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Sonic frame data

ShadowLink84

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Found by using the debug code

Jump: 6 frames (to be in the air)
Landing: (lagless) 2 frames

1st Jab: Frame 3
Lasts: 20 frames
hitbox duration: 1

2nd jab: Frame 2
starts: (after 1st jab) Frame 12
Lasts: 22 frames
hitbox duration: 1 frame

3rd jab: Hits frame 3
starts: Frame 24 (after first and second jab)
Lasts: 32 frames
hitbox duration: 1 frame

Ftilt: Frame 6 and frame 8
Lasts: 34 frames
hitbox duration (1st hit): 1 frame
hitbox duration (2nd hit) : frames 8-12 =5 frames


Dtilt: Frame 6
ends: frame 27
Hitbox duration: frame 6-9
Crouching while performing a Dtilt will actually cause Sonic to go back into a crouching position unless he does another Dtilt. Stupid huh?

Utilt:
1st hit: frame 7
2nd hit: frame 8
duration: 8-9
3rd hit: frame 18
duration: 18-20
Lasts: 48 frames


Fsmash: Frame 18
Lasts: 44 frames
hitbox duration: Frame 18-22

Dsmash: Frame 17
Lasts: 57 frames
durationof hitbox: frame 17-37 (not 100% sure)

Usmash: Frame 19
Lasts: 65 frames
duration of hitbox: 19-32 (not 100% sure)

Side B: Frame 17
invincibility: Approximately 4-6 frames
Ends: Frame 11 (when jump canceled)
Frame: 8 (shield cancel)
Frame: 11 (grabbing)

Down B: Frame 17
Ends: Frame 38 (psuedo cancel)
Jumps: Frame 18
It can actually jump straight up like the side B but it is only on frame 18 which is 1 frame after it can actually hurt someone.

up B: Frame 5
Invincible frames: Had a hard time but it appears to be from frames 4-10.
Lasts: 19 frames

Neutral B: Frame 51 (not shortened)
shortened: Frame 26

Fair: Frame 5
duration of hitbox : frame 5-15
Lasts: 36 frames
Landing frames: 30

Uair: 5 frames (first hit) frame 14 (second hit)
Ends: Frame 38
Landing frames: 22
hitbox frames (1st hit): 5-7 invincible on frame 6???
hitbox frames: 14-16

Nair: Frame 6
lasts: 46 frames
Landing time: 14 frames

Bair: frame 13 (tough one the stupid game kept making me airdodge instead)
Ends:Frame 37
duration of hitbox: 13-16
Landing time during bair: 11 frames

Dair: Frame 16
duration of hitbox: 16-36? (kinda tough getting it )
Ends: Frame 46
Landing time: 30 frames

Grab: Frame 6
Ends: Frame 29

Dash grab: frame 10
end: 39 frames

Pivot grab: frame 10
ends: frame 35

Up throw: Frame 23
Ends: Frame 47

Fthrow: Frame 10
Ends: frame 42

Dthrow: Frame 18
Ends: Frame 87 (due to hit delay)
opponent bounces: Frame 54

Bthrow: frame 43
Ends:66

Side taunt: Frame 1
Ends: Frame 103

Down taunt: Starts frame 1
Ends: Frame 95

Up taunt: frame 1
ends: Frame 79

Spot dodge: Lasts 24 frames

Forward roll dodge: 31 frames

back roll dodge: 31 frames

Air dodge: 58 frames

Dash speed: Crosses FD in 57 frames.
Hits the halfway point at frame 30.
Top speed reached: frame 31

Dash attack: Frame 5
duration: frame 5-23
Ends: Frame 43


Out of shield options:
Shield: Frames 1-7
Shield disappears frame 8
Shield cool down: 7 frames
Frame is brought back up frame 8
Total time to raise and drop shields: 8 frames
Total time before any action can be taken: 14 frames.

Powershield window: 10 frames

OOS Options:
Grab: Unaffected by shield, Frame 6.
Usmash: Frame 2 (hits frame 20)
Uair: Frame 7 (hits frame 9)
up B: Frame 2 (sonic goes up frame 25)

you get 1 frame for jumping out of shield, so all moves thata re done that involve jumping out of shield gain +1 to activation time.
The exception to this is Uair which requires sonic to be in the air before it can be used.

Any ground moves gain +7 to activation time.
This is due to cool down time which is 7 frames long after the shield has been dropped.
Frame 8 is when the move begins.

