Match-up discussion #27: Lucas

K, let's do Lucas now.

From now on, I assume the match-up's will be rather boring, since most of them are covered in other characters threads already. Lucas has already been done on the Lucas boards and the community agrees that it's 60:40 Wolfs favour. You can read it if you want...whatever

Discuss

Wolfs favor 60:40.

Ussually Lucas lvl9 CPU's are the easiest for me. they have a crappy recovery so i just dodge them. But it may be different from real players.

It's definitely different with real players <_<

Gheb_01 said:

It's definitely different with real players <_<

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Yea my friend is a Lucas mainer but he doesn't want to go online...

60:40 for Wolf. NEXT!!!

This is one of, if not my most well understood Wolf matchup due to the fact that my brother mains him and I main Wolf. I think I have played Lucas more than any other character.

I would agree with the 60:40 matchup. Bair is excellent against Lucas, although one thing you do have to remember is his tether throw, so he can shield grab it no matter how well you space it. His fsmash is dangerous but his others aren't very bad due to their slow startup. You've generally got better range in the air than him, and if he screws up it's incredibly easy to punish him with fsmash. I usually keep my back to him most of the match because he has a very difficult time approaching due to bair and fsmash.

all I can think of at the moment.

The only reason it's 40-60 in that thread is because I didn't have a good argument at the time.


I honestly thought it was 45-55, but alas, I had to bow to the majority.



Please, at least have a real debate, so I can finally stop worrying about this particular matchup.

whaaaaaatttttt

I totally meant to post in another thread, sorry for spam post X_X

EDIT: I'll make this post be me asking Blackbelt, do you have a good argument now? I'd be interested in hearing it if so

Well, I admit I haven't been really concentrating on this particular matchup, so I admit that I haven't been really thinking of arguments, as it were.


I mean, I know that Wolf is heavy enough and fast fally enough to get Naired for lots of damage, and that Lucas' jab combo is faster than anything Wolf has.

Also, while Lucas has lots of laggy moves, he also anough good moves with very little after lag, as to avoid the FSmash punishment.


ultimately, the thing that would give Wolf the advantage is the lagless Bair, and, while I admit that it's not 100% gaurenteed, I was messing around, and I think Lucas' Fair might beat it.


Like I said, I've been focusing on other stuff.

Wolf has more mobility in the air, than most other characters. Beating his bair does not only depend on the properties of the enemy attack but also their mobility in the air. A slow moving opponent can barely scratch wolf in the air, since he can just DI away after using bair. 0 lag fair is also very bad for Lucas, since it comes out almost instantly and subdues Lucas aerial game for a good part. Lucas isn't bad in the air at all, but I'm not sure, whether he can beat Wolfs aerials. On the ground...well the jab combo from Lucas requiers perfect spacing, since Wolf outranges Lucas easily on the ground. The best thing vs Wolf is PK Fire spam. If the Wolf is stupid enough to reflect it, you get a free hit.

The reason why I give it a 60:40 is because Wolf wins on the ground and is at least tied in the air with Lucas, who is also easier finished than Wolf. Wolfs main concern is PK Fire spacing + psi magnet, since only fsmash can get through and is thus easily predicted. Lucas also can royally screw Wolfs recovery. These are the factors i took into account. Feel free to disagree with me

I got an eye opener today.



40-60, favor Wolf, no question.


Cut, send, print.

Don't worry too much about it, Blackbelt. If you think you found an argument, that may chnage the match-up you can still come back to discuss any time. Our goal is not to show how wtfpwn Wolf is but to get an accuratematch-up thread. Therefore you can post your arguments later if you find something.

The last word on match-up isn't spoken yet

Gheb_01 said:

Don't worry too much about it, Blackbelt. If you think you found an argument, that may chnage the match-up you can still come back to discuss any time. Our goal is not to show how wtfpwn Wolf is but to get an accuratematch-up thread. Therefore you can post your arguments later if you find something.

The last word on match-up isn't spoken yet

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No no, you don't understand.

I am saying I was incorrect.

I now think it truly is a 40-60 matchup, advantage Wolf.


and the Lucas Matchup Discussion agrees with this assertion.

i dunno if its just my lack of good DI but lucas can juggle you pretty well with up tilt, also his down tilt combo's into his jab, but wolf really has nothing to worry about against lucas, unless he catches you with a recovery attack, those hurt

lol This thread is pretty old, Golden.