phi1ny3
Not the Mama
Samus
Matchup:
60:40
General info:
LU LU vs SAM SAM
60-40 in Lucarios favor
If you dont feel like reading this decently sized post just rea the next sentence. At the Highest level of play for Lucario AND Samus, the match-up ratio would be 60 to 40 in Lucarios favor. If you wish to see WHY, proceed to the paragraphs below. WHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAH!
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The Grand Scheme
Samus CANNOT kill
Samus ONLY does well when we have room to spam
Samus has SLOW melee atatcks
So pretty much, GET in our face. We DO NOT have a reliable answer to that method. ALWAYS have a medium to fully charged Aura Sphere on hand in case the spam gets too bad, fire it and run behind it to get BACK in our face(lol thats f-ed up), Pick stages where we CANT spam so that way you reduce our MAIN way of building your %s. Make sure you use your DBZ $hit to its fullest, it works on the WHOLE cast.
What to avoid:
lolChargeShotbeingeasilyavoidable
If you don't want to ignore this post/read dark font, start highlighting now.
I will admit Lucario has the advantage in most cases against Samus. But that doesn't mean it's easy pickings. A good/smart Samus can outcamp, outrange and outlast Lucario. Don't expect all of them to just try to keep you back with Missiles and Z-air. I agree with Xyro on the match-up.
Starting off, as G-Beast mentioned, B-air is something you should watch out for. It can get suprisingly low kills, especially near the edge of any stage, and is in general a good GTFO move. That being said, it's not really something you should specifically try to focus on avoiding; Just something you should watch out for. As far as projectile game goes, Samus has Lucario beat in terms of continuity and overall usefullness, but Lucario has power on his side later in the game. Missiles aren't too hard to avoid if you know what you are doing. Make it a priority to avoid them, as the damage gradually adds up, but be careful if they decide to approach and only use them scarcely. Bombs'll help her get out of some situations, but they aren't much. Do not try to approach, even if you think you can make it. Bombs coupled with good mindgames and bad judgement could make the difference between 4% from a Z-air to a KO from a Fully Charged Charge Shot. Charge Shots themselves are more useful than most people think. You're in for a hard time if you underrate them. On top of beating out or clanking with Fully Charged Aura Spheres up until dangerous percentages, most Samus players use the sporadically, when you least expect them. Finally, as far as her offensive game goes, her Melee combat is on the weak side, but when used properly is a force to be reckoned with. F-tilt, D-smash and Dash attacks have suprisingly good range. N-air and D-air, while apprearing as weak options, are incredibly good attacks. N-air has good range, is quick, can be used to escape many things, can lead to other moves(SH weak N-air can trip if not careful) and is good for gimping. Repeated N-airs also take their toll on your stock. D-air is not only a good spike, but good for racking up damage as well. Take into account the range, speed and all around usability, and it is one of Samus' most useful moves. While it's not very difficult to avoid, it is a very good retreating option, and is deadly near edges. Screw Attack is also a threatening move, though it can be somewhat easy to punish. That leaves U-air and F-air, which are good for racking up damage and are fairly useful. While killing remains Samus' weak point, she does have kill moves you should watch out for(Charge Shots, D-tilt and B-air in particular, D-air, F-smash, U-tilt and D-smash to a lesser extent)
LU LU vs SAM SAMRecovery and Gimping
Ah yes, this is the ONE WAY Samus can tunr the tide of the match and win! As all of you know, Samus is VERY VERY floaty which allows us to get back to the stage easier than most. You also know that our Tether is the LONGEST(yes more than ZS and olimar) in the game. You MIGHT even know that we can STILL bomb jump like we did in melee. And if you ever played a Samus you know her UP+B has great hieght and its MULTI hitting so the chances of you edge hogging our recovery is slim to none.
Now combine that with lucarios PREDICTABLE and SLOW recovery. Sure you can wall cling but dont kid yourself, its trash and you know it. Samus can shoot multiple missles to stop you recovery LOW or HIGH and she can even run off stage to shoot missle of zair. Spiking the recovery and wall cling is nothing hard for samus player because MOST of our kills on the ENTIRE cast consists of spike so we know every way possible to set up for it and force you to get in the range of it.
