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Yoshi Moveset Discussion #1: Jab

Metatitan

Smash Master
Joined
Nov 3, 2008
Messages
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What i had noticed that the jigglypuff boards had done was make a moveset discussion to either clarify what each move is best for people who already used her or for people wanting to learn how to use her. Not to mention i see a lot of yoshies not using their tilts enough (tut tut) so i figured i'd start moveset discussions. Please discuss and debate the uses of yoshi's jabs as well as the pros and cons.
 

SharkAttack

Smash Lord
Joined
Dec 4, 2005
Messages
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NW Ohio
Yoshi does have great jabs. Their fast, can give good damage and can be used after many attacks. At low percentages I like jabbing my opponent after dash attacking them.
 

Metatitan

Smash Master
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Nov 3, 2008
Messages
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dash to jab is a wifi combo, ur gonna get punished badly if u use that "combo" offline. as for yoshi's jab, jab when they are at higher % because they can shield in between the jabs at lower %. also when u are in killing %, NEVER JAB A JIGGLYPUFF WHO IS AN EXPERIENCED RESTER. trust me i will rest your jab and i have plenty of victims that can vouch for me :)

jab is great for setting up a grab, hyphen smash or even an egg lay if u play ur mindgames well enough. Jab cancel to groundpound is so amazing o_O
 

MrEh

Smash Hero
Joined
Aug 24, 2008
Messages
6,652
Location
Honolulu, HI
Use it it hit things when your tilts would be too slow.

Your Jab is quick, and has decent range. I like abusing it whenever possible.
 

Blistering Speed

Smash Champion
Joined
Mar 18, 2008
Messages
2,709
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Dot Dot Dash Dot
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The 1-2 Jab Combo (A,A)

Range: Mid
Priority: High
Knockback: Low-Mid
Damage: = 3,6 (9 total)

Yoshi's Jab is great for what it was made for, a move to give him breathing space. It's also Yoshi's fastest move and is often his best option OOS. Thanks to it's little post lag it can also be used efficiently for shield pressure and smart jabbing stops a lot of defensive game, but watch out because certain characters can shield grab between the first and second hit. Often times F Tilt is better for it's range, but the Jab works great as a 'panic button'.

Yoshi's jab isn't as versatile as some as you can't go from the first jab into a grab, because of Yoshi's laggy grab, but for an extra 3% you can Jab to F Tilt. At lower percentages, you can go straight from jab into a D Tilt, but most use B Air to transition from defence to offence smoothly.

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Tail Swipe (F Tilt)

Range: Mid-High
Priority: High-Mid
Knockback: Low
Damage: Pointable in 3 directions, Upward (10dmg), Downward (8dmg) and Straight (9dmg)

This move is arguably Yoshi's best ground move. Very fast, with decent range (second only to D Tilt), good priority and a great comboing move. The upward tilted F Tilt should most always be used as the primary direction, as it does the best damage and it also works great as an aerial deterrent. This move should be your primary ground move, fast and versatile, it's the move that 'rarely fails you.'

At lower percentages this move can chain into itself thanks to its relatively low knockback and the fact it sends people straight up. At higher damages, this move also sets up for an U Air combo/kill. You can also link the first hit of Jab into F Tilt. This move can also follow up virtually any aerial except D Air (landing lag).

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Tail Whip (D Tilt)

Range: Very High
Priority: Mid
Knockback: Mid (no longer fixed)
Damage: 10dmg

Just as F Tilt is your aerial deterrent, D Tilt should be your ground deterrent. Hitting with the mid section of the tail also helps it works as an effective gimper. It is also safe on block, unlike it's more used counterpart, the D Smash. The key aspect of this move over others is it's range, which whilst the hitbox is slightly smaller then the actual tail, is still Yoshi's largest ranged move.

At lower percentages, you can go straight from the two jabs into a D Tilt. B Air follows from this well, quickly swapping from offence to defence. Note that this move can be teched, declining from its usefulness. None the less, it's still a decent and underused move.

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Tail Uppercut (U Tilt)

Range: Low
Priority: Low-Mid
Knockback: Low
Damage: 10dmg

This is a hard move to fit in, because whilst good, there are often better alternatives. U Smash often fits where it could and does the job better. It is however great at low percent combo’s and this is what it should be used for. Use U Smash over this in intercepting aerial foes, as the tail’s quite slow in getting to it’s full height. Don’t use this outside of a combo either as if shielded it has fairly punishable lag. It also has another use in beating out predicted spotdodges, people expecting an U Air can get a surprise if you U Tilt from an empty SH.

This follows up well from low knockback moves which put people off the ground, prime examples being F Tilt, B Air and U Tilt (at low percentages they can be chained, similar to F Tilt). At higher percentages, you can also go straight from this into an U Air.

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Headbutt (F Smash)

Range: Low
Priority: High-Mid
Knockback: Very High
Damage: 14dmg (uncharged)

This is Yoshi’s highest knockback move and it should be used as nothing other then a KO move because of this. It’s rare that you get a chance to use it because of the move’s poor range but this works out quite well as it’s then fresh and at best KO potential. This kills at around 115% from the center of FD on Mario with DI. The pull back on the F Smash can be used riskily to dodge an attack and counter attack, Stutter stepping helps with this, but the main time you will use this is to punish lag, most likely landing lag.

You should always be looking for an opportunity to use an F Smash when your opponent is at high percentage, but unfortunately this opportunity does not rise very often, so when you get chance to, use it!

