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The OMG FiZZ is back Stupendous "Critique my Lucario" Thread

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F1ZZ

F1ZZ

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I noticed that alot of Lucario mains were making threads of "Critique my Lucario". So to help clean up the boards I decided to make this thread so that all Lucario mains can be critiqued in one thread. So post your Lucario vids here and they will be looked over.


TO POSTERS

Please refrain from posting videos where you destroy your opponent. It is hard to help you if you 3-stocked your opponent, make sure that you are about equal in skill so the Lucario Boards can properly help you. Also refrain from posting alot of vids at once.

Post away!

Sticky?
 
tedward2000

tedward2000

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I laughed at the Irony of this thread and the one directly above it.
With every "Rate my lucario", there comes a main hub to collect 'em all.

lets see how well this works (crosses fingers in hopes it does work)
-t2
 
Aurasmash14

Aurasmash14

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You should make sections later one for each player in case he wants to put up more vids.
 
hough123

hough123

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I'll post my videos from the tourney Saturday when Keist uploads them.
My first loss was recorded, a Marth (=\). (Super close match BTW.) My second was to D3. Again, it was really close, but it wasn't recorded. (Yes, I had no secondary the ballz to fight a D3 as Luc.)
 
ckm

ckm

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F1ZZ said:
Hey guys, I created a Youtube account and uploaded a video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-8H_L7y_s5c

Please give me any feed back. Also do you guys think this should be thread stickied?
Click to expand...

I like your aggressive style. Just make sure that you avoid putting yourself in bad situations by doing so.

I would say use regular grab more and ease off on the FP. FP is good but its 9 frame startup and terrible ending lag make it pretty dangerous, especially if youre just running up and using it like you did a couple times in the video. Using it out of jab combo would be better, but make sure you are hitting (not getting shielded) with the jabs or you will probably wiff the FP when the player dodges/counterattacks/etc out of shield. Personally, I mostly use FP when punishing something laggy or landing behind a shielding opponent.

I like that you are good at using DT, but again... its pretty risky to be throwing it out mid match and crossing your fingers. I guess as long as these things continue to work for you, I won't be the one to tell you not to. But I suggest that you don't let yourself get reliant on DT because it hasn't been proven to be effective at high levels of play (i.e. pros don't usually use it =p)

That's all I got, looks good f1zz. I'd like to see more with other matchups.
 
F1ZZ

F1ZZ

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Come on guys, critique my video! I need as much advice for my upcoming tournament. Oh ya, ckm thanks for the advice and I am going to try and upload other matchups sometime soon.
 
hough123

hough123

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First off, you need to grab more. Not FP grab, but grab grab. While FP is great for Booser, one of those grabs could have been a killing Fthrow, making the match easier. While this isn't too severe a problem, cut down on the FP a tad.

Next there's DT. You are incredible with it, but that still doesn't make it a good move. A shield grab would have worked better because of the control over your opponent. When you grab the opponent, you decide what to do with them and where they go. DT is pretty much set in stone about where they go. This gives your opponent a chance to manipulate your attacks to work in thier favor.

The only other thing besides me telling you to grab a bit more and FP a bit less is don't edgehob Booser. Booser's recovery is better than most give it credit, so don't even try or you'll get hurt :laugh:

I hope this helps =D
 
phi1ny3

phi1ny3

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Bowser needs more ftilt to catch your landing frames, and more fair, it's pretty much stealing percentage to use it to trade with lucario's fair and it would help if he did more SideB.
Now for lucario:
less FP, bowser hardly spotdodges and with one of the best punishing tools (upB), It's risky, I would leave it for punishing since it sets up nicely, plus when you do FP, try following it up with fair as opposed to AS or dash attack, you'll catch them before they shield pretty well, and you pretty much have lucario's bread-and-butter thing going on when that happens. Use more grab, at low percents, with how big bowser's hurtbox is, you can use dthrow and fair string him afterword, which will turn out much better percent wise. don't fsmash at point-blank range (bad habit to do overall), and DT is something I'll leave up to you, since some people have frankly made it work out okay, I would learn to replace it with utilt, jab, SH dair, or grab oos.
Good stuff, really used some good tools (I like how you got in his face XD).
 
