How to Land an Usmash [MAJOR UPDATE]

A small fact: people like to roll. A staple to any noob's game, rolling is always among the first habits a new player will pick up. And who's to blame them? It's fast, it moves you away from your opponent, and it's safe. Rolling, all in all, is usually fail-proof. As we grow as players we learn that rolling isn't all it was cracked up to be, as players start to abuse us, so we learn to stop abusing rolling.

The thing is, no one ever truly removes it from their system. And in our quiet moments of desperation, we revert to our former selves and our former mindsets, and we roll.

As Peach, we can take exceptional advantage of this with our usmash. Using simple spacing and prediction, Peach is now capable of killing below 100%.

For an example usable at lower levels: your opponent is standing on the edge of FD and you throw a turnip. The vegetable, which is among the most terrifying things in Brawl, horrifies the opponent to the point that his only reaction is to roll. You, aware of this, have prepared by charging an usmash at the finishing length of his roll. He rolls directly into you - scoring you an exact shoulder-pad sweetspot.

The same can be done with platforms, except much easier. When landing on a platform, opponents still highly enjoy rolling. The only problem is, platforms are small and since they can't roll into air, their rolls are usually cut short at the edge. At that point, instead of predicting the length of their roll, simply usmash the edge. It's tremendously easy.

Or just catch them when their landing on the platform.

Platforms are the usmash's best friend. If an opponent is on a low enough platform, pressure them with usmash like there's no tomorrow. You are Peach. There is not going to be another opportunity for you to kill that Snake at 99% until 80% from now. LAND THAT USMASH.

Unfortunately, most players will not actively be above you. Fortunately, you are Peach and thus have an array of moves to haul them up there. Ftilt, dtilt, utilt, and even the lovely dair all have beautiful vertical trajectories. It's like Peach is built for this or something.

You can also try:
- noting ledge patterns and charging one right at the edge and releasing when they jump
- attacking aerial campers by running beneath them and usmashing
- out-of-shield (they have to be big usually)
- throwing turnips upward and reading airdodges
- other stuff probably

LANDING AN USMASH USING PLATFORMS

Let me explain how to read the pictures below. The screen-shots highlight every platform on that stage capable of being used to score an usmash. I use two colors to show each platforms potential: green to show a guaranteed usmash, yellow to show a possible usmash - assuming a few conditions.

Green platforms are 100% reliable. As long as you are accurate, the opponent will be hit no matter the opponents condition.

Yellow platforms, on the other hand are less dependable, and you scoring the usmash will depend on how low the character's hurtbox is. For example, characters like Marth might be unharmed due to their stature, while low standing characters like MK, might be hit. Keep in mind, most characters will be very low if they hit a platform in their tumbling animation. Yellow platforms are harder to use, but the KO potential still exists.

Also, be aware these aren't all the stages and all the spots usable for usmash KOs. I've omitted stages such as Rainbow Cruise and Pictochat due to their varying nature - be creative and find your own d*** kills.

STARTER STAGES

Battlefield

• Peach's best neutral in my opinion. Use usmash often and aim for the edges!

Yoshi's Island

• Both of these should be yellow technically. You can only score usmashes when one of the edges has tipped low enough.

STARTER/COUNTER STAGES

Castle Siege

• Castle Siege is full of possibilities but never promises. The platforms are just high enough to barely make glancing blows on certain characters, while just hitting others.

Delfino Plaza

• Delfino has several situational spots - the most common being the tips of the slanted platform.

Halberd

• Halberd is very conductive to vertical KOs due to it's low ceiling. As soon as it lands, the main platform is the perfect height for scoring them yourself.

Lylat Cruise

• While the middle platform is too high, the side platforms are at the exact height for the usmash.

Pokemon Stadium 1

• Pokemon Stadium is very efficient in that it always offers an usmash no matter the transformation. Unfortunately, the main transformation is barely high enough to have it miss.

COUNTER STAGES

Distant Planet

• Now this is beautiful. 75% of the main platform is covered in platforms - and not just any platforms, sinking platforms. These will put enemies in place for the much more powerful shoulder sweetspot. I consider this the best stage for usmashes.

Frigate Orpheon

• It's just the edges on the second transformation, but edges are of the most use for the usmash.

Green Greens

• The platforms are unfortunately just a tad too high sometimes, but it's Green Greens. It's small enough that a utilt will kill anyway.

