Easiest way to beat ICies: Kill Nana, run the clock on Popo ggz. Aircamp/Platformcamp/Running the clock are the preferred/safe strategies to beat them. Any stage with platforms are good, BF/LC/RC are best imo.
5/5
5/5
-
Welcome to Smashboards, the world's largest Super Smash Brothers community! Over 250,000 Smash Bros. fans from around the world have come to discuss these great games in over 19 million posts!
You are currently viewing our boards as a visitor. Click here to sign up right now and start on your path in the Smash community!
Out of order, new matchup thread coming soon!
- Thread starter Sesshomuronay
- Start date
- Status
Gimp them whenever you have the chance. Shine is pretty good at this, from my experience. Uhhh, yeah, don't get grabbed >_> Wolf can space and run away fairly well, so this shouldn't be a huge issue unless you keep messing up.
Do not end up above ICs in general, their utilt will likely land them a grab and their uair is amazing. Jumpshine has helped me out a bit in this matchup, but shine in general is very effective (reflects blizzard/ice blocks, separates ICs). If you ever grab one of them, use fthrow because it's fast and will hit both if they are nearby (info from JJ).
I'd say it's about 50/50, there's not much in particular that I can think of for this matchup though .__.
Do not end up above ICs in general, their utilt will likely land them a grab and their uair is amazing. Jumpshine has helped me out a bit in this matchup, but shine in general is very effective (reflects blizzard/ice blocks, separates ICs). If you ever grab one of them, use fthrow because it's fast and will hit both if they are nearby (info from JJ).
I'd say it's about 50/50, there's not much in particular that I can think of for this matchup though .__.
Prawn
Smash Master
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2009
- Messages
- 3,031
I'm super ****ed on vicodin from getting teeth pulled so I'll edit this with a long description tomorrow morning. but for a quick summary
I don't think it's 50-50 at all >_<
Sopo can CG wolf to ridiculous percents
Platform camping vs. Uair = Uair wins
Aircamp?? lol, with wolf?
Desync'd IBs give wolf a tough time IIRC
and battlefield is not that good vs ICs lol.
60-40 at best for wolf.
I don't think it's 50-50 at all >_<
Sopo can CG wolf to ridiculous percents
Platform camping vs. Uair = Uair wins
Aircamp?? lol, with wolf?
Desync'd IBs give wolf a tough time IIRC
and battlefield is not that good vs ICs lol.
60-40 at best for wolf.
Seagull Joe
Smash Legend
You forget yourself. Wolf has several options when getting back on stage on battlefield. Jumpshine can completely desynch and destroy Ic's recoveries. Shine in general beats Ic's. Wolf can't be blizzard walled because he has a laser and it will just hit the Ic's. Its 50-50.
Sopo cannot cg Wolf as long as you think. Maybe to 40% max. Wolf is also very versatile in the air. Getting grabbed isn't too easy. I'll ask God is my rock's opinion on this matchup because Meep hasn't played any Wolves to tell me what he thinks. We haven't played Wolf vs Ic ever....
tedeth
Smash Master
Nah Sopo can cg wlf to a pretty high %. Not too much of an issue though.
Prawn
Smash Master
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2009
- Messages
- 3,031
didnt say blizzard wall I said desync'd ice blocks.
also el oh el, sopo can cg you guys to like 70-80 lolololololol. I recall playing JJWolf in friendlies when I was TERRIBLE a few months ago and not doing too bad. Idk how I'd do now, I wanna MM him
also el oh el, sopo can cg you guys to like 70-80 lolololololol. I recall playing JJWolf in friendlies when I was TERRIBLE a few months ago and not doing too bad. Idk how I'd do now, I wanna MM him
DtJ Hilt
Little Lizard
Sorry for missing this back when it was posted, I forgot it existed lol >.>Hilt, what's so great about walkoffs for Olimar? And also, you didn't mention much about how Olimar performs on RC, would it be a more viable CP than the other two if the Wolf player is comfortable with the stage?
