DK can survive anything

Ripple · Dec 4, 2008

this is what my next video will be showcasing. How high can DK get his % but still surviving or just surviving ridiculous attacks in general. (like snake's f smash at 106%)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5CwnOLYwEE

keep in mind that this is just a clip I happen to have on hand and probably one of my worse examples

Kitamerby · Dec 4, 2008

Holy ****.

ssbbFICTION · Dec 4, 2008

I saw no amazing DI in these videos. Just good DI

infomon · Dec 4, 2008

Wow, what hilarious timing for a thread like this to be here.

I just discovered that DK's up-B is one of three exceptional moves in the game that can instantly halt all knockback.

Here's my demonstration video:
[Crazy Recovery Techniques: G&W Bucket-Cancelling + moar!]

(DK's stuff is only shown briefly towards the end... sorry

)

Basically, most characters try to survive by escaping hitstun early with a fastfalled aerial, quickly followed by a Jump or momentum-changing Special towards the stage. However, using a Jump or momentum-changing Special while you're in knockback, causes you to receive an extra magical boost away from the stage. This is to prevent moves like Fox's Shine from allowing him to survive from ridiculous hits, thus breaking the recovery system.

However, three moves are inexplicably safe from this mechanism: G&W's down-B, Yoshi's side-B, and DK's up-B! DK's is the least useful, but it still allows him to survive some absurd situations.

Hope this helps, and sorry if it's already known to your boards...

itsthebigfoot · Dec 4, 2008

^ this is retardedly useful on japes

A2ZOMG · Dec 4, 2008

I doubt it would be. DK only goes straight up when doing an Up-B momentum cancel. He's not going to easily sweetspot any ledges in the process, and his Up-B lasts a long time, meaning some characters should be able to chase it down if necessary.

If he DIs high, he'll be airborne for a year before he comes down. If he DIs low, he also risks taking a KO sooner than necessary.

A better stage for that AT would be Norfair IMO.

itsthebigfoot · Dec 4, 2008

A2ZOMG said:
I doubt it would be. DK only goes straight up when doing an Up-B momentum cancel. He's not going to easily sweetspot any ledges in the process, and his Up-B lasts a long time, meaning some characters should be able to chase it down if necessary.

If he DIs high, he'll be airborne for a year before he comes down. If he DIs low, he also risks taking a KO sooner than necessary.

A better stage for that AT would be Norfair IMO.

itsthebigfoot said:
^ this is retardedly useful on japes

ok, i know this is new for you, but THINK, japes has a huge ceiling to do this, and if dk hits water, he makes it back to the stage every time.

put two and two together for this

A2ZOMG · Dec 4, 2008

I put it together. This doesn't work on the left side first of all.

And true, there is a huge skybox, but you'll be in freefall for a year without the ability to air dodge. A good opponent is not going to simply let you get away with that, and you are probably more likely to get killed as a result of doing that because if you are actually at the percents where this would be useful, you are also at the percents were another attack would be able to KO you. Even if you try to go to the right side where you have a chance to recover, a good opponent will chase you there and KO you, and THEY will use the water to get back onto the stage.

All in all, there is a really narrow window at which this technique will make you survive any longer, and DK puts himself in a state with very few options when doing this. Personally me, I think you're better off just having good DI in general than worrying over this.

Kitamerby · Dec 4, 2008

A2ZOMG said:
I put it together. This doesn't work on the left side first of all.

And true, there is a huge skybox, but you'll be in freefall for a year without the ability to air dodge. A good opponent is not going to simply let you get away with that, and you are probably more likely to get killed as a result of doing that because if you are actually at the percents where this would be useful, you are also at the percents were another attack would be able to KO you. Even if you try to go to the right side where you have a chance to recover, a good opponent will chase you there and KO you, and THEY will use the water to get back onto the stage.

All in all, there is a really narrow window at which this technique will make you survive any longer, and DK puts himself in a state with very few options when doing this. Personally me, I think you're better off just having good DI in general than worrying over this.

Who the hell cares about if you're going to die anyways? It's fun to cheat Death and steal some precious seconds off of the death clock. :D

A2ZOMG · Dec 4, 2008

Not the point at all. If you miscalculate how much knockback you actually took, and you use this when just simply DIing well would have saved you anyway, you're screwed.

Unless this technique gives DK an easy way to get to a ledge, I recommend against using it.

infomon · Dec 4, 2008

Yeah.... it's not the most useful thing in the world for DK; but at high percents there will be times when it really is obvious that you'll be KO'd otherwise. Norfair should be a decent place to avoid side KO's, perhaps by turning them into vertical lava-KOs where you might not need to use up-B. Distant Planet's probably the best legal stage where this could be useful, since walk-offs can make it difficult for the opponent to actually catch you as you land, and on the right, the opponent might not want to follow you on the monster's head. Castle Siege might work too, on the walkoff parts; it's so big, they might not even be able to catch up to you with anything really dangerous.