Luigi's Mansion

• The floating middle platforms are almost too low for the usmash, but their useful at times. The side platforms can also be used (rarely), but they must be low enough.
  
  Photo courtesy of Elucifer: usmash can also hit an opponent when standing on the middle floating platforms.

Norfair

• Another great usmash stage. All of Norfairs platforms are conveniently low enough for usmashes.

Pokemon Stadium 2

• PS2 continues the tradition and offers several usmash spots like it's predecessor. Of note is the electric transformation which allows all it's platforms to be used. The conveyer belt could even be used for fun moving smashes.

Common Misconceptions

• The moving platform on Smashville
• The center platform on Jungle Japes
• The middle platform on Lylat
• The center platform on Halberd when moving
• The side platforms on the normal transformation of PS2
• The first platform on Frigate Orpheon

Stop trying to usmash people on Smashville's, Jungle Japes, or Lylat's middle, platform. It won't work.

Like, EVER. The platforms are just simply too high.

Try holding up, and pressing A instead.

LANDING AN USMASH BY SHIELDING MOVES
BY RAZMAKAZI

Original Thread: http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=244540

If any of the following attacks hit your shield, you are guaranteed an usmash. The numbers next to the character's names shows at what percentage they are KO'd from an usmash with no DI (percentages courtesy of Xyless).

Razmakazi said:

Sweetspot Upsmashes by Dropping Shield and doing Dash + Usmash

NOT powershielded unless otherwise noted, just NORMALLY shielded having your shield PUSHED. These can work most of the time but you have to judge for yourself if you're too far away to try to usmash. Use your eyes man since spacing can change things so these are not 100% all the time. It's more like 100% all the time if you're close enough. Sometimes you kinda...aren't. And these all should work for sure if you powershield. :]

so yea...if you powershield all of these should work for sure and there's more possibilities and more things work such as mario's fsmash.

Don't take my word as law and question this and test it yourselves. It's important to use your own heads so we can get accurate results and make our character better so I'm asking you to doubt me here.

Click to expand...

Blue means guaranteed with proper spacing.
Green means guaranteed with a power shield.
Orange means the attack must be mis-spaced.
Yellow is likely, but requiring testing.

Bowser 89%

• NOTHING

Captain Falcon 89%

• Falcon Punch
• Fsmash
• Non-autocancelled Knee
• Falcon Kick
• Dsmash

Diddy Kong 78%

• Usmash
• Dsmash

Donkey Kong 92%

• Side B
• Fsmash
• Dsmash
• Donkey Punch

Falco 75%

• Usmash
• Fair
• Dsmash

Fox 70%

• Usmash
• Dsmash

Ganondorf 88%

• SH Fair
• Fsmash
• Dsmash
• Murder Kick
• **** Punch

Ice Climbers 75%

• Squall
• Fsmash
• Usmash
• Dsmash

Ike 87%

• Uncharged Eruption
• Utilt
• Forward B
• Jab (3rd Hit)
• Fair
• Nair
• Dair

Jigglypuff 63%

• Pound
• Usmash
• Rest
• Fsmash
• Dsmash

King Dedede 95%

• Jet Hammer
• Usmash
• Dsmash
• Fsmash
• Waddle Dee Throw

Kirby 70%

• Aerial Hammer
• Usmash
• Grounded Hammer
• Fsmash

Link 86%

• Up B
• Fsmash (2nd Hit)
• Usmash

Lucario 80%

• Fsmash (low Aura)
• Dsmash (low Aura)

Lucas 77%

• Fsmash
• Usmash

Luigi 79%

• Tornado
• Dsmash

Mario 80%

• Fair
• Fsmash

Marth 77%

• Shield Breaker
• Dancing Blade (Up)

Meta Knight 70%

• NOTHING

Mr. Game & Watch 78%

• NOTHING

Ness 78%

• Usmash
• Dsmash
• Fsmash

Olimar 73%

• Dsmash

Peach 74%

• NEEDS TESTING

Pikachu 72%

• Dsmash

Pit 79%

• NOTHING

Squirtle 65%

• Usmash
• Fsmash

Ivysaur 82%

• SH Fair
• Fsmash
• Dsmash
• Usmash

Charizard 85%

• Fsmash
• Dsmash
• Rock Smash

R.O.B. 83%

• NOTHING

Samus 83%

• Dsmash
• Fsmash
• Dtilt

:shiek: Shiek 72%

• Usmash
• Dsmash
• Dair
• Fsmash

Snake 93%

• Jab (3rd Hit)
• Utilt

Sonic 79%

• NOTHING

Toon Link 76%

• Fsmash (2nd Hit)

