SBR Recommended Rule List Discussion: Brawl

The ruleset can be found here:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=187735

The voting on the stages was based off of discussion, with the options being Starter, Counterpick, Banned, or to not vote at all. To be solidified as a Starter, Counterpick, or Banned stage, a stage needed to have at least 2/3rds majority (66.67%). If a stage did not, it would be split into two categories and the TO using the rule list would have to choose which category he prefered it to be in. No stage had equal or even close to equal votes for all three categories at once.

All stages were voted on with the intent of every ruleset using the stage striking system.

The layout below is listed in this manner:

Stage: Starter - Counterpick - Banned

You may notice some odd votes, such as Battlefield getting a vote for banned (Thanks, AOB) or New Pork City getting two votes for Starter (Iggy and Joshu). That's because the SBR has a sense of humor like everyone else. I'm leaving the votes as is without removing the joke votes for posterity, but rest assured that a revote would have been done if anything would have ever been decided by these "joke" votes.

Battlefield: 47-0-1
Smashville: 24-0-1
Hyrule Temple: 0-0-16
New Pork City: 2-1-20
Mario Bros: 2-0-22
Castle Siege: 14-16-1*
Final Destination: 26-2-1
Luigi's Mansion: 0-30-8
Halberd: 18-16-0*
Wario Ware: 0-2-33
Spear Pillar: 1-0-31
Corneria: 1-27-9
Shadow Moses: 0-6-29
Rainbow Cruise: 0-30-1
Pokémon Stadium 1: 16-14-2*
Frigate Orpheon: 1-29-0
Yoshi's Island (Wii): 37-0-0
Norfair: 1-27-0
Flat Zone 2: 1-1-22
Mario Circuit: 0-14-11*
Onett 0-10-12*
Brinstar 1-20-0
75m 2-2-24
Skyworld 0-12-8*
Pirate Ship: 2-18-4
Delfino 10-12-0*
Pokémon Stadium 2 2-21-2
Yoshi's Island (Pipes) 0-15-6
Jungle Japes 0-14-1
Distant Planet 0-20-10 (66.67%!)
Bridge of Eldin 0-2-25
Pictochat 0-25-9
Green Greens 0-10-11*
Port Town Aero Dive 0-13-15*
Rumble Falls 0-3-21
The Summit 0-2-20
Lylat Cruise 16-9-0*
Mushroomy Kingdom I 0-0-19
Green Hill Zone 0-17-3
Big Blue 0-3-17
Hanenbow 0-5-16
Mushroomy Kingdom II 0-0-21

For Doubles Only:
Hanenbow: 0-9-8*

Stages with asterisks had close votes, and therefore can be used in more than one category.

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Stages become Starter stages when it is agreed by a 2/3 majority in the SBR that each stage is overall a fair stage with only minimal advantages and disadvantages given that has an overall low number of hazards, ineffective hazards, or basic hazards that can be predicted and implemented into a strategy.

Stages become Counterpick stages when it is agreed by a 2/3 majority in the SBR that they are not an overall fair stage in that they give specific advantages and disadvantages to certain types of characters, so much so that it can influence the match directly. Or, that the stage has hazards that disrupt play to such an extent that it cannot be assumed the player can avoid them with minimal effort or the hazards have such incredible damage and knockback that they can directly influence the outcome of a match.

Stages become Banned stages when it is agreed by a 2/3 majority in the SBR that they are not a fair or competitive stage at all, in that certain characters can easily have a near 100% win rate against others at top level play or that a large majority of the cast cannot actively be played on this stage, or that the stage simply requires such a radical change in gameplay that players cannot be reasonably expected to adapt (such as the Cave of Immortality in Hyrule Temple). Hazards can also cause a stage to be banned if they are random in nature and thus directly disrupting gameplay on a consistent basis, or if they are so powerful and/or unavoidable that they directly determine the outcome of a match on a consistent basis.


Starter
Battlefield
Smashville
Final Destination
Castle Siege*
Halberd*
Pokémon Stadium 1*
Yoshi's Island
Delfino*
Lylat Cruise*


All of the above starter stages were deemend to have very little, if any, effect on the outcome of the match. Games on these stages are generally up to the player's skill, and while some characters prefer one or more stages listed above we believe the stage striking system combined with rudimentary knowledge of your opponent's character gives you the ability to remove any disadvantages these stages could potentially give you.


