R.O.B. Matchup(DONE)

R.O.B.




General Discussion

R.O.B.(rob) is a newcomer to the game that brings a lot to the plate. He has two projectiles in which one can stay on the stage and mess with you while the other one simply needs to be recharged after being shot. It takes a few seconds to charge and shoot, but the longer you wait to shoot it the more powerful it gets. This applies to both projectiles. He has some airiels that are just plain plain awesome while he can manipulate you on the ground with his tilts and smashes. Combine this with the best recovery in the game and you have yourself a tough matchup.

Pika's Advantages

1.) Faster
2.) recovery makes it harder for rob to gimp

Pika's Disadvantages

1.) Less Projectiles
2.) Cannot CG rob
3.) airiels< robs
4.) very hard to edgeguard rob

Strategy for Winning

General

To win against rob you are gonna have to rely on your finess as a pika player. Unlike snake or sonic where you can just man handle these characters and just brute them into their death, to beat rob you must always be careful and plan out your moves accordingly. He has great kill moves and the ability to stay alive for long periods due to his recovery.

Projectiles

The first thing that needs to be discussed are the projectiles. Rob has 2. He has a laser and an actual item(gyro) which he charges up with downb and shoots it out. The longer both are charged the more dangerous they are. The laser needs 1-2 seconds to charge after being shot to be shot again while it takes about 20 seconds to fully charge it up. The gyro can be shot instantly while taking 3-4 seconds to fully charge. Some things you need to know are that the laser can be shot at angles, so crawling is pretty much useless. The gyro cannot. The gryo, when shot, stays on the stage and continues to spin. If you run into it then you get more damage. The longer its been charged the longer it spins. And if you are not sure how powerful the laser has gotten look at rob's head. There is a red light that blinks. The brighter it is the more powerful the laser.

Now as a reaction to these projetiles it is adivsed to do a few things. For the laser, when on the ground, shield both the laser and gyro. Do not attempt to spot dodge the laser. You can try to to spotdodge the gyro once you get the timing down for it. Most robs like to use the laser when they are on the ledge. They ledge hop into a laser which makes it harder to edgehog them. Another use of the laser is when you have been sent off the stage and are flying into the air. They will shoot a laser at you and hit you so that you die. This has happened to many good players. The only thing we can do here is airdodge at the right moment. So when knocked off the stage, watch out for the laser.

Another thing that rob's like to do it shoot a gyro then laser you right after. Like it was said before, shield. More importantly, powershield the laser. If you find yourself at the gyro and you grab it, hold onto it for a few seconds then throw it up in the air. Rob cannot use another one while you are holding onto it and its in the air. And it is now your projectile too. If the thing keeps spinning and you are sure that rob is gonna pick it up and throw it at you, then knock it off the stage. Get it off and out of play. Now they can also use the laser first and then use the gyro. So be aware at all times for the projectiles.

Offense/Attacking

As for actually attacking rob, this can be difficult but its not impossible in any way. The main point that I want to stress is not to get to aggravated when your opponent is at a high percentage. It may take +130% to kill rob. So my first piece of advice before I talk about any form of aggressive play is to be patient. Just try and get damage in, no matter how small it is.

Now some people like to play rob aggessively and others tend to be more defensive. This is ok. But it really depends on the rob you are playing. If the rob like to camp, well then you need to get in close to make those projectiles less useful. If they don't use their projectiles that much then a defensive playstyle is an option.



The first thing I am going to talk about are robs tilts. Be aware that he can angle his tilts and they can outrange and cancel almost all of pikas ground approaches. They are aggravating. Their startup time is mimnimal and their lag is equally good. If you are approaching be aware that rob can angle his ftilt upwards towards you. If you are crouching he can still hit you. The tilt will not miss. Robs love their ftilt and dtilt. If you find yourself a victim of tilts be defensive. Shield. Wait till the tilt has ended and shield grab. You can spot dodge them but it leaves you with very little time to get an attack in. Grabbing allows you to pull off some combos and send rob into the air, which is where we want him.

His Air Game

Getting rob to fight in the air will win you your match. His air game is very predictable since most of his moves have already been mapped out. His weekspot is his underside. He can only hit you with his bair and nair, which have a considerable startup time. But be aware...they hurt so be aware. Your uair is your friend in this match when in the uair. You can combo into nair or bair(if you save your jump). The only airiel that poses a threat is the fair. Now when I say threat I mean a move that comes out fast and has descent priority and not predictable. Robs will use the fair a lot. If you get hit by it just DI away and then use your QAC to get underneath him. The player will then panic and become a little predictable. Use pikas quickness when in the air.