Frame 8=sonic begins jab
Frame 10= jab hitbox appears.

The only moves that are not affected by the shield cooldown time are moves that are used out of a jump which gain +1 to activation time.

Uair requires 6 frame wait time in order to be in the air.
So it hits on frame 9 making it faster than every other option available besides his ^B.

Jab has slightly more range but less priority and 1 frame less speed. Making it a less applicable option


edit: I did not find out how long the hitboxes endure because it is rather difficult to time it @_@.

Edit2: HAAA I FORGOT THE DASH ATTACK!
Edit3: I forgot the grabs how noob.
Edit4: I am going to sleep to prepare for Apex ****.
edit5: I added in the duration of the hitboxes for most of the moves, I am having a bit of trouble with ome of them though.
 

MarKO X

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fair, uair, and nair all start on frame 5
grab, ftilt and dtilt are on frame 6

fsmash is the superior smash attack.
 

darkNES386

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Please ask any questions incase you're confused.
IASA = Interrupt As Soon As (aka, you can shield/attack at this point)

How I get my data: I use an external USB capture device (Dazzle) with the program called virtualDub. Once the footage is captured VirtualDub can replay it as much as I want with the corrected frame rate. I hold shield after a ground attack and count the frame just prior to the shield going up. Aerial attacks go until Sonic begins a tumble from his spring... so spring aerial attack, tumble animation means it ended.

If you'd like to learn more about my capture method please go here:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=193379


As of right now I am in the process of gather attack data since I spent a great deal of time already on Sonic's movement.


Simple Pivot (standing and turning in place)
I’ve been able to do the following as early as shown, it’s my understanding that you only need 1 frame to turn though…On 2: shield On 3: tilts On 4: jab

Dash (running)
Dash Start: Frames (7)
1: Trip (73 total) can occur, 7-11 Invincy?
1-3: Initial animation, can't be interrupted. (Sonic magically slides since he has to accelerate so fast, as he hunches over)
After 4: Can side-B
5-7: A new Dash Start in the reverse direction can begin. (1 frame as sonic starts to turn, then goes back to the initial Dash animation above)
8th: Foxtrot or Dash animation begins

Foxtrot (after Dash Start): 29
11-20: Begin a new Dash Start
-always ends at same time regardless of length traveled
-must fully finish before he can do regular attacks or shield
-jump, dash attack, usmash or side B at anytime.

Out of Dash Options
RunAround – 23 IASA starts:17
Screech Stop – 19 IASA: 14-19
Dash-around (after Dash Start) 20 IASA:
Shield Stop
Attack: 15
Standing Grab: 1 shield frame prior (fastest)

Covering FD
From startup to 1/2: 30
Full: 57, 58 Sonic falls off edge
*So basically Sonic takes 3 frames to accelerate to top speed, oh snap
*Sonic is not affected by dashing past a character.

Jumps
Jump to freefall – total of 38 (Regardless of short hop or full jump)
1-6: Sonic leaves ground after
7-10: initial jump before going into ball form
11-37:stays in ball
38: out of ball and begins to enter free fall

shorthop length (no fastfall) – lands on 46
shorthop (fastfall ASAP) – 40 < best I can get
fullhop (no fastfall) – shield on 71
fullhop (fastfall ASAP) – shield on 57 < best I can get

Dodges
Spot Dodge: 21 Invincy ends
Air Dodge: 30 Invincy ends
Roll: 32 frames till shield is back out (on 20 Invincy ends)
*tested with both triple falco pawnage and bowser flame (I was wary of invincy frames ending when landing on air dodge).

Shield Stop: 20
Attack: 15 (IASA starts)
Standing Grab: 1 shield frame prior (fastest)

Grabs
Standing Grab: 6 frames
Standing Grab Whiff: Shield on 30
Dashning Grab: 10 frames
Dashning Grab Whiff: Shield on 40

MANY OF THESE HAVE NOT BEEN FULLY DETERMINED YET. THANKFULLY TENKI HELPED POINTED OUT ALOT OF THE DIFFERENT USEUFL INFORMATION WE CAN GATHER.

