ROOOOY!
Smash Master
- Joined
- Dec 24, 2006
- Messages
- 3,118
- Location
- Lincolnshire, England.
- NNID
- Gengite
- 3DS FC
- 5456-0280-5804
As Sonic mains, I'm sure there are some moves of Sonic's that you cannot encorporate into your game at all. Hopefully, with a bit of in-depth discussion about each move, we can discover more things about it. Useful talking points may include whether the move is good on the offense or defense, whether it's a move with high range/priority, whether the move is good to punish lag, what characters it's effective against, and whatever else you can think of really.
Hopefully with such discussion we can see when and why to use moves in particular circumstances, and use Sonic's moveset to it's maximum potential.
Sonic Specific Acronyms.
HA = Homing Attack.
Sonic's neutral B move
SC = Spin Charge
Sonic's down B move
SD = Spin Dash
Sonic's Side B move
SDR = Spin Dash Roll
What Spin Charge turns into after the initial charge(s), what Spin Dash turns into after the 'hop'
SDJ = Spin Dash Jump
Jumping out of a SDR, has a hitbox
ASC = Aerial Spin Charge
Down B in the air. Has different properties to a grounded one
ASCSC = Aerial Spin Charge Shield Cancel
An ASC shielded once it hits the floor
SDSC = Spin Dash Shield Cancel
Cancelling the charge of a Spin Dash by putting up a shield
VSDJ = Vertical Spin Dash Jump
Jumping whilst a Spin Dash is charging. Has a hitbox
iSDR = Invincible Spin Dash Roll
Performing a Spindash on a 45 degree slope, the roll retains the invincibilty frames from the initial 'hop' during the roll
Moveset Analysis
Sonic's Jab
First punch:
Hitbox out - frame 3
Damage - 2%
Second Punch:
Hitbox out - frame 10
Damage - 2%
Final Kick:
Hitbox out - frame 20
Damage - 3%
Sonic's jab is a low priority, low range move, as you can see from the hitbox diagram above. On the surface, Sonic's jab combo looks very poor. However, due to the speed of the first punch, it can be pretty good in very close range combat, especially against those characters who have nothing to match that speed, Ganondorf for example.
The fastest way to do the jab combo is not to mash A, just hold it, seriously. The biggest problem with this move is in it's speed and range combined. Yes, the first punch comes out fast and has decent range, but even though the second one comes out fast, it's only going to hit if the opponent is spaced poorly because the range is awful. Combine this with the final kick being slow to come out after the second punch, despite it's decent range, you're still likely to have your jab combo interrupted.
It's not a bad punisher, mostly due to it's speed. It's something you should learn to use on reflex is your opponent is idle/recovering from a laggy attack.
The jab combo is also not bad in ACTUAL combo terms (comboes in Brawl ZOMG! :O)
Strong N-air > Jab x3 is inescapable at a low percent.
Dash attack late hit > Jab x3 is not a combo per-se, but more of a follow up.
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=wIP7QY0anuw
Above is a video demonstrating what is known as a jab lock. Although Sonic is not shown doing it, he can. Simply put, it is where an opponent does not tech the ground when knocked down, and so you can run up to them and repeatedly do a single jab across the floor of the stage at them, inching forward as you do so. It's inescapable unless you screw up. If you think about inflicting 2% a punch (may stale down to 1%) from one end of the stage to the other, finishing it off with a fast but stronger move, it's a nice way to inflict a lot of damage easily, and makes your opponent look really scrubby.
Also
It's something to bear in mind, this. You're obviously not going to pull things like that off consistantly on the same opponent, but try and suprise random noobs with it, lol.
Down Tilt
This move is very useful, and something that I would endorse Sonic players to use more often, especially when the opponent is at lower percents. It has IASA frames, has fairly good range, and does 6% damage.
There are three different ways this move could develop. Use it at very close range and, as dtilt drags you forward, the opponent ends up behind you, where your only option to follow up is a pivoted u/ftilt. The second is at medium range, which is probably the most useful. It pops the opponent up, and leaves the possibilities for follow ups endless. The final hit is where you hit the opponent with the tip of your foot, it pushes opponents away quite far and often causes tripping at lower percents.
However, 6% by itself is nothing to get too excited about. This where follow-ups are important from the dtilt that knocks the opponent upwards infront of you. Some examples are :
D-tilt to Jab combo = 13%
D-tilt to U-tilt = 20%
D-tilt to d-tilt again = 12%
D-tilt to grab = 14-18% (with no pummels)
Dtilt to Grab Release (one pummel) to dtilt to utilt to fair = Max of 43%!
And many more.
Please bear in mind that the success of these follow ups are pretty character dependant. Slow fallers or characters with high acceleration aerial DI like Squirtle will probably find it easier to escape. On the flipside, fast fallers with poor aerial acceleration like Wolf are more susceptable to the follow ups, it also helps if the opponent has slow aerials so they can't disrupt you with attacks of their own.
It's also not too bad for edgeguarding. If you get the dtilt to horizontally push them down off the edge, it sets up fairly nice for a fair/nair/dair.
Now, if you were new to Sonic reading this, you'd be thinking "WOW! Dtilt is awesome!" However, you'd be wrong, there are a few downsides to this move.
1. It has fairly bad start up time, but not horrendous.
2. Due to the forward movement, it's fairly easy to get shield grabbed.
So there we have dtilt, a very good utility move. Despite it's low damage, you can create so much with it.
Also
Forward Tilt
Another good tilt, yet a lot different in usage to dtilt. Where as dtilt was more of a combo starter, ftilt is more of a punisher. It has pretty decent priority. This is one of Sonic's more damaging moves, doing 4% first hit and then pushing them on to the tip of his foot for another 7%. You could just throw it out there for the 7% though, that's still respectable.
This move has a big advantage over dtilt in that you can't really be shield grabbed due to the massive range of it. The last hit also shield pokes pretty well, too. Other advantages include more damage, and less ending lag. This should be primarily be used in spacing and punishing. Ftilt out of a shield clank of your own is probably the best option, because despite jab coming out faster, ftilt is only slightly slower and does more damage.
What I love mostly about ftilt is that, being Sonic's biggest ranged horizontal move (second to ss-fsmash) it completely shuts down characters with range issues on the ground, for example Pit or Mario, who have nothing to match the range.
Up Tilt
Think of utilt as the juggernaut of all his tilts. Doing the most damage out of all of his tilts, this one is broken down into three hits; 3%, 4% and 7%. Having good priority too, it works well against characters who approach aerially. By a very small margin, it's the slowest to come out of all his tilts (by one frame). It's disjointed up above his feet when he flings them above him, which again makes it pretty good for picking characters out of the air.
It can kill midweights off the top of Final Destination unstaled at 155%, but 190% with full DI. If you're fighting someone and they're still alive (bear in mind if they're alive at this percent you suck) throwing out a sure-to-hit utilt may take them by suprise. However, these numbers are pretty high, so if you are wanting to kill with utilt (you weird, weird freak) you'd do best either playing on a level with low ceilings, or a level with platforms to do it on near the top of the level. It should be killing at a lower percent this way, but still, why not just fsmash?
There are a few set-ups for this move: dtilt, dash attack (to pivoted utilt), even a single jab to a utilt.
Not many set ups, huh? This is because the main flaw with this attack is that it's incredibly situational, for two reasons.
1. It's horizontal range sucks, the opponent has to be spaced terribly for this move to actually connect without being set up. It's bad range means that if you misjudge whether or not it's going to hit and you throw it out, your opponent can punish easily with a ranged move.
2. Freaking long ending lag. It's one of Sonic's more laggy attacks. Combine this with number 1, and you can see how situational it is because if you whiff it you should get punished.
If that hasn't put you off the move forever, shame on you. However, this moves main function is to deal with aggressive aerial characters, and it does it well indeed. Combine good priority with disjointed hitbox above him and it beats out a lot of dairs, and beats characters who are appraoching diagonally. Seriously, if I were to nominate one match-up you have to use it in, it would be Mario. It trades hits with Mario's bair, which is his main approach. If you can confine him to the ground with this then you're going to walk all over him because he's balls on the ground.
If you jump-cancel a charged SDR on a hill (like Corneria's fin), you can do a sliding U-tilt that looks just like Falcon's running U-smash, but faster and more...slidy.
Down Smash
Sonic first rolls forwards then backwards before subtly moving forwards and back again. There are three possible chances to hit (the very last movement is just an animation) making this a good move when your opponent attempts to roll or spot dodge. The first hit of this does 12% and is Sonic's second best kill move. It kills at 120% from the centre of Final Destination, and 145% with full DI. It is also Sonic's fastest smash, coming out after 16 frames, and on another note has IASA frames.