I'm sure it'll surprise some ppl tho

10clutchingatstraws

hova · Dec 4, 2008

if ur smart and use it in situation where you would have just died otherwise

how is it now useful? any technique is bad if used poorly, that's not a valid argument

Qckpy01 · Dec 4, 2008

THAT IS BROKEN!! At least for G&W......
That vid deserves it's own thread.

Edit: Oh and forgot to mention. For DK, it'd be best used in teams. I guess Yoshi too.....

ph00tbag · Dec 4, 2008

DK doesn't really need momentum canceling anyway. He can live well past 200% with just good DI and aerial hitstun recovery anyway.

Qckpy01 · Dec 4, 2008

ph00tbag said:
DK doesn't really need momentum canceling anyway. He can live well past 200% with just good DI and aerial hitstun recovery anyway.

Well why not live past 250? If it's possible, why not?

itsthebigfoot · Dec 4, 2008

A2ZOMG said:
I put it together. This doesn't work on the left side first of all.

And true, there is a huge skybox, but you'll be in freefall for a year without the ability to air dodge. A good opponent is not going to simply let you get away with that, and you are probably more likely to get killed as a result of doing that because if you are actually at the percents where this would be useful, you are also at the percents were another attack would be able to KO you. Even if you try to go to the right side where you have a chance to recover, a good opponent will chase you there and KO you, and THEY will use the water to get back onto the stage.

All in all, there is a really narrow window at which this technique will make you survive any longer, and DK puts himself in a state with very few options when doing this. Personally me, I think you're better off just having good DI in general than worrying over this.

yes, if you do it on the left there's no way you can just move to the right, dk's upb has no horizontal distance at all, none i tell you.

between mixups of fast falling and not fastfalling, as well as decent enough control, and the fact that you aren't aiming for land, the only move you'll be hit with is a quick aerial if you don't screw up, and unless they're ness, snake, or dedede, that aerial won't ko you.

this technique is very good on japes

Qckpy01 said:
Well why not live past 250? If it's possible, why not?

only 250? aim higher

infomon · Dec 4, 2008

itsthebigfoot said:
yes, if you do it on the left there's no way you can just move to the right, dk's upb has no horizontal distance at all, none i tell you.

I think you meant to be sarcastic here (?), but when you're cancelling knockback with up-B, it really spends most of its time spinning in place, you barely move sideways at all with it.

but yeah, DK's aerial mobility makes up for it, especially with fastfall mixups.
YOU MUST RECOVER!

magikguy · Dec 6, 2008

not snakes bazooka :'(. But yeah dk makes a great tank

KoSa! · Dec 7, 2008

Amazing DI, I always knew you had great DI. Still do the Uair for momentum?

Ripple · Dec 7, 2008

KoSa! said:
Amazing DI, I always knew you had great DI. Still do the Uair for momentum?

yep, and those videos are 3 months old. think of my DI now

10survives

A2ZOMG · Dec 7, 2008

itsthebigfoot said:
yes, if you do it on the left there's no way you can just move to the right, dk's upb has no horizontal distance at all, none i tell you.

Yeah. Exactly, you only move straight up from a momentum cancel see...

between mixups of fast falling and not fastfalling, as well as decent enough control, and the fact that you aren't aiming for land, the only move you'll be hit with is a quick aerial if you don't screw up, and unless they're ness, snake, or dedede, that aerial won't ko you.

DDD is a bad example. He sucks at killing, and he moves slowly horizontally. What were you thinking? And besides, matchup vs King DDD doesn't matter at all when he wins by just getting three grabs.

Characters like Marth, G&W, Metaknight, ROB all move pretty quickly. And they all have aerials that come out fast, and kill people. Those are the people you actually have to watch out for.

And see, the thing you forget is that the water can also save other characters besides DK. Which means they will follow you right offstage and edgeguard you.

if you're on the left side, it's pretty **** obvious where you are going because you can't land in the water there and expect to survive.

itsthebigfoot · Dec 7, 2008

A2ZOMG said:
Yeah. Exactly, you only move straight up from a momentum cancel see...

DDD is a bad example. He sucks at killing, and he moves slowly horizontally. What were you thinking? And besides, matchup vs King DDD doesn't matter at all when he wins by just getting three grabs.

Characters like Marth, G&W, Metaknight, ROB all move pretty quickly. And they all have aerials that come out fast, and kill people. Those are the people you actually have to watch out for.

And see, the thing you forget is that the water can also save other characters besides DK. Which means they will follow you right offstage and edgeguard you.

if you're on the left side, it's pretty **** obvious where you are going because you can't land in the water there and expect to survive.

i've never really had to watch out for mk's aerials killing me, upb maybe, but not the aerials, same for gdubs, and marth. rob's bair could do it, but he'd have to predict to land it. ness and snake are much more of a threat, so is d3's fair.

also, if another character isin the water with dk, dk's upb will refresh their time in the water, meaning as dk recovers, they are guaranteed to die by the water.

and dk can head right or grab the left ledge, that's two options.

