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New Marth Tech- Shield Breaker Bouncing

Remzi

Remzi

formerly VaBengal
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Yes, yes, the MBR strikes again with yet another Marth AT. This one is what I like to call Shield Breaker (SB) Bouncing.

Explanation:

Ok, so I think by now we all know that a fully charged Shield Breaker in midair creates an extremely large horizontal boost. What we've just found out is that you can SB again immediately after and receive another boost of equal(?) velocity. You can also B-reversal the SB and gain a boost in the opposite direction.

You'll likely only be using this when you get knocked really high in the air and are somewhere near the stage's upper blast zone. Immediately double jump and charge a shield breaker when in this situation and you should be able to create a second (and third if you are high enough in the air) boost in either direction.

Here is how it looks: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ccVNf4O4PTk (Watch in HQ if you know whats good for you, we SHOULD have a better quality video up soon)

Utility:

-Easy horizontal recovery from high up
-Land on the ground safely (avoid juggles)
-Avoid being edgeguarded while recovering

This looks pretty awesome so far, hopefully it's usefulness in game will live up to it's seemingly high potential.

Credit to BarDulL for showing me this. He deserves most of the credit, all I did is publicize it in the MBR and make a video + this thread.

Thoughts and/or Comments?
 
Conti

Conti

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wow, neat tech... not gunna lie, =] good find... [too bad ill never use ;) ]

gunna make recovering against MK and people a bit easier, and avoid gimps with "teh mindgames"
 
Pr0phetic

Pr0phetic

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Looks interesting, good find Bardull! So Marth actually has two high potential ATs =]

When I first saw this I was like is he talking about wavebouncing a SB? 0.o Then I read it lol
 
Shaya

Shaya

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...For a long time, it's been a major ISSUE that Marth even with the awesome horizontal boost from shieldbreaker, could never really recover above the stage. He has to land, in a predictable location, and getting to the ground is the hard part, REMEMBER OUR BIG GOD **** BLIND SPOT!

Hence he'd be forced to go for under the stage, and most likely requiring a dolphin slash. Which is generally not great for us, we're putting ourselves at risk of being edge hogged. Then afterwards we're involved with the whole TRIPLE JUMP GLITCH, making it extremely difficult for Marth to get back onto the stage against several characters...

This however, used intelligently, alleviates one of Marth's most annoying recovery quirks (a huge horizontal distance, but over all **** recovery option). Recover up above the stage, with the 'practical' option of instantly pushing yourself under the stage to dolphin slash if need to [via a wavebounce/b-reversal]. Or even FURTHER onto the stage (whilst still moving him LOWER WITH THE HUGE HORIZONTAL BOOST!) that I don't think many character's dash speeds could even reach.

The versatility, and continual boost you get from this (I wonder if the momentum keeps reducing?), is actually... Potentially really fantastic. But really, a versatile (i.e. many options) recovery move from Marth? That's great in itself. Move over Meta Knight!
Click to expand...
For the longest time, the Marth Back Room's true goal has been to do one thing:
Make the meta knight match up BETTER.
Through various things we've probably helped the ground part of the game (hence all our match ups),

the only remaining issue was gimp city, and well the solution? "GIVE MARTH AN EPIC COOL SUPER COOL RECOVERY TECHNIQUE", 6-7 days later after my proclaimation, here this comes hahaha.
^ Stupidity, by the way.

I really like this, and I really think this could be AMAZING for Marth in terms of boosting his survivability against the characters who not only can actually gimp him, but can also hinder his ability to get back onto the stage.

By the way, Marth's fully charged shieldbreaker has 78 frames start up. And from that point its 19 frames for every 1/3rd or so of final destination boost... (and 30 odd frames of ending lag after each one)
 
L

lolgrec

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lol whoever thought of shield breaking after the fully charged SB? it was something as simple as that and look at the blossoming potential of it...the marth boards are truly teh greatest boards and so are the people 8) MK, your days are numbered, sir...
 
Asimio

Asimio

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Great find, but I can't really seem to get where it's going to be used though. If you're that high up, you can get to the edge anyway to avoid being juggled, and even if you do that won't Marth still be vulnerable to aerials whizzing across like that?
 
BanjoKazooiePro

BanjoKazooiePro

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That's pretty cool, and useful for recovering. When you do the second SB, though, does the momentum change the amount of damage to your opponents shield, or is it still just based on how long it has been charged for?
 
L

lolgrec

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yeah nah i know it isn't anything that is earth shattering, yet at least, its like anything else that is new that comes up, its utilities will be discovered later and just how useful/useless it is will be determined in time...

thanks for humbling me, shaya -_-; i got a bit carried away due to my disdain for MK, like anyone else and i've never quite fully understood the problem against D3 besides overwhelming power and that annoying chain grab...or i just haven't faced a gewd D3 yet o_O
 
TreK

TreK

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great

still punishable & shouldn't be used often but nice trick to put in once in a while lol
 
Tennet

Tennet

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Nice, and SB breaks the same amount of shield no matter how much it has been charged.

Now I want to know what happens if you use other moves after the SB...
 
Doomblaze

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@ Tennet:
Does it really? I assuming you mean besides being fully charged because that breaks shields instantly...
I double anything else would happen if you used another move

sexy find barbull!
If you hit someone with this, would it still break their shield and do a whole lot of damage?

I cant believe something this simple was overlooked, dang, at least now we know it =D
 
Tennet

Tennet

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Go check yourself, uncharged and charged break the same amount, i believe the only difference is kb.
 
VGSteve

VGSteve

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Knockback and damage increase depending on how long you hold it, but charged or uncharged SB depletes about 80% of the opponent's shield.
 
Tari

Tari

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Well.. clearly as you can see from my post count, I don't post that often. But seeing this I decided I wanted to comment. Truthfully, I don't think I'm that good of a Marth player as most of the people on this board, (infact I'm sure I'm probably the worst :laugh:) either way, I had one question about this AT...

Wouldn't this be easily open to aerial attacks from below?
 
Hype

Hype

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LOL.

I'm not Tari, and I've never seen him at a tourney.

I wouldn't be that obvious, haha.

Edit: And I wasn't around in April 2007.
 
**Havok**

**Havok**

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heyyyyy...does this mean if you pivot it onto someone it has the same knockback as fully charged shield breaker?
 
Remzi

Remzi

formerly VaBengal
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**Havok** said:
heyyyyy...does this mean if you pivot it onto someone it has the same knockback as fully charged shield breaker?
Click to expand...
I haven't checked but I'd imagine not, the momentum properties and damage/knockback properties are not related.
 
Tari

Tari

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clowsui said:
LOL @ NeO

Tari he thinks you're Hype in disguise
Click to expand...
Lmao, Hype would kick my butt skill-wise, though I could see why he thought we were the same.. we live in the same city. I may have joined a while ago, but I never really started posting until recently.

Edit: @Hype I've only been to one tourney so you probably wouldn't have seen me.
 
legion598

legion598

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um wow so theoretically u could save ur second jump to go under the stage and up to the other side without touching the ground after being hit into the upper part of the danger zone.
 
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