The vertical range of this attack is poor, but the horizontal range is pretty decent considering it reaches both in front of and behind him. It makes it extra adept at hitting people that are badly spaced. It's also good for punishing whiffed attacks or landing lag on mistimed aerials if you can predict where they're going to land.
Most of Sonic's attacks revolve around him curling into a ball. Dsmash is one such move. Don't depend on this, but if your opponent is inexperienced against Sonic and can't tell the difference between that and his other similar start-up animation moves, then it can make for some pretty trippy mindgames.
If ever you fight a spotdodge happy opponent, don't just simply throw out a dsmash at close range and hope it hits. Find the rhythm of their spotdodging, charge your dsmash up a little, and when you're confident that you're going to get the timing right then release.
Remember not to stale this move out during the fight. Being Sonic's 2nd strongest kill move, you'll want to keep it fresh just in case you can't land a fsmash.
Also
Up Smash
This move is where Sonic curls up into a little ball...yet again...and rises upwards, having a hitbox the whole time. It does a nice bit of damage in 14% uncharged, though at higher percents it will likely do less. It has invincibilty frames, as far as I know when Sonic is rising and also when he is at the apex of his jump. The part without the invincibility frames has a lot of priority regardless.
Usmash is an interesting move, some people love it, some people hate it, but it has a few applications.
Before discussing them, I'd like to outline some problem with this move :
-Much like the utilt, it has bad ending lag, so if you throw it out and miss, you're getting punished.
- Again like the utilt, usmash has pretty poor horizontal range.
- It's a multi-hit move, and particularly at high percents, it's pretty easy for the opponent to DI out of.
However, like I said before, this move has a fair few uses. Using a hyphen smashed version of this as an approach can be pretty good and rack up damage well as long as you can aim it, and aiming is easiest on characters with big frames like Dedede or Bowser.
Speaking of Dedede, his Inhale is often a concern to Sonic's approach, as he swallows Spindashes/charges or dash attacks or whatever. The invincibilty frames in this move help avoid being swallowed when approaching with him and so Sonic takes no damage and still follows through with the attack. Good stuff.
Another advantage is that when used offensively, it's hard to defend against. It eats shields very well, and due to the fact the hitbox stays out for a long time, opponents often drop their shield before the move is over. In connection with it having a long duration hitbox, this attack is also pretty good to hurt spotdodge abusers, because upsmash stays out longer than anybody's spotdodge in the game.
Due to the high priority/invincibility of the move, it's also pretty good defensively too. It's a decent anti air attack, particularly useful against people with very commited aerial approaches with not great range (GTFO Marth), think of someone like Fox, except with lower priority on their aerials. Infact, I found this attack to be VERY useful against Metaknights when they were shorthopping expecting us to fill out pants with unrelenting grit, just throw one out and watch him DIE.
This move has pretty good vertical range, which makes it pretty adept at catching people stranded on platforms.
Neutral Air
Nair is a move I don't see people using enough of, often because it's forgotten about and fair is used instead because it's quicker, but it's a shame because it's actually a good move. Sonic's 2nd fastest aerial, the hitbox comes out after 5 frames which is pretty cool. This move also does three different amounts of damage, depending on when you hit with it. Part of the beauty of this move is that the hitbox stays out so long, but more about that later on. If you hit with the first few frames, it does 11%, hit with the middle duration of the attack, it does 8%, and if you hit with it quite late it does 5%.
One of the main problems with this move is that it has little range, and as we know; if an aerial has little range, it has little 'priority'. As a reminder of how aerial priority works, as it differs from grounded priority:
If two aerials collide in midair, whichever aerial's hitbox hits the opponent's hurtbox first wins the priority battle and so their move deals damage and knockback.
Where this move shines is that it's useable in a variety of different situations. One such situation is to punish spotdodge abusers. If an opponent is spotdodging in front of you, doing a SH nair at their position will more or less ensure a hit, thanks to the hitbox staying out so long. Even if the opponent sees it coming and rolls away from where you're landing, you probably won't get punished missing except by characters with fast attack speed or long range since nair doesn't have much ending lag at all. Another good use for this is in edgeguarding. Since it comes out fast, doing one out of a spinshot offstage is pretty good for catching opponents unexpectedly. Nair has pretty underrated knockback, and is a pretty good killer offstage. It's also pretty hard to dodge because, as I said before, it's hitbox stays out for ages.
What people seem to neglect is that it's one of Sonic's more damaging aerials, along with his fastest. People don't really use it too much out of a SDJ, and they should. It's better than using a fair (which a lot of people do), as nair is for the most part used less than fair in matches, and so fairs should be used sparingly to avoid becoming stale. It's also a good 11%, which is probably more than you'll get out of fair, too.
Finally, it's a pretty good "OMG OMG OMG GET AWAY" move in the air due to it's speed, it helps break out of troublesome aerial strings of attacks if you know the opponent has nothing to match it in speed. Otherwise, it might get outprioritized, but Sonic's all about taking risks, right?
Down Air
Dair is an interesting move. Interesting in the way that although it is an aerial move, it mostly isn't used on opponents who are in the air. It does 8% damage (making it Sonic's least damaging aerial), has odd range, and debatable priority. When the dair command is issued, Sonic stops in midair for a moment, then shoots down towards the ground stretching his leading foot out at roughly a 25 degree angle the way he is facing. He travels for a bit over a double jumps height, his body a hitbox the whole time.
But what if I hit the ground before the move ends?!?!
Then you get a hell of a lot of landing lag. You have to initiate the attack high up enough so that the dair will already have cancelled by the time you hit the floor. The easiest and most common way to do this is to spring from the ground => dair. This is common in the respect that it can be used as a (rather poor) approach, but usually when the spring is used as an escape tactic, a dair follows so that they can get back down to the ground quickly to resume fighting. This is okay for the most part. However, when you're fighting someone with good reading skills, doing a spring => dair will often result in your opponent camping your dair landing spot, so they can punish you before you can put your shield up in time. There's not really a way to combat this, the only thing I can recommend doing is to used dair from spring sparingly, otherwise you're going to become really predictable/punishable. Also, remember that if you initiate a Fast Fall before the dair, you will be Fast Falling as the attack finishes (unless you've already hit the ground, obviously.)
This move is about as close as Sonic can get to a spike (even though he already has freakin loads on his back) in that it's a semi-spike. This makes it a pretty good gimper when you're offstage. Where the move starts up and he starts to shoot downwards, a little blue aura shows up around his feet, this can semi-spike if the foe is not DIing upwards. You can use a spring afterwards to recover from offstage, just make sure you don't use it when you're too far away to recover, or if you're doing it towards the stage, make sure you don't end getting stuck under a stage lip or something and dying.
It also has oddly high knockback if you're using it close to ground on a grounded person. Here's Tenki explaining a little about it, and also why it's a good spotdodge punishment (other than the fact it has a long lasting hitbox) :
Another useage for this is if you're really being pressured by your opponent. If you're feeling too manly to run away, then SHing and stomping the ground, when your opponent is at a high enough percent, will send them far enough away for them not to punish your landing lag. It's just good to break up your opponents momentum and get out of bad situations. Hell, even if you miss with the SH dair, the sight of a three foot tall blue hedgehog stomping on the ground might leave the opponent paralyzed with fear too much for them to punish you for it.
Forward Air
Fair is a very commonly used move by most Sonic players (except Boxob) and for good reason too. If all 6 hits connect, it does 14% making it Sonic's most damaging aerial, and the hitbox coming out on frame 4 it is also Sonic's fastest. It also has pretty good priority because the hitbox is slightly disjoint in front of his head. The last hit of fair does the knockback. If the opponent is at a high percentage offstage, the knockback on fair is pretty high, which with power and speed makes it an adept offstage killer.
Offstage it's also a good killer in the fact that it can reverse stage spike. If the opponent is "on" Sonic's body during the last hit of fair, the opponent is sent backwards. At a low percent, a dthrow off the edge to Fast Falled fair is a very sexy stage spike. (video to come)
Also at lower percentages, you can SH them and link them together one after the other. Two fairs = 28%. It's basically the easiest way to rack up damage there is. Obviously, this works better on characters with larger frames, like Bowser or Dedede, as all hits will probably connect. On the flipside, smaller characters like Squirtle or Kirby will escape it easier not getting hit by it all. But hey, Sonic's always liked abusing the fatties. As a matter of fact, you don't want to be using this much against characters like Squirtle at all. Being a multihit move, characters with good aerial DI and/or small frames find this move far too easy to DI out of, and you'll probably only land a few hits on it.
It's also very good for pressure. Even on stages that do not benefit Sonic like Battlefield this move shines. It's great for catching people who are stranded on platforms. It's also a pretty good psychological barrier. Being a 6 hit move, being hit by all 6 hits may affect the player, they might feel overwhelmed so start making more mistakes, especially if you start chaining them together. Of course, the ability to stay calm whilst being pressured is player specific, so I wouldn't rely on this trail of thought, it's just something to bear in mind. As well as being a good offensive move, it's also pretty good on the defense. A retreating fair is a challenge for your opponent to work around.
