In Depth Frame Data 90% Complete

the most awesome guy in the world said:

Before reading, you MUST read this.

I can see whats happening.
And they don't have a clue.
They'll fall in love, and here's the bottom line
Our trio's down to two (Oh)

The sweet caress of twilight.
There's magic everywhere.
And with all this romantic atmosphere
Disasters in the air!

Snake Frame Data​

Hey guys, I want to make 1 clear distinction. The knockback in the two sections, 1st and 4th, are no equal. This is because one is dealing with base knockback and the other is dealing with initial knockback. Initial knockback is the amount of launcher speed a move has on Mario at 0%, which is in my knockback guide. However, this is only useful for relationships on the character in questions because using only initial knockback, you cannot convert the knockback to another character. However, if you use base, which is very directly related to the initial (ask me if you want more complicated information), you can find the knockback for the entire roster.

Key Terms

Hits On
This is the first frame the attack starts to hit on.

Duration
This is the total number of frames the attack lasts until the first IASA frame.

Hitlag
This is the number of frames of freezeframe animation when an attack connects.

BlockHitStun
This is the number of frames of freezeframe on the animation of a shield when an attack hits it. The shielder does not slide during this time.

Blockstun
This is the number of frames after shield hitlag that the shielder cannot unshield in.

Base Damage
How much the attack does at 0% in a Versus Battle (%'s in parenthesis is when move is fully charged)

Knockback Angle
The angle which the opponent is sent before directional influence.

Other Knockback Stuff
Base is the speed at which the opponent is sent in a versus Battle. Growth is how this increases per % of damage.

Click to expand...

I would like to thank Eternal Yoshi for his first frame data thread. I have borrowed the hitbox and hitbox duration frames for this thread - so that I will not have to redo them as they take a painstakingly long time. However I would like to mention something as to prevent confusion.

When saying the first IASA frames and the full duration - he lacked to mention he counted the IASA frames starting from the ending hitbox or something. Because some of his data "seems" wrong when plainly looked at (some of it is). Also - some of his data was hard to understand. (A Hitbox going away on frame 5 meant it last hit on frame 4)

Here is Eternal Yoshi's thread if you are interested to see:
http://www.smashboards.com/showthread.php?t=225125


Multi-Hit moves such as Jab "start counting" when the animation for the next part begins. (EG: Jab 2 starts after Jab 1, but does not include Jab 1 frames. Only the frames starting from the animation of Jab 2). This does not apply to moves such as Dair or Nair

General Information
Landing Lag:
Soft: 2
Hard (fast falled): 6

Eternal Yoshi said:

Grab

8
29

Dash Grab
12
29

Pivot Grab
9
29

Edge attack(under 100%)
25
27
63

Edge attack(over 100%)
41
44
70

Edge Roll(under 100%)
Invincibility starts at 7
ends at 32
50

Edge Roll(over 100%)
Invincibility starts at 7
Ends at 52
80

Jump
leaves ground at frame 11

Dash
15 until first step
3

Skid
4
24

Shield
Guard animation finishes at frame 8
2

Shield Drop
8
16

Crouch

3
8

Exit Crouch
4
10

Roll from floor
Invincibility starts at 7
ends at 21
36(Both front and back)

Forward Roll dodge
Invincibility starts at frame 9
ends at frame 19
36

Backward roll dodge
Invincibility starts at frame 9
Ends at frame 19
34

Air Dodge
Invincibility starts at 4
Ends at 31
40

Spot Dodge
Invincibility starts at 2
Ends at 22
26
34


Tech
Invincibilty starts at 7
ends at 22
28

Tech Roll
Invincibility starts at 6
ends at 21
41

Get up attack( I don't know the name of this move)
Invincibilty starts at frame 7
ends at frame 23
15 (back)
19 (Front)
16
21
50

Get up attack over 100%(why is there two?)
Invincibilty starts at frame 7
ends at frame 23
16 (front)
26 (back)
18
28
50

Click to expand...

Jab

Input: A
Hits on Frame: 3-4
Duration: 15
Hitlag: 4
Blockstun: 1
Blockhitlag: 4
Base Damage: 4%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 45
Base: 1308
Growth Rate/ variance: 0

2nd Jab

Input: A-->A
Hits on Frame: #F
Duration: 22
Hitlag: 5
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag: 5
Base Damage: 3%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): # [range = -180<x<=180]
Base: 1080
Growth Rate/ variance: 0

3rd Jab

Input: A-->A-->A
Hits on Frame: #F
Duration: 46
Hitlag: 6
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag: 6
Base Damage: 7%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): # [range = -180<x<=180]
Base: 2607.57
Growth Rate/ variance: 24.49

Forward Tilt

Input: Forward or Back --> A
Hits on Frame: 4-5
Duration: 31
Hitlag: 6
Blockstun: 2
Blockhitlag: 6
Base Damage:
First Hit: 8%
Knockback:
Angle (degrees above forward): 45
Base: 211
Growth Rate/ variance: 0