Looking for a specific stage? Hit Ctrl+F on your keyboard to use the "find" function!



Counter

Castle Siege*

Castle Siege, due to the poor ledges on the first transformation and the walk-off section for the second transformation, was deemed to be too influential to a game's outcome to be listed as a Starter 100% of the time. We understand why some TOs would want to make this a counterpick. However, the effects of this stage do not influence the game in such a negative manner that it needed to be banned.

Luigi's Mansion

Luigiu's Mansion, due to its psuedo "cave of immortality" effects, unique projectile stopping pillars, and the fact that matches generally take much longer led this to be a counterpick.

Halberd*

As it is a moving stage with a floor you can jump through and several hazards, we felt that while it could work as a Starter it influences the game enough to where a TO may want to make it a counterpick.

Corneria

While the wall on the right is dangerous and the ceiling is low on top of the fin, we do not believe these are uncontrollable aspects of the stage and therefore it should not be banned. If you wish to camp the wall in hopes of getting off an infinite, you must put your back to the blast zone that is incredibly close to that side of the stage.

Rainbow Cruise

The lack of available ledges and need for a strong aerial game make this stage too unfair for many characters to last as a starter. However, this makes it a great counterpick.

Pokémon Stadium 1*

This level is a fair level, but it has odd ledges that hurt gameplay and transformations that nearly force your opponent to camp. As such, it ended up in both Starter and Counterpick categories.

Frigate Orpheon

Due to the lack of ledge on the right side of the first transformation and the potential danger of stage flipping for bad recoveries, this was placed as a counterpick.

Norfair

The consistent wave of hazards pushed this into the counterpick category; the multiple ledges giving strong advantages to those with poor recoveries also played a role.

Port Town Aero Dive*

This stage doesn't have ledges for many sections, so was automatically out of the running for being a starter. The cars, while avoidable, are incredibly strong and this ended up in both the counterpick and banned category.

Mario Circuit*

The small stages and walk-off edges made this a tough call, placing it on both the counterpick and banned lists.

Onett*

The large amount of walls and consistent hazards placed this in the counterpick list, and the walk-off edges facing a wall meant edge camping would be a serious threat to many members in the SBR, which placed it in the banned list.

Brinstar

The uneven ground completely changes how aerials are canceled, and the lava can be a strong influence on the match; this placed it in the counterpick list.

Skyworld*

The ability to spike people from the stage through the clouds made this an instant ban for many in the SBR, but after closer looks we found that it is possible to destroy the top plats for saftey and the ability to tech, DI strongly, or fight elsewhere led this to being a viable counterpick as well.

Pirate Ship

The unique layout and features of this stage such as water, strong hazards, tall platforms, etc., placed this in the counterpick list.

Delfino*

Due to this being a moving stage with several walk-offs, water sections, and ledge-filled areas, it was placed in both the Starter and the Counterpick list.

Pokémon Stadium 2

The transformations were deemed to have too strong an effect on the match to be placed as a Starter, but not strong enough to merit a ban.

Yoshi's Island (Pipes)

This stage originally was in both the counterpick/banned category, but after a revote it was decided that this stage was a unique counterpick that was very effective against light characters (especially Metaknight); worries of D3's chain grab existed, but were not enough to warrant placing this in the ban category.

Jungle Japes

The water and high ceiling made this a counterpick.

Distant Planet

The unique layout and slanted hill on the left side combined with the addition of items (the pill things) put this in the counterpick list.

Pictochat

The frequent transformations have too great an effect on the match to let this be a neutral, but not enough to ban the stage.

Green Greens*

Due to the small ceiling and close blast zones on the edges combined with the bombs and blocks falling on either side, this was placed in both counterpick and banned.

Lylat Cruise*

The tilting of this stage and overall janky ledges led this to being placed in both Starter and counterpick.

Green Hill Zone

The odd layout, break-away floor, and checkpoints led to this being a counterpick.

