infomon
Smash Scientist
Ho Ho Ho, and Merry Steakmas to all Sonic mains! In the spirit of giving, and since you've all been good steaklings, Santa's brought some trivial ATs/discoveries.... they're prolly already known by the likes of Tenki/MC, but nevermind that:
1. Sonic's dash-turnaround state has some weird properties. If you time it properly, this is the only way I know of where you can get Sonic to slide along the ground in a crouch! In particular, I think there's some time after the turnaround starts but before you're dashing in the opposite direction.... where you're sliding forward a little, but you can still do anything, as if you were in a walking state.
This means you can slide forward in an Utilt, or even a Dsmash (extending its range OMG!!) Unfortunately, the amount of slide is extremely minimal. practice the timing with a crouch (since it's easy to see if you get the slide or not), then try using other moves. I can get a vid if I'm not making sense...
2. Grinding is awesome! It seems like you're pretty helpless throughout, but this is superficial.
Naïve grind:
However, smart Sonics overcome these limitations with moar tech-skill:
But much more importantly:
Srsly grind is awesome...... spend hours practicing the tech-skill of how to use it properly, it definitely gives moar options!! Combined with dash-turnaround mixups (like what Malcolm owns with), Sonic has crazy ground-versatility.... although increased risk of tripping.
I'm trying to increase my dextrosity so that, for example, I have spacing control akin to a Marth. One thing I've been doing a bunch: at low %s, Fthrow > grind forward.... you can quickly get into place to catch them again. You can control the spacing of the grind, to really follow beneath them, or stay out of range of whatever aerials they have. you can side-B shieldgrab if they attack, but another thing I do is dash-attack out of the grind as a fast getaway. Or instead of trying to grab them after the Fthrow, jump-cancel a spring from below them, if you want to mix it up.
Why is that better than just dashing forward? Well, I find with the dash I'd either go too far, or be simply vulnerable as I'm whizzing forward. I get better spacing with a grind. The grind also gives a false sense of safety to the opponent..... at least until they adjust to all its tricks.
Try the Fthrow-chasing on an Ike for lolz. You basically force them to use their second jump to get away.... but then they've used their 2nd jump, and you're below them (as close as you want to be), which is fairly happy.
3. A minor glitch, I wonder who can solve the mystery? Spring > Dair beside it. Then VSDJ into an immediate aerial or airdodge, and try to land on the spring. For some reason, I go right through it! Without the VSDJ, I have no problem landing on the spring. But a VSDJ can land on the spring on its own. I don't know of any other circumstance where you pass right through the bloody thing. Anyone have any ideas?
Merry Steakmas to all, and to all a good fight!
1. Sonic's dash-turnaround state has some weird properties. If you time it properly, this is the only way I know of where you can get Sonic to slide along the ground in a crouch! In particular, I think there's some time after the turnaround starts but before you're dashing in the opposite direction.... where you're sliding forward a little, but you can still do anything, as if you were in a walking state.
This means you can slide forward in an Utilt, or even a Dsmash (extending its range OMG!!) Unfortunately, the amount of slide is extremely minimal. practice the timing with a crouch (since it's easy to see if you get the slide or not), then try using other moves. I can get a vid if I'm not making sense...
2. Grinding is awesome! It seems like you're pretty helpless throughout, but this is superficial.
Naïve grind:
- Attack or C-stick = dash attack (can't use jab, tilts, smashes)
- Can only use side-B; other Specials don't work
- Can't shield
- Grab = dash-grab
However, smart Sonics overcome these limitations with moar tech-skill:
- You can jump out of grind, which means you can use a jump-cancelled up-B or up-smash
- Dash attack means you can also DACUS, so you have two up-smash options
- I think jump-cancelling lets you homing attack as well... or if not, then just jumping works (a few frames difference, max.).... not that you'll ever do this
- You can't shield or spotdodge during a grind, but you can dodge-roll
- Furthermore, side-B gives you a shield, spot-dodge, and standing-grab
- You can pivot-grab during grind... this looks weird; try it during a long/fast grind, Sonic's hand kinda moves around funny... and it's a sliding grab that's much more defensive than his clunky dash-grab
But much more importantly:
- Tap forward during grind to start another initial dash. And from an initial dash, you can do anything! You're free to use jabs, tilts, smashes, and Specials. So you can Fsmash out of grind -- stutter-stepped, in fact. This also gives you a down-B out of grind, although it's tricky to do quickly.
- Furthermore, use dash-dance input during the grind, to do any of these aimed behind you (obviously).
Srsly grind is awesome...... spend hours practicing the tech-skill of how to use it properly, it definitely gives moar options!! Combined with dash-turnaround mixups (like what Malcolm owns with), Sonic has crazy ground-versatility.... although increased risk of tripping.
I'm trying to increase my dextrosity so that, for example, I have spacing control akin to a Marth. One thing I've been doing a bunch: at low %s, Fthrow > grind forward.... you can quickly get into place to catch them again. You can control the spacing of the grind, to really follow beneath them, or stay out of range of whatever aerials they have. you can side-B shieldgrab if they attack, but another thing I do is dash-attack out of the grind as a fast getaway. Or instead of trying to grab them after the Fthrow, jump-cancel a spring from below them, if you want to mix it up.
Why is that better than just dashing forward? Well, I find with the dash I'd either go too far, or be simply vulnerable as I'm whizzing forward. I get better spacing with a grind. The grind also gives a false sense of safety to the opponent..... at least until they adjust to all its tricks.
Try the Fthrow-chasing on an Ike for lolz. You basically force them to use their second jump to get away.... but then they've used their 2nd jump, and you're below them (as close as you want to be), which is fairly happy.
3. A minor glitch, I wonder who can solve the mystery? Spring > Dair beside it. Then VSDJ into an immediate aerial or airdodge, and try to land on the spring. For some reason, I go right through it! Without the VSDJ, I have no problem landing on the spring. But a VSDJ can land on the spring on its own. I don't know of any other circumstance where you pass right through the bloody thing. Anyone have any ideas?
Merry Steakmas to all, and to all a good fight!