H

HyperEnergy

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Alright, here's a critique of your second video against Pikachu, separated by which second(s) it happened on.

:28 - A missed grab, pay more attention to your spacing in situations like this. I suggest retreating if you notice you aren't in range, or using FPG.

:32 - :36 - Here you were throwing random fairs/dairs to hopefully bait an approach, but pika saw through it and punished with an utilt. Next time, avoid doing it more than once. I think it would've been better to charge AS after your first fair.

:38 - An fsmash. Lol, everyone here must've been guilty of doing that at some time. I'm pretty sure you know you shouldn't have done this so I'll just leave it at that.

:42 - Fair to dair. Fair itself wasn't an issue, but the dair afterwards was a poor choice of tactics. If your fair ever gets shielded, I'd recommend jumping away unless their shield is small enough to shield stab through.

:51 - **** those platforms lol. All I can say here is pay more attention to where your character is.

:57 - Yeah, you knew better than to attempt a grab here. I guess :28 was just a habit you need to get rid of. =/

:58 - Once again you got punished for a random fair. Make sure your opponent cannot get under you if you plan to do fairs.

1:27 - It looks like you dropped your shield at the wrong time. You could've either dropped it earlier (respond faster), or realize that your opponent will attack again if you fail to retreat on time and keep shielding until after his next attack.

1:31 - Pika used thunder foolishly here, and you failed to punish, you should've done a bair. On the bright side, you punished his fsmash directly afterwards.

1:59 - Good job at reacting to Pika's edgehog in time. If you had curved ES to the right rather than up this would've been a really sweet moment.

2:07 - I <3 AS's priority. It just eats up all those other inferior projectiles. Keep doing this to people dumb enough to spam their own projectiles when you have a FCAS.

2:24 - Nice, your opponent was in a rush to get rid of you and you took advantage of this with an airdodge to dsmash.

2:35 - It looked like you did a bair here, but I can't really tell. At any rate, you got punished for using such a slow move here.

2:40 - This made me lol. A thunder edgeguard that shouldn't have hit you did, and Pika was the one that died. =/

2:47 - A rather small issue, but try to avoid using fair while landing like the plague. I have to admit this is hard, but it will probably pay off greatly if you can get rid of that urge to do fair instead of nair.

3:00 - Great job predicting quick attack and punishing.

3:15 - Oh wow, nice spacing and mindgames here. Pika fell right into your jab combo. Too bad he DIed the opposite way.

3:31 - What!? You used a dair instead of utilt? That was a bad move.

3:48 - That usmash was bad and was based on guessing Pika would quick attack, rather than predicting. You're lucky your shield came out in time.

4:06 - 4:08 - Here Pikachu is standing on the ground doing nothing or in other words, he started waiting for an opening. Then you got grabbed. Stuff like this should set off a red flag to you indicating that your opponent is planning on thinking about his next action. For a better explanation, read the Spontaneity section of LunInSpectra's 7 Habits of a Professional Smasher.

4:24 - I'd like to say something about this, but one of the videos I put up in my critique thread had the same thing, only with Kirby's rock. So I'm gonna keep quiet lol.

Now then, I have a few more things to point out here...


Number of poorly spaced/timed fsmashes: 12 (8 were punished).

:38 - Punished by utilt.
1:11 - Unpunished, opponent attempted an utilt but missed due to shield push.
1:28 - Punished by usmash.
1:51 - Unpunished, opponent attempted a grab, but missed because of shield push.
1:53 - Punished by dsmash.
2:26 - Unpunished, opponent didn't predict and instead retreated.
2:50 - Punished by dash attack.
3:02 - Punished by fair into utilt (Pika utilt can kill? Really, that tiny little tail whip?).
3:26 - Punished by grab.
4:03 - Unpunished, opponent improperly spaced an aerial and missed.
4:08 - Punished by grab.
4:17 - Punished by dsmash.

Hopefully this gives you a good idea of how much that fsmash usage needs to be fixed lol.