Wario 85%

• Dsmash
• Fsmash

Wolf 85%

• Fsmash

Yoshi 84%

• Dsmash
• Usmash
• Fsmash

Zelda 72%

• Utilt
• Usmash

Zero Suit Samus 72%

• Dair
• Down b
• Fsmash

OTHER TRICKS

SH Dair -> Usmash

Praxis said:

So here's what I've got so far (tested on the SANDBAG, I have not had the opportunity to test it on a live player yet). If you perform a short hop and Dair at the apex right as you start to descend, you should pull off two or three of the kicks before you hit the ground. Since it's the FOURTH hit that sends opponents upwards, it drags the opponent into the ground, and as soon as you touch the ground you can Usmash.

Click to expand...

Jab Cancel -> Usmash

Supermodel From Paris said:

If Peach is INSIDE the hurtbox of certain characters, jab cancel (actually I'm not sure if peach can jab cancel, you might just be waiting for it to end but it FEELS like you cut some lag off by hitting down to cancel) to usmash kills earily and reliably. I've been trying it out in friendlies offline and online and I've gotten some kills this way that are surprisingly early for Peach.

There are a lot of good ways to set this up, but it only sweetspots on tall characters like Snake, Zero Suit, Ganon, Zelda, etc. You must Glide toss UPWARD or DOWNWARD (not toward the opponent) and then jab, cancel, and upsmash once you are in their hurtbox. It requires precise spacing and is very escapable but good for a mix-up and easy kill when your opponent isn't expecting it.

Click to expand...

[MK Specific] Grab Release -> Usmash

MenoUnderwater said:

AHAHAHA, it works. ...I think.

Fellow Peaches, I've discovered the long awaited grab-release > usmash on Meta Knight.

...on Smashville.

I was watching M2K vs MikeHAZE this morning when I saw Mike grab-release M2K into the direction the platform was moving into an usmash. Clearly, applying the added distance granted from the moving platform into a hyphen-usmash should let us reach MK when a grounded release would not. I tested it against my nairing and DIing brother and it did seem to work.

Try it out and tell me your results. A situational kill is still a kill.

I plan on trying it with utilt, along with various aerials, and on several characters.

Click to expand...

MenoUnderwater said:

It probably works on Rainbow Cruise as well due to this:

http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=251972

Yaaaaaaaaaaaay.

Click to expand...

Usmash Out-of-Shield

EdreesesPieces said:

This thread is great. I wanted to bring up something that has me reallllyy interested. Upsmash apparantly has 14 frames of startup. Does this mean you can upsmash out of shield any character that uses an aerial with at least 14 frames of aerial cooldown? (As long as they are within the range of your upsmash)

Moves i've recently managed to SWEETSPOT an upsmash out of shield:

-Metaknight's f-air
-Lucario's down air

The possibilities can be really really good..the trick is to begin your upsmash out of shield the second you're done shielding any hitbox that could hit you. I think it's possible to usmash out of shield a LOT of moves in this game if the opposing character doesn't retreat on their spacing properly. The beauty of upsmash out of shield is that you don't waste 7 frames with a shield drop. So it's actually QUICKER to usmash out of shield than it is to drop shield and do any smash that is at least 7 frames!! HOLY **** OMG.

Click to expand...

Usmash at the Ledge

Rickerdy-doo-da-day said:

Very minor thing (not sure if its been mentioned) but you can get an Up Smash in when people are recovering off the ledge. You can get one by sheilding a get up attack (e.g. they're hanging on the ledge and use an attack) and using an OoS Up Smash or moving towards them and Up Smashing (OoS Up Smash is much more likely work and especially against big characters like Bowser). You can also get one if someone does a jump get up (e.g. they're hanging the ledge and use jump) but you have to get it just right