It's great to get someone who actually mains the character in here for once btw
Hopefully it's not too late, since you all have moved to ICs. Olimar's really not that bad on RC. He does have a lot of problems against characters that can keep a constant pressure game on him, and force him to areas that, if he's backed against a ledge, can't merely jump to another area. If Olimar has problems keeping a character out, Olimar's bad against them on RC. If the character has an amazing air game and can use it to pressure Olimar while he's forced to be in certain areas on the stage, Olimar's bad against them on RC. Otherwise, it's actually pretty good for him, and would tbh be a legit CP against certain characters.
hahaha yeaahhh ^^; I tend to do that sometimes...
Also your reasoning on RC and Japes are convincing. I probably wouldn't be too comfortable facing wolf on either, though I would definitely want to try it lol
castorpollux
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2007
- Messages
- 2,502
I remember 2 stocking you while not trying that hard to avoid grabs.didnt say blizzard wall I said desync'd ice blocks.
also el oh el, sopo can cg you guys to like 70-80 lolololololol. I recall playing JJWolf in friendlies when I was TERRIBLE a few months ago and not doing too bad. Idk how I'd do now, I wanna MM him
Thanks Hilt
Yeah, SoPo's CG goes on for quite a while, but his grab range is as bad as ours. It's not a stretch to say that we can avoid getting grabbed by SoPo.
Yeah, SoPo's CG goes on for quite a while, but his grab range is as bad as ours. It's not a stretch to say that we can avoid getting grabbed by SoPo.
Seagull Joe
Smash Legend
MM in Md/Va me? Our Ic's>NE's. We have a ton. Meep, God is my rock, Bonk, Sanoscy learned em, Coney learned em. And more. It's getting ridiculous. No one uses Mk anymore as a counter because the Ic patrol sweeps by with their mighty pivot grab outta nado shiz. LOL
Prawn
Smash Master
- Joined
- Apr 27, 2009
- Messages
- 3,031
LOL im well aware of meeps **** as I've experienced first hand.
And if I'm ever down there sure, I <3 MMs even if I lose because I learn a lot, even more so than tournament matches IMO.
Turbo Ether
Smash Master
- Joined
- Apr 12, 2006
- Messages
- 3,601
I played a good ICs player tonight in tournament and got ***** as Wolf. So I had to go Snake to win
I kinda understimate ICs, so now I understand what makes them difficult to fight. Trying not to get grabbed is fun, imo.
I kinda understimate ICs, so now I understand what makes them difficult to fight. Trying not to get grabbed is fun, imo.
lol, didn't look like we were getting much discussion anyways >_>
They're... kinda up to date. Idk, depends on how you think of matchups I suppose, we started MK this June if that helps.
ArcPoint
Smash Lord
Omg, Usmash is so good at separating them for some reason. Punishable as crap, but still it separates them really well.
Blargy
Smash Journeyman
Well i'm going to try this since i know this MU pretty well since my brother plays ICs and I used to main them also
to me its 60-40 ICs favor
They can pivot grab you like no other you only have a couple of safe moves that cant be pivoted (there regular grab sucks tho)......there uair ***** like no other so NEVER go above them there desync blizzards are makes you have to approach diffrerently.
Usmash and Dsmash are good at splitting them apart and its always best to go after nana just hit them away charge a Dsmash and let nana come and get hit from it.
AC fairs and space bairs work pretty well (they can pivot a Bair tho but cant the fair) never shine blizzard or IB since they leave you wide open for a grab.
for a stage i choose anything that has platforms (except smashville its to much like FD) never choose RB since for some reason most ICs are good there and always ban FD.
Also never underestimate SoPo he can still do massive dmg to you.
But in a nutshell just camp like no other and when he gets near you do a hit and run strategy and keep camping those platforms (watch for the uair **** though) and use AC fair and bairs most of the time. Oh and where pretty easy to CG.