Forward Tilt 2

Input: Forward or Back --> A
Hits on Frame: #F
Duration: 30
Hitlag: 8
Blockstun: 3
Blockhitlag: 8
Base Damage:
Second Hit: 12%
Total: 21%
Knockback:]
Angle (degrees above forward): 45
Base: 2250.8
Growth Rate/ variance: 26.6

Up Tilt

Input: Up --> A
Hits on Frame: 6-13
Duration: 37
Hitlag: 9
Blockstun: 4
Blockhitlag: 9
Base Damage: 13%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 88
Base: 2341.22
Growth Rate/ variance: 34.06

Down Tilt

Input: Down --> A
Hits on Frame: 6-8
Duration: 34
Hitlag: 8
Blockstun: 4
Blockhitlag: 8
Base Damage: 10%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 105
Base: 2289.7
Growth Rate/ variance: 28.73

Forward Smash

Input: Forward/Back + A
Hits on Frame: 41-43
Duration: 79
Hitlag: 11
Blockstun: 8
Blockhitlag: 11
Base Damage: 23% (32%)
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 40
Base: 3565.66
Growth Rate/ variance: 34.58

Up Smash

Input: Up+A
Hits on Frame: It varies so go by this:

Eternal Yoshi said:

Hits with Mortar mechanism at frame 11
Mortar Shell comes out at frame 29

Click to expand...

Duration: 51
Hitlag: 1 (0 for mortar)
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag: 1 (0 for mortar)
Base Damage: 4% with mortar shooter 10% (10%)
*when hitting with the part that does 4%, it stales up smash!
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward):70
Base: 3289
Growth Rate/ variance: 19.08

Down Smash

Input: Down+A
Hits on Frame: 130 (soonest)
Duration: 76
Hitlag: 10
Blockstun: 0
Blockhitlag: 10
Base Damage: 14% (20%)
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 90
Base: 3250.16
Growth Rate/ variance: 22.06

Neutral Air




Input: A while airborne
Hits on Frame:
First Kick: 10
Second Kick: 28 (if first connects)
Third Kick: 46 (if second and first connect)
Fourth Kick: 61 (if third, second, and first connect)
Duration: 67
Landing Lag: #F (30) - second #F is non-IASA landing lag
Hitlag:
First Kick: 6
Second Kick: 6
Third Kick: 5
Fourth Kick: 9
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag:
First Kick: 6
Second Kick: 6
Third Kick: 5
Fourth Kick: 9
Base Damage:
First Kick: 6%
Second Kick: 5%
Third Kick: 5%
Fourth Kick: 12%
Total: 29%
Knockback:
First Kick:
Angle (degrees above forward): N/A
Base: 1536
Growth Rate/ variance: 0
Second Kick:
Angle (degrees above forward): N/A
Base: 1536
Growth Rate/ variance: 0
Third Kick:
Angle (degrees above forward): N/A
Base: 2219
Growth Rate/ variance: 0
Fourth Kick:
Angle (degrees above forward): 45
Base: 1733.22
Growth Rate/ variance: 56.06

Forward Air

Input: Forward+A while airborne
Hits on Frame: 23-26
Duration: 69
Landing Lag: #F (30) - second #F is non-IASA landing lag
Hitlag: 9
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag: 9
Base Damage: 14% (15% when sweetspotted)
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 85 (90 when sweetspotted)
Base: -736.25
Growth Rate/ variance: 51.95

Back Air

Input: Back+A while airborne
Hits on Frame: 7-26
Duration: 42
Landing Lag: #F (30) - second #F is non-IASA landing lag
Hitlag: 9
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag: 9
Base Damage: 14% sweetspot, 10% sourspot
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 45
Base: 1997.94
Growth Rate/ variance: 32.79

Up Air

Input: Up+A while airborne
Hits on Frame: 10-22
Duration: 47
Landing Lag: #F (22) - second #F is non-IASA landing lag
Hitlag: 9
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag: 9
Base Damage: 14% sweetspotted, 10% sourspotted
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 85
Base: 1864.18
Growth Rate/ variance: 36.13

Down Air




Input: Down+A while airborne
Hits on Frame:
First Kick: 6
Second Kick: 23 (if first kick connects)
Third Kick: 40 (if second and first kicks connect)
Fourth Kick: 57 (if third, second, and first kicks connect)
Duration: 59
Landing Lag: #F (30) - second #F is non-IASA landing lag
Hitlag:
First Kick: 6
Second Kick: 6
Third Kick: 6
Fourth Kick: 8
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag:
First Kick: 6
Second Kick: 6
Third Kick: 6
Fourth Kick: 8
Base Damage:
First Kick: 6%
Second Kick: 5%
Third Kick: 5%
Fourth Kick: 12%
Total: 29%
Knockback:
First Kick:
Angle (degrees above forward): 90
Base: 123
Growth Rate/ variance: 0
Second Kick:
Angle (degrees above forward): 90
Base: 138
Growth Rate/ variance: 0
Third Kick:
Angle (degrees above forward): 90
Base: 170
Growth Rate/ variance: 0
Fourth Kick:
Angle (degrees above forward): 50
Base: 2270.04
Growth Rate/ variance: 36.58