Your Air Game

Pika's airiels are the game winning moves here. Not that they kill, but they set you up for everything. You need to know what you are doing in the air against rob. DO NOT use the same approach every time when facing rob. Use your fairs to shield poke as well as FFing>combo. The bair is awesome. Interchanging the fair and bair will always keep the rob wondering what is coming. SHould they shield longer or let go sooner...stuff like that. Plus you don't have to do a RAR to use the bair effectively. As for the nair and uair, use them. Shield>Sh nair when they are in front of you and at high percentages. When rob is behind you SH uair. The SH uair will hit 95% of the time if you set it up right. Watch some vids of anther if you need to learn how to set it up. As for the dair, use it, but try and not let it hit the ground. Too much lag time and rob has a great laser. It situational since you want to stay away from robs upside.

Also, another thing with the nair. Pika's and robs. They are very similar in the way they come out. Pika's is faster but robs is more powerful. Now you pika players know how good the nair is for killing so that should give you an idea of how well robs nair kills. It is one of his best killers!!!! It can hit all around him. Do not mess with his nair. Try your best to watch for the setup and punish its lag time. Its very easy to see coming since rob needs to be well above the ground to use it.

Smashes

As for robs smashes...we will start with the fsmash. He can angle this also. I know...it sucks. But now that you know you can counter the fsmash. It has terrible range compared to pikas. Rob's use this as a killing move and for damage gains. The usmash...well it has great range, it can kill, and NEVER GET ABOVE ROB!!!!!!! Never. He will use it and almost certainly kill you. If he doesn't use it, maybe because of the slight startup lag or end lag, he will use his utilt to try and juggle you. His dsmash is also very similar to pika's. Difference is that its short, harder to DI out of due to reaction times for DI'ing, and its startup time is next to nothing. That being said we pika players know how awesome our dsmash can be. Robs is better. Do not get into a dsmash battle cuz we will lose.

As for our smashes, use them for damage gains. Use you usmash more in this matchup. Try and techchase with the thunder after wards. Its always good to get a thunder in. Use your dsmash, but be aware that its easy to DI out of. Now for the fsmash. Probably your most useful smash option. Save it. Do not let it degenerate. You will use it for killing. Never use it before 105%. If you do make sure that you are getting a sweetspotted fsmash in to make it count. Saving your fsmash will help you finish the match more than any other move.

Your Tjolt

Now I usually talk about pikas projectiles first when approaching, but its good to change it up everynow and then. Pika's tjolt. Spammable. Easy to use. Great for free damage. Anotherwards...use it. Use it often. Use it when approaching to get a shield out of your opponent. If they don't then they get hit, acquire damage, flinch, and you get a free FF fair. Pika's thunder. Learn to use it against rob. Be aware that rob can reflect it. His sideB reflects. It has some startup time yes, but I have fallen victim to it and so has many others. So when thundering, or tjolting, watch out for the potential reflect. If you know its coming then just do not let the thunder hit you. Now there are vids of this player called Stealth Raptor who uses the thunder better than anyone i've seen. Watch it. Learn how to use thunder becuase it deals a great deal of damage and is awesome.

Killing/Edgeguarding

Now for kiling rob. Maybe the most useful section here. The kill moves are the fsmash, usmash, thunder, nair, and utilt. This may be obvious but lets go through them. The fsmash is great for killing at lower percnetages as well as thunder. Usmash>techchase thunder is a great rob killer. Save your fsmash and use it at around 110% to kill. The nair is good for +130% kill to due robs weight. If if doesn't kill, don't get aggravated. You will kill him eventually. Be patient. You will have to get him at high percentages for killing. Now the utilt...great move. Comes out fast and is easy to land a thunder since it sends the rob at an awkward angle. IF you find that the rob is at a high percentage use your utilt. It comes out extremely fast compared to your other moves.

When trying to edgeguard rob...well this will prove difficult since he has by far the best recovery in the game. His bair gets him closer as well as being able to turn on/off his upb. If he tries to go above the stage use your thunder. Some robs ahve developed a strategy of staying off the edge because of the recovery ability. They are forcing us to play them where we cant really do much. You must learn how to edgeguard. we have a great recovery too. Don't be afraid to go off the ledge. Be aware of his spike though. Your thunder is a great move off the ledge. If it hits you, you stop for a split second. Use this.

When rob is edgeguarding he is extremely efficient. He can hit you with his laser to kill you. He can spike. He can ftilt you(wop). So that being said, use your skullbash whenever he WILL NOT ATTACK YOU. Use it sparingly. Your life really does depend on it. Your QA is your bf. Learn it. Use it.

