Donkey Kong Matchup

Donkey Kong



General Discussion

Pikachu and DK are polar opposites. Pikachu is a lightweight with some good killing power while DK is a heavyweight with some good speed. Pikachu has a small frame while DK has a huge one. Now DK has one of the best killing power in the game. As Pikachu, it is your utmost duty to be as evasive as you can against DK. Slipping up will equal death. Thanks for Pikachu’s speed you should be living up till 130% where DK’s ftilt and back throw will start killing you. DK will normally be living till 140-150% unless you land an fsmash near the ledge or thunder2. Usmash > thunder starts working easily once DK is 130%, but can be started earlier dependant on DK’s DI.


Pika's Advantages

1) Agile and hard to hit
2) Easy to hit target
3) Projectile
4) Great combo game
5) CG to 60% with fthrow, and one to 50% on the ledge with dthrow
6) Faster in all but one aspect
7) Exceptional recovery


Pika's Disadvantages

1) Kill Power
2) Faster aerial mobility
3) Higher damaging moves
4) Range
5) Reliable SAFs in UpB and nB
6) 3 Spikes
7) Sakurai Combo
8) CSS is hard to tech with Pikachu [Player skill advantage]

Strategy for Winning

The Start of the Match:

99% of the time, the first thing that will happen:

Pikachu uses tjolt and DK charges DK punch till the tjolt reaches him.

I guarantee you that’s how it will start. Anyways, run up with your tjolt or fire anyone then go after DK. You do not want DK to keep a fully charged punch as it rain on your parade with his SAF and net a kill at 80-90%. Of course be wary of the 9-punch which will kill Pikachu at 65% with great DI. Some DKs tend to keep a 9-punch charged up then make a fully charged one once you get to fully charged kill range.

Also, you have a CG that works from 0-60% with fthrow and to 50% with dthrow on the ledge (in case you catch DK after an fthrow at the ledge) And the Dthrow tends to have DK panic and jump/UpB which is GREAT to punish. BUT remember! DO NOT GO FOR THE CG. Only do it if you are given the chance to. If you manage to grab DK, great! CG away. But don’t make it like “OMG I MUST CG BEFORE I COMBO HIM” crap. If you play like that, DK will have you ready to die before you can even land the CG.

Now then, you will have to keep DK pressured with tjolts and speed. Hit and run is what Pikachu is great for. You have many things that work on DK

Pika's Pressure Game:

You have a faster move set than DK by a few frames. You have to abuse this speed against DK. Hit him before he can hit you. DK is a big target so you have more combos than normal. Like dtilt > dtilt is a true combo at low %’s since DK is a big target and heavy he can even be hit THREE times in a row if he was in your face at 0% (lol unlikely though)

You want to pressure DK with SPEED. That means tilts, aerials and grabs. QAC can also work, but don’t abuse QAC. It’s a great mind game to throw out but it can be punished harshly since there is like a frame of hitstun so they can easily shield before you do anything else. However, QAC > rising aerial is great when they don’t react fast enough.

I like to juggle DK since his dair is slow enough that you can stop before it hits you if you are being smart about it. So I tend to utilt > uair juggle > nair to finish it then tech chase with more uairs. If DK lands on a platform, its uair pressuring time.

Punish DK with smashes. He's a heavyweight still so he still has punishable post lag. Fsmash deals a hefty 21% damage when sweetspotted. It’s great for punishing DK’s Up B landing on the stage. Usmash is good in case fsmash is too slow to punish. Don’t use dsmash though.

Also, DK’s moves extend his hurtbox, so if DK isn’t spacing his tilts/smashes you can easily shield grab his arms (not his hands).

Lastly, shield pressure works well on DK. Just be careful not to get shield grabbed as DK has good grab range (as much as DDD). DK’s shield is weak, so after a short while, you can easily shield stab it. You want to land behind DK with fair though to avoid being shield grabbed by him. He has a beastly grab game.