SPRING:- sits for 240 frames (4 seconds)
1: Sonic prepares to be launched
2: Spring appears
5: Sonic leaves spring
10-14: Sonic is definitely invincible (needs more research)
18: IASA Start
37-50: Sonic reaches apex
-From apex dair>autocancel>shield takes 45 frames
-starting dair between frames 18 and 28 result in no auto cancel)
-fastest possible cancelable dair takes 67 frames total (Spring>Dair>autoCancel>shields 5 frames later)

Down-B:
- Charge:
- - - - Startup lag/length until single-charge's release (I heard that B-sticking might help get a perfect single-charge [?]) – 12 to charge aura, frame 16 aura appears for SDR
- - - - "Spin out"/ending lag (try holding down until the charge dies, or alternatively/easier, total length of a 0-charge down-B [like if you instantly let go of down] and subtract the startup lag frames)
- Single-charge data (flat level):
- - - - Speed: Length of time to cross 1/4, 1/2, 3/4, all of FD.
- - - - Turnaround: Length of time to perform a turnaround, until you can SDJ.
- Full-charge data (flat level):
- - - - Speed: Length of time to cross 1/4, 1/2, 3/4, all of FD.
- - - - Turnaround: Length of time to perform a turnaround, until you can SDJ. – 36 frames, 37th frame is SDJ… also frame when hitbox returns

Side-B:
- Startup lag (minimum time until shield comes out - Bonus is to test minimum charge until you can VSDJ) 8th frame in ball… for vsdj (not angled), begins moving up on 9th frame.
- Single charge side-B (# of frames from startup until it starts the hop - I suspect that shield might come earlier) – 9 till shield comes out (takes 2 from startup)
- Hop length (flat level) - from release to landing. 30 frames
- Invincibility frames on: ____

60 frames for spin dash jump to end with Sonic in free fall

BONUS:
- Length of time for Spinshot to cover 1/4 and 1/2 of FD
 

JayBee

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so, it would mean that the best OOs option from a close ranged attack would be jab.

jab is better than most people realize. i hope the mario/luigi boards have info i can compare, because i think sonic's jab and marios can be used in similar fashion. at least on the first hit.

i know this would be hard work, but if someone could show clips of moves with thier hitboaxes highlighted in slow motion, that would be really steak.
 

ShadowLink84

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Did you actually make contact with anything during these attacks?

I get 19 frames total for a jab if it doesn't connect, 20 if it does.... stuff like that.

I counted the frame data from when the move has not connected.
simply because the game ADDS frames in order to accomplish the hit delay much like it adds in frames when you slow down gameplay to 1/4th gameplay
It would not be accurate if I gave the frame data when the move connected with the opponent.


Also did you hold shield as each ground finished and did you mash B as each aerial finished?
Yes. However its possible that I counted wrong because the buttons used interfered at some points.

I plan to go over it again in the morning and check everything. if you find anything wrong I will not at all be bothered to change it.

Concerning the aerials, I simply double jumped because of Sonics unique position during the first frame of his jump.
It was much quicker for me anyway.




Read my next post to clarify.....
..
.
.
.
What?


@jaybee: Not really, Sonic does not have much range to his jab so its hard to use it OOS effectively. Most of the time the opponent uses quick moves at close range with more range than the jab.
 

darkNES386

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ftilt
Hitbox out - 6
Ends - 35
Safety - 16
See... right now I checked ftilt and this is what I got:

Ftilt -35 (meaning if he whiffs, frame 36 is the earliest he can shield)
Disjointed hitbox: starts on: 6 (results in double hit, requires opponent to be directly next to you)
Normal hitbox: 8 (this is when Sonic full extends)
I suspect frame 7 is a single hit, but I need to specifically test for it when I can.
Single hit – 41 total
Double hit - 46 total

Now, DJ explains that the
"Ends = time the attack lasts if it is NOT blocked"
"Safety = If this move is shielded, enemy has this many frames to attack you if they drop shield instantly to counter-attack while you are still lagging from the attack"

So what I am so frustrated about is right I have no captured video in true frames that can show me what happens when a shield is hit... how many frames are added (since obviously they are if DJ stated without hitting)

What I would suspect is that if Sonic hits a shield with only the second part

safety frames = miss total - frames up to hitbox + shield stun - shield drop

16 = 35 - 8 + shield stun - 15 ---> shield stun = 2

... that makes sense I think.

We can't simply say.... I'm going to fitlt and have it blocked and see when I come back into my shield because that information is useless if the opponent can't drop their shield fast enough to jab/attack.