I give this move 4.5 steaks out of 5. Seriously, we're looking at one of Sonic's best moves here, people.
Boxobair
Boxobairing has unlimited potential, but unfortunately very few are able to do it. Despite not being able to do it myself, I feel qualified to write about it since I've been on the recieving end of one a fair few times. It is the art of massively staling out your bair by completely neglecting to use other moves, but somehow boxobairing still seems to be an effective killer.
Infact, the creater of Boxobair only uses three moves in matches:
1. Jumping
2. Boxobairing
3. Masturbating to previous two steps.
This is a moved to be feared.
Back Air
Bair is a really adept killer. Whilst technically not being as strong as fsmash and dsmash in knockback terms, it's still probably a better killer then them both. The advantage to killing with this over killing with the other two is that you can kill with it absolutely anywhere on or off the stage. It also has really snazzy techniques to it :
Boxcutter : Spinshot => Fast Fast Bair
Is one such example, and doing it within range of a woman will sexually excite them, and it'll strike fear into the hearts of men.
In all seriousness though, bair even without all the 'Box' related techniques is one of Sonic's best moves. It hits for 13%, although it has a sourspot for 9%. Bair is a sex-kick. The heel launches the target the other way, but the sour spot comes a moment after Sonic sticks his foot out. Even so, this is Sonic's strongest aerial in terms of damage. This, like quite a few other of Sonic's moves, has a pretty disjointed hitbox, the hitbox is disjointed from Sonic's body. It should be used in killing primarily, you have other options for damage racking if you want to avoid staling the move out. However, if you want to piece some awesome stuff together, try something like a Fast Falled bair to a reversed fsmash on an opponent at a low percent. In fact, a FF bair on an opponent at a low percent opens up quite a few opportunites, like a pivotgrab, or a ftilt for example. It's pretty good for all sorts of tech chases at lower percents, now that I think about it.
Another beauty of bair is it can be used both on the offence and defence. SH retreating bairs are very hard for an opponent to attack with any purchase, just like advancing bairs are pretty hard to defend against. Such are the advantages of being a high priority aerial.
It has a lot of potential offstage as well. Having good knockback, it'll be killing at moderate percents. It's also the best aerial for stage spiking, just for the sheer sexiness of it. It's a pretty notable move to use when edgeguarding a ROB, as his Booster only has limited charge, and so keeping him away from the stage with as many bairs as you can catch him with may actually gimp him. Nevertheless, it's a good edgeguarder, in both damage racking and gimping potential. Also, due to the slight upward trajectory of the knockback, if you bair someone after a spring or just generally from near the ceiling of the level, they're going to die at low percents, even lower if they DI wrongly.
This move isn't all brilliant though. You've got to be careful not to overuse your bair and become predictable with it. For example, with a lot of the more 'aggressive Sonic playstyles' I've seen, after a spindash when they've gone past the enemy the player often jumps and reverses into the enemy for a bair. It often works, but you can get really predictable, and if you overwork it it's going to get anticipated and punished. Another problem with it is that it's actually Sonic's slowest aerial. However, being slow is a small price to pay for how awesome it is to kill with.
Up air
Uair is insane. Very popular among anybody who's good with Sonic, and for good reason too. Although Sonic's second least damaging aerial at 9%, it more than makes up for it in it's other attributes. This is a two hit move, the first for 3%, and the second for 6%. The hitbox comes out after 5 frames, making it a pretty fast and effective move, along with Sonic's joint second fastest aerial.
The first hit is pretty disjoint horizontally, and if SHFFled then briefly after Sonic goes into his 'lull I'm a dizzy upside-down helicopter sonic cuz i landed on ma head' state you can utilt the opponent, which is really nice for 17%. It also works very well as a replacement for a ledge get-up attack, as as his hitbox protrudes so far out from his hurtbox (therefore meaning it has good horizontal priority) you can hit the opponent with it and shouldn't really fear a counter attack.
Disjoint by large distance above it, the second hit hits for 6%. This hit particularly has a lot of uses. For one, it's so disjointed above him that it can consistantly break every characters dair in the game other than the really awkward ones (Dedede's, Lucario's.) It also breaks through thin level obstructions/walls, which again is good if you want a good but of free damage with little risk to yourself.
As for the move itself in general, it often combos into itself when the opponent is at low percents like this :
Spindash -> SDJ -> Uair -> Uair.
Also coming into play at low percents is an upthrow, followed by a uair. Whilst this is generally a pretty good follow-up, you have to be extra wary not to misjudge the fall speed of some of the faster fallers in the game, because if you do it makes it pretty hard to space your uair with an opponent falling on top of you safetly enough not to get damaged yourself.
It also makes for some complete 'wtf?!' kills on your opponent, star KOing some of the heavier characters in the game comfortably at under 100%. Whilst a lot of these star KO's with be spring => uair whilst your opponents above you, please bear in mind that this is pretty easily telegraphed once you start to spring. It allows the opponent to see what you're doing and at least try to counter attack. Be EXTRA aware that you don't get killed doing it yourself, watch for the moves that have straight upwards knockback. It's sad to say that I've been the victim of being star KO'd whilst trying to star KO by Ike's eruption, Kirby's Rock etc. In other words, don't be too eager. If you see a counter attack coming, just airdodge and nair. You probably won't star KO but at least the damage output will be pretty good.
Using this move a lot is encouraged, to the point that you shouldn't really be bothered about staling it out, unless you specifically want to star KO early with it. Whilst this might not make too much sense, it's all quite simple. As the move stales, the knockback decreases, which makes it easier for juggling with.
Homing Attack
Oh dear, it's time for this. I was dreading this write-up because I hate this move so vehemently that I never use it unless I randomly do it by accident. 8% damage, bad start up lag, bad priority, and....interesting range. This move theoretically is long ranged, but the bloody thing never hits. Homing attack always aims for the opponents back, so if they're charging you then it's most likely going to miss and you'll have to endure punishment because of it's long ending lag time. You can cut said starting lag in half for this move by pressing B again halfway through it's start-up. It hits the opponent when it wants to when they're standing still, when it's at it's most 'effective' is at an opponent running away, of if an opponent is above you. It has a curved like trajectory as it's trying to hit the opponents back, so if they're up in the air above you, it's probably not going to go over them and it'll just beast them in the face. And as for the running away opponent...WHO RUNS AWAY FROM SONIC?!
I'm trying to think of some positives for this move and am really struggling. It can be used in punishing stationary characters trying to attack you who are pretty commited to their offense, like Zero Suit Samus firing her Stun Gun or Wario Biting or something, but unless you cut the start up lag in half, you're just going to fail with it and get punished as the opponent has time to counter you. You can recover from offscreen in a bottom corner on Smashville by Homing Attacking a ledge-hanging opponent, I suppose you could use this move to edgeguard, but your opponents going to basically have no reflexes to get hit by this because...
It's really easily avoided. As if the thing never aimed where you wanted it to anyway, if the opponent spot/airdodges or has any invincibility frames at all when this move is released after the charge, then Sonic decides to neglect trying to attack the opponent at all and onstage, finds delight in headbutting the floor. It's even worse offstage. If you Homing Attack to try and recover and your opponent is a poor sport by spotdodging or whatever then you're going to shoot downwards in the way you're facing. This is really annoying. It puts you in like the only bad place possible offstage for Sonic. If you spring back to the stage and you're too close because of it you're going to get either spiked or grabbed out of it and you're going to die.
Onstage it's easy as hell to defend against too. See one coming, most average/bad players will try shield it and the when you bounce off it helpless you'll get an uair/utilt/usmash at you, which is never fun. A good player will move to where Homing Attack would land if they spotdodged, spotdodge there, then punish you with a down smash or forward smash or whatever as you bounce off the floor like a silly floor headbutting hedgehog.
So yeah, don't use this attack much at all, if not never.
Spin Charge
As we've talked about ASC, Spindash and Spincharge endlessly, no more discussion is really needed.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=170844
This thread is a must read if you're thinking about picking up Sonic. I'd highlight the important parts in the first three posts, but to be honest it's worth reading completely.
Spin Dash
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=170844
This thread again. Learn it and instantly become good.
Spring
Spring is one of the most important things in Sonic's arsenal. In fact, I'd say he'd be completely useless without it. It has so many uses and quirks that if you're not using this constantly, you shouldn't even main Sonic.
