hold.

@ El Nino: I agree with this too. Some of the most bitter atheists I have ever met were usually raised Catholic or Baptist (which given some of the parents I've met in both religions, I can kind of understand :psycho:

).

highfive · Aug 14, 2009

I believe that when two powers(in this case a "higher" power and doubt) come in to contact the world splits itself in to two. Many believe that one must be completely right and the other wrong. The problem is that both parties believe they are correct. Therefore both parties will try to exterminate the other with reasoning.

Just a quick question:

Who invented animals?

:mad: · Aug 14, 2009

highfive said:
Just a quick question:

Who invented animals?

An animal. Some people like to call him "God". He's exactly like us, only a "super-animal". He lives in clouds, I've heard.

It's just a rumor, though.

Fatmanonice · Aug 14, 2009

highfive said:
I believe that when two powers(in this case a "higher" power and doubt) come in to contact the world splits itself in to two. Many believe that one must be completely right and the other wrong. The problem is that both parties believe they are correct. Therefore both parties will try to exterminate the other with reasoning.

Just a quick question:

Who invented animals?

I'm sorry but as a studying zoologist, this line made me laugh out loud. :laugh:

El Nino · Aug 14, 2009

Fatmanonice said:
I'm sorry but as a studying zoologist, this line made me laugh out loud.

And, as a zoologist, you are expected to have the answer. Who invented animals?

Fatmanonice · Aug 14, 2009

El Nino said:
And, as a zoologist, you are expected to have the answer. Who invented animals?

I laughed because he used the word invented, not because I think I completely know the answer. To me, invented would be a word that you're use for machinery or other man made objects, not living things.

:mad: · Aug 14, 2009

Fatmanonice said:
I laughed because he used the word invented, not because I think I completely know the answer. To me, invented would be a word that you're use for machinery or other man made objects, not living things.

Exactly why I didn't give a serious answer.

But the question still stands. Who invented animals?

highfive · Aug 14, 2009

Fatmanonice said:
I laughed because he used the word invented, not because I think I completely know the answer. To me, invented would be a word that you're use for machinery or other man made objects, not living things.

If you use "who invented animals?" on someone you don't know very well or a passing stranger then they'll most likely reply "no one."
Many atheists use this question to fool others since of course "invented" is often tied to creation of a machine. Then they say something like "haha! there you have it! No one invented animals; therefore God does not exist! you even said it yourself!"

Red Arremer · Aug 14, 2009

Mother Nature.

TP · Aug 14, 2009

highfive said:
Many atheists use this question to fool others since of course "invented" is often tied to creation of a machine. Then they say something like "haha! there you have it! No one invented animals; therefore God does not exist! you even said it yourself!"

Wow, those atheists are stupid *******s, then, but I've never actually seen an atheist try something that stupid.

BTW, you know how Intelligent Design is being taught in public schools in some states? You know, schools using taxpayer money? You think I wouldn't be upset by that?

highfive · Aug 14, 2009

Twilight Prince said:
Wow, those atheists are stupid *******s, then, but I've never actually seen an atheist try something that stupid.

BTW, you know how Intelligent Design is being taught in public schools in some states? You know, schools using taxpayer money? You think I wouldn't be upset by that?

You obviously have never been to Idaho.

Your second question: I'm sorry if the gov't. offends you but that's how they roll. It really depends on the person if they believe what they are taught.

Fatmanonice · Aug 14, 2009

Twilight Prince said:
Wow, those atheists are stupid *******s, then, but I've never actually seen an atheist try something that stupid.

BTW, you know how Intelligent Design is being taught in public schools in some states? You know, schools using taxpayer money? You think I wouldn't be upset by that?

Intelligent design is religion trying to bend to scientific standards which is one of the reasons why they often get their foot caught in their mouth on the matter. It's a pseudo-science that does so much more to discredit religion than give it support. In all honesty, I don't think either community should really care about the other but the two are constantly butting heads in the States. It's odd because, in all the other places I've been in the world, it was pretty much a non-issue.

TP · Aug 14, 2009

Fatmanonice said:
Intelligent design is religion trying to bend to scientific standards which is one of the reasons why they often get their foot caught in their mouth on the matter. It's a pseudo-science that does so much more to discredit religion than give it support. In all honesty, I don't think either community should really care about the other but the two are constantly butting heads in the States. It's odd because, in all the other places I've been in the world, it was pretty much a non-issue.

Only 4% of the USA is atheist. A study showed that in the USA, atheists are the least trusted minority. Even homosexuals and Muslims are trusted more than atheists here, which is surprising based on all the hatred I have seen for those groups. This country sucks.

Amazing Ampharos · Aug 14, 2009

You have to understand that many atheists feel very strongly about matters of religion. It's socially very unacceptable to be an atheist (most distrusted minority in America, excluding such a consideration of minorities as "criminals" or "terrorists" or something) so if you're going to be that instead of the "don't care" option which is non-practicing non-denominational Christian, you probably have a specific reason for taking a stand.

