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Tech Chasing.

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victra♥

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victra#0
Tech Chasing

I've been playing melee competitively for years. Captain Falcon happened to be one of my main characters, so tech chasing was something I did quite a bit when I played spacies. This is something I'm sure we all did, not only with Falcon, but with pretty much every other character. But did you know that we've all been referring to it by the wrong name? That's right. For years, we've just been calling it "techchasing" or "reading your opponent" or even as "mindgames". Little do we know, the correct term is actually Chainchoking.
Let me post this as well so no one gets confused.
---
Tech chasing = predicting
Chainchoking = reacting.

---
Now, let's get down to it.
Recently, Renth, Cash Mooney and I were enlightened by the teachings of the Ganondorf Brawl forums. When one reacts to a tech in order to follow up with a move, such as another grab or an aerial for example, we refer to this as chainchoking. The discrepancy between reading a tech and predicting a tech is seen above and will be explained in further detail below.

What is it?
This idea came to me when I gerudoupthrew a fox. I noticed that when I did, and the fox didn't tech, they were restricted to only a few options. The basic idea is to wait for them to get up, and you react to what they do. For example, if they gerudoroll, you can run up and gerudoJC a gerudograb or gerudoSHFFL an gerudoaerial. If they attack to get up, gerudoshield and follow up with a gerudoshield grab or an gerudoSHFFLed gerudoaerial. If they normal stand up, you can do the same thing but with out the need to gerudoshield. Sometimes you can follow up with a strong gerudosmash attack or a strong gerudoaerial attack (like the knee) after you chainchoke them to high enough percents, which will sent them off the stage, thus killing them. Be careful though, because they may tech your throw, and then you have to react even faster with more gerudoing. This makes this technique extremely difficult, so I suggest that only the pros should attempt this. This is different from the tech chasing we know and love. We used to predict what they would do and catch them if we were successful. This removes guessing from the equation by reacting after they have initiated their response.


Chainchoking- Not for Everyone


Chainchoking is hard. Very hard. You must know every animation of the character if you want a chance to succeed, and even then you need great reflexes. You also have to SHFFL aerials if you plan on using them, and JC grabs if you plan on following up with grabs. Don't even think about trying it online. I expect that we will all get better at this with practice, to the point where it can give us the advantageous matchups we have been longing for. However, this will still only apply for the few Ganons who are capable of doing this.

To make everything easier, let's have some abbreviations and standards:
GUA- getup attack
Out- roll away
In- roll toward
Up- standing up without a GUA


When and Why?​
This tech is more situational than it seems at first glance. The main limiting factor is the difficulty. Characters almost always has good options after a chainhoke. Chainchoking is guaranteed in theory, risky in reality (or at least until we are good at it, which nobody currently is). We are so good at attacking after a choke that going for a chainchoke and failing is a huge waste. Chainchoking is the best option in most situations if you can do it, especially on places like Final Destination. However, don't go for the chainchoke any other move can get it done. (Like a strong attack.)

This tech has more benefits than you would think. Despite the difficulty, this is worth learning for many reasons. First and foremost, damage. Chokes add up quickly, and since the chainchoke ends near the ledge, they are put in a very bad situation from it. Another benefit is that the chokes refresh all your other moves. As you should know, the game keeps track of the last nine moves you have hit with. We don't care if the choke gets stale, so this is restoring the other moves for basically nothing. Another benefit that should not be overlooked is the affect this has on your opponent. He will get demoralized if he gets choked time and time again with no escape. You are crushing his spirit with this move, and that is an advantage that can't be measured. A frustrated opponent is far more likely to make mistakes than a calm one.

Video
Chainchoking - A Proof of Concept and Introductory Video
DO NOT say you can chainchoke until you have WATCHED THIS VIDEO!

edit: I actually watched the original video and it's funnier in itself.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMTL74uIXlw
 

turtlecake

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At 2:38, there is a PERFECT example of chainchoking



Seems SS also learns from the ganon boards
 

victra♥

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victra#0
this is known stuff with a gay new name
It isn't the same, even ask Renth or Cash.

Chainchoking refers to not only techchasing the rolls but also the get ups. Since gets ups are not techs nor are they rolls I myself wouldn't classify it in a techchase. So I see Chainchoking as the combination of gerudoing all sets of an opponents moves including rolls and get ups.
 

ihavespaceblondes

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Tech chasing = predicting or reacting to an opponents choice of tech or non-tech in order to get another hit.
This doesn't need a new term, especially not one that sounds like something I already have a real-life fetish for.
 

Renth

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You have no idea how much I love you right now Victra. There's a reason I avoid talking in brawl forums and that's one of them.