Obviously, most up B's are used to recover, and Sonic's is no exception. It has great vertical distance and good horizontal distance, and the horizontal distance can be increased if you air dodge or use an aerial, particularly fair, nair, and bair just as you get control over Sonic after he goes out of his unresponsive state. If you combine this with spinshots and Homing Attacks and such to recover, you will soon realise that Sonic probably has the best recovery in the game. As an additional note to offstage play/ledge tactics, it's often a given that Sonic's Spring doesn't sweetspot the edge on the way up. As talked about recently, this is not true, as from the first few frames after Sonic comes off the spring, he can actually grab the edge. It's not got that much use, except it helps Sonic edgestall pretty effectively. Also, if someone is trying to ledgehog you after you use your Spring, you can actually Foot Stool Jump them, so being ledgehogged isn't really a problem.
As a word of caution, Sonic can get grabbed out of his Spring if using it to recover by an opponent onstage. If you are grabbed and the opponent does not pummel you, once you're released you will fall to your death and you can do nothing about it. Be sure not to use this too close the edge as you're rising, or if you want to, then attack out of the Spring with an aerial to be a little safer. The first hit of uair is good, because the hitbox is pretty disjoint to the sides of him.
Normally Sonic's height decelerates to a stop when rising from a spring, then accelerates down to his fall speed, but you can fastfall at the peak of the spring, and if you time it right, you buffer the fastfall so that on the way down it puts you instantly at your fastest descent speed. So if you fastfall right at the peak of your Spring, it actually feels really nice, you boost down a lot faster than expected. Not only that, but you can fastfall during an aerial. So try a Spring > Uair timed well so the peak of your height (and hence your fastfall) comes in between the kicks. This is especially useful if you've risen a bit too high from the spring to chase your opponent off the top, as it brings you down to their level and so you're given a better chance at hitting them and therefore killing them.
Another good use for Spring is to wreck recoveries. Especially at higher percents, Springing somebody whilst they're recovering offstage is Sonic's safest and most effective way to gimp. If we take someone like Falco for example, Spring him whilst he's starting his Up B will, if at a high enough percent, knock him down at such an angle that he can't recover. It also eats up random things like Ness' PK Thunder safetly without the need for you jumping into it damaging yourself. The only problem with the spring is that it's a projectile that is quite easily out prioritized. If you look at someone who's got a particularly weak recovery from below like Mario, Spring would probably not be the best option. Even if you're using it at them when they're far away enough to upB back to the edge safetly, uair comes out fast enough and out prioritizes, and as you can only Spring them once before landing you've just wasted your chance at gimping.
Other offensive uses for this include stopping ledgestalling characters, and this also sets up quite well for jab locks (see jab write-up for information on what they are.)
Spindash hop > FSJ > Spring > Dair > Jab Lock
Is an option, but your opponents would have to not tech the Spring AND be really slow for you to pull this off. Seriously, if you pull this off, once you're done with them please Side Taunt them, it's the only way they'll learn. For most characters, when they're at less than 30% they will be knocked down and so be prone to being jab locked, and a higher percent will send them into that weird 'hitstun slide' like after Dedede's D-throw. With this in mind, you can't use the Spring to send someone from jab lock to death, and so it's main function here is for easy damage racking.
This is also good for setting up star KO's. Either hitting them late with a dash attack then Springing where you're both sent up where upon you u-air them is sexy, and so is just chasing them when you've sent them up towards the top of the screen when they're at a high percent with an up throw or whatever.
However, where this move really shines is on the defense. Unless the chaingrabs are timed frame perfectly (which will happen rarely) it is possible to Spring out of Dedede's and Falco's at very low percents. It's also a brilliant GTFO move, for example if you're in something like Mario's utilt lock, where most characters would get ***** by it, you would only get him by one or two and then you could just Spring away and leave him with 4% damage for his troubles.
As already covered in the dair write-up, one thing you should avoid doing is overusing the Spring. With or without the dair, it's pretty easy to get landing camped and punished, even with a lagless landing.
Finally, one of the most interesting things about this move is that it gives Sonic invincibility frames (i.e. he can't get hurt even when attacked.) As soon as Sonic leaves the Spring until about full hop height, Sonic is invincible. They're pretty useful for getting out of tight spots I guess. And yeah, apparently pulling this face makes you invincible, try it!
Down Throw
Can't think of how to word things >_< I'll come back to this.
Forward Throw
Popular opinion here is that f-throw is the worst of Sonic's throws, and I'd have to agree. Other than a fairly decent 9%, it doesn't bring much else interesting to the table. It is the fastest of Sonic's throws too, but where this move really falls down is that there's a lack of options from it. Opponent's hitstun from the throw is really short, so do it at too low a percentage, and your opponent will fairly easily counter you with an aerial. What makes it easier to counter you from is that it's knockback is really awkward. They're not sent far, but they're sent at about an 80 degree trajectory, and you can't really follow up from it very well.
The only way this move shines is in throw mix-ups, and even that's dependant on what your opponent does. If I were to use an example, it's that if your opponent was in killing percentage range (anywhere above 100%) and you usually use uthrows to get them into killing positions, you could fthrow instead. The correct DI on uthrow is towards Sonic, and so if you randomly fthrow them around 100%~ and they do not react accordingly then they are going to be DI ing incorrectly towards you, which is going to put them in an opportune position for you to kill them (above you) as opposted to them DI ing away out of 'follow-up' range if you had uthrown.
Being fast also has it's advantages too. If you were to take an opponent to Luigi's Mansion for example (wtf are you doing on Luigi's Mansion, freak?) and you were to quickly fthrow them unexpectedly as you'd usually use an actual good throw, they may not tech the lower level's ceiling in time which could set them up fairly handily for jab locks. Pokemon Stadiums windmill is also a good example of a place where you could potentially use this throw to set up a jab lock, but the stages you could use are pretty limited.
So that's fthrow, can be good for mix-up, just don't use it a lot, if at all. Limited in use, and I'd say about as useful as Homing Attack...unless when you fthrow once his foot connects with the opponent you shout "It's gotta be the shoes!" It then does 20% and kills midweights at 90%, but seriously you've gotta do it frame perfect.
Back Throw
Tied with dthrow, bthrow is Sonic's weakest throw, doing only 8%. Unlike dthrow though, you can't really do much from a bthrow at all. Marginally better than fthrow, this throw is completely ruined by DI upwards, with opponents surviving this around 150% when thrown from the edge of levels. So this could be said to be a kill move if the opponent has bad DI, but they'd have to be at a high percentage anyway.
There are very few good things to come from this move, though where it's most applicable is to get the opponents offstage. Considering it's horizontal trajectory and medium knockback, it sets up very well for Sonic's great offstage game. Another use for this is an almighty Box technique!
Boxthrowing : Chaining bthrows on an opponent, though this only works if the opponent doesn't DI, jump, counter attack, or whatever. Still awesome though.
The one match I find bthrowing really useful is against a competant Snake. If the Snake player starts Snake Dashing/Mortar Sliding, simply shield the first hit where he charges into you (the pop-up bit), grab to instant bthrow, which considering bthrow makes you move position by rolling backwards, helps you move out of the way of the falling mortar.
So yeah, bthrow, not much to say about this one. This, much like fthrow, is a window of opportunity you could say, where it's outcomes/follow-ups depend really on what the opponent does.
Up Throw
Up throw is absolutely ridiculous. If it had killing power, it'd be the best up throw in the game, as it is now it's certainly one of the best. Even though it won't be killing until daft percentages like 200% with proper DI, it will be putting your opponent in a very uncomfortable position, towards the ceiling of the stage which sets up nicely for a spring -> uair or even bair will kill if your opponent DI's wrong. Depending on where you do it, like on platforms or wherever, you can be basically setting up for the kill practically guarenteed at low 100%'s or sometimes under for light characters. As highlighted in an earlier move write up, don't be too confident in this set up, as springing into an attack like Ike's Eruption near the ceiling of a stage and dying at a ridiculously low percent makes for some embarrassing epic fail moments.
Up throw shines at the beginning of an opponent's stock though. Being the most damaging upthrow in the game at 12%, it's a good way to rack up damage early on in a match. What emphasises the damage racking is the follow-ups from up throw when your opponent is at 0%. Uthrow -> usmash is unavoidable for most characters, and can do max 26%. Perhaps the most interesting follow up from an up throw though is another upthrow. If you can find a way for your opponent can land in front of you without attacking (say by forcing an airdodge or something) you can simply re-grab the landing for another delicious 12%. There are plenty of ways to help encourage a regrab opportunity; SDSC, empty SH, whatever floats your boat.
In fact, here's a whole list of options from an up throw, taking into account what defensive measures an opponent could take.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=5253352#post5253352
The correct DI for upthrow is down towards Sonic's body. A cool stage to use this on I guess would be Luigi's Mansion. An upthrow, if the opponent doesn't tech a ceiling in the house, could lead to a jablock, which'd be pretty sexy. I honestly can't see anything wrong with up throw. It's Sonic's best throw, if not his best move in the game.