Dash Attack

Input: A or C-stick left/right/down while dashing
Hits on Frame: 5-12
Duration: 42
Hitlag: 7
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag: 7
Base Damage: 11% sweetspotted, 9% sourspotted (with sweetspot), 8% Sourspotted, 6% Sourspotted Sourspot... oo
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 65-70
Base: 2117.43
Growth Rate/ variance: 26.23

Neutral B

Move Name: Grenade
Input: B
Hits on Frame: 2 after detonation
Duration: 24
Hitlag: 0
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag: 0
Base Damage: 2-5% when thrown, 12% explosion. Can do 15-18% total.
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 90
Base: 2090.64
Growth Rate/ variance: 23.28

Forward B

Move Name: Nikita
Input: Forward/Back+B
Hits on Frame:
Duration: 82 is soonest, longest is a variable
Hitlag: 0
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag: 0
Base Damage: 7% dropped, 14% while under control
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 50
Base: 2840.32
Growth Rate/ variance: 26.62

Up B

Move Name: Cypher
Input: Up+B
Hits on Frame:
Duration: 47-105
Hitlag: 1
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag: 1
Base Damage: 6%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): N/A (it's weird)
Base: 2675
Growth Rate/ variance: 0

Down B


Move Name: C4
Input: Down+B to place, Down+B to detonate after placement
Hits on Frame: 29-31 (starting from when you press Down+B to detonate)
Duration: 5
Hitlag: #F
Blockstun: #F
Blockhitlag: 5
Base Damage: 17%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 90
Base: 1844.27
Growth Rate/ variance: 40.69

Forward Throw

Move Name: Flip
Input: Forward during Grab
Duration: Varies by character
Base Damage: 9%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 45
Base: 2262.45
Growth Rate/ variance: 16.95

Back Throw

Move Name: Over Shoulder Flip
Input: Back during Grab
Duration: Varies by character
Base Damage: 9%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 45
Base: 2423.45
Growth Rate/ variance: 16.95

Up Throw

Move Name: Body Slam
Input: Up during Grab
Duration: Varies by character
Base Damage: 10%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 90
Base: 2491.1
Growth Rate/ variance: 17.09

Down Throw

Move Name: Sleeper
Input: Down during Grab
Duration: Varies by character (but we are always at a -1 frame advantage)
Base Damage: 12%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): N/A
Base: 0
Growth Rate/ variance: 0

Pummel
Input: A during Grab
Duration: #F
Base Damage 2%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): N/A
Base: 0
Growth Rate/ variance: 0

Taunt's Info


Base Damage: 2%
Knockback:

Angle (degrees above forward): 25
Base: 2193.14
Growth Rate/ variance: 10.43

I'm amazed how much time has been put into this. THe time EternalYoshi spent getting frame data, and what SuSa did to organize, collect photos and other testing.

SuSa is pro.

Good job man, looks good.

I'm starting to think that the cypher has landing lag like Sonic's bumper.

I noticed that I can't shield instantly when I land and the SE for landing is very different. I'll do tests and retcons later.

susa said:

the most awesome guy in the world

Click to expand...

Thank yeh, thank yeh

When an opponent touches a mine, on what frame does it explode/do damage? That's the main thing I feel is missing from this.

woow i never thougt that u tilt have more frames than d tilt
gooood job^^

Please, base and knockback growth in fully charged forward smash and mine. Also charge release frame smashes please.

You should use PSA to finish this up, despite the fact that the PSA numbers seem to be 1 frame early.

I haven't hacks, so I can't do it.

All you need is FitSnake.pac and Phantom Wings, PSA. See the Smash workshop for more info. You don't need to touch your Wii.

how many frames does it take to pull out a nade?

I bumped this to show that I collected some data using Phantom Wings's PSA program. For some reason, it counts everything 1 frame after the animation begins so I corrected it already. Here's what I have so far.

Dodges

Start of Invincibility Frames
Duration
First IASA Frame(if any)

Front Roll Dodge
4
14

Back Roll Dodge
4
16

Spot/Sidestep Dodge
2
19
26

Air Dodge
4
26

Floor tech(Normal)
1
20

Floor tech(Front Roll)
1
20

Floor tech(Back Roll)
1
20

Wall tech(Normal)
1
20

Wall tech(Wall Jump)
None

Ceiling Tech
1
20

Front Roll from get up(face plant)
1
19

Back Roll from get up(face plant)
1
25

Front Roll from get up(face up)
1
24

Back Roll from get up(face up)
1
31

Click to expand...

Note that the victim will always be face up from Snake's dthrow.

Question regarding frame data. If Snake stands over his own C4, FH and detonates upon rising the FH, the C4 will detonate beneath him and not get caught in the explosion.

I was wondering if the C4 detonation causes enough hitstun on an opponents shield that Snake could try to FF a Bair against there shield as they take shieldhitstun from the explosion? And possibly break a slightly worn out shield?

Not enough hitstun.

How about the frames of the ledge attack, 100% ledge attack

sorry if i'm bumping this but its an important thread...
can we have the shield advantage frames?

What's a shield advantage frame?