DK’s Pressure Game:

Of course you can’t like waltz in and smack DK around. He has a range advantage for a reason. All of Dk’s tilts are pretty devastating and save DK from having a big disadvantage against Pikachu.

Utilt has some good range so approaching from above tends to get negated by this move. One thing to note, if you happen to get utilt’d at low %’s quickly nair/uair (no lag on landing if uair) to interrupt his utilt > utilt combo.

Dtilt will combo into itself and if it trips to down B. that’s 30% right there, which is bad for a feather weight.

Ftilt does a great job at spacing. DK is gonna pimp slap your ***.

DK has a good grab game, he has 7 throws in total since fthrow gives him 4 new throws. Cargo Dthrow does great mind games when off stage. But since Pikachu is great at recovering, it doesn’t do much to him. Do be wary about what DK does after that since you have to recover still, which means DK is in the way to the stage. He can dthrow > ftilt at 0% and that’s about it.

Lastly, DK has grounded UpB to pressure you. It will put some heavy damage to a shield if all hits hit and DK can usually get away with it. You have to really be wary of it since it will do some damage if you aren’t prepared for it. If you manage to avoid it, you can easily punish it. If you happen to be behind him then just wait behind him as he can’t go backwards. Don’t jolt, it will cancel it out, instead run after him because he will most likely go away from you at least, then grab him. Another thing is you can attack it from above. But the biggest problem with UpB is the SAF frames. DK can turn the momentum around with this move if he catches you with its SAFs.

When in the air, DK’s bair will stop anything Pikachu has. It has more range than any aerial Pikachu has so be warned.

Killing:

Pikachu’s best moves to kill are fsmash, thunder, and nair. Usmash is good for killing but with a thunder follow up, you don’t get many usmash kills unless you usmash DK the first time when he is at usmash killing %.

Thunder is too easy to land on DK when you are pro at thundering. When you are good at thundering characters like Kirby, DK is like a walk in a park thanks to his big size. The only problem is that it takes more % to get him into thunder position.

Nair does a good job at killing once DK gets to 140%. Near the edge, nair will kill DK at that percent.

You have to be careful when trying to kill cause DK has SAFs and he isn’t afraid to eat your moves to kill you. DK Punch starts its SAFs at frame 18, so fsmash gets risky if he predicts it.

Ftilt him if all else fails.

Gimping:

Pikachu has two ways to attempt to gimp DK. A simple nair DK away and thunder. Attempting to nair DK away will end up with your eating his invincible (frame 4-6 however) Up B. But since nair is frame 3, you can hit him before it so I mention it. Or you could always bait the UpB and hit him out of it.

Thunder can work better since DK’s recovery is a straight horizontal line so all you have to do is wait till DK HAS to jump/UpB towards the stage and form a thunder wall a bit away from the ledge that he HAS to eat thunder. It tacks more damage and if you are bold you could wave bounce with thunder and try to net an early kill with T2.

You can also just keep tjolting DK. With good aim you can knock DK away, or tack like 20%+ with many tjolts.

DK’s Kill Game:

First and foremost, DK has the ever so famous, SAKURAI combo. It’s a side B to DK punch for those who don’t know. It’s pretty ridiculous, but how long you are stuck in ground depends on % and your button mashing ability. But if you get hit by side B at 50% and he has a 9 punch ready, kiss that stock goodbye. DK has fsmash and fully charged DK Punch to also kill you early. They kill you at 90%, but…

Pikachu is nimble enough to not get hit by side B, fsmash, and DK Punch, so DK has to use other means to kill Pikachu normally. But don’t get cocky; you HAVE to be trying to avoiding those moves because your life depends on it. Do not get intimidated either. Be wary of it, but don’t panic.

Now DK has two more smash attacks left. Usmash and Dsmash. Dsmash kills 105% sweet spotted. Usmash kills like 80% but it’s requires Pikachu to be above DK. DK will land it only if he is thinking ahead of you. Dsmash ,however, hits at frame 11, (10 if you were in the air) and well, that’s pretty fast. However, it is completely unsafe on block. You can fsmash him easily after wards.