Fantastic use of their terminology on the Gerudo.
 

KosukeKGA

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This is something I'm pretty good at...

Thank you for sharing this information with everyone. I'm sure it will help many.
 

Witchking_of_Angmar

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Slowly starting to enjoy my mothertongue again. :)

It isn't the same, even ask Renth or Cash.

Chainchoking refers to not only techchasing the rolls but also the get ups. Since gets ups are not techs nor are they rolls I myself wouldn't classify it in a techchase. So I see Chainchoking as the combination of gerudoing all sets of an opponents moves including rolls and get ups.
Magus posted about this a while ago on the Falcon boards about how Sheik can viably techchase chainchoke Falcon to death without needing to jab him if he doesn't tech. It's not new. Just not well known.
 

KosukeKGA

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Well, now that I put some thought into it, that does seem pretty redundant...But, it should be viable still as it is different.
 

KirbyKaze

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There has ALWAYS been an element of inescapability in certain tech chase strats. Why do we NOW need a new term for it?

This is nothing new. I've been telling people for a while that reaction based tech chase strats are superior in virtually every way to prediction ones, but that some specific prediction ones on a few select characters have a better payoff and therefore are viable sometimes (notably Falcon's Dair, Jigglypuff's Rest / F-smash sometimes, etc).

I mean, ultimately this doesn't really make a huge difference in the long run or anything. But I don't see the need for naming it.
 

Kyu Puff

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There has ALWAYS been an element of inescapability in certain tech chase strats. Why do we NOW need a new term for it?

This is nothing new. I've been telling people for a while that reaction based tech chase strats are superior in virtually every way to prediction ones, but that some specific prediction ones on a few select characters have a better payoff and therefore are viable sometimes (notably Falcon's Dair, Jigglypuff's Rest / F-smash sometimes, etc).

I mean, ultimately this doesn't really make a huge difference in the long run or anything. But I don't see the need for naming it.
Let's say I d-throw f-air someone with ICs. I can react with an IBL (ice block lock) but that's techchasing because I'm assuming that they don't tech. Actually, it's more like half tech-chasing, half chainchoking because they don't actually tech, so I'll call it a techchoke.

Back on subject, instead I can wait and react to what they do. If they stand up in place, I can stutter step f-smash desynch. If they roll away, I can "mini-dashdance" ice block desynch and then follow the ice block. If they roll backwards, maybe I'll dash and regrab, and begin either a buffered alternate throw CG or a hobbling variation sequence.
 

KirbyKaze

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Let's say I d-throw f-air someone with ICs. I can react with an IBL (ice block lock) but that's techchasing because I'm assuming that they don't tech. Actually, it's more like half tech-chasing, half chainchoking because they don't actually tech, so I'll call it a techchoke.

Back on subject, instead I can wait and react to what they do. If they stand up in place, I can stutter step f-smash desynch. If they roll away, I can "mini-dashdance" ice block desynch and then follow the ice block. If they roll backwards, maybe I'll dash and regrab, and begin either a buffered alternate throw CG or a hobbling variation sequence.
Hmm...

If that's the case, it sounds like you're covering multiple tech options while you're doing this, which allows you to only have to worry about 2 tech chase options.

In that case choke chase is somewhat misleading. I mean, tech chase makes sense but I think for your example it needs a more visual name. Like cover-flexing. Because you're covering tech options and reacting on reflex, not prediction.
 

rehab

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Cash and especially Renth are two Ganon players who practically built Ganondorf to what he is today (in melee). You can understand how frustrating it is for them to come here and see all of you hyped up over something so well known like "predicting a tech" homgz. Who could blame you guys though. You guys have only began your smash career where as the three of us have been smashing competitively for what is now 4 years.

By no means am I trying to come across an elitist, but when it was us who built the foundation of competitive smash, it irritates us to see fresh players literally write off what we spend years accomplishing with they're own name. Not that I'm dissing you guys for trying though. I don't mean it like that.



There are -essentially- 2 kinds of DI.

#1: DI #2: Smash DI

"Aerialdancing" = #2

You can see how ridiculous it sounds when you take something that is literally common knowledge and calling it your own.

I'm not trying to diss brawl or start a flame war. I hope you can understand where we are coming from.

Also, I hope no one rights this off as spam because I don't see why this isn't considered on topic. I'm simply refutting the OP. Debates move the community forward, as do debates do in real life. I'm sure you guys are willing to reply to a few posts that don't consist of "oh chainchoking is cool im going to try now. =D"
So, 10/10 or 10/10
 

SpaceFalcon

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Nice thread victra, I'm gonna read it now as soon as I change this **** 5 posts per page thing.
 
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