At any rate, I enjoyed watching your matches. I especially liked how you DIed out of most of Pika's dsmashes. Just try to be more patient with your attacks; if you try something and your opponent reacts in a way in which you didn't expect, be prepared to change your plan. Keep up the good work, your Lucario is definitely one of the better ones out there. =)
 
D. Disciple

D. Disciple

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Thanks for the critique man. I'll keep in mind about my timing with fsmashes, I have been working on it, and it has paid off immensely. I hope to rep Lucario mains well at Genesis.
 
Aurasmash14

Aurasmash14

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I Agree with most of what hyper wrote with a few exceptions.....
at 1:31 a bair would have been too obvious, just go with AS
at 2:44 the pika whiffed a grab and you let him go unpunished.
at 2:49-2:50 you rolled behind the opponent and use a Non SH fair. This isnt advisable unless your opponent is fool enough to follow you in the air and knowing pika, he isnt.
at 2:53 that was some nice fairs.
at 2:55 the ledge attack at over 100% is way to risky, dont use it.
at around 3:03 when you died, you should have used your invincibility to charge AS instead of rushing pika.

oh and good luck on Genesis.
 
phi1ny3

phi1ny3

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You certainly have a grasp on fair, D. Disciple.
Conceal and play with fsmash a bit more. I saw a few times where they PS'ed them. One way to stop that is to stutterstep, which can preven the grab afterwards from happening. Another is charging it just a teensy bit longer.
Loved how your air game was swarming all over your opponents, although getting in close with uair was a bit risky, especially on ledgehop. If you ledgehop stuff, you don't often have to overextend yourself in terms of zoning, often times uair has a pretty deceptive horizontal range of its own to the point where you can hit them underneath the stage (which is usually a safer place for planking with aerials anyways).
I know this is more of a conditioning thing, but I noticed with a few of your matches, you kept doing the mistake your opponents were doing at times: making it clear they were going to try using kill moves. You want to do all you can to throw off your opponent's senses to the idea, whether it's making an empty hop before doing AS/fsmash, feinting like your going to try to wall them, or giving them limited chances so they have to get hit more (offstage, uthrow, juggling stuff, and sometimes fair shenanigans can really throw off your opponent). You really have to just fine tune how you want to slip in the kill, if you also see your opponent getting desperate (like that falco) doing the same thing, shield, punish, and just make sure that you don't forget the original intent of his plan.
You've got a good grasp on damaging him up, I think you just need to work a bit more on finetuning edgeplay and endgame (aka killing and such). Some of those gimps were great ^_^
The above posts got more specific, and I didn't feel like repeating something already said much.
 
phi1ny3

phi1ny3

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hough123 said:
My videos are finally up :chuckle:

Part 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqfrJO5bVfw&feature=channel_page
Part 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O4tTDWTjEGk&feature=channel_page

I jumped into the **** in both, losing 2/3 to his Marth.