DK’s uair is the next move on KO power. It kills Pikachu at 110% near the ground, but since it’s usually when you are in the air, it can kill as early as 100% It comes out in 6 frames so its hard to avoid without knowing its coming. And it will literally come out of nowhere.

Next, if you are good at avoiding uair, bthrow will kill at 130%, if you “don’t get grabbed” then ftilt will kill by 135%. Course if it’s stale then it’ll kill later.

Bair will also kill, but that will only hit Pikachu if he’s in the air.
If you didn’t catch on, DK’s best way of killing Pikachu is when he’s in the air. So keep that in mind.
Oh and the CSS is a ***** to tech on FD, but on SV and BF it’s easier and you won’t die if you fail to tech until 60%

[COLOR="Brown[SIZE="3"][/SIZE]"]DK’s Spikes:[/COLOR]

DK has 3 spikes, but you shouldn’t get spiked normally, being as small and agile as you are. But, you have to know how to avoid DK’s spikes first.

Dair: The basic aerial attack that just sends downwards. It’s slow and easy to see coming. Just watch DK and don’t be under him when he does it.

Fair: No.. you need some extreme mind games to hit pikachu with this.

Side B: Probably the easily spike to pull off as DK, as it has great mind game potential. First off, it levitates DK till after his headbutt. It’s a great spike to get people with when they are trying to gimp DK. So, if you try to gimp DK, keep an eye out for it, because if you don’t see it coming, you’ll be wishing you did.

So outside of spikes, you should recover just fine. If you side B carelessly, you WILL get spiked.

So yea, in the end it comes down to how well Pikachu can avoid DK and how well DK can keep up with Pikachu.

Stages:

Counterpicks: Frigate Orpheon, CS, FD (warning about CSS, use SV if you can’t tech it well/get caught by it a lot)

Ban: Luigi’s Manion, Brinstar, and Pirate Ship

Stage striking: BF and YI


Helpful Video's

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Overall Matchup

55:45 Pikachu

DK. so he hurts. like a lot. his fully charged punch has super armor frames as does his fsmash. his dsmash is a good punisher and can kill you off the top. what we have is our speed, cgs, and combos. get him into the air and try to combo the crap out of him. thats all i know of this matchup- the only good DK i played was darkrain, and he quit months ago i am going to call it tentativley 60-40 pika till i see more data. and if any DK wants to play me online to help determine the matchup i am open for it.

I haven't played a lot of top level Pikachu's but from what I have played, the match was pretty even. Like most matches in Brawl it is very stage dependent. I would call it Pika advantage on his good stages and DK on his, so even overall. Pika does do well on a lot of DKs best counter stages though, which is something worth noting. I tend to find myself countering with neutrals in this matchup, Battlefield really helps us here.

As far as the match goes, yes you get chaingrabs and can rack up damage quickly, but the difficulty comes in killing DK. On the other hand, DK can have trouble approaching Pika, but once he gets in he can do good damage and kill early. This is what makes it so stage dependent. If DK is on a stage that helps him with a good approach option then he can do very well. Pika is still very hard for DK to edgeguard though, but I hardly think that matters as early as he can get kills.

Feels even to me, but thats just based on the handful of Pikas I have played.

Does jab edge guarding work like the in "jab my heart out"?

no it doesnt lol. no person would do that.

Hmm, I have a friend who plays a pretty good DK, so I'll just quickly add some things I've noticed:

- Stealth is right: comboing DK is essential in this matchup. He's heavy, fairly slow compared to Pika, and a huge target, so it's not hard to get a good combo going, especially once you have him in the air. Utilt (possibly proceeded by a dthrow or FF fair) > uair x2 > whatever is your best friend. Also, if you're on a flat surface, fthrow CG at low %s. You pretty much need to combo & CG him, because his tilts and smashes outrange Pika on the ground. They're slow (not Ike or Ganon slow, mind you, but they have considerable startup lag); however, they're very powerful. Try to keep the fight in the air, because Pika's airgame > DK's.