AND THEY CAN FUSE OFF OUR LAZORS!!! (even though its probably banned by now lol).
well there's my attempt to do this MU hope you don't die from my lack of grammar abilities.
to me its 60-40 ICs favor
They can pivot grab you like no other you only have a couple of safe moves that cant be pivoted (there regular grab sucks tho
)......there uair ***** like no other so NEVER go above them there desync blizzards are makes you have to approach diffrerently. Usmash and Dsmash are good at splitting them apart and its always best to go after nana just hit them away charge a Dsmash and let nana come and get hit from it.
AC fairs and space bairs work pretty well (they can pivot a Bair tho but cant the fair) never shine blizzard or IB since they leave you wide open for a grab.
for a stage i choose anything that has platforms (except smashville its to much like FD) never choose RB since for some reason most ICs are good there and always ban FD.
Also never underestimate SoPo he can still do massive dmg to you.
But in a nutshell just camp like no other and when he gets near you do a hit and run strategy and keep camping those platforms (watch for the uair **** though) and use AC fair and bairs most of the time. Oh and where pretty easy to CG.
AND THEY CAN FUSE OFF OUR LAZORS!!!
(even though its probably banned by now lol).well there's my attempt to do this MU hope you don't die from my lack of grammar abilities.
Sesshomuronay
Smash Lord
So are we coming to a general matchup ratio thing?
Is 50-50 alright?
Is 50-50 alright?
tekkie
Smash Master
blizzard beats bair, grab = death (for the ice climbers i deal with anyways) and until they screw up reeeeeally badly and separate them it's a crazy uphill fight
i wouldn't call it less than 55:45
i wouldn't call it less than 55:45
Sesshomuronay
Smash Lord
I guess I'll update this sometime today or tomorrow.
Sesshomuronay
Smash Lord
I added some info. I guess I'll wait another day or two in case anyone wants to add anything.
Sesshomuronay
Smash Lord
I guess we can start ROB now.
castorpollux
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2007
- Messages
- 2,502
55:45 ROB
I know the match-up very very well. It's pretty much an even match-up except that ROB has no bad stages and wolf has a couple.
I'm ready to explain to anyone who disagrees.
I know the match-up very very well. It's pretty much an even match-up except that ROB has no bad stages and wolf has a couple.
I'm ready to explain to anyone who disagrees.
Yeah JJ, I disagree. What are Wolfs bad stages against ROB? ROB has Rainbow Cruise and Frigate Orpheon as CP. OK. But Wolf has Halberd and Brinstar. Other than that I don't see how any stage has a big impact on the match-up at all.
5/5
5/5
castorpollux
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2007
- Messages
- 2,502
ermm if you feel halberd/brinstar gives wolf a big advantage over rob, then I may be wrong.
But I don't see how those stages do
But I don't see how those stages do
KRDsonic
Smash Master
If Wolf vs. ROB is even, then I'll really need to pay attention to what people say to do in this matchup, because it's the only matchup out of all of my characters that I feel helpless in :/
tekkie
Smash Master
Seagull Joe
Smash Legend
I alt Robert and have no idea how to fight Wolf with him. I know how to fight Rob with Wolf, but not the reverse. JJ shed some light?
ROB gets owned by Wolf in aerial combat imo. Bairs chain oh so nicely on him :D
If he utilts you at low %, you'll end up at like 40% or something after the usmash. Our blaster stops his gyro when he shoots it out though, so that's good. I feel that ROB has the advantage on the ground.
How do Brinstar/Halberd give Wolf an advantage against ROB?
If he utilts you at low %, you'll end up at like 40% or something after the usmash. Our blaster stops his gyro when he shoots it out though, so that's good. I feel that ROB has the advantage on the ground.
How do Brinstar/Halberd give Wolf an advantage against ROB?
Seagull Joe
Smash Legend
I'm pretty sure you can sdi or just regular di the utilt from Rob. Rob in the air is Wolf's dinner. His *** is his blind spot.ROB gets owned by Wolf in aerial combat imo. Bairs chain oh so nicely on him :D
If he utilts you at low %, you'll end up at like 40% or something after the usmash. Our blaster stops his gyro when he shoots it out though, so that's good. I feel that ROB has the advantage on the ground.