I would do the following:

Attack - total (miss)
Hitbox Frame Location (disjoint description if applicable)
Determine safety in this fashion:

counter ("safety")= total (for miss) - hitbox location (cause they already happened) + shield stun frames (this gives the opponent more frames to work with) - shield drop frames (which should be 15).

safety = total - hit - shield stun + shield drop




Now... a shield grab comes out faster than a dropped shield attack.

When sonic reaches out of a standing grab, he connects on frame 6. You only need one frame of shield to actually peform a shield grab (7 frames total for Sonic). Simply state each character's shield grab time (1 + frames till grab connects) and they can know the bare minimum they need if they wish to do that.

According to DJ's thread. Sonic fsmash has 12 Safety frames... but his fsmash hitbox comes out in 17 (assuming 12 takes into account the shield drop frames as I showed above)... it will be impossible for two Sonics to ever attack out of shield the other Sonic with an fsmash... however, an ftilt (8 frames... since there's no way they're standing on top of each other after the fsmash pushes the shield) would be able to connect.
 

ShadowLink84

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I put stuff since I do not want it to take a good chunk of the page.

When I was compiling the frame data I wanted to first do it for when the attack whiffs , or rather, when it is moving its fastest.
Simply the basic data of the move.
When it has a hitbox, when the move ends , etc etc.Similar to the brawl character frame database that we have in tactical discussion.
To be a a small update with some more accuracy as to when these moves come out.

What you are talking about is providing the frame advantage data which is something I was already planning to post later on when I had a bit more time. (I should have mentioned it within my initial post sorry).

Concerning hitbox location, i believe Djbrowny already assembled several pictures showing the location of the hitboxes during the first frame that they appear.
I do not believe there is anything showing how they move during the attack primarily because there is no reliable method of showing them, especially since hitboxes in the smash series is so sloppily done.

I find it fruitless to say how much of a hit delay each attack receives (unless you want it for dictating how many frames the opponent has to SDI upon being hit).
 

darkNES386

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Just answer this and I'll sleep easy tonight:
1) Shield stun, is that the correct term for additional attack frames added when an attack connects with a shield?
2) Is this number the same for each "hit" or is it unique to each attack?

I sleep restless tonight... with additional comments:

1) I see nothing wrong with multiple people getting on frame data.
2) We need to establish some common ground

e.g.
Make sure we're finding the fastest way to end the moves:
Hold shield on ground attacks (I use y because it's more reliable than R)
Mash B on aerial attacks
It's almost more important to tell people who care when you actually can interrupt (IASA) than when the move animation finishes. It's less thinking and it makes finding the best/suited options easier.

Frame 1 of each attack needs to be established.
Sonic's dtilt may have a crouch, but if you start a second during IASA frames then you won't actually have Sonic crouching. When Sonic does an ftilt he may scoot forward a frame or 2 before bending over, but if you execute it perfectly you won't see those.
 

Browny

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Wow thats awesome, all my numbers were +/- 1 frame except for like, 2 attacks :)

BTW on the topic of safety, I chose the method i did to compare oos options.

For example, I have sonic as having 12 frames of vulnerability if his fsmash is shielded. This is useful since we can determine how safe the attacks is to use in various matchups. such a move is completely unsafe vs marth, since his fsmash hits on 11. if he was to drop shield as past as possible, you will be fsmashed. vs characters like falco for example, his fsmash is just slow enough such that he cant punish you for it (since it has the range to do so). just about the only thing he can do to it is laser or reflector when you consider the shield knockback

My determination of safety used no equation, I simply played the game in 1/4 speed, attacked a shield, dropped shield as fast as possible and re-shielded with sonic and counted the frames. it has the same degree of accuracy all my other numbers have, which is +/-1 frame
 

darkNES386

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SL, DNes, I love you both. <3<3<3<3<3<3.
You know I feel the same way about you Umby
My determination of safety used no equation, I simply played the game in 1/4 speed, attacked a shield, dropped shield as fast as possible and re-shielded with sonic and counted the frames. it has the same degree of accuracy all my other numbers have, which is +/-1 frame
Doesn't power shielding change those numbers?

I'm going to get this cleared up this weekend when I get back home. In the meantime I guess I"ll have to put my project on hold.
 

ShadowLink84

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My determination of safety used no equation, I simply played the game in 1/4 speed, attacked a shield, dropped shield as fast as possible and re-shielded with sonic and counted the frames. it has the same degree of accuracy all my other numbers have, which is +/-1 frame
Dont use 1/th speed mode. It adds in frames in order to smooth out gameplay. So it may actually be less

You know I feel the same way about you Umby
Doesn't power shielding change those numbers?
Yes
If you perfectly powershield (frame is up on frame 1) and power shield. There is no shieldstun and you can drop the shield in one frame rather than frame 4.