Do not take this as a personal attack please, but I'm going to explain exactly how I see religion. I see it as a very bad thing as it teaches people to make decisions on the basis of things other than evidence, and I see its survival to this date as explained by some honestly dirty tactics (warfare of conversion, building membership by indoctrinating children while simultaneously spurring members to reproduce a lot, encouraging people to get offended when religion is challenged, etc.). I don't hate people who are religious; I know plenty of religious people I like. Obviously I'm not going to be able to go out and win "converts" very easily, and I really have no interest in making that my life mission. Instead, I just do my best to encourage people to think about everything critically and otherwise ride the slow but sure demographic shift toward a less religious society. I only try to win a "convert" if I run into someone particularly apathetic about religion, usually with the argument "the fact that you don't care means you already don't believe; why don't you just call yourself an atheist?".

I'm sure someone was offended by that anyway. That is one point I do love to challenge. Why do people get upset when you challenge their ideas? Religion is ultimately an idea after all. As a scientist, I don't get upset when religious people tell me evolution isn't real or that the Earth is 6000 years old or something like that. I also don't get offended by the way my mother refuses to believe the genetic evidence that balding is a sex linked trait so males that are going to bald probably inherit that gene from their mothers so I'm probably not going to bald since that side of the family has a full head of hair for the most part. I simply present the evidence as I understand it and am content with that. It's not important to me to force other people to interpret the evidence as I do or to accept my interpretation as valid; I can be satisfied with my own analysis on my own, and thus from my end virtually all my disagreements are civil disagreements... as should really be expected in a civilized society. I mean, if a religious person runs into an atheist who harasses them, sure, they have a good basis to get upset (in my experience, this is quite rare, though it does happen), but if the atheist just tells them that they strongly disagree with their religion, no matter how vehemently the atheist expresses his disagreement, I don't see why they should get offended.

Arbutus · Aug 14, 2009

highfive said:
You obviously have never been to Idaho.

Your second question: I'm sorry if the gov't. offends you but that's how they roll. It really depends on the person if they believe what they are taught.

I know we like to teach people to question a lot, but the things they teach you in school you generally take to believe.

After all, school taught me that 'ph' is an 'f' sound even though it should be some awkward string of letters that should never appear in words. School also told me that I should disregard the 'k' in knife and that I should totally ignore the way colonel is spelled and say it like 'kernal'.

Oh well. The teacher said it. Must be right.

Wouldn't you just hate me if I was being serious?

Fatmanonice · Aug 14, 2009

Amazing Ampharos said:
You have to understand that many atheists feel very strongly about matters of religion. It's socially very unacceptable to be an atheist (most distrusted minority in America, excluding such a consideration of minorities as "criminals" or "terrorists" or something) so if you're going to be that instead of the "don't care" option which is non-practicing non-denominational Christian, you probably have a specific reason for taking a stand.

Do not take this as a personal attack please, but I'm going to explain exactly how I see religion. I see it as a very bad thing as it teaches people to make decisions on the basis of things other than evidence, and I see its survival to this date as explained by some honestly dirty tactics (warfare of conversion, building membership by indoctrinating children while simultaneously spurring members to reproduce a lot, encouraging people to get offended when religion is challenged, etc.). I don't hate people who are religious; I know plenty of religious people I like. Obviously I'm not going to be able to go out and win "converts" very easily, and I really have no interest in making that my life mission. Instead, I just do my best to encourage people to think about everything critically and otherwise ride the slow but sure demographic shift toward a less religious society. I only try to win a "convert" if I run into someone particularly apathetic about religion, usually with the argument "the fact that you don't care means you already don't believe; why don't you just call yourself an atheist?".

I'm sure someone was offended by that anyway. That is one point I do love to challenge. Why do people get upset when you challenge their ideas? Religion is ultimately an idea after all. As a scientist, I don't get upset when religious people tell me evolution isn't real or that the Earth is 6000 years old or something like that. I also don't get offended by the way my mother refuses to believe the genetic evidence that balding is a sex linked trait so males that are going to bald probably inherit that gene from their mothers so I'm probably not going to bald since that side of the family has a full head of hair for the most part. I simply present the evidence as I understand it and am content with that. It's not important to me to force other people to interpret the evidence as I do or to accept my interpretation as valid; I can be satisfied with my own analysis on my own, and thus from my end virtually all my disagreements are civil disagreements... as should really be expected in a civilized society. I mean, if a religious person runs into an atheist who harasses them, sure, they have a good basis to get upset (in my experience, this is quite rare, though it does happen), but if the atheist just tells them that they strongly disagree with their religion, no matter how vehemently the atheist expresses his disagreement, I don't see why they should get offended.