How do Brinstar/Halberd give Wolf an advantage against ROB?
castorpollux
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2007
- Messages
- 2,502
this10charbairdanceI can safely say I probably have the most experience against wolf as ROB. I've probably played JJ Wolf several hundred times... no lie. Those videos of his bair strings? Yep that was me :/ I think at this point it's pretty much just mind games since we've played each other so much, but I'll try and contribute what I can.
ROB's Advantages:
F-tilt and fair are probably ROB's most useful tools in this matchup, as was pointed out already. If wolf is hurt far off stage, bair is a very useful tool to get the kill. Just fall with him and react accordingly.
ROB's Disadvantages:
Landing a kill move can be a problem if you staled your n-air. Wolf can juggle you. ROB's best option is probably to go to the ledge, but he also good tools to keep you from coming back. Just mix it up.
Opponent's Advantages:
Shine, short-hop shine, blaster/grab mind games, bair hurts (if you whiff a fair expect some punishment), pretty good air and ground speed
Opponent's Disadvantages:
Possibility of getting gimped, however it is a lot harder than it seems. Yes there is always something you can do to gimp the wolf, but wolf always has a way to get around it. Watch out for the range of f-smash and d-smash (front side is stronger) and wolf can have trouble killing you.
What ROB should try to do:
Learn to perfect shield and grab the bair. Typical spacing stuff with tilts and aerials. I do a lot of grabbing in this matchup. If he gets inside you and you can't get a grab, use jab. It's just as fast as his jab.
For counterpicks, I would say RC, frigate, or PS 1 to mess with his recovery. Not sure on bans, and I would say for neutrals just go with your comfortable one.
Ratio: 55:45-60:40 in favor of ROB.
It's not game over for wolf by any means... but if your not JJ don't use wolf against me
I may add some stuff later.
castorpollux
Smash Champion
- Joined
- Dec 19, 2007
- Messages
- 2,502
joebot's my friend. I was just trolling him
Aww, how sweet
So does anyone else get fsmashed out of bairs?
So does anyone else get fsmashed out of bairs?
LiL.Will
Smash Journeyman
- Joined
- Dec 1, 2008
- Messages
- 321
- Location
- Oklahoma City,Oklahoma
- NNID
- ZOMGitzWill
- 3DS FC
- 2208-5740-6357
Does Candy's Short Hopped Fast Falled Up-air to Footstool Neutral Air lock still work? I've always been curious...
I'll post a summary later on.
I'll post a summary later on.
tekkie
Smash Master
i get ftilted/shieldgrabbed depending on spacingAww, how sweet
So does anyone else get fsmashed out of bairs?
Seagull Joe
Smash Legend
It works. Just he can't pull it off in a match ever. I talked to him and he just laughed because its like impossible to actually do. If you do do it then huge props to you.
KRDsonic
Smash Master
I remember going into training mode and discovering that footstool thing for myself too, before I even used Wolf And yeah, it'll never happen in a real match, too hard to do, and I can't think of a time you'll ever get to get in that Uair on him at 0% with the right spacing and stuff.
And yeah, it'll never happen in a real match, too hard to do, and I can't think of a time you'll ever get to get in that Uair on him at 0% with the right spacing and stuff.
Even if you did hit him with an uair, why would you bother attempting the lock when you can start a string of bairs?
Also, ROB can't airdodge out of his upB unless he stops boosting and uses an attack, but that shouldn't be a very common scenario against good ROBs. If it ever happens, shine through whatever they might throw out and fair/bair, should connect unless they immediately airdodge, I think.
Also, ROB can't airdodge out of his upB unless he stops boosting and uses an attack, but that shouldn't be a very common scenario against good ROBs. If it ever happens, shine through whatever they might throw out and fair/bair, should connect unless they immediately airdodge, I think.
- Status