- Don't come down on DK from above. I'm not sure to exactly what % he can do this (lowish-mid?), but he'll combo you with multiple utilts.

- You think DK's up-b is just for recovery? Oh no, my friend.... it has super armor, and some DKs will abuse this by using it on stage. It moves pretty far horizontally, too. You MUST DI & jump out of it, or you'll eat a lot of damage.

- Don't take DK to stages with lots of platforms if you can help it. He can easily reach you through them. BF is bad, bad, bad. Also, if there's a wall on the stage, he can dtilt lock you.

- I speak from personal experience when I say NEVER Skull Bash for recovery. You WILL get spiked.

- When you're at high percentages, DK has plenty of moves to kill you with, and Pika is light, so expect to die fairly early. His smashes are all powerful and have good range, but the upside for us is that they have startup lag and are pretty easy to see coming. If you're coming back onto the stage and DK jumps out at you, chances are he's going for a spike (dair) or a bair for the kill. Airdodge through him or time your QA so that you go THROUGH him. I've been caught by the spike foot in the middle of my QA when Pikachu is vulnerable.

- Other random things to watch out for: cargo carry > stage spike. At highish percentages, this will definitely kill you. Also, please don't get caught with his side-b (when he pounds you into the ground with his head) if you're in kill range..... you'll eat a free charged fsmash.

- On the flip side, killing DK can be a *****. His recovery has ridiculous horizontal reach but isn't that great vertically, so if you can gimp him with tjolts, go for it. If you're expecting fsmash or usmash to kill him, they have to be fresh, because DK is one of the heaviest characters in the game. I find most of my kills coming from utilt > thunder, because DK is large (think DDD style) so he has a harder time airdodging through it.

I would call it 60/40 Pika. We have a projectile, a CG, better aerials, and a good combo game on DK, but he can kill us early and can be pretty **** on stages with lots of platforms. Combined with super armor on some powerful moves, he can give you trouble if you're not careful.

Isnt this one of two characters thats easy to set up the 0 -> death combo on?

I played a pretty good DK in tournament recently, so i will relay all the information i have.

Donkey Kong is the 2nd best large character in the game. He has ridiculous power, unexpected speed, and great range which can make fighting him a pain in the ***.

First off, grab game. DK has the infamous Cargo to B-throw off the level which will stage spike you if you don't tech, so either mash out, or prepare for the tech. Adversely, pikachu has his CG till about 60%, so abuse it as much as you can. 60% on DK is still about 40% on most other characters because of how heavy he is. At low %s, DK can D-throw to F-tilt you, giving you i think 19-21%, i don't remember the exact number. This is the only practical grab combo DK has, so you won't see him grabbing pikachu as much as other characters. DK would, on most characters, cargo and then throw them off the level with his D-throw cargo (Sends you basically straight forward) but pikachu's great recovery makes this MUCH less practical.

Pikachu can combo DK to hell. His size, weight, and fall speed are all perfect for pikachu. You can do so many things to DK, so just mess around and you will find something you like. On the other side, DK isn't much of a comboing character, but when he does, it packs a punch. Dk only needs around 5-7 hits before he can kill you, so try to avoid getting hit. Donkey kong can be footstool comboed (U-tilt to footstool or D-throw to footstool at 0%) and he will get caught in the QAL for quite a long time because he is so big. However, if you get the grab and you have the whole length of the stage to go, i would advise CGing him instead. I think DK's jab lock % starts at around 75%. If you get him in jab lock, he will be hard pressed to get out since he is so huge. Remember that you can QA passed him and jab lock him the other way too

DK has the best spacing in all of brawl. His huge range on his f-tilt makes it really bothersome to get close to him on the ground. He also has D-tilt, which is fast and still has great range. It can trip you, and then the DK can down-b you, giving you about 23% from both attacks. If you get in a habit of jumping, he can RAR a bair, which also has insane range and power. In a SH, DK can use 2 Bairs, which makes it his fastest aerial. Thankfully, Pikachu has a projectile, so we don't really need to approach that often. However, DK can just walk up to you and powershield them, and then F-tilt you.