However, Lucario DOES have answers. Simply STAY in the middle or as close to the middle of the stage as you can. What is samus gonna do, come run up to your face and MAKE you go to the ledge? NO, read the section above here again and realize we CANT melee attack your *** at ALL so we cant force you to the ledge that way. Only our projectiles can do that.....oh wait, did you read the first section? Yea if u did you would know that, if done correctly, samus projectils SHOULDNT mess with you that much if you keep a medium to fully charged Aura sphere handy at all times.
Yes i know lucario can run off and fair or combo samus, but do u really wanna take the chance of doing that and then have us use our GREAT recovery and tether the ledge you were UP+Bing to? Its not worth it so dont try it.
Overall, samus wins in this department.
LU LU vs SAM SAM
60-40 in Lucarios favor
Projectiles
Right out fo the boxs samus has you beat. She can pelt you with lock-on missles/Homing missles/Charge Shot(cs) and Zair(yes i consider it a projectile). Feel scared yet? In reality it is the SAMUS players who should be scared.
Ok so while we build up EASY damage on Lucario from our spam(this is our priority because samus has problems uilding up damage with melee attacks) we also are fueling your DBZ $hit. So in reality, the more we spam and the more the spam hits you, its making you stronger......********.
Another thing we HATE is the fact that your MEDIUM to fully charged aura sphere GOES THROUGH zair, lock-on/homing missles and weak charge shot. WE MUST HAVE a CS that is EQUAL to your Aura Sphere or else yours beats ours and we take the hit. Lucario is one of the 2 chars that have a projectile that can stop ALL of our projectils. Its just dumb and it gives lucario a nice advantage on Samus's BEST attribute.....projectiles.
Overall, i think Samus wins this department slightly.
How to win:
LU LU vs SAM SAM
60-40 in Lucarios favor
DBZ $hit
I dont know the correct term for it but i call it "DBZ $hit" because when goku loses a fight(gets his *** beat) he gets stronger. Same for lucario! Each time you kids get hit your attacks do more damage. Ive seen poor ZS's get kill at 40% from a lucario at like 165% and 2 stocks behind doing a F-smash. That **** is screwed up. Anyway, this DBZ $hit is KEY in the samus vs lucario matchup....as u read on, you will understand.
As far as her defensive capabilities go, Samus gets screwed over. Her slow fall speed, large stature and overall clumsiness makes her very easy to combo, juggle and KO. Her recovery is above average, though, allowing her to live for a long time with good DI. On top of that, she's a bit faster, is "floatier," and has a few quick moves to escape. Overall though, the fight remains in Lucario's favor. Just be cautious, especially when recovering.
Samus would be more of a challenge if she had more than one attack. (Zair)
Samus would also be more of a challenge if she could kill before 678%.
Seriously, just stay in the middle of the stage, and you're fine. If she can't get you offstage, you're not going to die ever. DI dtilt away from her to the front, and you can live to past 160 if it's fresh.
If she does get you offstage, be sure to DI properly and be sure to recover high. If you recover stage-level, you're prone to charge shots and zairs, and if you're coming from below, you'll get daired, although you may survive with meteor canceling at low % if you slip up and get bumped off, considering that Dair has horrid base knockback, but a high growth rate.
About the only thing Samus has thats a threat is the ftilt and zair. Other than that, Lucario should be able to crossup and outrange Samus with tilts and whatnot. It's really hard to kill him with Samus. The occasional dtilt and utilt are really important to keeep fresh, because everything else is all about racking up cheap damage.
Lucario racks damage faster, can outrange her, out maneuver her in the air and kills her faster. It's a very annoying matchup for Samus players. Most of her approaches that AREN'T projectiles are walled out by Lucarios' aerials, and his Aura Sphere can cause major trouble even against her projectile spam.
The one thing to look for is Samus knocking you off stage. Zair can really mess you up then. And like G-Beast said, our nair is useful everynow and then in the matchup, it keeps us out of the A>A combos for the most part. It won't KO you, but get sus out of trouble sometimes. Bombs are tricky to avoid.