Hopefully with such discussion we can see when and why to use moves in particular circumstances, and use Sonic's moveset to it's maximum potential.
Sonic Specific Acronyms.
HA = Homing Attack.
Sonic's neutral B move
SC = Spin Charge
Sonic's down B move
SD = Spin Dash
Sonic's Side B move
SDR = Spin Dash Roll
What Spin Charge turns into after the initial charge(s), what Spin Dash turns into after the 'hop'
SDJ = Spin Dash Jump
Jumping out of a SDR, has a hitbox
ASC = Aerial Spin Charge
Down B in the air. Has different properties to a grounded one
ASCSC = Aerial Spin Charge Shield Cancel
An ASC shielded once it hits the floor
SDSC = Spin Dash Shield Cancel
Cancelling the charge of a Spin Dash by putting up a shield
VSDJ = Vertical Spin Dash Jump
Jumping whilst a Spin Dash is charging. Has a hitbox
iSDR = Invincible Spin Dash Roll
Performing a Spindash on a 45 degree slope, the roll retains the invincibilty frames from the initial 'hop' during the roll
Moveset Analysis
Sonic's Jab
First punch:
Hitbox out - frame 3
Damage - 2%
Second Punch:
Hitbox out - frame 10
Damage - 2%
Final Kick:
Hitbox out - frame 20
Damage - 3%
Sonic's jab is a low priority, low range move, as you can see from the hitbox diagram above. On the surface, Sonic's jab combo looks very poor. However, due to the speed of the first punch, it can be pretty good in very close range combat, especially against those characters who have nothing to match that speed, Ganondorf for example.
The fastest way to do the jab combo is not to mash A, just hold it, seriously. The biggest problem with this move is in it's speed and range combined. Yes, the first punch comes out fast and has decent range, but even though the second one comes out fast, it's only going to hit if the opponent is spaced poorly because the range is awful. Combine this with the final kick being slow to come out after the second punch, despite it's decent range, you're still likely to have your jab combo interrupted.
It's not a bad punisher, mostly due to it's speed. It's something you should learn to use on reflex is your opponent is idle/recovering from a laggy attack.
The jab combo is also not bad in ACTUAL combo terms (comboes in Brawl ZOMG! :O)
Strong N-air > Jab x3 is inescapable at a low percent.
Dash attack late hit > Jab x3 is not a combo per-se, but more of a follow up.
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=wIP7QY0anuw
Above is a video demonstrating what is known as a jab lock. Although Sonic is not shown doing it, he can. Simply put, it is where an opponent does not tech the ground when knocked down, and so you can run up to them and repeatedly do a single jab across the floor of the stage at them, inching forward as you do so. It's inescapable unless you screw up. If you think about inflicting 2% a punch (may stale down to 1%) from one end of the stage to the other, finishing it off with a fast but stronger move, it's a nice way to inflict a lot of damage easily, and makes your opponent look really scrubby.
Also
Yes, sexy.
It's something to bear in mind, this. You're obviously not going to pull things like that off consistantly on the same opponent, but try and suprise random noobs with it, lol.
Down Tilt
This move is very useful, and something that I would endorse Sonic players to use more often, especially when the opponent is at lower percents. It has IASA frames, has fairly good range, and does 6% damage.
There are three different ways this move could develop. Use it at very close range and, as dtilt drags you forward, the opponent ends up behind you, where your only option to follow up is a pivoted u/ftilt. The second is at medium range, which is probably the most useful. It pops the opponent up, and leaves the possibilities for follow ups endless. The final hit is where you hit the opponent with the tip of your foot, it pushes opponents away quite far and often causes tripping at lower percents.
However, 6% by itself is nothing to get too excited about. This where follow-ups are important from the dtilt that knocks the opponent upwards infront of you. Some examples are :
D-tilt to Jab combo = 13%
D-tilt to U-tilt = 20%
D-tilt to d-tilt again = 12%
D-tilt to grab = 14-18% (with no pummels)
Dtilt to Grab Release (one pummel) to dtilt to utilt to fair = Max of 43%!
And many more.
Please bear in mind that the success of these follow ups are pretty character dependant. Slow fallers or characters with high acceleration aerial DI like Squirtle will probably find it easier to escape. On the flipside, fast fallers with poor aerial acceleration like Wolf are more susceptable to the follow ups, it also helps if the opponent has slow aerials so they can't disrupt you with attacks of their own.
It's also not too bad for edgeguarding. If you get the dtilt to horizontally push them down off the edge, it sets up fairly nice for a fair/nair/dair.
Now, if you were new to Sonic reading this, you'd be thinking "WOW! Dtilt is awesome!" However, you'd be wrong, there are a few downsides to this move.
1. It has fairly bad start up time, but not horrendous.
2. Due to the forward movement, it's fairly easy to get shield grabbed.
So there we have dtilt, a very good utility move. Despite it's low damage, you can create so much with it.
Also
I was there and recorded. PM me if you want the vids.So my mom got invited to a passion party.
Forward Tilt
Another good tilt, yet a lot different in usage to dtilt. Where as dtilt was more of a combo starter, ftilt is more of a punisher. It has pretty decent priority. This is one of Sonic's more damaging moves, doing 4% first hit and then pushing them on to the tip of his foot for another 7%. You could just throw it out there for the 7% though, that's still respectable.
This move has a big advantage over dtilt in that you can't really be shield grabbed due to the massive range of it. The last hit also shield pokes pretty well, too. Other advantages include more damage, and less ending lag. This should be primarily be used in spacing and punishing. Ftilt out of a shield clank of your own is probably the best option, because despite jab coming out faster, ftilt is only slightly slower and does more damage.
What I love mostly about ftilt is that, being Sonic's biggest ranged horizontal move (second to ss-fsmash) it completely shuts down characters with range issues on the ground, for example Pit or Mario, who have nothing to match the range.
Up Tilt
Think of utilt as the juggernaut of all his tilts. Doing the most damage out of all of his tilts, this one is broken down into three hits; 3%, 4% and 7%. Having good priority too, it works well against characters who approach aerially. By a very small margin, it's the slowest to come out of all his tilts (by one frame). It's disjointed up above his feet when he flings them above him, which again makes it pretty good for picking characters out of the air.
It can kill midweights off the top of Final Destination unstaled at 155%, but 190% with full DI. If you're fighting someone and they're still alive (bear in mind if they're alive at this percent you suck) throwing out a sure-to-hit utilt may take them by suprise. However, these numbers are pretty high, so if you are wanting to kill with utilt (you weird, weird freak) you'd do best either playing on a level with low ceilings, or a level with platforms to do it on near the top of the level. It should be killing at a lower percent this way, but still, why not just fsmash?
There are a few set-ups for this move: dtilt, dash attack (to pivoted utilt), even a single jab to a utilt.
Not many set ups, huh? This is because the main flaw with this attack is that it's incredibly situational, for two reasons.
1. It's horizontal range sucks, the opponent has to be spaced terribly for this move to actually connect without being set up. It's bad range means that if you misjudge whether or not it's going to hit and you throw it out, your opponent can punish easily with a ranged move.
2. Freaking long ending lag. It's one of Sonic's more laggy attacks. Combine this with number 1, and you can see how situational it is because if you whiff it you should get punished.
If that hasn't put you off the move forever, shame on you. However, this moves main function is to deal with aggressive aerial characters, and it does it well indeed. Combine good priority with disjointed hitbox above him and it beats out a lot of dairs, and beats characters who are appraoching diagonally. Seriously, if I were to nominate one match-up you have to use it in, it would be Mario. It trades hits with Mario's bair, which is his main approach. If you can confine him to the ground with this then you're going to walk all over him because he's balls on the ground.
If you jump-cancel a charged SDR on a hill (like Corneria's fin), you can do a sliding U-tilt that looks just like Falcon's running U-smash, but faster and more...slidy.
Napi is a pretty cool guy and seems to know a lot, we should listen to him more.
Down Smash
Sonic first rolls forwards then backwards before subtly moving forwards and back again. There are three possible chances to hit (the very last movement is just an animation) making this a good move when your opponent attempts to roll or spot dodge. The first hit of this does 12% and is Sonic's second best kill move. It kills at 120% from the centre of Final Destination, and 145% with full DI. It is also Sonic's fastest smash, coming out after 16 frames, and on another note has IASA frames.
The vertical range of this attack is poor, but the horizontal range is pretty decent considering it reaches both in front of and behind him. It makes it extra adept at hitting people that are badly spaced. It's also good for punishing whiffed attacks or landing lag on mistimed aerials if you can predict where they're going to land.