Now rip into me with your consturctive criticism =3


EDIT: A whole day and no posts? I feel unloved <\3
Click to expand...
1st match: You did okay vs. Wolf. Predictable? Yes. (especially that rolling, gotta stop that in all matches, replace it with more shield, air movement, and spotdodge).
Now for marth...
Marth is tough, no one's fooling on that. However, marth has some exploitable things:
That marth in particular used NO grabs. That being said, you should have used shield more often, and even if he starts to use grab more often, you'll still want to know when and where to use shield, because this is going to be a camp/punish game. Lucario's aerials are going to be horrendous when compared to marth's, this isn't a war of attrition. You'll be waiting for him to get a little sloppy on his fairs, and either roll, attempt some fair stuff, or rushing underneath (carefully, his fair is still very bothersome) for a jab/utilt/grab.
Marth is very frame specific, it's why his kill moves as a whole (especially fsmash) are mad unsafe against either shield or air dodge. You need to either stay more grounded until you get him to goof (he will), or if he finally does an approach in attempt to shift your momentum off. AD will do well to get in his more weaker zone "close inside" from the air and to bait stuff, as well as spotdodge. Lucario also has some really nice juggling tools, something which marth's hate to be situated against. Marth is almost as bad underneath as ROB, maybe worst. Once you get in his weak zones, you'll want to anticipate him either shield grab punishing, DS at higher percents, or DB.Although all of these can be punished pretty harshly, DB is probably going to be the hardest move in dealing with him on the ground, but making him approach with AS will help in making it easier to nail him. As for those fsmash kills, seriously, if you're on the ground near that zone, learn to shield it, if in the air, air dodge, it's a free grab or opportunity to really make it somewhat disadvantageous for him.
Off stage gimping is actually feaseable with lucario vs. marth, you have to bait out fairs and most importantly, the SECOND JUMP. If you do, whether they try double jump -> DB for some height momentum, or anything, you can either seal their gimp by fair WoP'ing or AS.
That's my advice, coming from a lucario and former marther.
Another important tip for a character like marth, DON'T EVER LET HIM READ YOU AND DON'T EVER GET PREDICTABLE. Marth is arguably just below snake and MK in ability to punish and do really well against predictable opponents, and your marth didn't even use DB and many other tactics to their fullest extent. Use roll as an option, not as a movement method or approach. I swear, I loved owning my scrub friends with marth just because he could punish predictable and bad habits (like rolling) so well, DB has got to be arguably is the best sideB in the game pretty much, mad fast, if spaced well, safe, refreshes moves really well, and stops momentum both in dashing and in the air, allowing for easy following/mixup.
 
hough123

hough123

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phi1ny3 said:
1st match: You did okay vs. Wolf. Predictable? Yes. (especially that rolling, gotta stop that in all matches, replace it with more shield, air movement, and spotdodge).
Now for marth...
Marth is tough, no one's fooling on that. However, marth has some exploitable things:
That marth in particular used NO grabs. That being said, you should have used shield more often, and even if he starts to use grab more often, you'll still want to know when and where to use shield, because this is going to be a camp/punish game. Lucario's aerials are going to be horrendous when compared to marth's, this isn't a war of attrition. You'll be waiting for him to get a little sloppy on his fairs, and either roll, attempt some fair stuff, or rushing underneath (carefully, his fair is still very bothersome) for a jab/utilt/grab.
Marth is very frame specific, it's why his kill moves as a whole (especially fsmash) are mad unsafe against either shield or air dodge. You need to either stay more grounded until you get him to goof (he will), or if he finally does an approach in attempt to shift your momentum off. AD will do well to get in his more weaker zone "close inside" from the air and to bait stuff, as well as spotdodge. Lucario also has some really nice juggling tools, something which marth's hate to be situated against. Marth is almost as bad underneath as ROB, maybe worst. Once you get in his weak zones, you'll want to anticipate him either shield grab punishing, DS at higher percents, or DB.Although all of these can be punished pretty harshly, DB is probably going to be the hardest move in dealing with him on the ground, but making him approach with AS will help in making it easier to nail him. As for those fsmash kills, seriously, if you're on the ground near that zone, learn to shield it, if in the air, air dodge, it's a free grab or opportunity to really make it somewhat disadvantageous for him.
Off stage gimping is actually feaseable with lucario vs. marth, you have to bait out fairs and most importantly, the SECOND JUMP. If you do, whether they try double jump -> DB for some height momentum, or anything, you can either seal their gimp by fair WoP'ing or AS.
That's my advice, coming from a lucario and former marther.
Another important tip for a character like marth, DON'T EVER LET HIM READ YOU AND DON'T EVER GET PREDICTABLE. Marth is arguably just below snake and MK in ability to punish and do really well against predictable opponents, and your marth didn't even use DB and many other tactics to their fullest extent. Use roll as an option, not as a movement method or approach. I swear, I loved owning my scrub friends with marth just because he could punish predictable and bad habits (like rolling) so well, DB has got to be arguably is the best sideB in the game pretty much, mad fast, if spaced well, safe, refreshes moves really well, and stops momentum both in dashing and in the air, allowing for easy following/mixup.
Click to expand...
Wow, thanks for the advice!
I got shield more, roll less, and Fsmash less. (From DJ.)