Banned

Hyrule Temple
New Pork City

These stages were both huge and had strong elements of circle camping as well as a cave of immortality.

Mario Bros.

The cave of immortality, walk-off edges, and incredibly damaging hazards/items led to this being banned.

Wario Ware

Being randomly given a reward allowed you to potentially get screwed over by getting a megamushroom while your opponent gets a starman, and for this it is banned.

Spear Pillar

Reversing your controls has too strong an impact on the match, and it doesn't help that there is a cave of immortality on the stage.

Shadow Moses

The walls are very close together and the impact that characters with chaingrabs and infinites have on this stage is undeniable; it becomes almost necessity for your character to have some sort of infinite to play well on this stage.

Flat Zone 2

The hazards are quick, hard to read, and do ridiculous damage and knockback.

75m

The this stage is incredibly large and makes for easy circle camping.

Rumble Falls

It was decided that the player is forced to fight against the stage far too often to make this a viable counterpick.

The Summit

The lack of edges and a OHKO hazard led this to being banned.

Mushroomy Kingdom I & II

The side scrolling properties of this stage with the addition of walls led for easy grab and infinite KOs; MKII also had a low ceiling for several points that made vertical KOs far too easy to achieve.

Big Blue

The stage layout itself was deemed too intrusive to allow this as a counterpick, as players had to fight the stage transformations and hazards as much, if not more, as the player.

Hanenbow

The ability to circle camp showed itself here as well as the irritating effect of moving the ledges away from characters with damaging up+bs.

After a doubles vote, we decided that these problems were not as apparent in a teams match and, should a TO desire, they could place this on the counterpick list for doubles only.

Bridge of Eldin

There were many factors leading to this stage being banned, most of them minor by thesmelves but combined led to matches inevitably reaching the time limit nearly 100% of the time. The time limit is in place to keep matches from going on too long, not as a set time for how long a game should take. BoE nearly prevents games at a competitive level from finishing, and this is not good for a tournament environment. This is all on top of Dedede having an easy chain grab in either direction leading to nearly 2/3rds of the cast losing a stock off of one grab.

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For people who want to C/P:

SBR Recommended Ruleset
Super Smash Brothers: Brawl (singles and doubles)

The following list was created by members of the Smash Back Room (SBR). Each rule was debated and voted upon in separate topics. While it is always up to the Tournament Organizers (TO) to determine the rules that best fit their tournaments, we recommend these rules be used as a base guideline to new and experienced TO's alike.

General rules:

• 3 Stock

• 8 minute timer

• Items are set to "off" and "none"

• All sets with the possible exception of winner's finals, loser's finals, and the championship are best of 3 matches (best of 5 and above is recommended for any "finals" matches)

• In the event of a dispute, controller ports will be selected by Rock-Paper-Scissors

• No player may choose a stage they have already won on in that set unless agreed upon by both players.

• In team matches, the ports will be determined in a 1221 fashion; whoever wins the RPS will choose first, then the opposing team will get their ports, and then the teammate of the RPS winner will get the last port.

• If the timer runs out, the victor is determined first by stock and then by percentage.

• Metaknight's Infinite Cape glitch is banned.

• If a game ends with Bowser doing his suicide klaw and it ends in sudden death, the sudden death will be ignored and that game will count as a win for Bowser.

• You are responsible for your own controller and name tag. Any malfunctions or errors that occur are your responsibility, so bring an extra controller if possible and always check to make sure you're using the correct settings BEFORE a match is played. If a match is to be restarted due to controller functions, it must be agreed upon by both parties.

• Any action that can prevent the game from continuing (i.e., freezing, disappearing characters, game reset, etc.) will result in a forfeit of that match for the player that initiated the action. You are responsible for knowing your own character, and must be wary about accidentally triggering one of these effects.

• Stalling is banned.

Stalling: The act of deliberately avoiding any and all conflict so that one may make the game unplayable. Running away from an opponent to reach a better position is not stalling, while doing an infinite grab endlessly against a wall is. Any infinite chain grabs most end quickly after 300% has been reached so as to prevent excessive stalling.