Most of Sonic's attacks revolve around him curling into a ball. Dsmash is one such move. Don't depend on this, but if your opponent is inexperienced against Sonic and can't tell the difference between that and his other similar start-up animation moves, then it can make for some pretty trippy mindgames.
If ever you fight a spotdodge happy opponent, don't just simply throw out a dsmash at close range and hope it hits. Find the rhythm of their spotdodging, charge your dsmash up a little, and when you're confident that you're going to get the timing right then release.
Remember not to stale this move out during the fight. Being Sonic's 2nd strongest kill move, you'll want to keep it fresh just in case you can't land a fsmash.
Also
Thankyou Tenki for covering my lazy ass.
Up Smash
This move is where Sonic curls up into a little ball...yet again...and rises upwards, having a hitbox the whole time. It does a nice bit of damage in 14% uncharged, though at higher percents it will likely do less. It has invincibilty frames, as far as I know when Sonic is rising and also when he is at the apex of his jump. The part without the invincibility frames has a lot of priority regardless.
Usmash is an interesting move, some people love it, some people hate it, but it has a few applications.
Before discussing them, I'd like to outline some problem with this move :
-Much like the utilt, it has bad ending lag, so if you throw it out and miss, you're getting punished.
- Again like the utilt, usmash has pretty poor horizontal range.
- It's a multi-hit move, and particularly at high percents, it's pretty easy for the opponent to DI out of.
However, like I said before, this move has a fair few uses. Using a hyphen smashed version of this as an approach can be pretty good and rack up damage well as long as you can aim it, and aiming is easiest on characters with big frames like Dedede or Bowser.
Speaking of Dedede, his Inhale is often a concern to Sonic's approach, as he swallows Spindashes/charges or dash attacks or whatever. The invincibilty frames in this move help avoid being swallowed when approaching with him and so Sonic takes no damage and still follows through with the attack. Good stuff.
Another advantage is that when used offensively, it's hard to defend against. It eats shields very well, and due to the fact the hitbox stays out for a long time, opponents often drop their shield before the move is over. In connection with it having a long duration hitbox, this attack is also pretty good to hurt spotdodge abusers, because upsmash stays out longer than anybody's spotdodge in the game.
Due to the high priority/invincibility of the move, it's also pretty good defensively too. It's a decent anti air attack, particularly useful against people with very commited aerial approaches with not great range (GTFO Marth), think of someone like Fox, except with lower priority on their aerials. Infact, I found this attack to be VERY useful against Metaknights when they were shorthopping expecting us to fill out pants with unrelenting grit, just throw one out and watch him DIE.
This move has pretty good vertical range, which makes it pretty adept at catching people stranded on platforms.
Neutral Air
Nair is a move I don't see people using enough of, often because it's forgotten about and fair is used instead because it's quicker, but it's a shame because it's actually a good move. Sonic's 2nd fastest aerial, the hitbox comes out after 5 frames which is pretty cool. This move also does three different amounts of damage, depending on when you hit with it. Part of the beauty of this move is that the hitbox stays out so long, but more about that later on. If you hit with the first few frames, it does 11%, hit with the middle duration of the attack, it does 8%, and if you hit with it quite late it does 5%.
One of the main problems with this move is that it has little range, and as we know; if an aerial has little range, it has little 'priority'. As a reminder of how aerial priority works, as it differs from grounded priority:
If two aerials collide in midair, whichever aerial's hitbox hits the opponent's hurtbox first wins the priority battle and so their move deals damage and knockback.
Where this move shines is that it's useable in a variety of different situations. One such situation is to punish spotdodge abusers. If an opponent is spotdodging in front of you, doing a SH nair at their position will more or less ensure a hit, thanks to the hitbox staying out so long. Even if the opponent sees it coming and rolls away from where you're landing, you probably won't get punished missing except by characters with fast attack speed or long range since nair doesn't have much ending lag at all. Another good use for this is in edgeguarding. Since it comes out fast, doing one out of a spinshot offstage is pretty good for catching opponents unexpectedly. Nair has pretty underrated knockback, and is a pretty good killer offstage. It's also pretty hard to dodge because, as I said before, it's hitbox stays out for ages.
What people seem to neglect is that it's one of Sonic's more damaging aerials, along with his fastest. People don't really use it too much out of a SDJ, and they should. It's better than using a fair (which a lot of people do), as nair is for the most part used less than fair in matches, and so fairs should be used sparingly to avoid becoming stale. It's also a good 11%, which is probably more than you'll get out of fair, too.
Finally, it's a pretty good "OMG OMG OMG GET AWAY" move in the air due to it's speed, it helps break out of troublesome aerial strings of attacks if you know the opponent has nothing to match it in speed. Otherwise, it might get outprioritized, but Sonic's all about taking risks, right?
Down Air
Dair is an interesting move. Interesting in the way that although it is an aerial move, it mostly isn't used on opponents who are in the air. It does 8% damage (making it Sonic's least damaging aerial), has odd range, and debatable priority. When the dair command is issued, Sonic stops in midair for a moment, then shoots down towards the ground stretching his leading foot out at roughly a 25 degree angle the way he is facing. He travels for a bit over a double jumps height, his body a hitbox the whole time.
But what if I hit the ground before the move ends?!?!
Then you get a hell of a lot of landing lag. You have to initiate the attack high up enough so that the dair will already have cancelled by the time you hit the floor. The easiest and most common way to do this is to spring from the ground => dair. This is common in the respect that it can be used as a (rather poor) approach, but usually when the spring is used as an escape tactic, a dair follows so that they can get back down to the ground quickly to resume fighting. This is okay for the most part. However, when you're fighting someone with good reading skills, doing a spring => dair will often result in your opponent camping your dair landing spot, so they can punish you before you can put your shield up in time. There's not really a way to combat this, the only thing I can recommend doing is to used dair from spring sparingly, otherwise you're going to become really predictable/punishable. Also, remember that if you initiate a Fast Fall before the dair, you will be Fast Falling as the attack finishes (unless you've already hit the ground, obviously.)
This move is about as close as Sonic can get to a spike (even though he already has freakin loads on his back) in that it's a semi-spike. This makes it a pretty good gimper when you're offstage. Where the move starts up and he starts to shoot downwards, a little blue aura shows up around his feet, this can semi-spike if the foe is not DIing upwards. You can use a spring afterwards to recover from offstage, just make sure you don't use it when you're too far away to recover, or if you're doing it towards the stage, make sure you don't end getting stuck under a stage lip or something and dying.
It also has oddly high knockback if you're using it close to ground on a grounded person. Here's Tenki explaining a little about it, and also why it's a good spotdodge punishment (other than the fact it has a long lasting hitbox) :
On the surface, doing a 'laggy' dair wouldn't make much sense, it's basically asking to be punished. However, this kind of dair has a few uses. It's often used, as already outlined, as a punisher. It could be used to punish laggy attacks, but I can think of better attacks to punish the enemy with in most situations. Infact, the only situation I could invision this being used as a punisher is if you're in the air and for some reason your opponent throws out a laggy attack. If Fast Falling a different aerial wouldn't be fast enough, a dair would be good I guess.
Another useage for this is if you're really being pressured by your opponent. If you're feeling too manly to run away, then SHing and stomping the ground, when your opponent is at a high enough percent, will send them far enough away for them not to punish your landing lag. It's just good to break up your opponents momentum and get out of bad situations. Hell, even if you miss with the SH dair, the sight of a three foot tall blue hedgehog stomping on the ground might leave the opponent paralyzed with fear too much for them to punish you for it.
Forward Air
Fair is a very commonly used move by most Sonic players (except Boxob) and for good reason too. If all 6 hits connect, it does 14% making it Sonic's most damaging aerial, and the hitbox coming out on frame 4 it is also Sonic's fastest. It also has pretty good priority because the hitbox is slightly disjoint in front of his head. The last hit of fair does the knockback. If the opponent is at a high percentage offstage, the knockback on fair is pretty high, which with power and speed makes it an adept offstage killer.
Offstage it's also a good killer in the fact that it can reverse stage spike. If the opponent is "on" Sonic's body during the last hit of fair, the opponent is sent backwards. At a low percent, a dthrow off the edge to Fast Falled fair is a very sexy stage spike. (video to come)
Also at lower percentages, you can SH them and link them together one after the other. Two fairs = 28%. It's basically the easiest way to rack up damage there is. Obviously, this works better on characters with larger frames, like Bowser or Dedede, as all hits will probably connect. On the flipside, smaller characters like Squirtle or Kirby will escape it easier not getting hit by it all. But hey, Sonic's always liked abusing the fatties. As a matter of fact, you don't want to be using this much against characters like Squirtle at all. Being a multihit move, characters with good aerial DI and/or small frames find this move far too easy to DI out of, and you'll probably only land a few hits on it.