I'm not sure about every character but basically, you Up Smash just as they jump up from the ledge as they have frames where they aren't invincible but can't perform any moves either. I've tested and checked this and even they use invincibility frames from grabbing the ledge, they still won't have enough to avoid getting hit by the palm of Peachs hands (its definitly a sweetspot hit). I did my testing on MK and got varied results but the majority of them were the Up Smash connecting on him before any of his aerials came out and I tried all variations. Sometimes I would get hit and the Up Smash wouldn't hit, other times they would trade hits. The hardest timing was hitting MK when he did a jump get up and airdodge asap but you can still get a sweetspot Up Smash in

And if anyone is curious, I tried doing a simple get up and a rolling get up but the Up Smash didn't connect either time. You get an Up Smash in if someone big like Bowser performs a simple get up but the timing is a bit strict

I still need to look into get ups from characters at 100%+ but I've done it on MK and atm I'm guessing everyone will be the same. The get up is slower and will allow more reaction time for you which is very good since 100%+ is an ideal percent to be killing with a sweetspotted Up Smash

Another thing that needs looking into is having Peach face away from the ledge and connect with the Up Smash away from the opponent (aka the opponent is behind her). I'm not sure if this allows her to get a much stronger sweetspot part in and I guess it might help if you ant to get a quick OoS aerial in instead? Bair would be ideal for that

One final point, the closer you are to the ledge the easier it is to get an Up Smash in. So if youre right by the ledge, you'll pretty much get an Up Smash everytime if they jump get up. This could be dsiadvantaged though since an kind of attack might push you off the ledge. If you aren't right next to the ledge though, OoS Up Smashes on simple get up attacks could be perfectly viable especially on bigger characters and most definitly when characters are above 100% (heck you could probably drop your sheild after the attack and dash in and Up Smash). Another problem I'm aware of though is that most good players are inventive and will normally mess around the ledge before getting up or drop down and jump/attack back onstage e.g. MK and his many jumps

Click to expand...

[MK Specific] Grab Release Against Wall -> Usmash

hiROI said:

So I have an idea to get upsmashes on MK.

This is based off of Meno's finding on smashville. Well, since MK has a set distance when air released, we can have a guaranteed upsmash on him if we air release him against a wall or solid object. This would make PS1 a good counterpick.

Click to expand...

PS1 Double Dsmash to Usmash

Thibault said:

Can somebody test this? I think i may have found an easy way to land upsmash on ps1.... during the change between stages when the new stage comes up there is a time when you can use smashes without endlag.. well ive tested this before and its worked a few times already but when the stages change hit down on the cstick twice and up once the result is amazing... you hit with the first hitbox of downsmash once then you hit with the first hitbox again on the other side and then you sweetspot upsmash :0 its pretty crazy when you do it lol and its not too hard to set up.... but im amazed at how effective it is :3

Click to expand...

SH Dthrow Turnip > Weak Bair > Glidetoss > Usmash

Corrupted said:

Sh dthrow point blank turnip, weak bair (doesn't matter how early/late), glide toss, usmash is frame legit from 70% on mario. non point blank dthrow from 90%

Click to expand...

Usmashing Attacks that Extend Hurtboxes

Razmakazi said:

So y'kno hooooooow saaaaay Marth does his side b down variation into DK's shield but how DK can just usmash oos and hit marth's hands and raaaaape him when he's clearly nowhere near him after like the 3rd hit?

I'm thinking Peach can do the same.

Saturday in tournament I beat Bigfoot's DK by usmashing through his DK's donkey punch before the actual hitbox came out. He was in the air and I wasn't even directly under him but I knew the punch was coming so I usmash'd and sweetspotted his arm and killed him.

Click to expand...

Havent read it yet, but Im sure its amazing
You make the coolest banners ever.

impressive compilation. Probably one of the more helpful threads I've seen in the entirety of this forum in the past year lol. Too bad Lucario is terrible at doing anything with platforms or I'd steal this

I don't think rolling is so much a habit scrubs get into but more of trying to pressure your shield thinking it's completely safe to do so or think that their autocancel properties protect them from oos options. Even on higher levels of play, perfect shielding a lot of things in this game can grant you usmashes oos, whereas opponents rolling on top of you is pretty rare to come by. Maybe something you want to include, at the very least. I think. That should be more notable than people rolling into you.

another fun guide with visuals [pretty :F] :D

your guides are informative and always a pleasure to read :3

Great guide, learnt something new again!~

Nice work. I need to try this out more often. I usually only try and land the sweetspot when a character hasn't aimed their recovery move properly and is falling helplessly.

i get a lot of usmash kills by doing it next to the platform like in between the platforms for lylat or BF or other stages b/c ppl know you're gonna usmash so they DI away from the platform and get their airdodge ***** by a sweetspot. other times doing it on platforms works. it's all about reading DI b/c usmash is a pretty telegraphed move.