A2ZOMG · Dec 7, 2008

itsthebigfoot said:
i've never really had to watch out for mk's aerials killing me, upb maybe, but not the aerials, same for gdubs, and marth. rob's bair could do it, but he'd have to predict to land it. ness and snake are much more of a threat, so is d3's fair.

G&W's F-air kills earlier than ROB's B-air. All of Marth's tippered aerials kill about the same time as ROB's B-air.

Snake doesn't chase offstage much. What you really got to watch out for is C4. Momentum cancel = free C4.

As I pointed out, DDD is way too slow. He's not going to chase down DK very easily if DK has a lot of room to DI.

also, if another character isin the water with dk, dk's upb will refresh their time in the water, meaning as dk recovers, they are guaranteed to die by the water.

Won't happen unless it's on the left side.

and dk can head right or grab the left ledge, that's two options.

Opponent waits on platform.

If DK heads for the ledge, he gets owned. If he heads right, he might survive if he DIs really well and his opponent was shaky enough to not land something that huge.

PKNintendo · Dec 7, 2008

Great vids. KOing your DK must be a pain.

Ripple · Dec 7, 2008

PKNintendo said:
Great vids. KOing your DK must be a pain.

people get more pissed off at my Jiggs because I survive until 130% sometimes

illinialex24 · Dec 7, 2008

Well a lot of the stuff is staler moves but he is heavy....

Ripple said:
people get more pissed off at my Jiggs because I survive until 130% sometimes

That is so awesome when you do that. But too many moves kill her early.

Ripple · Dec 7, 2008

illinialex24 said:
Well a lot of the stuff is staler moves but he is heavy....

That is so awesome when you do that. But too many moves kill her early.

actually, none of those clips show me getting hit by a diminished attack. they're all fresh

illinialex24 · Dec 7, 2008

Ripple said:
actually, none of those clips show me getting hit by a diminished attack. they're all fresh

Then how did Pit's F-smash not kill you? Seriously? And to kill DK, I fair him out of his B-up. A fresh fair kills him mid 90's or before.

Luigi player · Dec 7, 2008

Nice Ripple, I think I have to work on my DI ^^

And for this momentum cancel... I think it's better with DK than with Yoshi, because Yoshi falls streight down and with DK you can move while you fall...

And you don't die at Japes if you use this. XD Not even at the left of the stage, because DK can't die from the river if you know how to upB out of it.

Ripple · Dec 7, 2008

illinialex24 said:
Then how did Pit's F-smash not kill you? Seriously? And to kill DK, I fair him out of his B-up. A fresh fair kills him mid 90's or before.

not F smash, F tilt. which still is a good killer at high %

illinialex24 · Dec 7, 2008

Ripple said:
not F smash, F tilt. which still is a good killer at high %

Oh ok. Huge difference lol.

Uncle · Dec 7, 2008

Man oh man, it's a a great feeling whenever you live past 200% with the big ape. I'll commit these suggestions to memory.

Luigi player · Dec 19, 2008

Ok I tested some stuff:

I was DK in Training Mode on FD... The other player was also DK and was in the middle of FD and I tried to survive a fsmash. (the % listed are the % DK had before he was hit of course)

DI: in this case it's best to always hold up until you see your attack and then DI forward...

Bair + upB: You can survive up to 118 %.

Uair + upB: You can survive up to 116 %.
(since bair ends 6 frames faster you'll die about 2 %s earlier if you use upair instead of bair...)

Airdodge + upB: You can survive up to 115 %.
(the airdodge lasts really long so you can only upB really late which makes upair and bair better options)

Bair + double jump: You can survive up to 106 %.

You see, upB break is really helpful at staying alive.

i1337 · Dec 20, 2008

lmao, yesterday in a doubles match i survived an fsmash from mk at 208% in the middle of fd. the upb momentum cancel thing is the best :bigthumbu

Terrydactyl · Dec 30, 2008

Playing online yesterday in a 4-man Brawl, it came to sudden death between Lucas and my DK.

I survived multiple attacks with DI and finally won with a D-Smash!

jayboi221 · Dec 30, 2008

donkey is very heavy and is big and strong

CELTiiC · Dec 30, 2008

jayboi221 said:
donkey is very heavy and is big and strong

Also, DK is pretty fast

daisho · Dec 30, 2008

jayboi221 said:
donkey is very heavy and is big and strong

Hinoarashi said:
Also, DK is pretty fast

"Bigger...Faster...Stronger too, hes the first member of the DK crew"

(Sorry couldn't help myself)

Donkey Bong · Dec 31, 2008

^^^

i wish DK had his coconut gun that fired in spurts in brawl

ook · Dec 31, 2008

The up-b momentum cancel is the greatest thing to happen to DK since the stage spike. no joke :O

DK can survive anything

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