My friend mains Marth, so I can practice against him as he plays without DB pretty much as well.
 
phi1ny3

phi1ny3

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No, get someone who uses DB, you gotta practice against it, I'm serious. For example:
DB1 -> grab
DB full combo
DB stalling
all this is good to learn to play against.
 
hough123

hough123

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phi1ny3 said:
No, get someone who uses DB, you gotta practice against it, I'm serious. For example:
DB1 -> grab
DB full combo
DB stalling
all this is good to learn to play against.
Click to expand...
Oh, that makes sense. Guess I'll be at the closest biweekly soon to find one :laugh:
 
Alus

Alus

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Dancing Blade can tick me off sometimes.

Well...if the people use it right...
 
F1ZZ

F1ZZ

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My only suggestions would be to use U-tilt more. You used it at higher percentages such as 60% whereas you should try to use it for 0%-30%. It is just better for racking up damage. Other than that I really like your Lucario. On the positive side, you use your dair very effectively. :)
 
hough123

hough123

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F1ZZ said:
My only suggestions would be to use U-tilt more. You used it at higher percentages such as 60% whereas you should try to use it for 0%-30%. It is just better for racking up damage. Other than that I really like your Lucario. On the positive side, you use your dair very effectively. :)
Click to expand...
Thank you =)
I'll try to get some footage of me fighting my friend the next time I go to his house so you guys can see some more.

Also Phil, he might like it if you used that previous Marth experience to help him get better ;)
 
iRJi

iRJi

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Aurasmash14 said:
Dancing Blade Is probably the most annoying attack marth can do.
Click to expand...
Lol, I might sound mean because I play one of the best marths around, but Dancing blade is not scary. Just a tip: with Lucario, DI up and out from Dancing blade, you can get out of it >_>
 
F

Fizzle

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:13 -- Dthrow or fthrow would've been a better choice of throw here, as you could've got an early edgeguard

:15 -- sh double fair = lag. Lag = bad. Do fair-nair or fair-dair instead. Or, better yet (since your first fair didn't connect), just do one fair and stop.

:22 -- Watch for the second hit. Your grab wouldn't have connected anyway -- you were way out of range. Fair or dash attack would've been better oos choices.

:31-:33 -- Nice combos. Utilt is Lucario's best anti-air move... so use it more when you have the chance.

:38 -- Rolling into opponents? No.

:52 -- Reckless. You were edgeguarding him fine with AS. Play safer.

1:04 -- Why roll away? You gave away your advantageous position when you could've punished his whiffed aerial.

1:14 -- You're in perfect position to punish TL's fsmash and you... roll? No. Jab, dash attack, or (maybe) dash grab oos would've worked fine for you here.

2:11 -- I don't see why you felt the need to ES here. You didn't get punished this time, but it would've been much safer to just DI forward and land safely.

2:21 -- What are you aiming at? Try not to fight TL with fair in the air, as his aerials are quicker and have longer range. Stay on the ground and play safe.

2:32 -- Stop doing that. Lucario players, in general, need to play safer and not always going for the predictable fairs offstage.

2:36 -- Bad choice with the dsmash here. Much safer bet would've been to roll/dash away and create some distance.

2:44 -- Utilt would've worked fine here. You got greedy with the charged fsmash and got punished.

3:01 -- You were way off that time. Again, safer is better. Gimps come with experience... and patience.

Other stuff:

-Stop landing with dair. That TL wasn't punishing you this time, but a more experienced player will just eat you up for it. Dair is very unsafe on shield.

-Learn to use other things oos besides grab. Lucario's grab range is **** so a jab, aerial, or even a dash attack is often a better choice at mid range.

-Uhh... keep playing. Unless this was online, your reaction time needs a lot of work. Both you and your opponent were getting hit by a lot of predictable stuff (falling aerials, random smashes) that can be shielded and punished easily.
 
F1ZZ

F1ZZ

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Thanks for the critique. I have some bad habits that I am trying to break like rolling into opponents.