Mainly because, you can't really build your life around science but you can do that with religion. With many people, if you challenge religion, you challenge their core beliefs and their very way of life. Religion encompasses a lot of things on a much deeper level than science does. I can't walk away from a conversation and feeling like "my life is a lie" if you try to convince me that evolution isn't real. I can't feel like my sense of morality is mis-guided if I'm told that the Big Bang is a load of crap. Religion goes off of faith. Science goes off of evidence. With science, you reasonably argue the existence of God by going off the scientific standard but with religion, you are usually only able to come to some conclusions based solely on faith. (ex; God is real because the Bible is true.) In scientific terms, religion often gets stuck in circular logic like this but I really haven't seen things in science that do the same simply because of the fact that you can test them.

highfive · Aug 14, 2009

Arbutus said:
I know we like to teach people to question a lot, but the things they teach you in school you generally take to believe.

After all, school taught me that 'ph' is an 'f' sound even though it should be some awkward string of letters that should never appear in words. School also told me that I should disregard the 'k' in knife and that I should totally ignore the way colonel is spelled and say it like 'kernal'.

Oh well. The teacher said it. Must be right.

Wouldn't you just hate me if I was being serious?

I before E except after C right? yes it's true that you tend to believe school learning but sometimes you find kinks like a teacher forgets a decimal and changes the answer completely. Then the whole class learns it that way.

I can't hate you. I don't even know you!

Firus · Aug 14, 2009

highfive said:
I before E except after C right? yes it's true that you tend to believe school learning but sometimes you find kinks like a teacher forgets a decimal and changes the answer completely. Then the whole class learns it that way.

There's a difference between calculating something and teaching something. If a teacher tells a five-year-old that a drop of beer will kill you, they're going to believe it.

Which is what happened to my sister before my parents pulled her out of private school specifically for things like that.

On-topic...

Atheists do that because every other religion ever does it too. I'm not personally attacking any religion, and I'm not attacking religion at all; I don't think less of a religious person, though I dislike religion itself. Which is why I'm agnostic. People are way too loldrama about religion. I don't care that much. But you've got terrorists blowing up buildings due to religion, large wars have started over religion, and the worst part is how intolerant many religions are. Most of my father's side of the family seems to have at least a slight dislike of my mother. Why? They're Baptist and she's Catholic. Oh noez, different sects of Christianity.

That's not personally why I am agnostic, but it certainly didn't pull me any closer to religion. I think it's perfectly fine and interesting to think about it yourself, but I don't see why other people have to get so touchy about it.

Take from this what you will. If you're offended, then you're reading it wrong and as such I don't really care that you feel offended. Religion IS capable of making people do and say very foolish things. Because humans are stupid and their minds are such a way that they can't handle someone having a different opinion from them, much less believing something different. It doesn't always have that effect on people, but there is certainly a potential.

Notice that, as I am human, I am not exempting myself from this.

REL38 · Aug 14, 2009

Falconv1.0 said:
I have to ask why is this called 'lol at religion' when it looks like it's about how atheists/non religious people lol at the bible and whatnot.

@TP-Treading thin ice bro, preaching that the bible and stuff, that is the truth, preaching there is 100% no God or afterlife for sure, that's a belief.

Agreed. It's all comes down to what you believe in. Facts like oxygen and gravity are undeniable, but how has science disproved the existence of God?

There are holes in religion and there are holes in science. But the main focal point when it comes to christianity is not to follow a bunch of doctrines and laws, but rather to improve the relationship between you and God. I don't have to go to church to become a good christian. I don't have to study the Bible like crazy to be a good christian. It's all about improving that relationship. A lot of people who claim to be christian ignore that reality.

btw I find it funny how one thread spawned 5 other threads dealing with similar topics.

El Nino · Aug 14, 2009

FirustheHedgehog said:
you've got terrorists blowing up buildings due to religion, large wars have started over religion

No wars are ever waged over religion or ideology. Wars are waged over territory and natural resources. Religion and ideology are methods of indoctrination used to train and control the foot soldiers.

Apart from politics though, religion can exist as its own entity. Science does what it does very well, but divinity is not a scientific concept, nor does it fall in the realm of science. A lot of things don't fall in the realm of science. Because of that, some people need religion.

I could do without the religious-political construct though.

Zero Beat · Aug 14, 2009

General understanding for the puzzled mind

Months ago:

Zero Beat said:
If you've been in the arena of atheism for any period of time, you'd know quite well that agnosticism means not knowing. Not believing is something entirely different.

Words to know:
Gnostic = Knowing
Agnostic = Not Knowing
Theist = Believes in god
Atheist = Not Believing in god

Visual representation:

This doesn't even need to go into the two forms of agnosticism. This is just about how there's two different spectrums: Belief, and knowledge.

You can say the following:
"I don't know, but I don't believe" and be an agnostic atheist(light cyan). Or, "I know there is no god" and be a gnostic atheist. (Dark cyan)

"I don't know there's a god, but I believe in one." Light red

"I know there's a God and I believe in Him." Dark red

^^^Refer to the picture.

|Theist<----->Agnostic<------>Atheist|. But it's two dimensional, not one-dimensional.

Hope this cleared some doubts or verified existing viewpoints.

lol at religous people, I mean really.

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