It's also very good for pressure. Even on stages that do not benefit Sonic like Battlefield this move shines. It's great for catching people who are stranded on platforms. It's also a pretty good psychological barrier. Being a 6 hit move, being hit by all 6 hits may affect the player, they might feel overwhelmed so start making more mistakes, especially if you start chaining them together. Of course, the ability to stay calm whilst being pressured is player specific, so I wouldn't rely on this trail of thought, it's just something to bear in mind. As well as being a good offensive move, it's also pretty good on the defense. A retreating fair is a challenge for your opponent to work around.
I give this move 4.5 steaks out of 5. Seriously, we're looking at one of Sonic's best moves here, people.
Boxobair
Boxobairing has unlimited potential, but unfortunately very few are able to do it. Despite not being able to do it myself, I feel qualified to write about it since I've been on the recieving end of one a fair few times. It is the art of massively staling out your bair by completely neglecting to use other moves, but somehow boxobairing still seems to be an effective killer.
Infact, the creater of Boxobair only uses three moves in matches:
1. Jumping
2. Boxobairing
3. Masturbating to previous two steps.
This is a moved to be feared.
Back Air
Bair is a really adept killer. Whilst technically not being as strong as fsmash and dsmash in knockback terms, it's still probably a better killer then them both. The advantage to killing with this over killing with the other two is that you can kill with it absolutely anywhere on or off the stage. It also has really snazzy techniques to it :
Boxcutter : Spinshot => Fast Fast Bair
Is one such example, and doing it within range of a woman will sexually excite them, and it'll strike fear into the hearts of men.
In all seriousness though, bair even without all the 'Box' related techniques is one of Sonic's best moves. It hits for 13%, although it has a sourspot for 9%. Bair is a sex-kick. The heel launches the target the other way, but the sour spot comes a moment after Sonic sticks his foot out. Even so, this is Sonic's strongest aerial in terms of damage. This, like quite a few other of Sonic's moves, has a pretty disjointed hitbox, the hitbox is disjointed from Sonic's body. It should be used in killing primarily, you have other options for damage racking if you want to avoid staling the move out. However, if you want to piece some awesome stuff together, try something like a Fast Falled bair to a reversed fsmash on an opponent at a low percent. In fact, a FF bair on an opponent at a low percent opens up quite a few opportunites, like a pivotgrab, or a ftilt for example. It's pretty good for all sorts of tech chases at lower percents, now that I think about it.
Another beauty of bair is it can be used both on the offence and defence. SH retreating bairs are very hard for an opponent to attack with any purchase, just like advancing bairs are pretty hard to defend against. Such are the advantages of being a high priority aerial.
It has a lot of potential offstage as well. Having good knockback, it'll be killing at moderate percents. It's also the best aerial for stage spiking, just for the sheer sexiness of it. It's a pretty notable move to use when edgeguarding a ROB, as his Booster only has limited charge, and so keeping him away from the stage with as many bairs as you can catch him with may actually gimp him. Nevertheless, it's a good edgeguarder, in both damage racking and gimping potential. Also, due to the slight upward trajectory of the knockback, if you bair someone after a spring or just generally from near the ceiling of the level, they're going to die at low percents, even lower if they DI wrongly.
This move isn't all brilliant though. You've got to be careful not to overuse your bair and become predictable with it. For example, with a lot of the more 'aggressive Sonic playstyles' I've seen, after a spindash when they've gone past the enemy the player often jumps and reverses into the enemy for a bair. It often works, but you can get really predictable, and if you overwork it it's going to get anticipated and punished. Another problem with it is that it's actually Sonic's slowest aerial. However, being slow is a small price to pay for how awesome it is to kill with.
Up air
Uair is insane. Very popular among anybody who's good with Sonic, and for good reason too. Although Sonic's second least damaging aerial at 9%, it more than makes up for it in it's other attributes. This is a two hit move, the first for 3%, and the second for 6%. The hitbox comes out after 5 frames, making it a pretty fast and effective move, along with Sonic's joint second fastest aerial.
The first hit is pretty disjoint horizontally, and if SHFFled then briefly after Sonic goes into his 'lull I'm a dizzy upside-down helicopter sonic cuz i landed on ma head' state you can utilt the opponent, which is really nice for 17%. It also works very well as a replacement for a ledge get-up attack, as as his hitbox protrudes so far out from his hurtbox (therefore meaning it has good horizontal priority) you can hit the opponent with it and shouldn't really fear a counter attack.
Disjoint by large distance above it, the second hit hits for 6%. This hit particularly has a lot of uses. For one, it's so disjointed above him that it can consistantly break every characters dair in the game other than the really awkward ones (Dedede's, Lucario's.) It also breaks through thin level obstructions/walls, which again is good if you want a good but of free damage with little risk to yourself.
As for the move itself in general, it often combos into itself when the opponent is at low percents like this :
Spindash -> SDJ -> Uair -> Uair.
Also coming into play at low percents is an upthrow, followed by a uair. Whilst this is generally a pretty good follow-up, you have to be extra wary not to misjudge the fall speed of some of the faster fallers in the game, because if you do it makes it pretty hard to space your uair with an opponent falling on top of you safetly enough not to get damaged yourself.
It also makes for some complete 'wtf?!' kills on your opponent, star KOing some of the heavier characters in the game comfortably at under 100%. Whilst a lot of these star KO's with be spring => uair whilst your opponents above you, please bear in mind that this is pretty easily telegraphed once you start to spring. It allows the opponent to see what you're doing and at least try to counter attack. Be EXTRA aware that you don't get killed doing it yourself, watch for the moves that have straight upwards knockback. It's sad to say that I've been the victim of being star KO'd whilst trying to star KO by Ike's eruption, Kirby's Rock etc. In other words, don't be too eager. If you see a counter attack coming, just airdodge and nair. You probably won't star KO but at least the damage output will be pretty good.
Using this move a lot is encouraged, to the point that you shouldn't really be bothered about staling it out, unless you specifically want to star KO early with it. Whilst this might not make too much sense, it's all quite simple. As the move stales, the knockback decreases, which makes it easier for juggling with.
Homing Attack
Oh dear, it's time for this. I was dreading this write-up because I hate this move so vehemently that I never use it unless I randomly do it by accident. 8% damage, bad start up lag, bad priority, and....interesting range. This move theoretically is long ranged, but the bloody thing never hits. Homing attack always aims for the opponents back, so if they're charging you then it's most likely going to miss and you'll have to endure punishment because of it's long ending lag time. You can cut said starting lag in half for this move by pressing B again halfway through it's start-up. It hits the opponent when it wants to when they're standing still, when it's at it's most 'effective' is at an opponent running away, of if an opponent is above you. It has a curved like trajectory as it's trying to hit the opponents back, so if they're up in the air above you, it's probably not going to go over them and it'll just beast them in the face. And as for the running away opponent...WHO RUNS AWAY FROM SONIC?!
I'm trying to think of some positives for this move and am really struggling. It can be used in punishing stationary characters trying to attack you who are pretty commited to their offense, like Zero Suit Samus firing her Stun Gun or Wario Biting or something, but unless you cut the start up lag in half, you're just going to fail with it and get punished as the opponent has time to counter you. You can recover from offscreen in a bottom corner on Smashville by Homing Attacking a ledge-hanging opponent, I suppose you could use this move to edgeguard, but your opponents going to basically have no reflexes to get hit by this because...
It's really easily avoided. As if the thing never aimed where you wanted it to anyway, if the opponent spot/airdodges or has any invincibility frames at all when this move is released after the charge, then Sonic decides to neglect trying to attack the opponent at all and onstage, finds delight in headbutting the floor. It's even worse offstage. If you Homing Attack to try and recover and your opponent is a poor sport by spotdodging or whatever then you're going to shoot downwards in the way you're facing. This is really annoying. It puts you in like the only bad place possible offstage for Sonic. If you spring back to the stage and you're too close because of it you're going to get either spiked or grabbed out of it and you're going to die.
Onstage it's easy as hell to defend against too. See one coming, most average/bad players will try shield it and the when you bounce off it helpless you'll get an uair/utilt/usmash at you, which is never fun. A good player will move to where Homing Attack would land if they spotdodged, spotdodge there, then punish you with a down smash or forward smash or whatever as you bounce off the floor like a silly floor headbutting hedgehog.
So yeah, don't use this attack much at all, if not never.
Spin Charge
As we've talked about ASC, Spindash and Spincharge endlessly, no more discussion is really needed.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=170844
This thread is a must read if you're thinking about picking up Sonic. I'd highlight the important parts in the first three posts, but to be honest it's worth reading completely.
Spin Dash
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=170844
This thread again. Learn it and instantly become good.
Spring
Spring is one of the most important things in Sonic's arsenal. In fact, I'd say he'd be completely useless without it. It has so many uses and quirks that if you're not using this constantly, you shouldn't even main Sonic.