So you'll raise your shield on frame 1, drop it on shield 2 and be able to act.

I do not believe that powershielding causes hitdelay.

I'm going to get this cleared up this weekend when I get back home. In the meantime I guess I"ll have to put my project on hold.
Get home it will help.

Just answer this and I'll sleep easy tonight:
1) Shield stun, is that the correct term for additional attack frames added when an attack connects with a shield?
No. Shieldstun is the amount of extra frames that your opponent remains in their shield upon their shield being hit.

Fr example normally when you raise and drop your shield, its around 5 frames.
1 frame to raise, 4 frames to drop.

If you are hit, shieldstun extends the frames you are in it. So you would be in it for 3 more frames.

Hit delay is the extra number of frames that are added to your attack upon hitting a shield.
So normally your move is 38 frames and it increases to 43.

With these two numbers, you ca then calculate the amount of frame advantage.

-12 frames meaning your opponent can hit you within those 12 frames (assuming they are in range)
+3 frames meaning the opposite, where your opponent is stuck in shield for 3 frames.

2) Is this number the same for each "hit" or is it unique to each attack?
no, shieldstun is dependent on each individual move.
Like for Sonics Ftilt, if we could seperate the two Ftilt moves (which we can since the first hitbox hits behind him.), it would have less hitstun because it has less knockback.
The second hit would add more because of having greater knockback.

I sleep restless tonight... with additional comments:

1) I see nothing wrong with multiple people getting on frame data.
2) We need to establish some common ground

e.g.
Make sure we're finding the fastest way to end the moves:
Hold shield on ground attacks (I use y because it's more reliable than R)
Mash B on aerial attacks
It's almost more important to tell people who care when you actually can interrupt (IASA) than when the move animation finishes. It's less thinking and it makes finding the best/suited options easier.

Frame 1 of each attack needs to be established.
Sonic's dtilt may have a crouch, but if you start a second during IASA frames then you won't actually have Sonic crouching. When Sonic does an ftilt he may scoot forward a frame or 2 before bending over, but if you execute it perfectly you won't see those.
The only problem I have is that the debug code I use disables the start button. I do not have the latest one so I cant pause the game. It is rather distressing.
 

Chis

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Good work ShadowLink, I've been waiting for new frame data for a while now.
 

Kinzer

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Plus AFAIK it doesn't hurt to get multiple people to do the same thing just to confirm what is.

Not to mention the more frame data we have, the better.

I think Shadow did a d*** fine job of confirming some/(all?) of DJ's FD (minus "You're too slow!") and added in some new things, no?

Hey Shadow is it by any chance possible for you to be able to tell us what opponents can do to Sonic from a D-Throw tech? I've heard things like how MK only gets grabbed again if he tries it, whereas other characters will probably have enough time to jab/grab Sonic, and how it might be different at different %ages.

Just some food for though, I appreciate being able to do this and get it done at all.
 

darkNES386

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Alright, thanks for clearing some of that up. The method I use is VirtualDub with my USB capture device. It properly syncs the video for playback (so that the frames run smoothly of course).

I think it will be easiest to start with no hits of any kind and make sure we have common ground on that. Then I'll move on to shieldstun.

How would we discuss/do we care about added frames from connecting? While those frames may be consistent... the hitlag suffered by the opponent will vary greatly. Correct?
 

ShadowLink84

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Alright, thanks for clearing some of that up. The method I use is VirtualDub with my USB capture device. It properly syncs the video for playback (so that the frames run smoothly of course).
Oh okay, that sounds good too ^_^

I think it will be easiest to start with no hits of any kind and make sure we have common ground on that. Then I'll move on to shieldstun.
Cool it sounds like a plan and since i already put it there I am sure we can assemble the data and ensure that its accurate.
Like how Ftilt ends on frame 35 for you but ends on frame 34 for me.
We can easily go over the frame data.

How would we discuss/do we care about added frames from connecting? While those frames may be consistent... the hitlag suffered by the opponent will vary greatly. Correct?
For myself I don't care too much from when a move has successfully struck the opponent (they get hit, take damage) because it really does not matter what happens at that point.
I mean we can find out how many frames the oppoent would have to SDI or DI upon being hit.