Set format (In Order of Procedure):
1. Opponents choose their characters for the first match *
2. Opponents start the stage striking procedure
3. Each player may announce one stage to be banned for counterpicks of the set
4. The first game is played, using the stage chosen during step 2
5. The loser of the previous match announces the next match's stage from either the Starter Stage List or the Counter Stage List
6. The winner of the previous match chooses their character
7. The loser of the previous match chooses their character
8. Repeat steps 5-7 for all proceeding matches
*Double blind character selection may be called for the first match


Stage Lists

TOs must move stages from the starter/counterpick into either the starter or counterpick categories and must move stages from counterpick/banned into either the counterpick or banned categories.

Stages in the Starter/Counter and Counter/Banned list did not receive 2/3 majority, and therefore you are given the option to put those stages in either category, as we did not come to a consensus on it.

The SBR Recommended rule list uses the stage striking system. In this system, players take turns striking stages from the starter list until only one remains; these stages are not banned and can be counterpicked later in the set. There must be an odd number of starter stages.

Starter
Battlefield
Final Destination
Smashville
Yoshi's Island

Starter/Counter
Castle Siege
Delfino
Halberd
Lylat Cruise
Pokémon Stadium 1

Counter
Brinstar
Corneria
Distant Planet
Frigate Orpheon
Green Hill Zone
Jungle Japes
Luigi's Mansion
Norfair
Pictochat
Pirate Ship
Pokémon Stadium 2
Rainbow Cruise
Yoshi's Island (Pipes)

Counter/Banned
Green Greens
Mario Circuit
Onett
Port Town Aero Dive
Skyworld

Banned
75m
Big Blue
Bridge of Eldin
Flat Zone 2
Hanenbow
Hyrule Temple
Mario Bros.
Mushroomy Kingdom I
Mushroomy Kingdom II
New Pork City
Rumble Falls
Shadow Moses
Spear Pillar
The Summit
Wario Ware

Additional Rules for Double's Play

• Life Stealing is allowed

• Set team attack to ON

• Hanenbow may be moved from Ban to Counterpick for Doubles

Optional Rules

Some rules were discussed in the SBR but were not deemed to be important enough to consider staples to a rule set, or were considered to be too intrusive to be common. We recommended you include any of the following optional rules you deem to be necessary and modify them as needed.

• Port slob picks: On a player's counterpick, that player may opt to redo the port selection process with that player or team picking their port first.

• Resolving Ties: Any games ending in time running out should always be decided by stock, and then percents. If percents are the same or both players die simultaneously, there will be a 1 stock overttime or the sudden death will be played out. The TO needs to decide which of these will be used before the tournament. Bowser's suicide klaw is exempt from this rule.

• Color Blind rule: Should a player have a color-based disability, he or she may request in a teams match to have a specific color for their team. This is so characters such as Lucario or Sonic can be granted the blue team so that there is not unnecessary confusion.

• Wiimotes and Classic Controller users should know to take the batteries out of their controllers after finishing a set; not only will this save battery life, but it prevents accidental intereference and delay for tournament matches.

• Pirated copies of Brawl or modded Wii consoles will not be used for tournament matches.

• The Mages DQ rule: After a match has been called, if a player is two minutes late he will receive a warning. At 4 minutes late, he will be given a loss for the first game of the set. After six minutes, he will be given a loss of the entire set.

• It is recommended to have a station set up specifically for Gamecube controllers; this prevents intereference from wiimotes in future matches, whether intentional or accidental. This is a great way to make sure the finals go smoothly. Alternatively, you could make a station for wiimotes only, but it is recommended to have a GC only station.

Notes

• This list is not meant to be copied and pasted, but instead copied and adjusted to fit each tournaments situation (time limits, regional philosophies, etc.).

• Some of these stages (Port Town, Skyworld) have been traditionally banned. Many of these stages had very fierce debate, the stages position on each list is only indicative of the end result of each debate. Some of these results have been quite surprising. Many of these stages that many banned immediately were put into the counterpick category because the SBR could not see any evidence for banning the stage rather than general distaste, which is not an adequate reason for removing a stage from the game.