Awesome work! I should start using Peach more on Norfair and Lylat Cruise.

This is pretty awesome, and good to point!

I enjoyed the read a lot! And I learned that Smashville is too high!

Timbers said:

Even on higher levels of play, perfect shielding a lot of things in this game can grant you usmashes oos, whereas opponents rolling on top of you is pretty rare to come by. Maybe something you want to include, at the very least. I think. That should be more notable than people rolling into you.

Click to expand...

I agree. I just used the rolling-into-you example as a leeway into the platform usage example, which is the main focus of the thread. Lemme do some light editing.

Yea... Peaches, don't expect good people to constantly roll into you. xD

Like Raz said, one way, and probably the best and my favorite, is to simply read airdodges.

What about brinstar?

Brinstar's aren't low enough. Or at least I couldn't get usmash to hit.

The tentacle things eat the usmash instead, and when they break, the platforms go up much too high.

Meno... No Homo but I love you man. Thanks for going through all the trouble and putting in all this hard work to teach our fellow Peaches how to up Smash. God knows they need this.

I'm not insulting anyone. I'm just saying I don't see much up Smashing out of anyone in particular. As a matter of fact (and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. I haven't been in some time, so things might have change.) Peach's up Smash has got to be the least used move in her arsenal. It's one of her best moves and no one barely uses it. wtf?

I'm not insulting anyone. I'm just saying I don't see much up Smashing out of anyone in particular. As a matter of fact (and feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. I haven't been in some time, so things might have change.) Peach's up Smash has got to be the least used move in her arsenal. It's one of her best moves and no one barely uses it. wtf?

Click to expand...

I have tro say that I agree. In fact, I don't use up smash anywhere near as much as I should. The thing is, unless I'm playing someone bulky like Bowser and Donkey Kong, I have trouble getting the sweetspot. But even if it sourspots it's not all bad; you can still use it to juggle to some extent.

I always thought that only the Battlefield platforms were at the right height to do it, but now it turns out there are way more.... Rest assured, this thread has definitely encouraged me to be more adventurous (sp?) and stop using UTilt to hit through platforms all the time...

Oh, and to Metatitan, unfortunately Brinstar won't work. Theoretically it's at just the right height to do it, but wherever I psoition myself the tentacle thing always absorbs the blow...

Sometimes I use the Up smash in battlefield and I miss :S other times I connect the smash, the hit doesnt strike always.

Master Peach said:

Peach's up Smash has got to be the least used move in her arsenal. It's one of her best moves and no one barely uses it. wtf?

Click to expand...

Totally agree. *shakes everyone's shoulders*

Where is the usmash spam?

I've been using it soooo often as of lately, and even at my tournament last Saturday, I've been scoring them at least once a match.

isaac0390 said:

Sometimes I use the Up smash in battlefield and I miss :S other times I connect the smash, the hit doesnt strike always.

Click to expand...

It's dependent on the characters hurtbox as well. Take Snake for example, his stance makes it so you can only hit him on the bottom of his feet - the space between is legs is (realistically) an empty space.

You should make them Yellow then.

Nice guide =)

MenoUnderwater said:

Totally agree. *shakes everyone's shoulders*

Where is the usmash spam?

I've been using it soooo often as of lately, and even at my tournament last Saturday, I've been scoring them at least once a match.



It's dependent on the characters hurtbox as well. Take Snake for example, his stance makes it so you can only hit him on the bottom of his feet - the space between is legs is (realistically) an empty space.

Click to expand...

:O Very interesting what you say, thanks for the explanation

Dekuu said:

You should make them Yellow then.

Click to expand...

Well, it's just a problem with accuracy, and not the platforms. You won't ever hit Snake if you aim between his legs, same if you aimed three feet away from him.

Character models are usually pretty exact to the character hurtboxes - even in their idle motions, their hurtboxes fluctuate with them. I think it's only when they perform attacks they get weird.