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Tail Slam Dance (D Smash)

Range: Mid
Priority: High-Mid
Knockback: Mid-High
Damage: 14dmg (uncharged)

Whilst we can all agree that D Smash has been nerfed from its great Melee counterpart, it still has its uses. Like many D Smashes, this is great for punishing rolls and that should be its primary use. This move shouldn't really be used for killing, it doesn't have much KO potential but it does come out very quickly, so for someone gimpable it can be good to just knock them off stage, setting up for edgeguard.

It's a decent panic move, but jab and F Tilt normally do the job quicker and better. Overall, a decent move with a few utilitys, but it's rarely the best move for the situation.

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Pullback Slam (U Smash)

Range: Mid
Priority: Very High (the head is invincible)
Knockback: High-High
Damage: 14dmg (uncharged)

A very versatile move, effective in alot of situations. It kills decently, ranging from 120 to 150 % and can be used as an approach thanks to sliding U Smash. The invincibility frames on the head means its great on intercepting aerial approaches and just in general stopping your opponent. This move has deceptive range, whilst nothing miraculous it's easy to underestimate so don't think it's Yoshi's Rest or anything.

You make a choice with this move, you save it for the kills or you use it in the everyday battle, both are useful in there own right. Don't forget that this move follows after a release grab.

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Big Boot! (N Air)

Range: High - MId
Priority: Low-High (rumoured invincibility or armour)
Knockback: High-Mid
Damage: 10dmg

Yoshi´s N Air is a great move. All of it's stats are good and is Yoshi's premier edge guard move thanks to it's knockback. Offstage you'll be getting kills as low as 100% with this, which combined with DJ heavy armour make it a force to be reckoned with. Note that you shouldn't use this as an approach as it's got some punishable after lag when SH'd (but hey, thats what B Air is for).

This move also has some great range essentially a bubble of hitbox around Yoshi and thanks to it's quick startup it's a good C-C-C-Combo Breaker.This thing should usually be your go to move when you´re near the edge along with eggs, for edgeguards, recovering and ledgehopping.

Overall, we can all agree that N Airing while DJing is not only AAA, it also looks like Yoshi can levitate himself Mewtwo style.

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Aerial Crazy Dinosaur Flick "ACDF" (B Air)

Range: Mid - High
Priority: Low-High
Knockback: Mid - Low
Damage: 13dmg

This move is IMO Yoshi's best move. It shield stabs, it multi hits, it auto cancels from a SH, meaning it can lead into great combos, I recommend following from this with any of Yoshi's Tilts and occasionaly the D or U Smash. This is pretty much Yoshi's best approach, well it's certainly his best from the air. To top all this off, it's also got big range from that tail. It's priority is also good so it's going to go through a fair few attacks. With alot of characters, B Air fences are basically uncounterable, because even with good shielding, properly spaced you can always react to what the other person counters with. Obviously, if you want to approach people infront RARing it is very useful.

Other misc uses are it working well as an anti edgeguard and also for cancelling out alot of projectiles (making it's approach even better).

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From the moveset discussion I made when I used to play Yoshi, it's not like the metagame has advanced enough for the information to not still be valid. Sup Yoshi's, dunno if any of you'll remember me lol.
 

bigman40

Smash Master
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Oct 11, 2007
Messages
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Just another day.
Pros:
- Good to use after tilts
- Can push opponents off nicely
- Quick, and able to ping other attacks fairly decently

Cons:
- Can be SDI out of easily (if opponent is attempting to space)
- Does NOT literately combo until at 30%
- Does NOT cover yoshi whole body as tilts do
 

Metatitan

Smash Master
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@ blistering, the moveset descriptions are a tad vague and the metagame has changed for yoshi, but not as much as others considering not enough people use him/are good with him
 

.Marik

is a social misfit
Joined
Sep 2, 2008
Messages
3,695
They are moderately useful.

Since they are only Jabs, don't overuse them. The priority of them isn't that good.

But compared to most other Jabs, they are probably one of the best in the game.

Jabs also make for great combos', such as Dash-Attacks+Jabs, and Jab+DownB.
 

Elefterios

Smash Journeyman
Joined
Jun 16, 2005
Messages
488
Location
Montreal
He probably means UpB. this goes to what I said, if you try to Jab combo Marth at low %s, then he can UpB inbetween our jabs.
I'm pretty sure he can counter as well. I had it done to me twice in a row >_> . But yeah, I'll test it out at a the next smashfest or something.
 

Yosheon

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 7, 2009
Messages
35
Location
United States
Yoshi's jabs are great, and jab-cancelling into one of your tilts is very effective.

I'm still wondering if Yoshi could get someone in the jab lock...
 

bigman40

Smash Master
Joined
Oct 11, 2007
Messages
3,859
Location
Just another day.
Yoshi's jabs are great, and jab-cancelling into one of your tilts is very effective.

I'm still wondering if Yoshi could get someone in the jab lock...
Yoshi can't jab lock people. You can't jab cancel to other moves though cause it confuses them when they're trying to shield.
 

Yosheon

Smash Cadet
Joined
May 7, 2009
Messages
35
Location
United States
Dang, it would've been pretty cool if Yoshi could jab-lock people.

Also, I'm glad that his jabs can cancel out a bunch of projectiles.
 

auroreon

Smash Ace
Joined
Aug 31, 2007
Messages
583
Jab Cancel > Tilts can be powershielded I think, at least people were able to when I tested it out. Jab is epic fail against Marth.
 
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