Now for the killing. DK has the huge advantage in this section, and it is obvious why. Every single one of DK's smashes WILL kill you at 110%. A 9-wind punch (DK's strongest attack) will kill you at 65% on Final D no questions asked. This means that at around 40%, a Forward-b to 9 wind punch will almost always kill you. Fully charged punch will kill at around 80%, but it has super armor when DK is actually moving his arm forward in the punch, so beware of this. DK has a useful way of getting this Forward-B if you are on the ground. He can footstool you, and before you have time to do anything, he can Forward-B you, which can be devastating (Commonly called Grounded Footstool Combo, or GFSC). Fortunately, you should never really be just standing on the ground, so it makes it really hard for the DK to do this. In order of speed of his smashes, D-smash takes the cake. DO NOT use any laggy attacks on his shield when you are at 105% or so, for you will die. D-smash is lightning quick, and very powerful. Next is U-smash. It is very powerful and will probably kill pikachu from 90-100% with good DI + momentum cancelling. Don't land on any platforms above DK while you are at high %s. F-smash is DK's slowest, but strongest smash. It will kill pika at 100% anywhere on final D. To mindgame you, DK's will charge this and D-smash and kill your sidestep, literally.

Pikachu cannot kill DK until around 100%, with the exception of the blue hitbox of thunder near the edge of the level which will kill at around 80%. Pikachu's most reliable way of killing in this Match-up is with U-smash or U-tilt to thunder. Because DK is so big, he will have a very hard time getting out of it. However, if the DK is frame perfect, he can Up-b it and the thunder will hit super armor, but this isn't likely to happen. Nairs off the level will do pretty good since it is hard for DK to dodge them, but don't use it until DK is at at least 130%. Thunder guarding is pretty useful, but you should go out farther than normal because otherwise he will just sweetspot the ledge. One VERY important thing to know about DK is that his UP-b stops ALL of his momentum. THerefore, it is very good when hit off of the level, for he will bair and then up-b, which will let him survive. However, when he does this he becomes very vulnerable, and if he decides to land on the stage, you can Charge a F-smash to kill him. He will try to mindgame you by being really close to the edge and go back and forth so you odn't know if he is going to land on the level or grab the ledge. However, you can just jump and nair him if he does this.

Off the level, Pikachu has the advantage. DK's have a really hard time getting back on the level against pikachu because of thunder, nair, and dair. Also, Thunder Jolts can help you if they try to go low, it can gimp their jump. DK's up-b has good horizontal movement, but very bad vertical momentum. If you happen to footstool DK of the cliff after he has jumped, he will most likely die. Donkey Kong has 3 spikes: Fair, Dair, and Forward B. All of these are pretty slow, but will kill you at 40% (Excluding Forward B, it is the weakest by far) if you happen to get spiked by them. Also, DK will kill you with fresh bair off the level at 90%, and diminished bair at 120%.

Levels to take DK to include Frigate Orpheon, Castle Siege, and Final Destination. Stages to ban against DK include Luigi's mansion, Pirate ship, and Brinstar.

I would say the matchup is 60-40 or 55-45 in pikachu's favor.

this is not a easy matchup for either imo. pikachus chaingrabs help him in this match up and the projectile is not something to worry about it can be canceled out by DK's bair. out of the pikachus i have faced not one of them has ever done the 0- death combo so im no sure if its possible on dk or not. pikachus u tilt to down b is escapable if you DI and AD correctly, pikachus aerial game has more combo ability but DK's bair either beats or trades hits with pikachus aerials. if the pikachu doesnt quick attack cancel mindgame and play smart to where he lands he can very likely be receiving a dk punch or side b to fsmash which most likely would kill pikachu. one of the things that Dk should watch out for is pikachus down smash since it has a big hitbox radius and dk being so big its not a good thing. i would call this a 55-45 pika favor since a 60% cg is a nice chunk of damage but its not a gaurantee that pikachu would get it in all the time.

like that sig picture you have ESAM, if there was one with the goggles pikachu that would be great <3.