Any other move you outrange Samus on with that broken Aura. We can't OoS Screw Attack you because your aerials cancel it and if you're on the ground you should be spaced well enough to avoid it. And while yes our Dair is strong, your uair and fair comes out faster even when we start the dair earlier than you! It's nasty. And then not to mention our floatiness leaves us easily comboed in the air by more broken-aura range and hit stun. A pain to fight.
I'd say 60-40 if not 65-35 Lucarios favor
LU LU vs SAM SAMMelee attacks
Im not gonna sugar coat this ****: I WET MYSELF WHEN LU LU IS IN MY FACE. Not only does samus's weight make her easy as hell to combo, we dont really have a move that will STOP the combos once we are in it.
I might be spillin' a secret to you lu lu kids that the world doesnt want you to know but....tee hee.... Lucario's aura has invisible hit boxes.....OMG LIKE YOU DIDNT KNOW THAT ALREADY!!!! But seriously, your attacks can be spaced in a way to where EVEN if we shield, you can still stay out of range of our longest melee attacks: d tilt, f tilt.
Thanks to your DBZ $hit, you can make alot of your moves KO moves. Man, ive seen lucarios Fthrow, Uair, Bair, Dair, fsmash, Dsmash and some times ive seen Utilt kill. Samus only has 3 reliable KO moves. CS, Dtilt, and F smash(assuming its not already exhausted).
Overall, Lucario will ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS win in this department.
Helpful tips:
Well, I have some random info to throw out there regarding the Samus matchup.
Lucario's crawl protects him from most of Samus' projectile game. Zair (but not the sweetspot), super missles, and uncharged shots (iirc). Crawling can actually be made use of in this matchup.
Lucario still has to watch out for homing missles though. He should be getting rid of those before trying to use his crawl as an approach.
In the case you are at stage level OR below stage level, what i said applies. You CANNOT guarantee 90% of the time you will be above the stage while recovering. And EVEN if you did, you lucarios tend to do 2 things, dair(to stop your falling) or airdodge. I could come back and bring a deluge of counters to that way of recovering but i didnt. I specified EXACTLY what we can do to you given the fact u recovery AT or BELOW the stage level.
Again incorrect. U assume i would just be randomly UP+B to get back to the stage. You need to consider the samus you would be playing. THE HIGHEST LEVEL SAMUS....aka ME or Tudor. We do things like shoot a missle or zair bfore we UP+B so that it clears the way or produces a chance for us to pull of the UP+B. btw, it has invincibility frames if UP+B is done from the ground.
Lucario Uair does beat Samus dair if i challenged it head on. But if i challenged it with the side where the hit box starts(again, samus at its highest level), samus wins. Dont say its ALWAYS wins because it doesnt.
As for missles, yes you are right you can fair thru a single missle. But again, AT THE HIGHEST LEVEL, missles arent used to damage as much as they are used to SET UP for grabs or CS or many other things. Do assume fair beating a missle is the answer to missles.......cause its not.
Key thing to remember, this is BRAWL. Nothing is 100% certain. h and do not feel like i am trying to be mean or shoot you down. I just want people to realize lucario is not an unstopable force vs samus. We have things.
Stages:
LU LU vs SAM SAM
60-40 in Lucarios favor
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Stages to Ban/CP
Samus's BEST neutral stages:
FD: this allows us to run away and set up HUGE walls of projectiles.
BF: obviously the platforms gives us decent advantages on most of the cast.
SV: moving platform opens up new ways of camping.
Samus WORST neutral stages:
YI: The ledges screw up out Zairs and other "coming from the ledge" attacks. Shy guys and tilting platform mess up our missiles.
Lylat C(if legal): The platforms are nice but the ledge and tilting stage can screw us up badly.
Samus BEST CP:
lol the neutrals that we are good at are generally what most samus players CP with.
Some other(like me) pick PKMN 1 or Jungle japes or Norfair.
Samus WORST CP:
Just take us to ANY LEVEL where there is little to NO room to spam. Projectiles is 80% of our game and if you take it away or reduce it greatly.....what do we have left?
Disclaimer: This thread is made for the sole purpose of keeping matchup discussing clean and organized. If people wish to discuss a past matchup, they may do so in this thread without cluttering the current discussion.
