Official G&W Stage Discussion #17: Frigate Orpheon

Frigate Orpheon.


Here's a link to Frigate Orhpeon's stage mechanics, by our very own Amazing Ampharos. http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=193606&highlight=frigate

I guess I'll start. Great stage for G&W - the boundaries aren't so small that he has to worry about dieing at ridiculous percentages ( a problem for G&W), and the lack of a lip doesn't hurt G&W very much.

i've never liked this stage because this stage hates me.
something ******** always happens like getting caught under the stage in transformation when i'm trying to recover or getting gimped by the few lips it does have. and the moving platforms just going out of reach at the wrong time. all the stuff i listed shouldn't happen but does *shrugs*


anyways i wouldn't take ROB here and i'd always ban it against ROB.

This stage is OK, and that's probably it.

The first transformation is pretty good for GW, got a nice platform for Nair-ing through, or for Dthrow -> Dsmash or tech-chasing. You can do D-throw shenanigans on the moving platform as well.

The second transformation is something that I don't really like. People can camp under the platform and it's hard to get at them if they're playing super defensively (which they probably are if they're camping). Take someone campy, say Olimar (since you might be CP-ing him here). If he camps under that platform, good luck. You already have limited options against him. What are you gonna do? Well, you can run up and try to shieldgrab him, but that would be ******** because of his awesome grab range. You can't get at him from his dead angle because the platform is in the way. You're probably going to turtle - and he probably knows it. You could also chill away from him and force him to come to you, but he doesn't have to, and there's no reason why he would or should. This is just one scenario (I play against Olimar often), but I'm sure it could just as easily go for other characters, with perhaps a little less difficulty approaching.

5.5/10 for this level. No reason why you'd CP it, since there's nothing here that really hurts GW, but no reason to ban it (except against ROB). You can gimp recoveries pretty well here, at least, but I can't think of anything else that's in GW's favor.

I love this stage (then again I also main ROB). First transformation can be quite an easy stock due to the lack of ledge of the right and up-b is a great attack while you're there. You can float back after you hit or cancel the chute to smackem if they are trying to beat you back. The left side isn't too bad either depending on who you're playing. Smart use of chef, dtilt, and nair (sometimes bair) makes it very difficult to approach GW.

Second transformation is kind of plain, but if you learn to time the platforms you can get some pretty sweet kills if you manage to dthrow them while its leaving, proceed to up-b away, and watch them go boom.

I would definitely not take a ROB here though. Its his best stage hands down.

Honestly though, i think its more preference here since I play it as ROB more than it is a great stage for GW. 6/10 due to the gimps and the platform tricks

Why is ROB so good here? Boom Cube (Sexy rob, our matches are in the Age Old Theatre) took me here for his CP... Everyone says ROB does really well here, but I dunno why.

Also, charge smashes as the stage transforms. Even less lag then usual, and your opponent sometimes over-tries to punish you and dies.

This stage also does nice things for me when I random cargo punch as DK.. but that is beside the point.

It seems like this would be a bad ROB stage. ROB's usually prefer large stages to camp effectively. How is it the best ROB stage?

I don't know who I would take here. If its a tether, I'd rather take them to RC. If not, G&W has many other stages to exploit depending on the matchups. I don't like this stage much. Many 5 or 6/10

Anything else you guys want to add?

Actually looking back at this I don't think it would work well for ROB vs GW. Usually Rob can camp the side platforms in the second transformation safely, which I don't see working when GW can just go out and smack him and go back with ease.

First transformation ROB gets it good due to the lack of a ledge on the right side and being able to gimp people there, once again something I don't see happening to GW due to his amazing recovery and the fact he can gimp ROB unlike most of the cast.

The superb camping and the gimps on this stage made it for ROB but GW can take advantage of gimping just as well and can pressure a ROB trying to camp, maybe even forcing him to run out of fuel in the process.

Otherwise, I could see GW taking people with weak recoveries here for the early gimps in the 1st transformation but the 2nd isn't that great. A dthrow on the platform (or fthrow/bthrow depending) could lead to an early death but I don't see anyone coming to fight out there.

Take tethers here if they ban RC maybe?

If you get a grab on the platform that moves up and down on the first form, the fact that there's a wall to the left can often mean that you are guaranteed something good out of down throw regardless of what they do, similar to the effect on Green Greens, although obviously more situational.

Yeah, when its in the down position, dthrow -> dtilt works nicely if they don't tech. Sadly, the dtilt lock doesn't last very long.

@ Moot: If they DI right/left when you use f/bthrow, they will be sent almost vertically. G&W has a crappy f/bthrow...

To avoid getting gayed by the stage, just jump right before it flips, and you should be find.

I like this stage a lot. Don't pick it against Snake. A strong stage against characters with tether, like ZSS.

I personally like this stage. Probably because I play light blue G&W and the background is always dark.

EDIT: Just to be clear, I wouldn't use this stage as a counterpick. I can't think of a character this is extremely good against.

Frigate Orpheon is a pretty good stage, but it's nothing special. I'd never pick it and would never ban it even among conservative rulesets.

Anyway, in my experience, it's best to play around on the right side of the first form and in the middle under the platform on the second form. That moving platform gives you so many more fishbowl opportunities than the usual terrain with the fun of under the stage antics and other such gimmicks, and being under a platform with that low part of the stage lets you camp pretty well, especially since you can crouch under all linear projectiles. These aren't particularly powerful tactics, but I feel they're the best way to play this level. I'd probably rate it 5/10; there's just not much to say about it.

Once again, good for GaW but not the best for anything.

Don't fret if they pick this level against you though. Nair a lot. As always remember to Bucket Brake.

Man, why am I bumping this?

Potential Gimps! I'm surprised you guys only talked about not getting caught under the stage, rather than catching other people under it. GaW has a very powerful tool for that, called the DOWN THROW. It'll plant them on the floor, while you safely jump to freedom.

Even if they don't get caught under the stage, a lot of the time they'll end up high in the air, ready to get juggled.

I find that uh, under the platform on the first transformation leads to them being under the stage a lot.

Discuss!

Edit: I've managed to Star KO the opponent. (Risky though, since sometimes you get yourself and they live)

Hmm..Frigate


The transformations are great in that they get your opponent in the air to land in some easy hits
The moving ledges occasionally create that wall to do that dtilt infinite as well lol
just a little extra advantage :X

Not the best stage for G&W but it isn't bad for him
spam nair and abuse the ledges