Stealth Raptor said:

DK. so he hurts. like a lot. his fully charged punch has super armor frames as does his fsmash.

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His forward smash does not have super armor.

ZxChrono said:

this is not a easy matchup for either imo. pikachus chaingrabs help him in this match up and the projectile is not something to worry about it can be canceled out by DK's bair. out of the pikachus i have faced not one of them has ever done the 0- death combo so im no sure if its possible on dk or not. pikachus u tilt to down b is escapable if you DI and AD correctly, pikachus aerial game has more combo ability but DK's bair either beats or trades hits with pikachus aerials. if the pikachu doesnt quick attack cancel mindgame and play smart to where he lands he can very likely be receiving a dk punch or side b to fsmash which most likely would kill pikachu. one of the things that Dk should watch out for is pikachus down smash since it has a big hitbox radius and dk being so big its not a good thing. i would call this a 55-45 pika favor since a 60% cg is a nice chunk of damage but its not a gaurantee that pikachu would get it in all the time.

like that sig picture you have ESAM, if there was one with the goggles pikachu that would be great <3.

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The 0-death has been published recently, and it definitely would work. It's just hard as balls to pull off.

Also, thanks for the sig compliment, but didn't make it, and the person who did closed her shop.

i stand corrected i thought he did.

Well, Peach can pull off almost as much damage at the get go as Pikachu; Pikachu has CG, Peach had her Dairs, but that head start isn't enough to win the match. Pikachu's Dsmash can be escaped easily before the final blow by SDI'ing upwards (if you do get hit by it, you'll be sent in a random direction with directly up being the worst). A nice thing Pikachus can use is Fair > followup, kind of like what Fox does with his Dair (though I can't remember if Pikachu's is lagless... probably or just low enough to followup with). Pikachu can definitely do some nasty combos on you if you're not careful. One example might be: Fair > Utilt > Uair > Nair with Nair being a great off-stage KO'ing move. If you DI really well though, I don't think you have to worry about a Utilt > Thunder KO. Also, another inescapable combo that Pika has is Dthrow > Utilt x ? > Nair at early percents, but I'm sure they're gonna CG you with Fthrow/Dthrow rather than use that.

Another problem I had against good Pikachus in the past was all the QAC'ing combos. Pikachu can dart across the stage and give you an Nair to the face, a shield-poking Dair, or send a bunch of Tjolts your way. But the only way Tjolts should be a hassle is off stage since it disrupts DK's recovery (stops it for a second, so be sure to use it right after). On stage, however, Tjolts can be canceled by the usual tilts and Bair (I wanna go out on a limb and say Ftilt, Dtilt, and Bair ALL clank with Tjolts; grounded Up-B, however, would get canceled, so approaching with this can be strained sometimes).

A definite advantage DK has here is KO'ing power. Pikachu's Dsmash isn't as bad as you think it is; his Usmash isn't as deadly as Fox's;, his Fsmash needs to be sweet spotted for maximum knockback; and Thunder can only really KO in the air (watch out for trickery though; some Pikachus might Thunder after your Air Dodge is done with and you're left vulnerable) OR if you touch Pikachu's body right when the bolt strikes him— that can easily KO under 100%. But, uh, you might be able to successfully punish a Pikachu using thunder with your SA frames from the Giant Punch. There's a bit of ending lag where Pikachu pops up, but it's kinda like Metaknight's Drill Rush when he pops up, so try and punch Pikachu when the bolt strikes him (give yourself good range though as to not get hit; use your reach). Pikachu also has SA when the bolt hits him I believe, so a fully-charged Giant Punch should be enough to handle it I think. Cargo Stage Spikes too! DK can pull off one of those when near the edge, and if it throws the Pika off-guard, it could easily be a stock at around 50%.