• The SBR debated heavily over rule enforcement but decided such decisions are currently too broad to be stated within this recommended rule list. It is recommended a system be in place to deal with disqualifications for players who are late or absent from matches (the Mages DQ rule is a good starting point) and for those who violate the rules. There is a list of optional rules that have been added for your ease of use.

• Players are responsible for knowing the rules. No more than the previous match should be replayed in the event of a rule violation and it is recommended that any disputes be brought promptly and quickly to the TO's attention.

• For larger tournaments pool play should precede double elimination bracket play.

• Wireless controllers should be discouraged because of interference, unreliability (battery life), and time hindrance; it is not advisable to ban them as many new players use them and banning their control scheme makes it difficult for them to participate.

• The semi-final and championship sets should be in at least best of 5 format.

• Drugs and Alcohol should be prohibited at most tournaments due to minor involvement and potential legal issues.

• Any rule-list that closely follows this guideline may include a note in its opening post (suggested beneath the tournaments title in smaller font) that reads "SBR Certified".

I'm pretty happy with the way this turned out. Making the ruleset took so long, but its finally done. I can only hope this helps people make better rulesets and furthers the evolution of the Smash scene.

I see "Bridge of Eldin" on the banned list, but it seems you forgot to add the reasoning about it more then the votes. Thumbs up for the rules though...

Why the hell was Green Greens even considered for ban? There isn't anything remotely broken on that stage.

Sliq said:

Why the hell was Green Greens even considered for ban? There isn't anything remotely broken on that stage.

Click to expand...

Many people in the back room felt that the bombs and blocks falling led to a "random" effect. Once you were on one side, they felt that the opponent had to cross over what could potentially KO them. Many also felt the bombs had too large an effect on the match.

I felt otherwise, as did many others though ^_^

I am not the greatest smasher nor the smartest but why is norfair counterpick ? I am not judging the rules im just asking. When ever i play on that stage i get killed by the lava more than my opponent, but that might be my fault XD.

Congratulations, guys. All of your hard work will no doubt help us TO's out A LOT. I think I speak for the whole competitive community when I say we seriously appreciate and respect you all for putting so much thought and effort into making an official ruleset for Smashboards.

...now all that's left for you to do is discuss the 'ISP' project. I jest, of course.

Overswarm said:

Many people in the back room felt that the bombs and blocks falling led to a "random" effect. Once you were on one side, they felt that the opponent had to cross over what could potentially KO them. Many also felt the bombs had too large an effect on the match.

I felt otherwise, as did many others though ^_^

Click to expand...

Also it was brought up that there are 4 walls, and some people just really hate walls, apparently.

Overswarm said:

Many people in the back room felt that the bombs and blocks falling led to a "random" effect. Once you were on one side, they felt that the opponent had to cross over what could potentially KO them. Many also felt the bombs had too large an effect on the match.

I felt otherwise, as did many others though ^_^

Click to expand...

It's called "don't **** around the blocks."

Ignatius said:

Also it was brought up that there are 4 walls, and some people just really hate walls, apparently.

Click to expand...

I forgot about the Dedede ***gotry, but other walled stages are allowed, so that shouldn't be a big deal.

That's why we went half/half on it and it can go in either category.

Also, you aren't in buffalo, new york.

Overswarm said:

That's why we went half/half on it and it can go in either category.

Also, you aren't in buffalo, new york.

Click to expand...

I am when I'm on the internet.

Sliq said:

I forgot about the Dedede ***gotry, but other walled stages are allowed, so that shouldn't be a big deal.

Click to expand...

I voted banned because the stage is really small and the walls leave you little room to fight while trying to avoid D3's CG. I voted banned on all levels that had walls with no CG-safe areas. On Green Greens, you'd have to jump on the sides and fight in a tiny little area in order to avoid getting CGd, and even then D3 can bthrow you into the bombs for a low % kill.

Otherwise I love the level.

LeeHarris said:

I voted banned because the stage is really small and the walls leave you little room to fight while trying to avoid D3's CG. I voted banned on all levels that had walls with no CG-safe areas. On Green Greens, you'd have to jump on the sides and fight in a tiny little area in order to avoid getting CGd, and even then D3 can bthrow you into the bombs for a low % kill.

Otherwise I love the level.

Click to expand...