*Snake utilt*

isaac0390 said:

Sometimes I use the Up smash in battlefield and I miss :S other times I connect the smash, the hit doesnt strike always.

Click to expand...

a good way to make sure you get the hit is to hit them when they land on the platform. for some reason it can reach that way

Usmash has some disjointed range on the sides; every now and then that helps if I miss the sweetspot. But I generally save it because if/when I actually do hit with it, I'll know it'll kill since it'd be the freshest move I have

What I tend to do when I'm about to Up Smash is, I try to set up my opponent. From what I've noticed (This may not be true. I'm just going from what I've experienced and seen.) people (Unless your Marth, Diddy, or Meta Knight) don't like to be that close to Peach if she isn't already stunned or defenseless. For that reason I tend to do this, I either tap, rush in and try to upsmash. Even if they are not in good range for a decent hit they'll receive something that you can take advantage of.

Another thing I like to do is grab and tech chase. The way I do it is like this, (This is sure to work if done correctly.) I grab and toss down, this is important, In the middle of all that, if you know your opponent well enough you should be able to predict where he's gonna roll. Before he get that chance to roll move in to a position where you think he's gonna be and charge the upsmash. If done right you WILL land a decent up Smash or even better a sweet spot.

And this one is my favorite. It's easy to do and your opponent can't help but fall into it.
Toward the edge of the stage (Where they may fall off.) you either tap or Toss them forward. Most likely they'll fall off. The first thing on their mind at that time is probably they want to get back on the stage. They'll jump. Prepare yourself (Ike lol) and charge your upsmash until they are in range. You don't really have to charge it, just move fast and swift and unleash that upsmash. Most likely it will hit and it'll be a good one.

This is what do and it works for me. Hopefully this may be useful for you guys. Try it out and see. I'm not making any promises though. You may have to feel these out as well while your battling.

Edit: I forgot to mention one. D-Smash in to Up-Smash. It's just that simple. Most people jump or are to stunned to do anything about about it. Do this and you should be able to land one. Try it.

Dsmash > Usmash is decent like MP said.
Sometimes I like to Jab > Hyphen Usmash.

I try to FF Dair > Hyphen Usmash but it doesn't really work for me

I only really use up smash from reading their airdodges or after a down throw and hope i read them correctly. I guess you could use it after Fair if they space over you?

airgemini said:

Dsmash > Usmash is decent like MP said.
Sometimes I like to Jab > Hyphen Usmash.

I try to FF Dair > Hyphen Usmash but it doesn't really work for me

Click to expand...

I'll have to try out these combos some time. The Dair> USmash one sounds like it's pretty useful at low percents, but unfortunately it probably doesn't work at kill percents. Meh, it's worth a try...

Master Peach said:

Another thing I like to do is grab and tech chase. The way I do it is like this, (This is sure to work if done correctly.) I grab and toss down, this is important, In the middle of all that, if you know your opponent well enough you should be able to predict where he's gonna roll. Before he get that chance to roll move in to a position where you think he's gonna be and charge the upsmash. If done right you WILL land a decent up Smash or even better a sweet spot.

Click to expand...

Wow, that sounds pretty sweet. And if they don't tech, then you can follow up with Peach Bomber as they bounce up. It's a win-win situation.

What I meant about the FF Dair > Usmash is that you FF it before the fourth kick hits so it doesn't knock them upwards.

SOOOOOO for some reason I decided to get info on how her usmash's hitbox interacts with characters on the ground.


- "In Front" means when her usmash is used in front of the person, "Behind" when her usmash is used behind the person (duh ).

- The first number is the damage done when Peach is facing the character, the second number when Peach is facing away from them (yes there is a difference).

This all assumes that you're as close as you can get to the character without pushing them away. Note that some of these numbers fluctuate, but I tried to get the general trend.