The last thing that I want to talk about is when rob is hanging off the ledge. This section deserves its own section. Rob can drop down>jump>many things. He can laser you. He can nair (the nair will hit above the stage even if rob is below it). If he is hanging off the ledge tjolt him to death. Keep jumping and shielding. Do not rush in cuz they can also just hit the A button and BAM!, it will hurt. You can even jump over him and thunder. I don't care. Just do not rush him.



Helpful Video's

Gonna get anthers

Overall Matchup

R.O.B. > Pika

Your picture didn't work...but for rob, anticipate that either after a throw, or just at a distance, his laser will be angled....rarely will a good rob use it straight, so learn to see this coming and dodge...his gyro hurts but can be used as aprojectile for your own uses too but make sure to shield it if you know its coming...also if you hold on to it, and don't throw it, he cannot make another one, and since Pika's special moves are pretty good on their own, that gives him an advantage. rob's recovery is insane, and so basically you need to kill him from the cieling or sides to not let him recover. that being said, since pika doesn't have alot of spikes, since his up-b is relatively easy to spike. his aerials take range over pika, so its all about timing...moreover, his d-smash has more priority than pikas, which is saying something, so watch out for the spot-dodge -> d-smash. Also, his side-b reflects projectiles, so just another thing to watch out for. Since rob is larger, he is easier to juggle, which is definitely a pika plus...just my 2 cents though

i played a **** good ROB at the tourney and man was it hard. his dsmash is almost the same as pikas; minus the electricity of course. but it comes out a bit faster than ours. next is he can spam his projectiles and even use the laser to hit you while you are recoverying to kill you. beware of his nair which has crazy potential. killing him seemed to work best by usmash>thunder at like 80%. i got lucky a few times with it. i saved the running thing till i knew i needed it so he wouldnt be conditioned to shield or dodge.

ROB is a toughy. There is almost no way to be offensive against him, as shield grabbbing, down dodge - dsmash, and his tilts neutralise EVERYTHING that pika can use to approach. Just grabbing the gyro doesnt always work, as pikas b moves may be good, but they dont really o much to a good rob. skull bask is too easy to shield, tjolt spam can be easily avoided by rob, either by power shielding, reflecting, or just jump over everything. same with thunder. oh btw he can reflect thunder. if the thunder has hit you, and you are poofing, he can side b into you, keep you trapped, while a reflected thunder hits you multiple times. yes. multiple. as in OW. If you want to play games with the gyro, dont hold onto it for too long, as it is disadvantageous in the long run. ROB will angle his laser always, especially against pika, as it travels over pika if straight when pika is crouching. Really you want to get ROB in the air. As bunny said, all his aerials are telegraphed way ahead of time. all but the fair have a long start up time and end time, though the nair is a bit less then the others. best thing to do is get them up into the air and see what they do. some (like my friend) will use nair as a defense mechanism. bait them into using it, then commence the uair juggling. once you get it started, the lag time on ROBs aerials can make it very difficult for him to recover. you can drop down, and then jump back up quicker then he can generally attack. just watch out for the fair, and the nair if he is high enough. Edgegaurding? no. you would have to get lucky to edgegaurd him. if oyu knock him off and he is coming back, my best advice it to back away from the edge. now if the ROB grabs the edge, they like to just hit a, as their recovery attack (or what ever it is called) has insane range. if he does that, short hopped thunder or dair. That is all I can think of before i go to work. I will post more if i can think of any.

ROB's recovery is his biggest asset since he can use it offensively and for recovery purposes. the thing you have to remember is that he can turn it off then back on since it runs on gas, which is why is the best recovery in the game and he can recover from anywhere on the stage. what i try to do is either get him below the edge so i can drop down and nair him or make it so that he has to recovery way up high over me so i can hit him with the initial startup of the thunder and kill him. another thing is that hitting him horizontally off the stage isnt that effective as hitting, for example, marth or ike. i try and kill ROB with an usmash as to make his recovery useless since he doesnt need it since he is above the stage. save your fsmash just in case though. rely on tilts and other methods of damage.

AND PEOPLE...START RESPONDING TO THE MATCHUPS EVEN IF YOU THINK WHAT YOU KNOW ISNT IMPORTANT.

This is a really hard match-up for Pikachu. After Rob runs at or away from you with his b air (hitting you with the front or the back), he hits the ground with practically no lag and starts up his d smash. Also, he can reflect your thunder and has great projectiles to counter your own. Remember to not be too offensive and to wait for openings.