D3's CG is a non issue if you pick a character that doesn't get CG'd. Therefor, if someone counter picks you there and plays D3, you could get the smart idea to play someone else on that stage.

Sort of how when people counter picked my Jiggs to Corneria I went Falco because Jiggs blows on that stage, or how I counter picked Jiggs with Link so I wouldn't have to do a ******** Jiggs ditto.

Also, every character can potentially back throw you into a bomb for a low percent KO.

Not that it will help but I voted banned on any stage with walls or a walk-off ledge. Reasoning being that someone shouldn't be forced to switch characters to maintain an equal footing with other players. It might be an indicator of skill, but that's not the type of skill we measure.

I lol'd at the color-blind thing, but I don't know why.

LeeHarris said:

On Green Greens, you'd have to jump on the sides and fight in a tiny little area in order to avoid getting CGd

Click to expand...

Don't forget the two platforms floating above the main island.

I'm not sure if Spear Pillar really deserved a ban. Only Palkia reverses your controls, so you can just ban Palkia's Spear Pillar. The hazards are predictable, and the cave is not a cave of inmortality, you can get stage spiked just by being there with some of the weakest attacks. Not to say that in that zone hazards are unavoidable.

Linko_Ridley said:

Only Palkia reverses your controls, so you can just ban Palkia's Spear Pillar.

Click to expand...

How? That's only possible if you restart every match with his color, and Cresselia's just as annoying.

cjrocker said:

How? That's only possible if you restart every match with his color, and Cresselia's just as annoying.

Click to expand...

Exactly, purple floors=reset. Poor Cress, the one that less hazards cause has no love... :486:

****, no Cress smiley?

^No :English101:, either.

Grunt said:

I lol'd at the color-blind thing, but I don't know why.

Click to expand...

Yes, we cater to the disabled as well. I thought it unusual yet expected that service to the disabled be provided.


I also found the port slob-picks interesting. Was it that hard for developers to base priority on something else other than over non-gaming matters like a controller port?

I noticed that Pictochat did not garner the 2/3 majority needed to force it to be counterpick, but with 4 people saying neutral and 12 saying banned, both positions are less than 1/3 of the votes. Further, it's starred in the vote tally but not in the descriptions. So which is it? Is it absolutely a CP, or could it be banned? Personally, I'd say absolutely CP, but that's just me.

Anyways, other than that, I'd say the stage list is perfect. You guys did a really great job with this.

Linko_Ridley said:

I'm not sure if Spear Pillar really deserved a ban. Only Palkia reverses your controls, so you can just ban Palkia's Spear Pillar. The hazards are predictable, and the cave is not a cave of inmortality, you can get stage spiked just by being there with some of the weakest attacks. Not to say that in that zone hazards are unavoidable.

Click to expand...

The point that most people banned it on, was that it's like a Mini-Hyrule, easy for a character such as Sonic to just run the circle path and avoid contact against many slower characters.

petrie911 said:

I noticed that Pictochat did not garner the 2/3 majority needed to force it to be counterpick, but with 4 people saying neutral and 12 saying banned, both positions are less than 1/3 of the votes. Further, it's starred in the vote tally but not in the descriptions. So which is it? Is it absolutely a CP, or could it be banned? Personally, I'd say absolutely CP, but that's just me.

Anyways, other than that, I'd say the stage list is perfect. You guys did a really great job with this.

Click to expand...

First off, if you think a stage is neutral, you clearly think it's a counterpick as well, sot he 4 added to the counterpick tally would have been 2/3 majority; but we actually had a revote on it anyway. People were a little quick to vote the first time, some points were brought up, so we redid the original poll. However, it looks like the Original Poll results were posted in the topic, not the new results.

Absolutely CP; we did a revote on Pictochat but I had the wrong tally there!

The inclusion of Pokemon Stadium 2 as counterpick suprises me, mostly due to the nature of the wind form. But that's just personal preference over what stages should constitute a ban.

I'll definitely be using this stage list regardless of personal preference, and the recommended ruleset (Modified somewhat of course). You guys did a great job, I'm impressed.

omegawhitemage said:

Not that it will help but I voted banned on any stage with walls or a walk-off ledge. Reasoning being that someone shouldn't be forced to switch characters to maintain an equal footing with other players. It might be an indicator of skill, but that's not the type of skill we measure.