I am more concerned about the shieldstun and finding out the frame advantage.


@Tenki: I love you too.
 

darkNES386

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Awesome Shadow. I'll be keeping track of my frame data in my first post of this thread. We can compare notes as we go along.

Once we map out all of Sonic's frame data I'd like to try and pick up on that advanced Sonic video. Something similar to this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-DTsUsMkeM

SL, DNes, I love you both. <3<3<3<3<3<3.
You know I feel the same way about you Umby
I love you.
@Tenki: I love you too.
So much love in this thread=)
 

Kinzer

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Not from this end of the internet, I'll just take the silence as a no Shadow. :(
 

Browny

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It provides a much more detailed and accurate method of acquiring the frame data.
tbh, its more accurate. but my numbers are more detailed. you gotta add things like frame advantage (even though sonic has none which benefit him) to determine the safety, and the auto cancel frames on his aerials, which afaik only uair has
 

darkNES386

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DJ and everyone else. I'd liek to think that how this is going to happen is post #1 and post#3 will continue to be updated by us as we try to report all useful information we can.

Along the way it would be helpful for others (such as yourself, tenki, kinzer) point out what we should be looking for and what is going to be useful.

What's the best way to find out when an aerial finishes? I've got 3 different ideas to test:

1) Do an aerial and then another attack as soon as possible (stick with the same second attack each time such as nair or HA to make the specific frame you're looking for easier to find)

2) Do aerials near the ledge and the attack finishes when Sonci is able to "lock-on" to the ledge... this will obviously be more difficult for dair.

3) Anytime Sonic has used his upB and then does an attack... he enters his spining tumble animation once the attack finishes.

Like I said, check out post #3 and let us know what else you want researched. Feel free to question any numbers that are questionable or statements that seem confusing.
 

Kinzer

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Up-Throw,please check how quick Sonic can react or its IASA frames.

Keyboard really messed up,get admin to contact me on AIM ASAP!I'll be online,promise.

Took 30 minutes to type all this,why is it backwards?
 

Kinzer

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Don't forget higher % follow-ups with incorrect DI *wink wink.*

I'm getting fast @ this but still annoying.
 

Umby

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Is it possible to get data for how long the hitboxes for Sonic's attacks last separate from how long the move animation itself lasts?
 

Kinzer

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He's asking if it's possible to capture the entire duration the hitbox of an attack is out.

Let's say Sonic's Forward Smash lasted 40 frames in total after release, Umby wants to know if it lastes from frame 15 to frame 30. This will tell us that Sonic has about 25 dead frames in his FSmash.
 

Tenki

Smash Hero
Joined
Apr 3, 2008
Messages
6,966
Location
GA
Four requests:

- Jab 1 (when can you move WITH contact?)

- Screech stop (IASA to say, jab).
EDIT: I'm wondering if different speeds give you different screech stop times.

- Dash turnaround (IASA to jab [DPC])

- Foxtrot (Startup+duration until you can re-foxtrot - assuming you let go of control stick immediately after frame 1)

XD sorry lol

Also, are ending frames (for U-air, specifically) the # of frames until you can double jump, or the number of frames until you get a regular landing?

If it's the first one, then I'd also like to request what frame you can do a lagless landing - it shouldn't be too far from the last hit...
 

ShadowLink84

Smash Hero
Joined
Sep 12, 2005
Messages
9,007
Location
Middle of nowhere. Myrtle Beach
Four requests:

- Jab 1 (when can you move WITH contact?)
With contact?
Approximately 3 frames later.
Mainly due to the hitdelay.

- Screech stop (IASA to say, jab).
EDIT: I'm wondering if different speeds give you different screech stop times.
it does not affect screech stop , I will have the data up once im done skinning a bird though, I have so much stuff to do.


Also, are ending frames (for U-air, specifically) the # of frames until you can double jump, or the number of frames until you get a regular landing?
The ones I placed were until you could perform another double jump.
Uair auto cancels when you shorthop.
Sonic has to be in his upright frame before he lands.


If it's the first one, then I'd also like to request what frame you can do a lagless landing - it shouldn't be too far from the last hit...
Updated to include some of the duration of the hitboxes. I am not 100% accurate on the ones in the air but those for the ground should be correct.
I also made a small error on Nair, I accidentally counted 5 frames it was actually 6, my apologies.
 
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