Still I would like it if others would critique my game play. It would help me alot. :)
 
Luccie

Luccie

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Hey guys. If you remember me from way back when, I complained all of the time that my Lucario failed. It...still kinda does xD. Since I can't record it by myself, can someone record it for me? (either going against me or just self-KOing yourself so another person and I can Brawl.)
 
Shenlong

Shenlong

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Im not the best in any means however:

0:18: Dthrow odd I'd recommend upthrow at that low percentage to combo due to toony's floatiness.

0:26 I believe you may have had time for an utilt.

0:44 Toony thought aerial you read it well with a nice uptilt.

1:02 Thats pretty dangerous using fair that low to the ground like that. You could have got punished, but you got back on with a good bair.

1:18 Good missed throw punishment.

1:47 I believe he could have shielded that fsmash. If he could you would have gotten punished.

1:52 Screams Fsmash but you got gready and missed out.

1:58 He misses grab you are in perfect position for fsmash but you go to dthrow?

2:07 Good aura sphere punishment on that arrow shot.

2:09 Why did you jump out there?

2:18 Fair back to stage = punishment and you received it

2:58 Good delay on the aura sphere.

3:05 I'm not sure but he delayed long enough for you to hit the ground for perhaps shield.

3:45 You had another jump too. You got greedy and got busted. X_X (Ewwwww)

3:56 Nice catch with the aura sphere.

I also noticed you AS 90% of the time on recharge you were hitting but still you need to mix it up some.

Just some humble observations . . . .
 
The_Bear735

The_Bear735

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@ Fizz's vid (I don't feel like doing times, just watch it and read at the same time):

- What the **** was that in the beginning? Why'd you jump, maybe do fair, and then charge? AS charge normally is fine, don't waste your time with jumping lol. Why'd you send it out immediately too? That's a bad idea. Save it usually. Also, reverse midair FP? Wtf.

- ROLL ROLL = don't do it son

- Don't bother dash grabbing too much, unless you've got a direct punish. It's not useful vs. lights like TL.

- Too much Fsmash at low percents. Ftilt is way better for damage racking.

- stop ****ing rolling omg

- You seem to just be letting your opponent do w/e he wants. You're being like "lol k" when ever he tries to approach, when you should be punishing.

- What was with that late AS and Fair? Work on your reaction time.

- god your rolling should be punished. This TL is horrible at punishing ground stuff.

- you should only spam fsmash when you're trying to scare your opponent or get the unexpected hit with it. You're just using it carelessly. And you could've easily punished his Bup with a dash grab, it was painful to watch.

- you decayed Fsmash way too much. :|

- ****ing stop ****ing rolling jesus **** it's called shorthopping

- What the mother **** was that after his first stock loss? you don't do that, EVER. Doing that is just saying "LOL HUG KO ME PLZ PLZ PLZ". I almost want to smack you for doing that.

- I'd like to point out how your plank got you usmash'd.

- DT interrupt into his jab? What the crap?

- l2SDI, you could've made it out of that Fsmash from where you were. You DI'd down!

- You should've died from that ******** "edge guard" attempt. You didn't do anything, you didn't grab the ledge, and you were Lucario. Your opponent is lol badddddd.

- that TL shouldn't have charged Usmash. You don't CHARGE a move that is naturally fast yet strong... Gah I hate anything that reinforces this "Lucario can plank well" idea.

- stop trying to grab so hard. Save it for shield or if he leaves himself open to dash grab.

- seriously? You really did a random dash FP? Really?

- oh **** I told you not to do nair offstage. Also, way to give up. You should've done the wall cling and made it back.

- Why do you always do NOTHING?! jesus, it's like you just don't even try to charge or attack! It's infuriating to watch.

- so many grab fails....

- What was that? You really missed the AS by a landslide. AND STOP ****ING ROLLING ****

- oh my **** I hate your rolling

- Honestly, you really didn't deserve that win lol. You barely avoided getting gimped once, and then you got gimped another time. I'm hoping that this was one of your bad matches or something. :\




I'm sorry but your critique is horrible Shenlong. You're not pointing out any of his obvious mistakes or telling him how to get over them. You're just occasionally mentioning that he could've done something else at one point.
 
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