Click to expand...

Then you should ban Dedede because I am forced to not play my main, Bowser, when I vs. a D3 player, and therefor have to switch characters.

Your move OWM.

Is there any reason why stage striking doesn't use the classic "1st pick or next 2" rule we always used in the schoolyard? That way, no matter who wins the toss, each person gets some sort of "advantage."

Sliq said:

Then you should ban Dedede because I am forced to not play my main, Bowser, when I vs. a D3 player, and therefor have to switch characters.

Your move OWM.

Click to expand...

Completely different set of circumstances. I only don't favor stages that give a certain character an advantage. (D3 in this case) The fact that some characters can be CG'd and others can't doesn't mean I'm in favor of banning a certain character. If your character can be CG'd, deal with it. I main ROB and I have to make due with the same problem. If you choose to play a certain character then you do so knowing knowing full well what lays ahead for you in terms of tactics and strategies that will be employed to beat you. If you still stick with a character that can be CG'd, learn to deal with it.

omegawhitemage said:

If your character can be CG'd, deal with it. I main ROB and I have to make due with the same problem.

Click to expand...

Bowser can (essentially) be infinited by DDD, so you don't exactly have the "same problem."

hey well bowser got this!!!

If a game ends with Bowser doing his suicide klaw and it ends in sudden death, the sudden death will be ignored and that game will count as a win for Bowser.

Click to expand...

haha I was actually just going to post that as my favorite part of the ruleset and you guys happened to be talking about the dinosaur...

But really I think that rules the best if you get bowsercided theres no reason you shouldnt lose.

Speaking of that rule, does that rule occur for dedede swallowcides and kirbycides, and any other character that does that to end a game? I assume that it does but I just wanted to make sure. Sorry if this is a stupid question.

I have a small case of colorblindness, and while it's not as extreme as some, I still appreciate the rule, and I'm sure others with a more serious case do too.

Great rules. I agree with almost everything.

Just wondering, what was the discussion Meta Knight's Infinite Dimensional Cape? Was there much dispute? What were the main arguments?

Thanks, SBR.

Subscribed.

Great ruleset so far.

Smooth Criminal

Count said:

Speaking of that rule, does that rule occur for dedede swallowcides and kirbycides, and any other character that does that to end a game? I assume that it does but I just wanted to make sure. Sorry if this is a stupid question.

Click to expand...

No.

The Koopa Klaw of Bowser's only works if Bowser is at a lower %; this means that, should sudden death occur, he would be winning if he had used this move unless his opponent deliberately tried to kill him or herself. The reason we put in the Bowser always wins rule is because of this combined with the fact that Bowser will win under other circumstances.

Kirby and D3's swallowcides are not determined by controller port, and can therefore be determined by % on a consistent basis.

Just wondering, what was the discussion Meta Knight's Infinite Dimensional Cape? Was there much dispute? What were the main arguments?

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It can be done infinitely ("it's hard" isn't an excuse), and the game is essentially put on hold until Metaknight has an advantage. MK could, with good reason, infinite cape in place until his opponent did something to make him vulnerable, and hten repeat the process. It is incredibly difficult to answer how this is stalling, as there is no way we can say "MK, make yourself vulnerable after X seconds", because then MK would just do it for one less second. Plus, we don't have people with stopwatches at every station.

Love it. Great job guys. One question though, does that mean that ICers infinite-grab chains are okay?

Well, I mean when you get to like 150% you can kill them with a smash anyways =S

Thanks! This is good news =)

Overswarm said:

It can be done infinitely ("it's hard" isn't an excuse), and the game is essentially put on hold until Metaknight has an advantage. MK could, with good reason, infinite cape in place until his opponent did something to make him vulnerable, and hten repeat the process. It is incredibly difficult to answer how this is stalling, as there is no way we can say "MK, make yourself vulnerable after X seconds", because then MK would just do it for one less second. Plus, we don't have people with stopwatches at every station.

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So basically the infinite cape is banned regardless of how long it is done?