Mario
In Front: 17 | 15
Behind: 8 | 15

Luigi
In Front: 17 | 15
Behind: 8 | 17

Peach
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 15 | 15

Bowser
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 15 | 15

DK
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 17 | 17

Diddy
In Front 17 | 17
Back 8 | 8

Yoshi
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 8 | 8

Wario
In Front: 8 | 17
Behind: 17 | 17

Link
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 17 | 17

Zelda
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 15 | 15

Sheik
In Front: 8 | 15
Behind: 17 | 15

Ganon
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 15 | 15

Toon Link
In Front: 17 | 17
Behind: 8 | 17

Samus
In Front: 17 | 15
Behind: 15 | 15

ZSS
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 8 | 15

Pit
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 17 | 15

IC
In Front: 17 | 17
Behind: 8 | 17

ROB
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 15 | 15

Kirby
In Front: 8 | 8
Behind: 8 | 8

MK
In Front: 8 | 8
Behind: 8 | 8

DDD
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 17 | 15

Olimar
In Front: 17 | 17
Behind: 8 | 17

Fox
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 17 | 17

Falco
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 8 | 15

Wolf
In Front: 17 | 17
Behind: 8 | 8

CF
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 17 | 15

Pika
In Front: 8 | 17
Behind: 8 | 8

Squirtle
In Front: 17 | 17
Behind: 8 | 17

Ivysaur
In Front: 8 | 8
Behind: 17 | 17

Charizard
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 15 | 15

Lucario
In Front: 8 | 17
Behind: 17 | 15

Jiggs
In Front: 8 | 17
Behind: 8 | 17

Marth
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 15 | 15

Ike
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 15 | 15

Ness
In Front: 17 | 17
Behind: 17 | 17

Lucas
In Front: 17 |17
Behind: 17 | 17

G&W
In Front: 17 | 17
Behind: 8 | 17

Snake
In Front: 15 | 15
Behind: 17 | 15

Sonic
In Front: 17 | 15
Behind: 15 | 15





EDIT: oh yeah I forgot, excellent thread . Very helpful.

......now that I think about it I'm not sure if this was the place to post this stuff lol >________>

Can we get a translation of the data hot?

I'm not too sure what it all means.

Basically, hotgarbage is showing the damage Peach's Up Smash will do when she uses it facing (first number) and facing away from (second number) the character

You can then guess that the higher numbers mean that Peach is sweetspotting the character (e.g 17 damage) and the lower numbers (e.g. 8) mean that Peach is hitting with another part of the Up Smash, I'm guessing the sourspot

In other words, you can tell whether the Up Smash will or will not sweetspot from the damage hotgarbage has provided

So for example, Up Smash will sweetspot Mario when Peach uses it infront of him, regardless of whether she is facing him or not. However, when Peach is behind Mario and uses her Up Smash, she will sweespot him if she is facing away from Mario but she won't sweetspot him if she is behind Mario and facing him

I think that's how it works anyway. Very very nice thread Meno, I need to try and use Up Smash more often

airgemini said:

What I meant about the FF Dair > Usmash is that you FF it before the fourth kick hits so it doesn't knock them upwards.

Click to expand...

Oh right. I'm not sure if that would work, but hey, it's worth a try!

Oh, and nice find hotgarbage. I must say I was very surprised when I found out that you can sweetspot against a standing Jigglypuff...

What Rick said . Perhaps I should have put words instead of damage >______>.


EDIT: yeah I was surprised as well mountain_tiger, seeing how kirby and mk are no-goes. I found ness to be amusing xP, his big, bulbous, shoulder-height head is just begging for super sweetspots lol.

Wow, this helps a lot! I never know if Usmash will reach so i always just end up using Utilt. I think I would kill a lot faster if I got in the habit of using Usmash more.

Astounding! Truly astounding! Excellent work, awesome visuals, and good warning for the impossible Usmash areas like Smashville or the center platform on Lylat. Kudos to you!

Perhaps you should make a vid of how to time a Usmash hitting a rolling opponent. Perhaps include different situations?

I think you left out another possible place to Usmash in Luigi's Mansion.

Awesome textures o.o

Oh, er. Sorry if the textures distract from the fact I'm trying to point out...
I was just going through old replays and I was like, "Wait a tick. I just usmashed through the floor. -snapshots-"

And the Luigi's Mansion texture belongs to PAVGN of Metal Militia.

MarthFanatique said:

Perhaps you should make a vid of how to time a Usmash hitting a rolling opponent. Perhaps include different situations?

Click to expand...

I can't do good recording on my own unfortunately.

Elucifur said:

I think you left out another possible place to Usmash in Luigi's Mansion.

Click to expand...

Very nice, I hadn't thought of that. But, hmm, wouldn't the little platform sink to low sometimes?

I don't think the middle platforms move at all...

Elucifur said:

I don't think the middle platforms move at all...

Click to expand...

Because they don't.