You can't play as ground-based against Rob as you normally can with Pikachu. Make sure to not d smash too often; his d smash beats yours in terms of speed or he can shield and then punish you with his f smash. Also, from time to time, you can him with the tip of your f smash since it has more range than his ground moves; however, be careful that he doesn't jump and b air into you with his head. Generally, your u smash is the best smash option against him, since he will likely use his b air often and the u smash tends to beat it in terms of speed. The u smash is also likely going to be your best killing move against Rob, followed by an occasional thunder.

In short, it seems best to play an aerial game with Pikachu. Use a lot of f airs against him while he's on the ground and use follow-up combos (generally started with u tilt) so that you can juggle him with u airs and, occasionally, thunders. You can pursue him off the edge, but remember he is by no means helpless. Gimping a Rob is nearly IMPOSSIBLE; his b up has amazing recovery and his aerials are quite good. If you are going after him, most likely for damage racking, Pikachu's d air is probably one of your best options as above him is one of his least protected areas.

Hopefully you guys can use some of this stuff. Good luck!

Ok time for some more things. When ROB is hovering, he has lost all ability to airdodge. if he tries to go over you, thunder. if he attacks, however, he regains his dodge. ROB has a big weakness in the diagnol direction, his only defense either shielding or fsmash, which is hard to use as a defense. if you try the diagnol, watch for the shield grab or dsmash. If he has YOU off the edge, he is likely to come after you with fair. It is a ery good wall of pain. so, this is for all you nutcases who use skull bash every chance to recover- you will get OWNED by the fair if you attempt it. fast fall, aerial dodge, then QA up. also watch out for his spike. if it hits it is pretty powerful. try to qa around him. If you see a gyro or a laser come out, expect to see the other projectile right afterwards. try to use that against rob. and never hold onto the ledge for very long. they can short hop dair and spike you off the edge if you arent paying attention.

Oh yeah an for videos the obvious choice would be anther vs overswarm

robs dsmash can be spot dodged, pikas cant *unless u shield a little first*

I played OS in 3 sets this weekend at a mini-tourney and was able to knock him into losers and then actually beat him in the finals. Strangely I wasn't able to observe what I changed about my tactics in general besides just knowing more about brawl in general.

You just plain don't want to get hit by the gyro or rob's Nair. Gyro because it does too much damage and Nair because it kills you. Good Robs will try to hit you with the gyro as you land because of the vulnerabilty, and the best counter to such tactics is to DI away or just get to the edge. Also, when you end up accidentally grabbing the gyro, a good idea is to just toss it straight into the air. Removes it from play for a bit which is almost depressing to the ROB.

I think short hop fair is my most common approach against him after weakening his shield with anything, fair into the usuals.. utilt, ftilt, dsmash (which'll get di'd out of but is sometimes the best option). I'm a lil reckless with fair because I try to very often go after the shield pokes.

Also in contrary to what stealth raptor said, you should try to develop a relatively aggressive edgegame vs ROB. I basically had to do this because OS basically spends the entire match out there, and it's probably pretty dangerous when you don't know all of robs options. A lot of it is taking advantage of dropping backwards off of the ledge and hitting him with a couple uairs when he's further out, and catching him with nairs when's trying to fly through the ledge. Just don't get hit by his good moves out there =P.

And... don't panic when his percent gets way too high. It sucks to get killed when you've had a 150% advantage so don't try to rush things. Plus, Pika always has the option of the killing utilt or utilt -> thunder (Usually can't be spot dodged properly..) when they get close to the 200% range XD.

alright guys. ROB is now almost complete. Just have to work on a few more paragraphs and we are kool.

I'm coming in here as a ROB main and just wanted to try to help you guys out some. Being below ROB is the best possible position for Pikachu. The only things an aerial ROB can hit you with from below are NAir and DAir, both of which have a really slow start-up. The NAir will be the most common option as DAir is a horrible move for ROB. Against the NAir, though, the hitbox starts at the bottom and ends at the bottom so if you avoid the very beginning, don't just jump in expecting free hits. You're either going to have to time your attacks to hit in the middle of the rotation (very hard as it seems the hitbox lingers further behind than the thrusters really are) or jut wait it out and hit him after.

Most smart ROBs will try to get to a ledge when they're being juggled, so putting yourself between them and the ledge is probably the best option as well. You'll want to be about a pika length away from him at most though. Some ROBs will use their Up-B when being juggled which means easy thunders if you can predict it, but even if you do predict it, thunder still probably isn't a good idea as ROB has a lot of control over his momentum with his up-b.

As for approaching (which you -will- have to do against ROB), your best options are probably the FAir or defensive approaches. ROB basically has a wall in front and above him, though. The FTilt outranges all your attacks and can be angled up to knock you out of FAirs. If you can manage to approach the ROB and airdodge through him, you're in a pretty good position, you just need to watch for his DSmash. A SH UAir when behind him with your back to him is usually a great idea. This is the juggle set-up that I've been caught in most commonly as the DSmash gets beaten by your SH and we can't SH BAir out of shield since Pika is so tiny.