Obviously, most up B's are used to recover, and Sonic's is no exception. It has great vertical distance and good horizontal distance, and the horizontal distance can be increased if you air dodge or use an aerial, particularly fair, nair, and bair just as you get control over Sonic after he goes out of his unresponsive state. If you combine this with spinshots and Homing Attacks and such to recover, you will soon realise that Sonic probably has the best recovery in the game. As an additional note to offstage play/ledge tactics, it's often a given that Sonic's Spring doesn't sweetspot the edge on the way up. As talked about recently, this is not true, as from the first few frames after Sonic comes off the spring, he can actually grab the edge. It's not got that much use, except it helps Sonic edgestall pretty effectively. Also, if someone is trying to ledgehog you after you use your Spring, you can actually Foot Stool Jump them, so being ledgehogged isn't really a problem.
As a word of caution, Sonic can get grabbed out of his Spring if using it to recover by an opponent onstage. If you are grabbed and the opponent does not pummel you, once you're released you will fall to your death and you can do nothing about it. Be sure not to use this too close the edge as you're rising, or if you want to, then attack out of the Spring with an aerial to be a little safer. The first hit of uair is good, because the hitbox is pretty disjoint to the sides of him.
Normally Sonic's height decelerates to a stop when rising from a spring, then accelerates down to his fall speed, but you can fastfall at the peak of the spring, and if you time it right, you buffer the fastfall so that on the way down it puts you instantly at your fastest descent speed. So if you fastfall right at the peak of your Spring, it actually feels really nice, you boost down a lot faster than expected. Not only that, but you can fastfall during an aerial. So try a Spring > Uair timed well so the peak of your height (and hence your fastfall) comes in between the kicks. This is especially useful if you've risen a bit too high from the spring to chase your opponent off the top, as it brings you down to their level and so you're given a better chance at hitting them and therefore killing them.
Another good use for Spring is to wreck recoveries. Especially at higher percents, Springing somebody whilst they're recovering offstage is Sonic's safest and most effective way to gimp. If we take someone like Falco for example, Spring him whilst he's starting his Up B will, if at a high enough percent, knock him down at such an angle that he can't recover. It also eats up random things like Ness' PK Thunder safetly without the need for you jumping into it damaging yourself. The only problem with the spring is that it's a projectile that is quite easily out prioritized. If you look at someone who's got a particularly weak recovery from below like Mario, Spring would probably not be the best option. Even if you're using it at them when they're far away enough to upB back to the edge safetly, uair comes out fast enough and out prioritizes, and as you can only Spring them once before landing you've just wasted your chance at gimping.
Other offensive uses for this include stopping ledgestalling characters, and this also sets up quite well for jab locks (see jab write-up for information on what they are.)
Spindash hop > FSJ > Spring > Dair > Jab Lock
Is an option, but your opponents would have to not tech the Spring AND be really slow for you to pull this off. Seriously, if you pull this off, once you're done with them please Side Taunt them, it's the only way they'll learn. For most characters, when they're at less than 30% they will be knocked down and so be prone to being jab locked, and a higher percent will send them into that weird 'hitstun slide' like after Dedede's D-throw. With this in mind, you can't use the Spring to send someone from jab lock to death, and so it's main function here is for easy damage racking.
This is also good for setting up star KO's. Either hitting them late with a dash attack then Springing where you're both sent up where upon you u-air them is sexy, and so is just chasing them when you've sent them up towards the top of the screen when they're at a high percent with an up throw or whatever.
However, where this move really shines is on the defense. Unless the chaingrabs are timed frame perfectly (which will happen rarely) it is possible to Spring out of Dedede's and Falco's at very low percents. It's also a brilliant GTFO move, for example if you're in something like Mario's utilt lock, where most characters would get ***** by it, you would only get him by one or two and then you could just Spring away and leave him with 4% damage for his troubles.
As already covered in the dair write-up, one thing you should avoid doing is overusing the Spring. With or without the dair, it's pretty easy to get landing camped and punished, even with a lagless landing.
Finally, one of the most interesting things about this move is that it gives Sonic invincibility frames (i.e. he can't get hurt even when attacked.) As soon as Sonic leaves the Spring until about full hop height, Sonic is invincible. They're pretty useful for getting out of tight spots I guess. And yeah, apparently pulling this face makes you invincible, try it!
Down Throw
Can't think of how to word things >_< I'll come back to this.
Forward Throw
Popular opinion here is that f-throw is the worst of Sonic's throws, and I'd have to agree. Other than a fairly decent 9%, it doesn't bring much else interesting to the table. It is the fastest of Sonic's throws too, but where this move really falls down is that there's a lack of options from it. Opponent's hitstun from the throw is really short, so do it at too low a percentage, and your opponent will fairly easily counter you with an aerial. What makes it easier to counter you from is that it's knockback is really awkward. They're not sent far, but they're sent at about an 80 degree trajectory, and you can't really follow up from it very well.
The only way this move shines is in throw mix-ups, and even that's dependant on what your opponent does. If I were to use an example, it's that if your opponent was in killing percentage range (anywhere above 100%) and you usually use uthrows to get them into killing positions, you could fthrow instead. The correct DI on uthrow is towards Sonic, and so if you randomly fthrow them around 100%~ and they do not react accordingly then they are going to be DI ing incorrectly towards you, which is going to put them in an opportune position for you to kill them (above you) as opposted to them DI ing away out of 'follow-up' range if you had uthrown.
Being fast also has it's advantages too. If you were to take an opponent to Luigi's Mansion for example (
So that's fthrow, can be good for mix-up, just don't use it a lot, if at all. Limited in use, and I'd say about as useful as Homing Attack...unless when you fthrow once his foot connects with the opponent you shout "It's gotta be the shoes!" It then does 20% and kills midweights at 90%, but seriously you've gotta do it frame perfect.
Back Throw
Tied with dthrow, bthrow is Sonic's weakest throw, doing only 8%. Unlike dthrow though, you can't really do much from a bthrow at all. Marginally better than fthrow, this throw is completely ruined by DI upwards, with opponents surviving this around 150% when thrown from the edge of levels. So this could be said to be a kill move if the opponent has bad DI, but they'd have to be at a high percentage anyway.
There are very few good things to come from this move, though where it's most applicable is to get the opponents offstage. Considering it's horizontal trajectory and medium knockback, it sets up very well for Sonic's great offstage game. Another use for this is an almighty Box technique!
Boxthrowing : Chaining bthrows on an opponent, though this only works if the opponent doesn't DI, jump, counter attack, or whatever. Still awesome though.
The one match I find bthrowing really useful is against a competant Snake. If the Snake player starts Snake Dashing/Mortar Sliding, simply shield the first hit where he charges into you (the pop-up bit), grab to instant bthrow, which considering bthrow makes you move position by rolling backwards, helps you move out of the way of the falling mortar.
So yeah, bthrow, not much to say about this one. This, much like fthrow, is a window of opportunity you could say, where it's outcomes/follow-ups depend really on what the opponent does.
Up Throw
Up throw is absolutely ridiculous. If it had killing power, it'd be the best up throw in the game, as it is now it's certainly one of the best. Even though it won't be killing until daft percentages like 200% with proper DI, it will be putting your opponent in a very uncomfortable position, towards the ceiling of the stage which sets up nicely for a spring -> uair or even bair will kill if your opponent DI's wrong. Depending on where you do it, like on platforms or wherever, you can be basically setting up for the kill practically guarenteed at low 100%'s or sometimes under for light characters. As highlighted in an earlier move write up, don't be too confident in this set up, as springing into an attack like Ike's Eruption near the ceiling of a stage and dying at a ridiculously low percent makes for some embarrassing epic fail moments.
Up throw shines at the beginning of an opponent's stock though. Being the most damaging upthrow in the game at 12%, it's a good way to rack up damage early on in a match. What emphasises the damage racking is the follow-ups from up throw when your opponent is at 0%. Uthrow -> usmash is unavoidable for most characters, and can do max 26%. Perhaps the most interesting follow up from an up throw though is another upthrow. If you can find a way for your opponent can land in front of you without attacking (say by forcing an airdodge or something) you can simply re-grab the landing for another delicious 12%. There are plenty of ways to help encourage a regrab opportunity; SDSC, empty SH, whatever floats your boat.
In fact, here's a whole list of options from an up throw, taking into account what defensive measures an opponent could take.
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?p=5253352#post5253352
The correct DI for upthrow is down towards Sonic's body. A cool stage to use this on I guess would be Luigi's Mansion. An upthrow, if the opponent doesn't tech a ceiling in the house, could lead to a jablock, which'd be pretty sexy. I honestly can't see anything wrong with up throw. It's Sonic's best throw, if not his best move in the game.
gotta try that.