Um, Pikachu's recovery can sometimes be easy to punish. If they're using Skull Bash, you can easily spike them, maybe by trading hits or winning the engagement. You can also punish them pretty easily with a Giant Punch if you think they're going to try and land on the stage, but Pikachus should almost never use Skull Bash since it has HUGE lag. You can even spike Pika kinda easily if he uses Up-B if you know the path and trajectory he needs to take to get back to the stage (just go for it since it seems to me like advanced Lucario Up-B without the possibility of a Wall Cling; it's always nice to gimp someone with a good recovery).

Hm... Anything else? DK may not have awesome combos like Pikachu does, but a couple of successful Dtilts that result in tripping > Down-B can easily be 20-30%. Bairs can handle a lot of Pikachu's other aerials, and I'm not sure if any of Pikachu's aerials out-prioritize the Bair. DK's Dsmash comes out quick and should be KO'ing at around 100% or more; Usmash would probably KO at 80%; 9-Punch at around 60-70%; 10-punch at 80%-90%; Bairs can kill when undiminished or sweet-spotted (don't count on much of those though); Spikes should work necessarily well; and Uair should do an okay job of KO'ing too.

Pikachu's Bair can hurt if all of the hits connect, but it has some pretty rough landing lag. His Uair is only for juggling purposes (it can't spike like it did in Melee). His tilts are ALL out-ranged by our Ftilt, and most likely our Dtilt. Pikachu's Dair pokes through shields when it hits the ground (it like releases a little shock wave), and I'm not sure if we could do a shield grab after the first hit of it connects. You should be able to escape Pikachu's Dthrow CG sometime by DI'ing towards him and footstooling him. Ehhh, DK's Down-B might not stop a lot of Pikachu's approaches since he has Tjolts and QAC'ing. And... yeah. That's about all I can think of right now; hope I contributed some. I would place this at about 50-50 or 55-45 in Pikachu's favor since those Thunders are gonna give you a rough time if you don't know how to react.

I have played anther too many times not to know this match up, I wish I would have known you were doing this so I could input some things.

55-45 pika

Ripple said:

I have played anther too many times not to know this match up, I wish I would have known you were doing this so I could input some things.

55-45 pika

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You can post something… Nowhere else to get better information on this matchup than from the guy that played the god of Pikachu so many times. D:

I think it´s 50-50 ....
In former times I hated to play pikas,
but now its fine, I mean DK has much more trouble getting used to the matchup than pika.
I think we can escape the cg with upB but im not sure... punsh with sa frames is so important!
everything else was said...

ripple, you need more upb

offstage, skull bash will get you spiked, predictable upbs will get you faired

that's all i can say since there are only two pikachu players ever and neither of them live in socal

i agree with 55/45

im bumping this thread so that everyone knows that there has already been a discussion on DK that i totally forgot about.

Lol yeah, people are awesome.

NVm, didn't see you wrote it.

ESAM said:

Lol yeah, people are awesome.

NVm, didn't see you wrote it.

Click to expand...

>_>; I wrote it

im taking the time to rewrite some things on it. overall its ussi written work though.

uptilt thunder is almos unescapeable so thats another kill combo :D

^ Ive gotten out of this combo many a times.

^ Utilt > thunder as a combo is DI dependant. Really good players make thunder a mind game more than a combo.

I don't know how many times i have to say that.

i agree that pikachu has to use a hit and run game to stay away from Dk's power attacks, and a constant barrage of thunder jolts and his up air along with sweet spotted thunders will spell the end for DK. The only way that I would use skull bash against DK is if I fully charge it and wait for DK to slip up and hit him with it when DK is left vulnerable. Basically the only way that Pika can with this match up is use his speed and sweet spot his attacks for the best results.