Anyway, that's all I could think of that you guys hadn't covered already. Best of luck against your Robotic overlords. : )

Personally I like mind games on rob. Staying in the air is the best way to fight ROB.(I know it sounds dumb because ROB aerials>pika) Dont by any means fight rob in the air, just try and come from the air with a thunderjolt>Fair. Usually they block of dodge the jolt and get hit with the Fair. From Fair you can pretty much start combos. Always look for DownB> dash SHNair
This is almost always done. DownB>Laser>Dash ShNair
I say dash cause they run over the gyro(sp?) to Nair you. If you mess with it and get hit, you will be Nair.
ROBs tend to Nair alot. Thats there best aerial. Don't fear there aerials. Fair is mostly used to gimp, Uair is mostly used after another attack( i.e Dthrow>Uair)
Dair is SLOW and Bair is used if you chase him or if your off stage. And beleive it or not, Nair has start up lag. So if you want to fight him in air its not the worst thing nor the best. Just dont hesitate cause pikas aerials are faster and can beat ROBs at coming out.
As for ground game......Dsmash is too fast. ROBs Dsmash is faster than MKs >_>

Thats why air approachs are best for this. Try to keep QAC at a minumum cause his projectiles will stop you

I wish I had a Video capture card to supply a vid. I know this match up so well.

Oh and you can pika jolt him if hes low off the feild, it may not kill hi' but it racks damage

When you are pressuring Rob on the ground, and you see the ROB sidestep. Get ready to either shield or grab, preferably grab. The grab will give you super armor, so you take something like 2% at worst and get a grab. If you shield, he will be able to retaliate after his attack before you will, since the D-smash will push you away.

Rob is our enemy <_< Stlths Rob 2 stocked my pika. Rob hurts. It seems they play by different rules now

Indeed. My friend mains ROB and it hurts. Thats why i picked up rob. the better to know your enemy. still hasnt helped too much yet.

Im going to find robs weakness

R.O.B.'s weakness is his lack of cuteness.

ESAM said:

R.O.B.'s weakness is his lack of cuteness.

Click to expand...

QFT

10 pikaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaas

ESAM your a temp mod right? go to high voltage thread

ROB users love the spotdodge + dsmash technique. I haven't tested it fully, but if you can bait a ROB into a spot dodge and unleash a fsmash, they should come out of the spot dodge into your best kill move. The timing is just right.

Yes you can do it. you just have to time it perfectly, cause rob can come out with the dsmash VERY quickly.

what's the deal with DI out of his dsmash? Is it straight up? and is it SDI?

yes, same as pikas, only infinitly harder to pull off.

It's not harder to pull off, it's just as easy to pull off. Only difference is you have to react faster. Which shouldn't be hard..it's easy to know when a ROB is gonna DSmash

hey guys...its done!!!!!!!

it sucks. go work on it some more.






jk looks awesome

Keep the pressure on ROB at all times in close quarter combat. His projectiles are so good it's effective against a small and agile character like Pikachu. We can combo ROB pretty well, so there's another reason to stay up close.
When you think you've left yourself open for even a split second, shieldgrab! Most ROB's say get the hell away from me in only one way- with a d-smash. Spot dodging the d-smash is unlikely to work as the hitbox lasts pretty long. Also remember that as you are coming down from the air, ROB has priority over you whether he is in the air or on the ground. Also don't get directly under him if he's coming back down from the air.

Well that's all I can think of for now. And horray! I'm a Smash Journeyman now!

That is a resounding comeback. GJ galax, hope you can make more of them, it would really be helpful to a lot of players.

Harbinger631 said:

ROB users love the spotdodge + dsmash technique. I haven't tested it fully, but if you can bait a ROB into a spot dodge and unleash a fsmash, they should come out of the spot dodge into your best kill move. The timing is just right.

Click to expand...

Hmm, is it possible to do that d-tilt slide into Fsmash? So, you d-tilt repeatedly, or once, just to get him to spot dodge, then slide to forward smash? Or would it be a little too long?

the dtilt slide isnt forward its backward unless i'm mis understanding your comment

Yeah. I thought it was possible to move forward but after playing I realize it cannot.. bummer.

lalala
rob is a *****

Very very useful thread all. Thanks for all this. I'll have to try some of this out.

Videos of Anther (Pika) vs. Overswarm (ROB)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1qCTOv8Ung
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J9SiVAB6vDE